locomotive kits 30368's Workbench SR Loco's with a bit of LNER

[30368]

13 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

I normally use Gibson wheels and clearances are designed with those in mind.

 

I use Gibson wheels too Mike but these were very cheap and the older Markits wheels have deep flanges so some attention necessary, should have room for the brake hangers now.

 

I have now soldered the running plate valances to the running plate. On the V4 these are fairly shallow making alignment tricky. I soldered the front section first, it gently curves inward. I then used hairclips to act as a heat sink for what I had just soldered and a second to locate the next section to solder. I worked back towards the cab. It went well and looks fine. If you are building one of these don't forget to punch all the tiny rivet detail marked on the valance etch. I should add that the running plate edge is "slotted" which makes location of the valance easier.

 

 I tried to use the minimum of solder because many of the crossmembers on the chassis locate on the running plate - still a little more cleaning up to do.

 

The smokbox saddle front/back have been folder over too.

 

Off to the garden now, Mrs B insists and who could blame her!

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

Edited May 14, 2023 by 30368

[John Tomlinson]

On 13/05/2023 at 10:41, 30368 said:

The rear pony truck has been assembled, I added brass bearings to aid smooth running. I then focused on the rear frame extensions that supports the firebox and cab. My plan was to located these critical components in the mainframe slot behind the trailing driver by fitting a beam in the slot which would protrude beyond the mainframe (and be the mounting point of the curved plate support for the firebox to be found on all LNER wide firebox locomotives). The frame extensions, which also have a slot in, could then be positively located at the mainframe end.

 

Before proceeding, one final shot of 30368 now it is weathered. When I grow tired of the look I will clean the loco with cotton buds.

 

 

To return to the K4, this image shows the pony truck and the two frame extensions you can just make out the slots in the mainframe and in the extensions.

 

I have soldered the beam to the mainframe slot and offered up the L/H frame extension ready for soldering.

 

Remember what I said earlier about Judith Edge kits being closer to building a real locomotive, this image reinforces that view. Solder still to clean up a bit more.

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

I'm sure you've stated this somewhere before, so please forgive the question.

 

Is your loco weathering done solely with powders? It seems very effective to me. I've never been comfortable painting weathering on a loco, especially one that is nicely lined (even more so if I've done it!). I have tried a few coaches with powders, and been pleasantly surprised by the results, whilst they don't come off that easily a damp cotton bud is great for correcting things that have gone a bit far.

 

Many thanks,

 

John.

[30368]

5 hours ago, John Tomlinson said:

Is your loco weathering done solely with powders?

 

Hi John,

 

Until the H15 that I completed for Phil (Mallard60022), where I used very lightly applied frame dirt paint, all my weathering was based on powders. I have started to use aerosol cans for valve gear and underframes, very lightly applied, and then use powders to get the variation in colour and tone that is required. I also use vallejo washes on underframes to replicate oil stains. You can see this effect on the 30368's underframe and wheels.

On loco bodies I generally use powders so that I can clean it off again to create the effect of loco cleaning leaving dirt/rust etc in all the nooks and crannies. Around running plate mounted lubricators I use washes. On inside cylindered loco's I use black washes on the underside of boilers to replicate all the oil thrown off the inside motion.

 

Hope that helps John, give it a try.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

Edited May 14, 2023 by 30368

[30368]

Coupling rods on today. Probably tread water a bit now until the gearbox arrives. I'm not complaing I have only just ordered it! I would like to tackle the boiler and firebox soon as this is perhaps (for me) going to be the biggest challenge on this build. Whilst I had no real problems with the Judith Edge ex GCR B9 4-6-0, which also required me to roll a boiler and firebox*, this was a parallel boiler. We shall see!

 

 

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

Edited May 16, 2023 by 30368

[30368]

Made a start on the boiler assembly today. The smokebox and front two boiler rings are all parallel so that is where I started.

 

This is the template, from the top is the tapered third ring, next is the smokebox inner and first two boiler rings and the piece of 10 thou brass is for this section. The last image on the template is the smokebox wrapper.

 

THe front part sof the boiler and smokebox is now complete. I made two smokebox wrappers, 10 thou and the outer one is 5 thou brass sheet. As far as I can see from the images of the prototype, no snap rivets were used.

 

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

[Michael Edge]

I would have built and fitted the cab before starting on the boiler, you won’t be able to work out the firebox without the cab frint in place.

