2021 hopes

[DutyDruid]

10 hours ago, adb968008 said:

 

I do suspect the demand for 1960-1990s Southern mk1 EMUs, and think its a vocal minority building on Southern interests rather than a rabid hobbyist group demanding units. I think 1st generation WCML ohle EMUs would have a more surprising demand, but the lobbyists aren't loud enough.

 

 

This raises some interesting thoughts.

 

When I made the transition from train set to model railway my interests lay very firmly with the "current scene" which at that point was various forms of WCML OHE traction and the early stages of containerisation of freight, all that was readily available RTR at that point.  It wasn't until Hornby shifted production to China that I really got back into what I had grown up with - which was very definitely BR(S) 50s/60s - and I think that was about the launch of the Merchant Navy, but I was never really satisfied with my lot until I discovered kits of BR(S) EMUs and latterly both main manufacturers started producing units.

 

Someone somewhere else in this thread has made the comment about the ubiquitous GWR branch line and the fact that the the stock for it was always fairly readily available, which was why for years the modelling press was flooded with that genre of layout - but GWR branch lines have never really floated my boat because I had very little experience of the real thing.  My point here is that in that whole swath of the south coast from Kent through to Portsmouth and north to the West of England Mail Line and up to London CORS, BILs, HALs (and then latterly CEPs, CIGs, VEPs plus 2H/3H and the like) were mainly what we knew for passenger services and as several people have commented "we tend to like what we remember".

 

I think the reason the Southern lobby started gaining traction with the likes of Hornby was that when  - let's use the US term to  describe them - electronic rail fanning groups got going the Southern group (SEmG, now SReMG) actually got organised far better than groups representing the other areas of the rail network and as a result were able to "engage" far more successfully.  And that's the turning point, some cottage industry kit manufacturers recognised the hole in the market and started producing (DC Kits & Southern Pride to name what I think of as the best two), the big boys saw their success and jumped in.  The problem is, of course, that the two manufacturers I have named have moved out of kit production, I gather on the grounds that they can no longer compete because their kits run out at about the same cost as an RTR unit; sadly the products of some of the cottage industry manufacturers left behind IMHO do leave something to be desired.  

 

So there it is, we Southern MU Modellers were "under represented" for a very long time and it was the dawn of the electronic railfanning groups which gave us our voice, which has for the most part has been listened to.  The hope has to be that - having managed to shutdown the two successful kit manufacturers in this arena - the big two continue to support us.  And if they don't?  Well, I have a plan but it will require a lotto win to bring to fruition...

 

 

[adb968008]

2 hours ago, Robin Brasher said:

 

I would be pleased to see a Barnstaple locomotive in the Hornby range now that its West Country locomotive has an equal performance and a similar haulage capacity. Perhaps someone could set an endurance test between the to models.

just imagine if...

 

Hornby did make Barnstaple in 2021, in a Hornby Dublo candy stripe box, with a metal body and as a limited edition, just like 6231 this year....

Current 2020 era tooling / detail / paint standards.

 

I think if Hornby explored more metal body toolings, in strict limited editions (just 2 or 3 a year numbers of just one class per year ) using the Dublo brand, they could be on to a big money spinner.. much coveted like Bachmanns wooden box limiteds were in early the 1990s.

 

if 2020 produced just one gem of a new idea.. the revival of Dublo as a brand using 2020 detailed metal bodies would be it.

Edited December 19, 2020 by adb968008

[The Johnster]

Additionally, has a means of getting inside the cab if it’s a tank loco, diesel, electric or multiple unit (or Bullied Leader, including fireman’s compartment, or for that matter GT3).  And if it is a GW pannier, Dean Goods, or Dukedog, please can we have the option of top feed/no top feed, or removable top feed and plumbing.  And while we’re at it, posable sliding cab side screens on GW tank locos. 

[gc4946]

My guesses for next year:

 

GWR Saint because of the interest generated by the newly-created prototype;

All-new rebuilt Merchant Navy;

4 SUB because it'll become a One : One permanent museum exhibit in Margate

 

Introduction of the class 802 variant in Transpennine, Hull Trains and GWR liveries.

