Pecorama-Pricey parts?

[Chubber]

On a recent visit to S. Devon, I detoured to Pecorama at Beer and bought 2 OO-9 Setrack turnouts and a 10ft and 15ft N gauge wagon chassis kit. Total, £29.80.

 

Out of curiosity, on my return, I looked at the Hatton's site, £25 plus £2 postage, total £27.00.

 

I'd expect to pay more than the Hatton's price at a local outlet, with stocking costs, delivery costs to the shop etc, but not at Pecorama.

 

Grrr!

[Kris]

Given it is Peco you have effectively bought from directly, I am not surprised that you have paid rrp. 

[Andrew P]

Given it is Peco you have effectively bought from directly, I am not surprised that you have paid rrp. 

It's the same at the Gaugemaster Shop in Ford / Arundel, for Gaugemaster Products.

[Enterprisingwestern]

Peco at Beer's main customer base is the holiday maker making an impulse purchase, not the savvy model railway enthusiast, so the prices reflect this.

It was always thus, I've only been once, about 30 years ago, and everything was RRP.

TBH, I'm surprised there was only a couple of quid in it, I would have expected a bigger differential.

 

Mike.

[Andy Hayter]

Peco support their distribution network by not undercutting them.

 

You will therefore be charged the full rrp. 

 

This is the exact opposite of what Hornby have done in the past - and they have been castigated for it.

[bertiedog]

Such is life. discounters offer lower prices, Peco and decently run shops expect the full price, just as you expect a full wage packet each week. Cheaper prices are offered, and it's up to you where you place the business, but expecting a discount from the manufacturer, who has possibly millions tied up in production costs and pays wages to staff without a reduction is a little odd.

 

If you pay full price you expect better service, full no argument G/tee, instant refunds on faulty items. All of this has to be paid for, and it is you the customer who pays for all of this. There's no magic source of income Peco have to hand out as discounts, and this applies to all suppliers in the model trade. They are simply asking the guide price and Hattons are giving a lower price to tempt you into dealing with them.

Hattons and others exist as high volume sellers, they tempt you to spend more in the end by using offers and discounts. But if everybody did it the system would simply breakdown, with no model shops left and a failing hobby.

 

Stephen

[john new]

A vote for Pecorama.

 

Also you have the advantage at Pecorama of when you've paid for it is there in your hand, you're not inconveniently faffing about waiting in for two or three days for the post/delivery service. Same with supporting your local Toymaster or equiv'. I sometimes do buy elsewhere (for example the recent ARGOS price on the Hornby Railroad Tornado & 3 Pullmans set was too good to miss) but usually prefer the local service outlets. I'm slightly fortunate that it is as local to me as any of the other proper model shops and the convenience and service justifies the trip.

Edited May 24, 2017 by john new

[bertiedog]

I feely admit I use Hattons and Rails Of Sheffield, Scalelink, etc by post as I have not got a local shop to buy all items from, and at my age it's difficult to travel a long way to get items. The prices are lower than retail in many cases, but thats what they want for them so a great bargain, but I still prefer to pay the going rate, it pays the producers bills, and keeps new items coming.

Stephen

[Chubber]

"the advantage at Pecorama of when you've paid for it is there in your hand, you're not "inconveniently" faffing about waiting in for two or three days for the post/delivery service"

"I'm slightly fortunate that it is as local to me..."

 

.....but I "inconveniently" drove 20 miles out of my way

 

 

"There's no magic source of income Peco have to hand out as discounts"

 

If I grow spuds and sell them to my neighbour, would he expect to pay the same for them as I charge someone 30 miles away for who I add delivery costs? I listened to the salesman describing to another customer all the injection moulding machines on site knocking out models and track...

 

 

 

Peco support their distribution network by not undercutting them.

 

Let me see if I understand..they charge RRP to support their distribution network who must surely have delivery charges and invoicing factored into their prices? Why would discounting the price of stuff bought at Pecorama by the delivery charge factor be undercutting their distribution network? My local gravel pit charges so much for a yard of gravel plus delivery costs. If I go with my half-ton trailer and collect it myself, I can save a good bit.

 

If you pay full price you expect better service, full no argument G/tee, instant refunds on faulty items.

 

I am assured that Ebay, Amazon et al offer the same safeguards...certainly John Lewis does as their exchange of a faulty T.V. proved, supplied at a hefty saving over Currys etc

 

they tempt you to spend more in the end by using offers and discounts

 

Tesco discounting the price of cat food wouldn't induce me to go out and buy a cat!

 

Peco at Beer's main customer base is the holiday maker making an impulse purchase, not the savvy model railway enthusiast, so the prices reflect this.

 

Hmmm....By the number of 'Thomas' toys being sold, it appears to work! Not many people seen buying 10ft wagon under frames though.

 

Given it is Peco you have effectively bought from directly, I am not surprised that you have paid rrp.

