Hornby 2021 - Playtrains starter range

[Classsix T]

6 minutes ago, 009 micro modeller said:

I agree but I think it’s the amount of money sunk in one pastime/hobby that makes it either/or, as people can’t necessarily afford to do both (it goes for both kids and experienced adult railway modellers - a similar effect happens if you want to model in multiple scales but can only afford one). This is probably more of a concern for a parent buying stuff for their kids that they may or may not take a deeper interest in.

 

Definitely agree. I think this is true even when today’s railway is compared to the fairly recent past. My everyday experience of railways these days is commuting on Great Northern and Thameslink, with endless class 700s, the very similar-looking 717s and a few 387s, and the intercity services that run alongside them on the ECML are increasingly dominated by Azumas or variants thereof in various operators’ liveries. Even just a few years ago there was more variety on the GN suburban lines in terms of loco and EMU types, and the same probably applies elsewhere on the network. There are aspects of the GN and Thameslink lines that I find impressive and perhaps even interesting, but not as a subject for a model railway. I also find the new trains on the southern end of the ECML a bit lacking in character compared to the trains they replaced, but that’s a bit more of a subjective thing.

 

I don’t model these railways, instead usually focusing on industrial narrow gauge, which I tend to find more interesting. However, it helped that I had parents who had some interest in model railways, and that we regularly visited family in Wales which meant that I experienced some NG railways first hand as well.

Wrt your first point. I've found myself dropping in and out of the hobby of model railways. I modelled quite profusely when Lima products were on the market offering relatively cheap to buy gear of 1980’s prototypes.

As I grew into my late teens and twenties I gravitated back to prototype capturing the last best knockings of the post-privatisation era. Once railtour ticket prices breached the £80 mark I was done. Still did (and do) photography but can't find the enthusiasm for a largely multiple unit railway. 

 

So I tend to pump some of that money into recreating the 80s and 90s in miniature.

 

But my initial point was, throughout all of that, PlayStation has and always be a part of my life. And contrary to the increasing cost of admittedly better railway models, in relative terms video games have become better and better but remain in inflation terms unchanged.

 

C6T. 

[RJS1977]

I suspect the difference is that with video games, almost all the cost is the development cost.

 

With model trains, although the development costs are still significant, there is also a lot of manual assembly involved. And the more separate parts in a model (which seems to increase with each new generation of models), the more manual labour is needed and so the real-terms cost of the models increases.

[woodenhead]

14 hours ago, Classsix T said:

But my initial point was, throughout all of that, PlayStation has and always be a part of my life. And contrary to the increasing cost of admittedly better railway models, in relative terms video games have become better and better but remain in inflation terms unchanged.

 

C6T. 

But the market for video games has grown massively whereas railway modelling has not allowing development costs on video games to be spread over more sales.  Video games are built on engines that do a lot of the work making development of new games easier saving development costs and thus keeping prices down.

[Classsix T]

Quite so, I should have clarified my final point that a launch PS2 cost me £300 with the games retailing for about £45 tops. Twenty years on, the PS5 retails for a smidgen over £500 and the games £70 for the AAA big hitters. Not bad given the advances.

 

Gaming now makes more combined income than music and cinema, but it's often seen as something that competes for market with model railways. Sorry I don't get that.

 

C6T. 

[RJS1977]

By way of comparison, in 2001, a Hornby 61XX cost slightly under £45. The new Dapol one is £120.

[Steamport Southport]

11 minutes ago, RJS1977 said:

By way of comparison, in 2001, a Hornby 61XX cost slightly under £45. The new Dapol one is £120.

 

That's comparing two different things though.

 

Even in 2001 the Hornby (Airfix) 61XX was 25 years old and extremely dated. It came out in 1977!

 

Using the example of computer games that's like comparing Pong or Space Invaders with whatever the kids play now.

 

 

 

Jason

[Classsix T]

I will concur though that even if model railways and PlayStation (etc.) aren't directly competing against each other for little Johnny's (parents) cash, they are both vying for his time.

But that could be said of many things. When I was last modelling frequently there were only 5 terrestrial TV channels and t'internet was barely a thing!

 

I don't know if I were a kid now whether a toy trainset would be able to hold my attention if I had streaming TV and an iPad to entertain me?

Thus I maintain it's inherently the child's peer group responsible for the introduction of the railway that should be nurturing an interest in trains. The pertinent point to this thread being, have Hornby brought a product to market that Dad/Granddad/Uncle would be happy to buy believing it'll, if not amplify interest (such as Thomas toys do coupled with the video media) it will at the very least maintain that interest.

 

Personally I think Hornby are taking something of a gamble with this range. Colourful and playworthy no doubt, but I fear the lack of a marketing (TV & video) or real life tie-in (Italian prototypes, really?!) might not be a brilliant strategy.