 

GWR bow-ended dining car (21st century version) - Margate produced one in the 70s/80s.

SR gangwayed luggage van and Pullman type Us to create Golden Arrow formations.

 

 

[Legend]

3 hours ago, gc4946 said:

 

 

Introduction of the class 802 variant in Transpennine, Hull Trains and GWR liveries.

 

 

 Strange that the LNER ones haven’t turned up yet . I think I remember that one of the factories that Hornby used had issues , was the owner retiring?  The IET and  a batch of the original Merchant Navies , specifically the BR blue one , were affected I think . Might account for delay . Neither have appeared . The TPE one was mentioned by mistake in 2020s catalogue so it was under consideration , just wondering if the lack of appearance of the LNER Azumas might have a knock on effect . 

[Guest Jack Benson]

There is a vast chasm between what we want and what we get. Every manufacturer must chose what we sell in sufficient volume to make a profit for shareholders and therein lies the rub for modellers. The annual UK 'wish' list lags behind list produced by German model media by a number of years and their efforts have been rewarded - almost every einheitslokomotive (standard) has become available and their industry has been scraping the barrel for some years. They too, have their one-off followers, mostly satisfied by the high end manufacturers but it worth noting that when Maerklin realeased the 'neverwazza' BR53 Mallet some thirty years ago it has yet to achieve half the volume of the more mundane BR38.10 upgrade released by Maerklin/Trix just thirteen years ago. In short, folk tend to buy what they know rather what they claim that they wanted.

 

If I was looking for a saleable product, it would need to be a prototype of sustained appea, that was well 'known' to the current purchasing demographic, had a wide geographic range and could be easily manufactured hopefully using existing components.

 

My own selfish interests are irrelevant unless they comply with the preceeding paragraph no matter how much I want to see 'my favourite' produced. Therefore I will simply suggest that the SR U class does tick those boxes even though I don't need one, the fact that it has been a consistent feature of list top five merely adds to its appeal. HOWEVER if I was looking for a left field contender, it would be the Billinton K-class if only because it is pretty loco and pretty goes a long way. 

 

Sorry, to all the other region followers, my apologies. This was prompted by a discussion elsewhere and it seemed worthwhile copying and pasting into this thread.

 

Stay Safe and Merry Christmas to all 

 

 

 

 

 

   

[adb968008]

2 hours ago, Legend said:

 Strange that the LNER ones haven’t turned up yet . I think I remember that one of the factories that Hornby used had issues , was the owner retiring?  The IET and  a batch of the original Merchant Navies , specifically the BR blue one , were affected I think . Might account for delay . Neither have appeared . The TPE one was mentioned by mistake in 2020s catalogue so it was under consideration , just wondering if the lack of appearance of the LNER Azumas might have a knock on effect . 

I’d say it increase its chances, the LNER and TPE could be produced at the same time.

it technically makes the TPE a non-event, whether they announced it in 2020 or 2021 it would still appear at the same time, just less headline waiting time, which always brings smiles.

 

I do wonder if some of 2020s announcements were delayed from 2019, if you remember many remarked how down deflated it seemed to previous years, 2021 could be the same, with 2020 bigged up for the event it was.

Edited December 19, 2020 by adb968008

[LMS_LNER_SR_GWR_fan2004]

Here’s my thoughts:

 

Steam:

A full-spec 9F Crosti

A WD 2-10-0

Possibly another influx of Railroad 9Fs, with preserved examples such as 92214 in its BR Green, 92134 as that has returned and possibly a rerun of Black Prince (that’ll probably be the case having just got hold of the 2000 limited edition!)

An S-160

 

Diesel/electric:

Any of the early AC electrics (classes 81-84)

43185 in its IC Swallow livery

The LNER Farewell HST

A rerelease of the EMT/EMR HST

Ex GC EMT HST

Blue Pullman HST

91119 in its IC Swallow livery

More class 87s, 87012 in its NSE livery or some DRS or GBRf 87s, or maybe 87101 in its late 90s BR Blue livery! I could see them doing a Bulgarian 87 as well to go with their European collection. (87004-8 perhaps?)

