Okehampton Railway re-opening

[Hal Nail]

On 24/01/2022 at 12:41, Kris said:

There are only a limited number of people in the right age group who live in Okehampton, 200-300. 

 

Bit surprised this revelation hasn't attracted more comment. Must be something in the water - 100 is seen as a good innings where I live.

Edited February 3, 2022 by Hal Nail

[Not Jeremy]

Regarding the reinstatement of the whole route, the forum attached to the "Join Up" website that I mentioned some while ago has now been set up.

 

Join Up

 

Should any of you wish to join in, then you will need to register to access the forum.

Edited February 19, 2022 by Not Jeremy
English

[Northmoor]

35 minutes ago, Not Jeremy said:

Regarding the reinstatement of the whole route, the forum attached to the "Join Up" website that I mentioned some while ago has now been set up.

 

Join Up

 

Should any of you wish to join in, then you will need to register to access the forum.

I've started looking at the background and while it's professionally-produced, it doesn't help when it makes simple errors of fact, like:

 

"Dr. Richard Beeching decided that only one railway line was needed between Exeter and Plymouth, and that the northern route via Okehampton was a costly duplication. British Rail bosses agreed with him and the coastal route through Dawlish prevailed". 

Dr Beeching WAS the boss of British Railways, it was government ministers who agreed with him.

 

"According to Devon Maritime Forum, the economic impact, which includes the tourist and fishing industries, could be anything from £60m to £1.2bn".

I'm not sure of the value of quoting a study which could only estimate economic impact within a range of values where the maximum was TWENTY TIMES the minimum.

 

In a classic case of drawing attention to the facts that support your favoured result and glossing over those that support other results, are these:

OPTION DESCRIPTION (BCR)

1 Business as usual (Not shown)

2 Strengthen the sea wall and other structures in the Dawlish area (Not shown)

3 Alternative Route A - Reinstate the former LSWR route from Exeter to Plymouth via Okehampton and Tavistock as advocated by JoinUp and others (0.14)

4 Alternative Route B - Reinstate the Teign Valley Line from Newton Abbot to Exeter via Chudleigh (0.29)

 

It also includes the statement, "There is doubt as to whether a resilient railway is practical on this route", without elaborating on why, because even despite that, the BCR is more than twice that of the LSWR route.  If it means Route B doesn't address the "Cowley Bridge problem", they're right, it doesn't but without the proposed spur shown on maps, neither does the LSWR route, the business case for which almost certainly didn't include this spur.

 

Overall, the site shows lots of enthusiasm but less obvious professional knowledge, it's basically just a (understandably biased) petition website.

[gwrrob]

This line has made the news today as passenger numbers since reopening have exceeded expectations.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-62736152

[ess1uk]

Excellent news 

let’s hope there are more upgrades 

[ess1uk]

Where was the flooding that shut the line?

[Northmoor]

1 hour ago, ess1uk said:

Where was the flooding that shut the line?

I didn't hear about flooding on the line but if it wasn't at Cowley Bridge Junction I'd be surprised.  The point that is missed by the Dartmoor "Route Re-openers"; in the last half-century CBJ has been closed much more often the Dawlish seawall section.

[2251]

A serious upgrade took place at Cowley Bridge Jct a few years ago to improve flood resilience so the possibility of the issue being there should be very much lower than it used to be.

[Not Jeremy]

23 minutes ago, Northmoor said:

I didn't hear about flooding on the line but if it wasn't at Cowley Bridge Junction I'd be surprised.  The point that is missed by the Dartmoor "Route Re-openers"; in the last half-century CBJ has been closed much more often the Dawlish seawall section.

“Route Reopeners”, here we go again, another negative cobblersfest of how impossible everything is, can’t you just give it a rest pal?

 

By the way, have you travelled on the reopened line to Okehampton yet? It is lovely, you’d really enjoy it…

 

[jcredfer]

19 minutes ago, 2251 said:

A serious upgrade took place at Cowley Bridge Jct a few years ago to improve flood resilience so the possibility of the issue being there should be very much lower than it used to be.

 

I remember the old days flooding at CBJ, with the massive flooding in the mid 50s.  That backed up all the way to Crediton and into lower areas of Exeter, blocking the roads too, Staff and Pupils at St Thomas and nearby places had to be evacuated by Army DUWKs.  [Mother was most impressed with her rescue!]  The issue was quickly addressed with the flood prevention scheme just below CB and into Exeter. The improvement was dramatic, with CBJ seldom even getting the sleepers wet.  Any closures due to flooding thereafter, were minor and short lived, so quite different to the closures at Dawlish.  

