UFOs - Is anybody out there?

[PatB]

11 hours ago, johnofwessex said:

 

I passed an AA box in Wales on holiday a few weeks ago

ISTR finding that the few remaining ones are listed structures.

[boxbrownie]

10 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

He makes a good pitch in that section, no question, but there is something about his overall drift/tone that reminds me of post-truth politicians, conspiracy theorists, and certain sorts of evangelists,

 

 

I turned off when he started the current “binary” chant......he has obviously decided that particular word presently is the fashionable key to any campaign or belief.

[Nearholmer]

It’s a standard trope for creating doubt/possibility-spaces, into which the listener is then gently, and non-overtly, persuaded to place what the speaker wishes them to place.

 

Its great stuff for enlisting the support of the high percentage of people who don’t like living with the possibility that they will never know “the answer”, and will have to cobble-along on the basis of either knowing-unknowing, or the balance of probabilities. I’ve never heard ‘respectable’ scientists/experts use the technique; they will usually say something like “we can’t be certain, but the indication, based on probabilities, is that ……..”.

 

I got into a bit of a debate with my brother in law on Sunday, which I quickly let drop for fear of creating ill-feeling, because he had picked-up on a load of similar stuff about the “Wuhan Lab Leak” thing. The stretched logic there being that because there is no clearly demonstrable animal-human chain of transmission, there are missing links in that chain, whereas for many virus the links are understood, then it is very highly probable (aka near certain) that it came from a lab. Nope! We just don’t know. Live with it!

 

 

[tomparryharry]

I used to see UFO. Quite a good band in the 1970's.

 

I tried to make a funny story about Mars, Galaxy, and Uranus, but you've heard them all before.  I guess I'll stay on Topic.....

 

 

[woodenhead]

It's very useful for the US to talk about aliens and UFOs, it's not as if they haven't done it before to create confusion and fear.

 

These strange craft that buzz their ships and aircraft, not done any damage but buzz around them - three possibilities:

1. Experimental top secret exotic US craft being tested against unwitting personnel
2. Experimental or other top secret Russian or most probably Chinese exotic craft spooking US personnel
3. Maybe actual aliens but the least likely one.

Swarms of AI controlled drones is being talked up these days a lot of this sounds like that sort of technology being tested, along with hypersonic vehicles that are claimed to be unstoppable.  There's a new arms race at the moment and talking UFOs is all part of the propaganda.

[tomparryharry]

I've heard rumours of UFO's  flying around Lands End.

 

Can't believe it myself, it's just plain Scilly....

 

Insert groan here..... 

[Reorte]

20 minutes ago, tomparryharry said:

I used to see UFO. Quite a good band in the 1970's.

 

I tried to make a funny story about Mars, Galaxy, and Uranus, but you've heard them all before.  I guess I'll stay on Topic.....

 

Bring back the groan button!

[woodenhead]

32 minutes ago, tomparryharry said:

I used to see UFO. Quite a good band in the 1970's.

 

I tried to make a funny story about Mars, Galaxy, and Uranus, but you've heard them all before.  I guess I'll stay on Topic.....

 

 

 

 

[rocor]

I would tend to approach the release of information by the American military regarding UFOs with a great deal of scepticism,  tending to look upon it as a scam by the military and the defence equipment contractors, to procure resources, for the development of advanced weaponry aiming to defeat the threat from these newfangled Chinese/Russian/Alien craft. 

[Ron Ron Ron]

15 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

.....Maybe I simply don’t warm to over-articulate Americans who clearly want me to believe something (the something in this case, I think, being that it would be a good idea to create and fund a whopping great study into this subject, presumably with him in charge).

 

 

 

5 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

It’s a standard trope for creating doubt/possibility-spaces, into which the listener is then gently, and non-overtly, persuaded to place what the speaker wishes them to place.

 

Its great stuff for enlisting the support of the high percentage of people who don’t like living with the possibility that they will never know “the answer”, and will have to cobble-along on the basis of either knowing-unknowing, or the balance of probabilities. I’ve never heard ‘respectable’ scientists/experts use the technique; they will usually say something like “we can’t be certain, but the indication, based on probabilities, is that ……..”.