 

Coaches:

Mk4 coaches and DVTs

Retooled HST Mk3s and possibly the Oxford Mk3As but with minor changes to make them better suited, Mk3B coaches as well so then we can get a BFO, and more Mk3 DVTs in liveries such as Greater Anglia, LSL IC Swallow and unbranded BR Blue (82115)

 

The list goes on and on but they’re the main ones I can think of!

 

[The Johnster]

I'm puzzled a little by requests for the WD 2-10-0, a very small class under BR and limited to a short haul iron ore traffic flow on the southern bank of the River Clyde in an area that nobody seems to have ever modelledl.  In a way, my much derided Adam's Radial and Beattie Well Tank scenario, very few models operate on layouts based on Lyme Regis or Wenford Bridge, or the late Victorian or Edwardian London suburbs that were the locos's stamping grounds when they existed in numbers, is less puzzling, as Lyme Regis and Wenford Bridge were at least rural idylls, unlike the heavy industry backdrop to the WD 2-10-0 field of operation. 

 

Admittedly they would have some appeal for military railway or preservation layout modellers.

[GreenGiraffe22]

A small loco for today's small end to end layout and a nice follow on from the A1 could be an LBSCR D1 =)

 

Better still, a D1 Motor Train pack! =D 

 

https://mikemorant.smugmug.com/Trains-Railways-British-Isles/SR-and-BRS/LBSCR-tank-engines/i-z8MJ432

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, The Johnster said:

I'm puzzled a little by requests for the WD 2-10-0, a very small class under BR and limited to a short haul iron ore traffic flow on the southern bank of the River Clyde in an area that nobody seems to have ever modelledl.  In a way, my much derided Adam's Radial and Beattie Well Tank scenario, very few models operate on layouts based on Lyme Regis or Wenford Bridge, or the late Victorian or Edwardian London suburbs that were the locos's stamping grounds when they existed in numbers, is less puzzling, as Lyme Regis and Wenford Bridge were at least rural idylls, unlike the heavy industry backdrop to the WD 2-10-0 field of operation. 

 

Admittedly they would have some appeal for military railway or preservation layout modellers.

If Rule 1 applies to Radials and BWTs, it surely applies also to the more numerous WD 2-10-0. Personally, I'd consider a de-crostied Crosti 9F to be more sense if they must pick a 2-10-0.

 

John

 

 

Edited December 19, 2020 by Dunsignalling

[TravisM]

I think that both a WD 2-10-0 and S160 2-8-0 would make good bed partners as both used in the UK prior to D-Day and then in Europe both prior and after the end of WWII.  A boxed set of the pair would be awesome.

[SD85]

The WD 2-10-0 would be a niche model but nice to have. Also I reckon an obvious first production run of it would be the LMR's Gordon, and that would sell out fast I reckon (it's been used on the LMR, mainline railtours and on preserved lines). Apparently Kitmaster might have been planning to do one of the WD locos in the 60s (I think it was the 2-8-0 version perhaps) which would have been interesting.

 

I'll reiterate the desire for a U Class; I don't personally need one but it's just utterly illogical that no manufacturer AT ALL seems to have produced it and no retailer has commissioned one. People claim that it's too similar to the N but that's sort of like saying there's no point producing a 78xxx class because it's basically a slightly updated Ivatt 2MT, yet Hornby are producing one.

Edited December 19, 2020 by SD85

[TomScrut]

8 hours ago, adb968008 said:

10 hours ago, Legend said:

 Strange that the LNER ones haven’t turned up yet . I think I remember that one of the factories that Hornby used had issues , was the owner retiring?  The IET and  a batch of the original Merchant Navies , specifically the BR blue one , were affected I think . Might account for delay . Neither have appeared . The TPE one was mentioned by mistake in 2020s catalogue so it was under consideration , just wondering if the lack of appearance of the LNER Azumas might have a knock on effect . 