 

I'd've done blatantly toy versions (I'm talking waaay simpler than Railroad) of prototypes using liveries I already had licences to produce!

Imagine little Johnny's delight at seeing his little train running around in the same basic form as the Freightliner Shed that he sees on the school run or Dad takes him to see at Ipswich.

 

But honestly, I do wish the best of luck to Hornby with these.

 

C6T. 

[Classsix T]

... And ffs, make sure that there is at least a modicum of recycled materials involved and plaster that AAAALLL the way through the marketing and box art.

 

C6T. 

[Steamport Southport]

20 hours ago, Classsix T said:

... And ffs, make sure that there is at least a modicum of recycled materials involved and plaster that AAAALLL the way through the marketing and box art.

 

C6T. 

 

What's that got to do with the price of fish?

 

If I buy a new product I want it NEW made from fresh materials not made from recycled trash. 

 

If you want recycled junk then make it yourself!

 

 

 

Jason

[SamThomas]

37 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

What's that got to do with the price of fish?

 

If I buy a new product I want it NEW made from fresh materials not made from recycled trash. 

 

If you want recycled junk then make it yourself!

 

 

 

Jason

Who really knows what products from the far east are actually made from ?

 

I expect we will find out in a few years.

[peach james]

On 16/01/2021 at 04:51, 009 micro modeller said:

 

Does that suggest they weren’t as commercially successful as hoped?

They still are available to some extent or another- 5258 is the "current" set, and klickpedia says it is still current, but I don't see it on playmobile.ca.  I'm not too bothered- my days of buying more playmo trains are over, as the niece has all of the battery operated ones :).  

[Phil Parker]

29 minutes ago, peach james said:

They still are available to some extent or another- 5258 is the "current" set, and klickpedia says it is still current, but I don't see it on playmobile.ca.  I'm not too bothered- my days of buying more playmo trains are over, as the niece has all of the battery operated ones :).  

 

Playmobil trains have been out of production for many years and now the garden railway fans are Hovering them up. Not sure you can deduce that they were unsuccessful, I suspect the producers (LGB) going bust on a regular basis didn't help. 

 

Mind you LGB  are now going strong and produce an excellent Lego compatible beginners set. 

[peach james]

Phil, there is an important question to ask:

 

WHICH Playmobile trains do you mean?

 

Because there are 3 distinct groups-
Faller Hit & Play Train (and E train) (1974(?)-1985)
LGB Era Playmobile (with metal rails & LGB Mechanisms) (1985-95-97)

Plastic Track Playmobile (which 5258 is the last set, a rather snazzy BoBo, a EMU(ish) thing, & a steam engine)  

https://www.klickypedia.com/themes/train/

As far as Lego trains go, there is a fair chance that we will see a secondary manufacturer made motor unit and transformer next year.  (FX Bricks).  They've already introduced 2 radius of curves larger than the Lego (40 stud) radius, and 32 & 8 L straights, with the intent of ~104r turnouts (in testing/pre production).   As far as I understand, they intend on introducing a power pick up that will allow the use of a pFX brick (bluetooth) to act as the intermediate to Power Functions motors.

James

 

[Phil Parker]

13 hours ago, peach james said:

Phil, there is an important question to ask:

 

WHICH Playmobile trains do you mean?

 

Because there are 3 distinct groups-
Faller Hit & Play Train (and E train) (1974(?)-1985)
LGB Era Playmobile (with metal rails & LGB Mechanisms) (1985-95-97)

Plastic Track Playmobile (which 5258 is the last set, a rather snazzy BoBo, a EMU(ish) thing, & a steam engine)  

https://www.klickypedia.com/themes/train/

As far as Lego trains go, there is a fair chance that we will see a secondary manufacturer made motor unit and transformer next year.  (FX Bricks).  They've already introduced 2 radius of curves larger than the Lego (40 stud) radius, and 32 & 8 L straights, with the intent of ~104r turnouts (in testing/pre production).   As far as I understand, they intend on introducing a power pick up that will allow the use of a pFX brick (bluetooth) to act as the intermediate to Power Functions motors.

James

 

 

I'm primarily thinking about the LGB-based trains branded Playmobil - however, it doesn't really matter as none of the ones you have listed are in current production. Yes, they are available on the second hand market, but that's not relevent to the discussion on Hornby Paytrains which is a mass-market, current product.

 

In the Lego world, there is already a massive 3rd party supply of material to allow you to expand your empire. A couple of years ago we featured a Swiss railway in Garden Rail that make great use of them. We chatted to Lego expert Holger Matthes at a Virtual Show and off camera, he showed me some of this. It's amazing what is available.

[Phil Parker]

17 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

What's that got to do with the price of fish?

 

If I buy a new product I want it NEW made from fresh materials not made from recycled trash. 

 

If you want recycled junk then make it yourself!

 

 

 

Jason

 

Better not buy anything made from steel, aluminium or paper then.