 

 

[Not Jeremy]

More Good news

[Not Jeremy]

The "join up" website fizzled out, but the idea just won't lay down.

 

 

[KeithMacdonald]

@Not Jeremy - thanks for posting links, appreciated, but some of us are not users of FaecesBorg.  Any chance of a quote?

[Not Jeremy]

Outline business case for Plymouth to Tavistock submitted November 22, outcome awaited.

 

Modern Railways appraisal railways around Dartmoor

 

This image from the Facebook group.

 

 

 

[Wickham Green too]

0.5tph seems a very odd measure ...... I'm trying to visualise half a train arriving every hour ! ☹️ ....................... if they mean a train every two hours, why don't they say so !

[Reorte]

3 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

0.5tph seems a very odd measure ...... I'm trying to visualise half a train arriving every hour ! ☹️ ....................... if they mean a train every two hours, why don't they say so !

Maybe the plan's for a train that splits at Bere Alston :)

[Wickham Green too]

10 minutes ago, Reorte said:

Maybe the plan's for a train that splits at Bere Alston :)

.... half of which stops all-stations from Plymouth !

[Jeremy Cumberland]

21 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

0.5tph seems a very odd measure ...... I'm trying to visualise half a train arriving every hour ! ☹️ ....................... if they mean a train every two hours, why don't they say so !

I suppose that if you read of a population density of 0.5 people per square kilometre you'd imagine census taking to be rather a gruesome activity, rather than merely involving long journeys between houses.

[osbornsmodels]

good luck to Tavistock (pop. 11000) but a much better investment would surely be to re-connect Bideford to the rail system

Bideford is the fourth largest town within the Devon County Council area with an estimated population for the Built Up Urban Area of 31,500. yet no direct public transport services to Plymouth, Bristol or London

[Wickham Green too]

Trouble with Bideford is all the population is the opposite side of the Torridge from the old station ( or any alternative ) - and once the people are in their cars .......................................

[Jeremy Cumberland]

18 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

Trouble with Bideford is all the population is the opposite side of the Torridge from the old station ( or any alternative ) - and once the people are in their cars .......................................

It's very similar to Barnstaple, and to Derry/Londonderry for that matter. The distance from Bideford itself to the old station is typical for many towns, where people are happy to walk to the station, but Westward Ho! and Appledore might want a connecting bus service.

 

1 hour ago, osbornsmodels said:

Bideford is the fourth largest town within the Devon County Council area with an estimated population for the Built Up Urban Area of 31,500. yet no direct public transport services to Plymouth, Bristol or London

Of course, even if Bideford got a rail service, there still wouldn't be direct services to Plymouth, Bristol or London. Is there really no bus service to Plymouth?

[Oldddudders]

My limited understanding of the road network in Devon - says he, sitting in Torquay - is that there are good roads around the coastal areas (A38 is dual carriageway, A39 not), and inland the now-excellent A30 heading for Cornwall, but across the county rather less so. And north Devon probably prefers Exeter to Plymouth. 

[osbornsmodels]

Quote

Is there really no bus service to Plymouth?

there used to be the 118 service and a change at Tavistock. Now no longer.

Quote

 And north Devon probably prefers Exeter to Plymouth. 

True but there is no option and to get to Exeter by bus is a 2hr 10 min ride or you can catch a train from Barnstaple after a 30 min bus ride to the station from Bideford. For the record there is not a single yard of dual carriageway in Torridge District but don't get me started on depravation and levelling up.

[Pacific231G]

2 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

0.5tph seems a very odd measure ...... I'm trying to visualise half a train arriving every hour ! ☹️ ....................... if they mean a train every two hours, why don't they say so !

It's a perfectly rational way of expressing the frequency . 0.5tph is six characters and fits in with frequency measures for other lines.  1 train/2hours is rather more to put on a legend and would be different from the way it's expressed for other lines.  

[KingEdwardII]

2 hours ago, osbornsmodels said:

no direct public transport services to Plymouth, Bristol or London

 

1 hour ago, Jeremy Cumberland said:

Is there really no bus service to Plymouth?

There really is no direct bus service to Plymouth. Or Bristol.

 

But there is a twice daily National Express bus to/from London Victoria, which is routed nowhere near Plymouth - takes over 6 hours.

 

Train from Barnstaple shows between 3h 30 and 4h to Paddington. Add up to 30 mins for bus from Bideford.

 

Yours, Mike.