[30368]

9 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

I would have built and fitted the cab before starting on the boiler, you won’t be able to work out the firebox without the cab frint in place.

 

Thanks Michael I intend to. Firebox template V1.0 complete so we shall see how that works out.

 

KInd regards,

 

Richard B

[30368]

Cab spectacle plate soldered in position and leading and trailing pony trucks made up and fitted. I have taken a good few pictures of the firebox wrapper since this is largely scratch building.

 

Tapered boiler ring soldered - template supplied is spot on.

To assist alignment and soldering of taper to the parallel section of the boiler I soldered some 5 thou brass strips inside the tapered section. Sorry about poor snap. It went together well but required a little filler as well.

 

Using the excellent dawing supplied with the etches together with my Isinglass drawing (drg 4/400) I made a template up and then cut the firebox wrapper from 5 thou brass sheet since it requires some complex curves. The rest of the boiler is 10 thou sheet. "Rolling" the firebox wrapper.

 

Template and wrapper. The template was offered up to the running plate/cab spec. to check fit and a little trimming was necessary. The brass was cut to Version 2.0 of the template.

 

I have decided to use Markits boiler washout plugs so the wrapper had to be marked out for these.

 

This image shows the completed wrapper with washout plugs soldered in position (still two more per side for surface mounting, supplied with etch) and the various bolts etc that locate the wrapper to the firebox.

Temp fit of firebox wrapper to the boiler. Looks fairly good I think. Still some more adjustment to the wrapper needed before it is soldered in position.

 

Obviously the "firebox" that we see is nothing of the sort it is a sheet steel wrapper. Under this is the copper firebox and insulation. So to complete the firebox I need to make up four, perhaps six more parts. Firstly two more wrappers that cover the firebox front, these will be tricky since they have compound curves. Also the firebox foundation ring, and all its rivet heads, is visable just above the frame extensions. So I will have to make up a few parts of the firebox proper to complete the task.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

Edited May 18, 2023 by 30368

[Mallard60022]

19 hours ago, 30368 said:

Cab spectacle plate soldered in position and leading and trailing pony trucks made up and fitted. I have taken a good few pictures of the firebox wrapper since this is largely scratch building.

 

Tapered boiler ring soldered - template supplied is spot on.

To assist alignment and soldering of taper to the parallel section of the boiler I soldered some 5 thou brass strips inside the tapered section. Sorry about poor snap. It went together well but required a little filler as well.

 

Using the excellent dawing supplied with the etches together with my Isinglass drawing (drg 4/400) I made a template up and then cut the firebox wrapper from 5 thou brass sheet since it requires some complex curves. The rest of the boiler is 10 thou sheet. "Rolling" the firebox wrapper.

 

Template and wrapper. The template was offered up to the running plate/cab spec. to check fit and a little trimming was necessary. The brass was cut to Version 2.0 of the template.

 

I have decided to use Markits boiler washout plugs so the wrapper had to be marked out for these.

 

This image shows the completed wrapper with washout plugs soldered in position (still two more per side for surface mounting, supplied with etch) and the various bolts etc that locate the wrapper to the firebox.

Temp fit of firebox wrapper to the boiler. Looks fairly good I think. Still some more adjustment to the wrapper needed before it is soldered in position.

 

Obviously the "firebox" that we see is nothing of the sort it is a sheet steel wrapper. Under this is the copper firebox and insulation. So to complete the firebox I need to make up four, perhaps six more parts. Firstly two more wrappers that cover the firebox front, these will be tricky since they have compound curves. Also the firebox foundation ring, and all its rivet heads, is visable just above the frame extensions. So I will have to make up a few parts of the firebox proper to complete the task.

Kind regards,

Richard B

Oooooof. Smart Engineering Richard.

There is something about shiny Brass (Counselling needed for me I think?).

Phil

[30368]

Phil,

 

I share, to some extent, your love of shiny brass, but only in connection with little locomotives. In contrast, I find the love of shiny horse brasses, suspect, if not downright dangerous.

Perhaps I need therapy (good band by the way) too?

 

Really like the work you are doing on your layout in, what I assume, is the loft? Great work.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

[30368]

Alas my firebox template was a bit short leaving a gap between firebox and footplate so I had to insert a section on each side. I thought I might wait until filler had been applied and smoothed down to the correct profile before showing any images. However, in my experience, when scratch building, mistakes happen, so I thought I would update you in "warts and all" style.