[Phil Parker]

On 22/12/2021 at 19:15, Classsix T said:

I'd've done blatantly toy versions (I'm talking waaay simpler than Railroad) of prototypes using liveries I already had licences to produce!

Imagine little Johnny's delight at seeing his little train running around in the same basic form as the Freightliner Shed that he sees on the school run or Dad takes him to see at Ipswich.

 

It's unlikely the licence would be global "Stick it on anything" - you'd have to get each model approved by the holder at the very least. It would be possible, but for a new range it makes as much sense to just do something attractive and avoid yet another hoop to jump through. Those who peered closely at Simon's screen during the Hornby TV series will have spotted a couple more decoration options floated at the start.

 

And if 3-year old little Johnny is really noticing the difference between a Playtrains model and the real thing, I dread to think what he's going to be like on RMweb in a few years time...

[boxbrownie]

15 hours ago, Phil Parker said:

 

Playmobil trains have been out of production for many years and now the garden railway fans are Hovering them up. Not sure you can deduce that they were unsuccessful, I suspect the producers (LGB) going bust on a regular basis didn't help. 

 

Mind you LGB  are now going strong and produce an excellent Lego compatible beginners set. 

They are what got us into garden railways, I worked regularly in Germany and Belgium and always bought the kids Playmobil for a “return home present” when it was hardly known about here, I bought my kids their first Playmobil trains set back in the 80’s they (we) loved it so much we started building a proper LGB garden railway, sold most of it now as we moved and now we just have two Stainz starter sets left for Christmas tree duties.

 

Beauty of Playmobil/LGB is take the mechanism out (easy couple of screws) and stick them in the dishwasher…..come out like new 

[boxbrownie]

14 hours ago, peach james said:

Phil, there is an important question to ask:

 

WHICH Playmobile trains do you mean?

James

 

Only one Playmobil  

[boxbrownie]

1 hour ago, Phil Parker said:

 

Better not buy anything made from steel, aluminium or paper then.

Or furniture, mostly made from particle board, or etc etc 

[boxbrownie]

1 hour ago, Phil Parker said:

 

 

And if 3-year old little Johnny is really noticing the difference between a Playtrains model and the real thing, I dread to think what he's going to be like on RMweb in a few years time...

Oh dear, that’s ruined Andy’s Christmas 

[CazRail]

Well my little one will receive her Playtrains set later today, I'll let her to decide if it's any good!

 

Merry Christmas all.

[Hroth]

On 25/12/2021 at 10:56, CazRail said:

Well my little one will receive her Playtrains set later today, I'll let her to decide if it's any good!

 

Merry Christmas all.

The main question is, did it survive unboxing, and did you have enough batteries!

 

Also of interest, Amazon are currently offering the Flash set for a penny under £40 Inc delivery.

 

And another question, have any RMwebbers bought a Playtrains set for their own use/to experiment on?

 

Just asking...

 

 

Edited January 1, 2022 by Hroth
Supplementary thoughts and questions....

[CazRail]

1 hour ago, Hroth said:

The main question is, did it survive unboxing, and did you have enough batteries!

 

She took to it very well, even if the box got sat on half way through boxing day! 

 

I haven't tried running it on my layout yet... 

[No Decorum]

Experience with the first Hornby plastic-track effort rather put me off this one. The earlier one was very limited. The newer looks rather better thought out, with remote control and possibilities for expansion. A Brio set didn’t got down very well with my older grandchildren when they were younger but their mother discovered some track and passed it on to a younger one. I added a couple of items and it has been a rip-roaring success. It will be a few years until he’s ready for the next step but I’m already thinking about it.

 

Meanwhile, another grandson has an occasional session with his basic Hornby, expanded from time to time with a track pack. That is a well thought out system. However, most of the 00 track on the market suits permanent layouts best and is very fiddly to put together and take apart. I was very impressed by the Kato N system, which I use for 009 until I get around to something more permanent. Kato H0 is harder to get and expensive. For the price of a Kato oval and controller (the Kato controllers are excellent) I was able to get a Bachmann Thomas set with a train into the bargain. I concede that the Kato is a large radius oval and the Bachmann is just a circle but the track in both sets lends itself to putting together and taking apart. I’ll see how it goes.

 

Here’s a curious thing. I got my seven-year-old a Railroad Class 59. It has a beautiful silvery finish and I thought he’d love it. He prefers his 0-6-0T steamers. 

[boxbrownie]

28 minutes ago, No Decorum said:

Experience with the first Hornby plastic-track effort rather put me off this one. The earlier one was very limited.

Last year (2020) I bought…er…rather Father Christmas delivered the earlier palytrain set to my 2 year old grandson (yes, I know Father Christmas was a little bit “previous” there) and during this year it has been one of his favourite toys, along with some inane childish plastic toys, nothing as important as a train set 

Edited January 2, 2022 by boxbrownie