.......Nope! We just don’t know. Live with it!

 

 

 

I think you've misread what Elizondo is saying.

(he's not the only ex-Pentagon figure to have spoken)

He's not trying to convince anyone about believing anything, other than that the subject should be treated seriously..

He is advocating that based on the weight of evidence they have accumulated, there should be an open discussion about the subject within US government, the Pentagon and the Security agencies, who often fail to talk to each other, or coordinate their efforts.

He is exactly saying we don't know what it is.

It's the Washington Post journalist who keeps bringing it back to UFO's and extraterrestrials.

As for looking for a key job, he and a couple of other figures who were involved, are now persona non grata with the Pentagon establishment for "going public".

 

I've no idea if there's anything in this, but it'll be interesting to see if the US government report actually says anything significant.

 

 

.

[Nearholmer]

24 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

He's not trying to convince anyone about believing anything, other than that the subject should be treated seriously..

 

Indeed. I understood his pitch to be "this should be taken seriously". Hence my comment about the "something" that he wants me to believe being that it would be a good idea to create and fund a whopping great study into it.

 

What gets my BS-detectors twitching is the way in which he pitches it, the technique that he uses.

 

I may just be a suspicious old bngger, but if someone set out to sell me a time-share, or invest in the economy of a far-off island I'd never heard of, or join a religion, or, or (all of which his technique seems eminently suited to) ....... using that approach, I'd walk rapidly in the opposite direction.

 

Which isn't to deny the possibility that alien life exists, or even to deny the possiblity that it has been, or is, here. Its just to say that I don't find that particular individual credible on the basis of that video. I think the word that they use for it in the US is "huckster".

 

 

 

 

Edited June 22, 2021 by Nearholmer

[brossard]

Don't know if Elizondo is really a huckster.  You really need to check out the History Channel series "Unidentified:  Inside America's UFO Investigation".  Elizondo travels the world investigating sightings and interviewing a lot of influential people.  The show features some very credible people, including Chris Mellon, former Asst Defense Secretary.

 

https://www.history.co.uk/shows/unidentified

 

Chile is very interesting and is alleged to have the most UFO sightings, possibly due to difficult to inhabit parts of the country (desert, wilderness).

 

While, from what I've seen and read, the evidence for UFOs is pretty clear, that they are operated by extraterrestrials is less clear.  The possiblity that these things are deep black super secret defense projects needs to be ruled out first.

 

Scientists will tell you that extraterrestrial life will exist.  They also say that given the distance from the star system that they inhabit and danger that such travel entails, there is nothing in our solar system to entice these people to make the trip.

 

John

[PatB]

Which rather suggests that Elizondo has a bit of a vested interest in keeping the whole gravy train rolling. 

[Ron Ron Ron]

44 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

....Which isn't to deny the possibility that alien life exists, or even to deny the possiblity that it has been, or is, here. Its just to say that I don't find that particular individual credible on the basis of that video. I think the word that they use for it in the US is "huckster".

 

 

He isn't saying it's extraterrestrial life that's behind these phenomena, but that is only one possibility.

In fact he's cautioning against making those sort of assumptions.

I think the spiel is more aimed at making his point understandable to a lay person (this is in America after all, but it would apply here as well).

 

Whether or not he's trying to make a new career out of his previous involvement with the Pentagon, isn't really the point.

 

 

.

[boxbrownie]

3 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

 

 

Which isn't to deny the possibility that alien life exists.

 

 

 

 

Oh it definitely exists……no doubt whatsoever, but where and in what form is anyone’s guess, and I am as sure it exists as I am we will never ever find any…….well none we can actually communicate with, let alone allow him to phone home. 

[F-UnitMad]

21 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

I got into a bit of a debate with my brother in law on Sunday, which I quickly let drop for fear of creating ill-feeling, because he had picked-up on a load of similar stuff about the “Wuhan Lab Leak” thing.

Do be sure to tell him about the two Chinese scientists who were going to blow the whistle on the laboratory near Wuhan that let the Covid 19 virus get out.
Apparently these two scientists bought airline tickets to Japan, but went missing whilst heading to the airport. They were never seen again.