Expand  

I’d say it increase its chances, the LNER and TPE could be produced at the same time.

 

Saying that, we don't know why it didn't get announced.

 

It could be that it was realised that the tooling mods for 802s were more difficult/costly than originally anticipated.

 

A TPE 802 at least (not sure about GWR) has a smaller kitchen/food area meaning the saloon would intrude into the motor area.

[Steamport Southport]

A WD 2-10-0?

 

Yes. But only if it's 90775 Dame Vera Duckworth....

 

 

It was done as a joke when it was on the NYMR.

[Les1952]

Looking at the other end of the market than most of the 31 pages I've just waded through...

 

I'd like to see something that would attract Juniors and keep them interested for a bit longer-

 

An upgrade to the basic 0-4-0 starter sets with TTS sound and a basic DCC controller.  No more difficult to play with at a young age than a traditional analogue setup but a bit more bang for the buck.  They might need to follow the Bachmann route and use a basic 0-6-0 chassis instead.  There are a couple of old toolings that could be used for the body in the shorter term.

 

I'd also like to see an upgraded TTS chip that can sychronise the exhaust of a steam loco to the wheels.  I don't think I well see this one and will have to live with listening to 9Fs with 0.7 cylinders instead of the normal 2...

 

I would also like to see the A1/1 to complete the post-grouping LNER Pacifics.  I know it was considered a failure but its annual mileage while low by LNER standards was still above the average of WR front-line classes.

 

Also it is time for a J67/J69, but that class had so many variations and rebuilds that it seemed no two were alike, quite an achievement in a class of 140 or so engines. Realistically I'm not sure if any manufacturer wants to plough this particular minefield.

 

And lastly on my wishlist of the day someone needs to plug the gap with a Standard 3MT 2-6-0, not to mention the ex-NER types I'd like to see.

 

I suspect we WILL see more Peckett liveries and more Terriers as they seem to be the current cash cows.  

 

Just a few random thoughts.

Les

 

[MGR Hooper!]

7 hours ago, The Johnster said:

I'm puzzled a little by requests for the WD 2-10-0, a very small class under BR and limited to a short haul iron ore traffic flow on the southern bank of the River Clyde in an area that nobody seems to have ever modelledl.  In a way, my much derided Adam's Radial and Beattie Well Tank scenario, very few models operate on layouts based on Lyme Regis or Wenford Bridge, or the late Victorian or Edwardian London suburbs that were the locos's stamping grounds when they existed in numbers, is less puzzling, as Lyme Regis and Wenford Bridge were at least rural idylls, unlike the heavy industry backdrop to the WD 2-10-0 field of operation. 

 

Admittedly they would have some appeal for military railway or preservation layout modellers.

 

I'm even more puzzled at the numerous predictions/requests for a full spec Franco-Crosti 9F.

 

Is there even a market for 2 versions of the Franco-Crosti 9F??? Granted the Hornby Railroad one doesn't have all the bells and whistles. But as I heard, they added the Franco-Crosti 9F to the Hornby Railroad range because the real locos always carried a plain black livery and they had a chance to update the chassis on the BR Std 9F.

 

I really don't see a market for a full spec Franco-Crosti 9F along with a Hornby Railroad one and I'm absolutely puzzled by the amount if requests/predictions for it. 

[The Johnster]

I’d agree; we are unlikely to see a full fat Crosti 9F in a red box as long as they have the existing version; there is no point in competing with yourself!  It’s a bit too close to the standard 9F for Bachmann as well IMHO.  Heljan possibly; they have ‘form’ with big locos and small esoteric classes!

 

The Crosti 9F is different and weird enough to attract sales on that basis alone.  IIRC they were all allocated to LMR Midland division sheds, but they worked long haul jobs and ‘got about’ a bit; I saw one at Severn Tunnel Jc in 1964.  

