steve1 Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 Very interesting. https://www.railtech.com/all/2023/10/20/british-pioneers-spark-new-battery-powered-life-into-centurion-shunter/?gdpr=accept 3D printed body on a Bachmann or Hornby chassis anyone? steve 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 Severn Valley were also supporting a Hydrogen conversion of another 08. https://www.railadvent.co.uk/2021/04/uk-first-severn-valley-railway-to-convert-class-08-locomotive-to-hydrogen-power.html There do seem to be quite a few 08s still trundling around in industrial use and a lot preserved, whilst I would hope most preserved ones would remain as they are for industrial use there is clearly a market to convert a few of these for continued life. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_08 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Nick C Posted October 20, 2023 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2023 1 hour ago, woodenhead said: There do seem to be quite a few 08s still trundling around in industrial use and a lot preserved, whilst I would hope most preserved ones would remain as they are for industrial use there is clearly a market to convert a few of these for continued life. Most preserved railways have several though - so you could easily keep some in original condition and have one converted (perhaps keeping the original bonnet so it looks correct) for day-to-day shunting use. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted October 20, 2023 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2023 I'm surprised at how 21st-century it looks given how much of the original loco is still used. Good idea. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 Why not just buy a battery shunter? https://lz1866.com/battery-locomotives Seems to be a cases of doing something for the sake of doing something when there is also an alternative readily available. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 9 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said: Why not just buy a battery shunter? https://lz1866.com/battery-locomotives Seems to be a cases of doing something for the sake of doing something when there is also an alternative readily available. Jason Maybe for the company involved it is easier for them to re-engineer a chassis with new motors than to build the loco from scratch. Basically they took an 08 removed everything but the chassis block, wheels and cab body, then added their technology into it. I would imagine beyond any metal framing the technology is manufactured for the company so it is off the shelf components packaged into a product. Absolutely nothing wrong in that and if they can convert several locos that way it should be profitable and low risk to all involved - proven technology all round. 1 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Graham_Muz Posted October 20, 2023 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2023 Shades of Bulleid's 500hp 11001 about it https://sremg.org.uk/diesel/bull-500-mob.shtml 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Nick C Posted October 20, 2023 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2023 28 minutes ago, woodenhead said: Maybe for the company involved it is easier for them to re-engineer a chassis with new motors than to build the loco from scratch. Basically they took an 08 removed everything but the chassis block, wheels and cab body, then added their technology into it. I would imagine beyond any metal framing the technology is manufactured for the company so it is off the shelf components packaged into a product. Absolutely nothing wrong in that and if they can convert several locos that way it should be profitable and low risk to all involved - proven technology all round. Exactly this I'd imagine - they've kept all the railway-specific bits, and fitted new electric-vehicle-specific bits - I'd imagine the motors, batteries and control gear are no different to those fitted to any other bit of large battery plant. It'll make certification much easier too I'd imagine. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 52 minutes ago, woodenhead said: Maybe for the company involved it is easier for them to re-engineer a chassis with new motors than to build the loco from scratch. Basically they took an 08 removed everything but the chassis block, wheels and cab body, then added their technology into it. I would imagine beyond any metal framing the technology is manufactured for the company so it is off the shelf components packaged into a product. Absolutely nothing wrong in that and if they can convert several locos that way it should be profitable and low risk to all involved - proven technology all round. Already proven technology. There's one at Allerton that has no problem moving EMUs about. As I'm saying it's totally pointless converting 08s. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 Just now, Steamport Southport said: Already proven technology. There's one at Allerton that has no problem moving EMUs about. As I'm saying it's totally pointless converting 08s. Jason Just like it was converting class 319s to bi-mode or old underground units to something of use on the network, adding Hydrogen technology to other units. It's just one of a series of ideas to update existing rolling stock to something more modern where it is cheaper than building from scratch. I'm not saying that there have not been issues with some of the existing conversions, but is that more about the technology than the idea. An empty bodyshell nicely cleaned up and protected is a blank canvass for conversion to a modern unit underslung with new technology. Nothing wrong with rebuilding something, it's been done since railways began and component replacement is business as usual. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Nick C Posted October 20, 2023 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2023 6 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said: As I'm saying it's totally pointless converting 08s. Isn't the whole point of creating an electric shunter to be better for the environment? In which case, taking an existing one and converting it will always be better (and cheaper) than buying new. As @woodenhead says, it's something that's been going on throughout railway history... Reduce. Reuse. Recycle. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artless Bodger Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 3 hours ago, Graham_Muz said: Shades of Bulleid's 500hp 11001 about it https://sremg.org.uk/diesel/bull-500-mob.shtml I thought EMD SW1500. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 7 hours ago, Nick C said: Isn't the whole point of creating an electric shunter to be better for the environment? In which case, taking an existing one and converting it will always be better (and cheaper) than buying new. As @woodenhead says, it's something that's been going on throughout railway history... Reduce. Reuse. Recycle. So we are to convert all those Pannier Tanks and Jinties as well. Some of the preserved Pannier Tanks are only about five years older than some of the 08s currently in use! You really are looking at a chassis that dates from the 1930s. How are you oiling it? They still need lubrication just as they did back in the days of steam. As I'm saying pointless when you've already got battery electric locomotives that can do exactly the same job. They exist, they aren't a pipedream. Those shunters can pull 3000 tons, they aren't toys. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted October 20, 2023 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2023 10 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said: As I'm saying pointless when you've already got battery electric locomotives that can do exactly the same job. They exist, they aren't a pipedream. Those shunters can pull 3000 tons, they aren't toys. Jason grandfather rights maybe? 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators AY Mod Posted October 20, 2023 Moderators Share Posted October 20, 2023 7 hours ago, Steamport Southport said: I'm saying it's totally pointless converting 08s. Didn't realise they were supposed to check with you first. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Simon Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 18 minutes ago, AY Mod said: Didn't realise they were supposed to check with you first. I thought it was a requirement to get authority from RMWeb, along with everyone in the railway industry as well At least quite a few of my projects it seems like I have to! Simon 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 (edited) 25 minutes ago, AY Mod said: Didn't realise they were supposed to check with you first. Okay, I'll bite. Should we be rebuilding all those old cars from the 1950s up until about 2000 as well? Millions of those about. Newer than those Class 08s. How about the trucks and buses. Plenty of them about in scrapyards and loads of them knocking about in the Third World. Why not just build new things that are designed to be eco friendly from the outset? Made of modern materials. I thought this was supposed to be a forum for discussion, it's even in the Discussion section? Or is it only certain views that are allowed? Quote a meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged. Jason Edited October 20, 2023 by Steamport Southport Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators AY Mod Posted October 20, 2023 Moderators Share Posted October 20, 2023 3 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said: Okay, I'll bite. Don't bother. You framed it as though you know better and that we should understand that. That's not a discussion. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted October 20, 2023 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said: Why not just build new things that are designed to be eco friendly from the outset? Made of modern materials. probably a lot to do with money, there are plenty of new things sat round doing nothing, trialled and not commissioned, class 18 for example, at least using an 08 if successful they can approach current users and offer a conversion at a fraction of the cost of a new build, also take into consideration infrastructure constraints and training etc 3 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Dave John Posted October 20, 2023 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 20, 2023 (edited) Surely if one wanted to buy a battery shunter then the first thing would be to get a written quotation for price and delivery cost from a variety of manufacturers ? Until then it is all rather open. Edited October 20, 2023 by Dave John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium JDW Posted October 20, 2023 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 20, 2023 Looks great to me. As far as 'why?' goes, I'd say it's probably a combination of cost and the fact that the 'railway' bits - the cab, chassis, wheels, and so on - already exist and are still capable of doing the job they were designed for. I don't know about rail, but a re-engineered bus or coach costs around half the price of a new one, so in the right circumstances can be a better option. I can see the value in a new-build electric or hydrogen shunter, but I can also see that with plenty of potentially available class 08s still around, repurposing existing vehicles makes a lot of sense. Probably even more so than a bus or coach, where retrofitting might extend the life but it's unlikely the body/chassis will last more than 25 years. In rail terms, something like an 08, or at least its basic structure, is a lot more durable and could potentially have a lot of life left if suitably refurbished, eliminating the environmental cost of new build. If the costs stack up and the base vehicles for conversion are already built and available, it seems a no-brainer to re-engineer 08s. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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