 

There's going to be a film made about it. The working title is "Two Wongs don't make a Flight."

 

 

......

 

[Reorte]

15 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

Oh it definitely exists……no doubt whatsoever, but where and in what form is anyone’s guess, and I am as sure it exists as I am we will never ever find any…….well none we can actually communicate with, let alone allow him to phone home. 

I wouldn't completely rule out the possibility of picking up radio signals at some point; I don't think we know enough to really judge the odds of that, can't reasonably rule out anything between "very likely" and "almost definitely not."

 

Non-intelligent life not from Earth though, all those icy moons with subsurface oceans are a distinct possibility.

[Gibbo675]

On 21/06/2021 at 15:04, Ron Ron Ron said:

In the run up to the official US government release of information, relating to AATIP and Unidentified Aerial Phenomena (UAP), there has been an increasing amount of discussion and articles published in the media.

Apart from the usual dismissive tone from some quarters, the subject is being treated quite seriously by some respectable publications and media outlets.

 

The number of former senior officials who have spoken publicly, may even suggest that a "softening up" exercise may be being carried out, prior to the public disclosure of the report.

 

The Washington Post carried out this interview with former AATIP director, Luis Elizondo, last week.

 

It's 31 minutes long, so needs your attention.

Whatever preconceptions you may hold, the points being made between 10.30 and 13.00 minutes, should make any rational human take note.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

Hi Folks,

 

Luis Elizondo is a rank amateur, you need to look up Bon Lazar for the very best in top quality American nonsense:

 

 

I had a good laugh at this one as well:

 

 

Enjoy,

 

Gibbo.

[rob D2]

There’s a fair bit of evidence Lazar worked where he said he did .

 

Whilst there is a question mark over where these items come from , there’s so much evidence from credible sources that you’d have to be a flat earth banjo player to say “ UFOs don’t exist “.

 

They obviously do, ( although I’m more intrigued by the under water version ) , and it’s a bit of a false flag stateside .They can outclass anything the US have , “ Oh we are only interested to the tune of $22m a year “. 
 

yeah right, either they know what they are , or there’s a lot of hidden budget there 

[Steamport Southport]

On 22/06/2021 at 10:15, tomparryharry said:

I used to see UFO. Quite a good band in the 1970's.

 

 

Still going. Saw them about two years ago.

 

I think that was titled the Last Orders tour. Now there are dates for 2022 so I don't think they're giving up just yet!

 

http://www.ufo-music.info/

[Mad McCann]

Oh, I'm pretty sure there are advanced, intelligent civilisations out there.

 

Probably intelligent enough to lock their doors as they fly through Earth space... 

 

Davy.

[Gibbo675]

Hi Folks,

 

Just for the fun of it:

 

 

Gibbo.

 

[rob D2]

Found another one in the internet where it is timed over the distance and is doing 2026mph....the intriguing thing is the fact it is rotating longitudinally as it goes. Seems their propulsion doesn’t really rely on orientation or the pointy end !

[boxbrownie]

11 hours ago, rob D2 said:

Found another one in the internet where it is timed over the distance and is doing 2026mph....the intriguing thing is the fact it is rotating longitudinally as it goes. Seems their propulsion doesn’t really rely on orientation or the pointy end !

Your just jealous now 

[Nick C]

12 hours ago, rob D2 said:

Found another one in the internet where it is timed over the distance and is doing 2026mph....the intriguing thing is the fact it is rotating longitudinally as it goes. Seems their propulsion doesn’t really rely on orientation or the pointy end !

 

Whoever made that one up presumably doesn't actually know much about flight - 2000mph is roughly the speed of an SR-71 Blackbird, to even get into space you need to be going much faster than that, with average orbital speed being around 17,000mph and Earth's escape velocity being roughly 25,000mph. If you wanted to actually travel interstellar, you'd need another couple of  orders of magnitude on top of that - the distance to the nearest star is about 4.37 light years, or 25 trillion miles - that's 4 and a half years at 670,616,629 mph.