[gc4946]

On 19/12/2020 at 08:08, gc4946 said:

My guesses for next year:

 

GWR Saint because of the interest generated by the newly-created prototype;

All-new rebuilt Merchant Navy;

4 SUB because it'll become a One : One permanent museum exhibit in Margate

 

Introduction of the class 802 variant in Transpennine, Hull Trains and GWR liveries.

 

GWR bow-ended dining car (21st century version) - Margate produced one in the 70s/80s.

SR gangwayed luggage van and Pullman type Us to create Golden Arrow formations.

 

 

 

A Urie S15 may also appear, this year would have been the centenary of its introduction, but model held back to be released next year.

Mk1 BCK could be on the cards with liveries including InterCity swallow charter livery with white roofs also applied on the FO and RBR.

[atom3624]

Pre-Grouping locomotives are becoming more 'interesting' it appears - even if we don't go right back to the Liverpool & Manchester ...

 

How about a full retool / re-introduction of the Singles - Midland and Stirling?

 

Al.

[Dunsignalling]

13 hours ago, SD85 said:

The WD 2-10-0 would be a niche model but nice to have. Also I reckon an obvious first production run of it would be the LMR's Gordon, and that would sell out fast I reckon (it's been used on the LMR, mainline railtours and on preserved lines). 

 

The problem might be working out how many (or few) would sell that weren't 'Gordon'.....

 

John

Edited December 20, 2020 by Dunsignalling

[TomScrut]

9 hours ago, Les1952 said:

An upgrade to the basic 0-4-0 starter sets with TTS sound and a basic DCC controller.  No more difficult to play with at a young age than a traditional analogue setup but a bit more bang for the buck.  They might need to follow the Bachmann route and use a basic 0-6-0 chassis instead.  There are a couple of old toolings that could be used for the body in the shorter term.

 

Or, a new DCC ready chassis for all the 0-4-0 and 0-6-0 stuff they sell? Whilst most of it is of no interest to me anyway I won't even consider anything not DCC ready, it's more messing about than I can be bothered with.

 

The rub is that anything I buy for my kids with a view to it going on my layout at some point needs to be DCC fitted so actually even stuff that's a bit of daft like a Santa train or whatever wouldn't be of any use to me.

[Dunsignalling]

7 hours ago, MGR Hooper! said:

 

I'm even more puzzled at the numerous predictions/requests for a full spec Franco-Crosti 9F.

 

Is there even a market for 2 versions of the Franco-Crosti 9F??? Granted the Hornby Railroad one doesn't have all the bells and whistles. But as I heard, they added the Franco-Crosti 9F to the Hornby Railroad range because the real locos always carried a plain black livery and they had a chance to update the chassis on the BR Std 9F.

 

I really don't see a market for a full spec Franco-Crosti 9F along with a Hornby Railroad one and I'm absolutely puzzled by the amount if requests/predictions for it. 

There probably isn't a market for a full-fat Crosti, and Hornby would be unlikely to do one without taking the opportunity to make a "normal" 9F to the same standard alongside it. Unfortunately the Bachmann one is good enough for it to be unlikely that Hornby could make one sufficiently better to induce us to replace ours.

 

I do consider, however, that a new version of the (perfectly adequate) existing Crosti to incorporate the mid-life alterations made by BR (c.1960) to make them work conventionally, would be a good idea.

 

I'd certainly have one.

 

John

Edited December 20, 2020 by Dunsignalling

[DutyDruid]

8 minutes ago, TomScrut said:

 

Or, a new DCC ready chassis for all the 0-4-0 and 0-6-0 stuff they sell? Whilst most of it is of no interest to me anyway I won't even consider anything not DCC ready, it's more messing about than I can be bothered with.

 

 

That's actually a staggeringly good idea @TomScrut, you would be staggered if you knew how many of those generic chassis and mechanisms are running around on freelance P4 and EM industrial layouts...  (see my previous post in this thread about the RailRoad Schools)

[eldomtom2]

Wasn't the generic 0-6-0 chassis made DCC ready a long time ago?