 

See gravel pit reply above...?

 

a great bargain, but I still prefer to pay the going rate

 

Stephen, you must be a very rare bird indeed!

 

 

Doug

[Andy Hayter]

 

 

 

 

Peco support their distribution network by not undercutting them.

 

Let me see if I understand..they charge RRP to support their distribution network who must surely have delivery charges and invoicing factored into their prices? Why would discounting the price of stuff bought at Pecorama by the delivery charge factor be undercutting their distribution network? My local gravel pit charges so much for a yard of gravel plus delivery costs. If I go with my half-ton trailer and collect it myself, I can save a good bit.

 

 

Doug

 

So let me see.  Your local gravel pit has a worldwide distribution chain that it is prepared to undercut by allowing you and your trailer a small discount. 

 

I don't think so.  More like every single sale is direct from the pit.  The only choice is delivered or self collect.

 

If you cannot grasp that selling a PECO large radius point for less than any model shop (because they can save on sending the item to the model shop) is, long term going to destroy the profitability of those shops, then we need discuss no further.

 

However since you think the gravel pit business model is the one for you, why don't you suggest to the boss of the gravel pit that he stocks PECO 10ft underframe kits and lets you buy them cheaply. 

[bertiedog]

No, a normal customer who does not expect a discount for nothing.....why should they drop a price for you? is it to come out of the salesmans wages, or out of company accounts, or the owners pocket. It is perfectly obvious that you cannot have run a business, where it is a pretty difficult situation each day to provide an income for yourself and pay the staff and taxes to the Government. Recent changes in the Pension provisions means extra costs all round, so why stand there and ask for a discount? Who is going to give up money from his pocket to meet the lower prices, money does not grow on trees, it is earnt.

 

I expect a discount for old goods, end of line, sales items for clearance, but day to day running of a model shop is a nightmare these days, and discounting on the scale we have has already affected the shops with mass closures.

 

Just as workman is meant to earn his keep, a shop is there to provide for the owner in the same way. I knew many Model shops in the 60's/70/s where sales had fallen so low at times that the shops could not afford heating all the time, and there was no income some weeks.

Maybe being in waged employment it has not dawned on you that you wages could be taken from you at any time? This is the way business operates, and margins, costs and profit get confused by one and all.

 

Nobody will turn down a bargain, offer full price for used items, and discounts have their place in the grand scheme of things, but it goes a bit far when a maker is expected to hand out a discount....for what?

 

Stephen

[Chubber]

If you cannot grasp that selling a PECO large radius point for less than any model shop (because they can save on sending the item to the model shop) is, long term going to destroy the profitability of those shops, then we need discuss no further.

 

The Pecorama shop does not do an on-line service, selling to personal callers to an out-of the way showroom in Devon will not alter the profit of a shop keeper in Birmingham or anywhere else. I suggest that were they to operate an on-line service then there is indeed merit in charging the RRP to avoid undercutting their distributors.

[chris p bacon]

The Pecorama shop does not do an on-line service

I'm not surprised, gravel is a bit awkward to post

[Andy Hayter]

If you cannot grasp that selling a PECO large radius point for less than any model shop (because they can save on sending the item to the model shop) is, long term going to destroy the profitability of those shops, then we need discuss no further.

 

The Pecorama shop does not do an on-line service, selling to personal callers to an out-of the way showroom in Devon will not alter the profit of a shop keeper in Birmingham or anywhere else. I suggest that were they to operate an on-line service then there is indeed merit in charging the RRP to avoid undercutting their distributors.

 

No, but it might do damage to someone like Church Street Models in Basingstoke - well someone has to sell models there.

[Chubber]

No, but it might do damage to someone like Church Street Models in Basingstoke - well someone has to sell models there.

After two visits last month "I can't find it at the moment, can you come back?" and "No, I haven't found it yet, not sure if had any to start with" and "I don't stock those, there's no call for them..." he seems to doing that for himself, quite frankly!

 

Hence my impromtu visit to P'ram. ..

 

Going way OT, but you did prompt the response.

Edited May 24, 2017 by Chubber

[Zomboid]

It's a retail outlet. Expect to pay retail prices.

And given that it's run by the company who determine what the RRP is, you should expect to pay RRP. No more, no less.

Could they seriously advise "Mike's Models" to charge the general public £10 for an item, and then sell it in their own shop for £8 themselves?

[Chubber]

It's a retail outlet. Expect to pay retail prices.

And given that it's run by the company who determine what the RRP is, you should expect to pay RRP. No more, no less.

Could they seriously advise "Mike's Models" to charge the general public £10 for an item, and then sell it in their own shop for £8 themselves?

Yes, if it normally costs them £2 to get the item to 'Mike's Models'. That's the crux of my argument.

 

Doug

[The Bigbee Line]

They do it to make money. An old guy told me in a shop. " my aim is to get the money from your wallet into my till, don't forget that."