 

The gap is very apparent in this image. The two 5 thou brass sections will be soldered between the boiler and the firebox leading edge forming the compound curve created by Gresley's wide firebox design.

 

The brass sections above have been soldered in position and filler applied but not yet cleaned up. Looks a bit of a mess!

 

Bag of goodies arrived from Paul at PDK kits all needed to complete the build. Thanks Paul, great service.

 

 

 

Kind reagrds,

 

Richard B

[Mallard60022]

2 minutes ago, 30368 said:

Alas my firebox template was a bit short leaving a gap between firebox and footplate so I had to insert a section on each side. I thought I might wait until filler had been applied and smoothed down to the correct profile before showing any images. However, in my experience, when scratch building, mistakes happen, so I thought I would update you in "warts and all" style.

 

The gap is very apparent in this image. The two 5 thou brass sections will be soldered between the boiler and the firebox leading edge forming the compound curve created by Gresley's wide firebox design.

 

The brass sections above have been soldered in position and filler applied but not yet cleaned up. Looks a bit of a mess!

 

Bag of goodies arrived from Paul at PDK kits all needed to complete the build. Thanks Paul, great service.

 

 

 

Kind reagrds,

 

Richard B

PDK and Paul are REALLY helpful with bits like that. I even got Tender Rea lamps for a Bulleid Pacific recently (not full size ones...). I had acquired a slightly damaged Pacific for next to nowt and now it's a as good as new; Valve Gear from Lendons of Cardiff.

P

[30368]

I have now cleaned up all the filler and "flash" painted the firebox area to show up any areas that required further filler. Looks fairly good now. I have been working on the cab area to check how drastic the changes to the V2 backhead will be.

 

PS - Does anyone make an LNER verticle reverser casting?

 

Cab sides have been tacked in place. I have used 0.5mm brass wire for the cab edge beading. LNER engines have very pronounced beading on tender and loco compared to, say, the SR.

 

The V2 backhead sides were cut away and the edges filed back until the width and profile was correct for the V4. In this image, the etched cab floor is almost ready for fitting.

I will use brass sheeting to cover the gaps left by removing the firebox sides from the casting. Very pleased with the look of the cab edging. Just noticed that the body has not been fitted to the chassis correctly!

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

Edited May 23, 2023 by 30368

[Mallard60022]

8 minutes ago, 30368 said:

I have now cleaned up all the filler and "flash" painted the firebox area to show up any areas that required further filler. Looks fairly good now. I have been working on the cab area to check how drastic the changes to the V2 backhead will be.

 

PS - Does anyone make an LNER verticle reverser casting?

 

Cab sides have been tacked in place. I have used 0.5mm brass wire for the cab edge beading. LNER engines have very pronounced beading on tender and loco compared to, say, the SR.

 

The V2 backhead sides were cut away and the edges filed back until the width and profile was correct for the V4. In this image, the etched cab floor is almost ready for fitting.

I will use brass sheeting to cover the gaps left by removing the firebox sides from the casting. Very pleased with the look of the cab edging. Just noticed that the body has not been fitted to the chassis correctly!

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

Mr Wright would know about the Reverser casting.

P

[30368]

I have now discoverd that when I produced the template for the firebox I referenced the bottom of the firebox to the wrong section of the running plate, in actual fact the footstep instead of the cab level! As a result:

 

a) The firebox was around 5mm too short and

b) The four a side boiler washout plugs were too high on the firebox side by about 4-5mm.

All very embarrassing but retrievable without starting again. I had already extended the legnth of the firebox and now bit the bullet and removed the washout plugs, plugged the holes and re-drilled in the correct position and re-fitted the washout plugs. I am now satisfied with the basic body form and will now complete the chassis.

 

Perhaps I should not have mentioned my errors just pressed on and said nothing. I don't think that is right somehow, I am an amateur loco builder and like any of us, prone to make mistakes during, what is for me, a learning process. The lesson for me is slow down a bit and check and double check and don't get carried away with the novelty and detail of, in this case, a major sub-component. Secondly, don't dispair, most cock-up can be rectified.

 

I thought it might be interesting to compare my Crownline V2, built in 2021, with the V4. Little and Large?

 

That is much better!

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

[Michael Edge]

 

57 minutes ago, 30368 said:

Perhaps I should not have mentioned my errors just pressed on and said nothing. I don't think that is right somehow, I am an amateur loco builder and like any of us, prone to make mistakes during, what is for me, a learning process. The lesson for me is slow down a bit and check and double check and don't get carried away with the novelty and detail of, in this case, a major sub-component. Secondly, don't dispair, most cock-up can be rectified.