 

You choose where you spend your money. Don't harp on that you had to pay full price.

 

I visit model shops and normally buy fishplates and small stock items. I've spent money to get there and then get some things I'll need. I don't have my price comparison head on. Life's too short...........

[hayfield]

"the advantage at Pecorama of when you've paid for it is there in your hand, you're not "inconveniently" faffing about waiting in for two or three days for the post/delivery service"

"I'm slightly fortunate that it is as local to me..."

 

.....but I "inconveniently" drove 20 miles out of my way

 

 

"There's no magic source of income Peco have to hand out as discounts"

 

If I grow spuds and sell them to my neighbour, would he expect to pay the same for them as I charge someone 30 miles away for who I add delivery costs? I listened to the salesman describing to another customer all the injection moulding machines on site knocking out models and track...

 

 

 

Peco support their distribution network by not undercutting them.

 

Let me see if I understand..they charge RRP to support their distribution network who must surely have delivery charges and invoicing factored into their prices? Why would discounting the price of stuff bought at Pecorama by the delivery charge factor be undercutting their distribution network? My local gravel pit charges so much for a yard of gravel plus delivery costs. If I go with my half-ton trailer and collect it myself, I can save a good bit.

 

If you pay full price you expect better service, full no argument G/tee, instant refunds on faulty items.

 

I am assured that Ebay, Amazon et al offer the same safeguards...certainly John Lewis does as their exchange of a faulty T.V. proved, supplied at a hefty saving over Currys etc

 

they tempt you to spend more in the end by using offers and discounts

 

Tesco discounting the price of cat food wouldn't induce me to go out and buy a cat!

 

Peco at Beer's main customer base is the holiday maker making an impulse purchase, not the savvy model railway enthusiast, so the prices reflect this.

 

Hmmm....By the number of 'Thomas' toys being sold, it appears to work! Not many people seen buying 10ft wagon under frames though.

 

Given it is Peco you have effectively bought from directly, I am not surprised that you have paid rrp.

 

See gravel pit reply above...?

 

a great bargain, but I still prefer to pay the going rate

 

Stephen, you must be a very rare bird indeed!

 

 

Doug

 

Peco's biggest customers are their retailers, it is vitally important to both Peco's retail and wholesale customers that they do nothing to adversely affect the retail outlets, in turn the smaller outlets can trade on equal terms with each other, whilst if the box shifters wish to reduce their margin they are free to do so 

[40F]

Yes, if it normally costs them £2 to get the item to 'Mike's Models'. That's the crux of my argument.

 

Doug

 

 

What argument ? Peco play fair by not discounting their own products as a gesture of good will and a show of support to their RETAIL customers as do Guagemaster. Please grasp some business sense

[40F]

If you cannot grasp that selling a PECO large radius point for less than any model shop (because they can save on sending the item to the model shop) is, long term going to destroy the profitability of those shops, then we need discuss no further.

 

The Pecorama shop does not do an on-line service, selling to personal callers to an out-of the way showroom in Devon will not alter the profit of a shop keeper in Birmingham or anywhere else. I suggest that were they to operate an on-line service then there is indeed merit in charging the RRP to avoid undercutting their distributors.

 

Eh Gads The factory came first and then Pecorama which in case you hadn`t noticed does include a miniature railway and a superb garden so it makes sense to show case their own products at the place of birth so to speak

[The Bigbee Line]

Final word... At the end of the day you left with the products in your hand. You did not have to wait for the courier to come and make the Hattons delivery, that time saving must be worth more than the £2.

[JohnR]

Pecorama were not "pricey". They were charging you what you should expect to be charged. If you can get it for less elsewhere - thats a bonus. Thats not what you should expect to be charged.

 

If Pecorama were charging OVER RRP "We're charging extra for the view out the window", then that would be "pricey". 

[Zomboid]

Yes, if it normally costs them £2 to get the item to 'Mike's Models'. That's the crux of my argument.

 

Doug

RRP is a price suggested by the manufacturer that should allow everyone involved to cover their costs and make a bit of profit. If retailers choose to undercut each other and eat into their own margins then that's up to them. But you can't expect the manufacturer, who define the RRP in the first place, to turn around and undercut their distribution network by telling Mike that he should sell the maguffin for £10 but then sell it for £8 themselves. That would be a great way to lose the distribution network.

By buying from the factory at full RRP, peco make more profit, which is good for them (and ultimately good for everyone who has an interest in the company continuing to trade), and they are not ripping anyone off because that's the price you would expect to pay anywhere.

[Enterprisingwestern]

Peco are selling to a lot of people who don't wake up in the morning thinking "I need a Thomas The Tank Engine Locomotive", it's not until they get to Pecorama with their anklebiters that they realise this. Therefore, Peco are doing their retailers a favour by introducing new customers for the future for them, irrespective of any cost considerations.

 

Mike.