 

That's the same process we've all used - some of us have just been at it a bit longer.

[30368]

Before completing the valve and brake gear and pickups and then assembly, the frames need to be painted. However before that I need to fit the trailing pony wheel axlebox/spring assembly to the frame extensions.

 

Cartazzi spring/axlebox casting fitted.

 

Must do some more fine emery work! View to illustrate how much firebox etc will protrude below the running plate so more firebox sections to make up.

 

And some detail added. Using 5 thou brass sheet, the hornblock retaining bracket and spring safety straps fitted.

 

 

Kind regards,

 

 

Richard B

Edited May 25, 2023 by 30368

[30368]

Been busy on the garden etc..

The valve gear frets are very fine, in many cases too fine to open out to accept 16BA set screws so I have used 0.6mm brass wire in places but have now found a stock of very fine soft iron rivets so will give them a try. Valve gear all cut out and prepared just needs assembly.

 

I have now moved on to setting the worm gear clearances which always seem to need more effort than expected. Anyway now ok and chassis undergoing running in.

 

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

Edited June 5, 2023 by 30368

[Michael Edge]

They aren't designed to take screw fastenings, I assemble motion with Duchess pins which are .45mm diameter, these are soldered.

[30368]

3 minutes ago, Michael Edge said:

They aren't designed to take screw fastenings, I assemble motion with Duchess pins which are .45mm diameter, these are soldered.

 

Thanks Mike. Not a criticism on my part - the etches are very accurate to prototype, I have just had to adapt to a finer level of construction. I have used 16BA for con rod small end but too large elsewhere. I shall get hold of some Duchess pins asap.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

[30368]

I have ordered various Duches pins in brass and steel for the valve gear.

 

Meanwhile I have continue with the body adding the splashers and boiler bands. The cast smokebox door has been modified with brass rivet strip to replicate the original. I couldn't resist fitting the boiler mountings and the model starts to look like the prototype, this helps focus. I am going to model 61701 in later years after the frame mounted rail guards had been removed and pony wheel splashers/shields (?) fitted. The A1 Loco company Highlander is some way away!

 

I should add that the loco runs so very smoothly and is very silent - those Highlevel gearboxes are good. Some work to do with pony wheel to cylinder front clearance! 

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

[30368]

Whilst awaiting parts on order, I have worked on the front end of the loco, the oil boxes and those parts of the cylinder monoblock that are visable. I know that Peter Coster (The Book of the V2s includes the V4s) suggests that the V4's did not have a monoblock cylinder casting I am fairly certain that they did. The steam pipe arrangements around the smokebox saddle are very much the same as the V2 arrangement on those loco's that retained the monoblock casting.

 

The three oil pots fitted to the front end.

 

The V4s, in common with the monblock V2s, have an asymetric steam pipe arrangement to the cylinders. The firemans side has a smaller monoblock casting visable and the cover over the steam pipe is smaller.

Drivers side has more of the monoblock visable and the cover over the steam pipe is also larger than the firemans side. Odd bits of white metal filed down. The steam pipe covers made from 5 thou brass sheet bent and cut to profile. I had to make three due to the bane of my workbench, or correctly me - ping!! never to be seen again until you are looking for something else that has gone flying. I guess I am loosing a bit of sensitivity at the ends of my fingers.

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

Edited June 9, 2023 by 30368

[30368]

Not done too much today - glued to the screen watching the Le Mans 24 Hours - fabulously wonderful race.

 

Did manage to do some work to the valve gear though.

 

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

[hayfield]

3 hours ago, 30368 said:

Not done too much today - glued to the screen watching the Le Mans 24 Hours - fabulously wonderful race.

 

Did manage to do some work to the valve gear though.

 

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

Richard

 

That is a very impressive piece of work with the valve gear

[30368]

17 hours ago, hayfield said:

That is a very impressive piece of work with the valve gear

 

Many thanks John, much appreciated.

 

Here it is again all connected up (except for reverser lifting link) and running very smoothly. Connected using brass pins (Mike Edge's suggestion) and 16BA, where appropriate. How am I going to explain the presence of a V4 on 70D to the shedmaster? Locomotive exchanges? Possible replacement for those tricky Light Pacifics? I don't think so......

 

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

Edited June 12, 2023 by 30368