Bachmann Class 40 BR blue color differences

[MattR]

I have a question about the shades of BR blue used on Bachmann Class 40s.

 

I used to have one of the 2003-tooled models (first photo) that was a dark blue that looked about right to me

 

However, I sold it on and picked up up one of the 2014-tooled models (second photo) that is a lot bright lighter with a blue-green tinge.

 

Which is more correct to the real thing (at least ex-works)? Or were there variations in the color applied so that both are correct? I'm about to weather the new one but I'm not sure if it's going to need a blue respray first.

 

 

Edited February 1 by MattR

[Ed-farms]

Paint would be mixed locally at the time of use, so a different person on a different day in a different works would make the blue for one loco over possibly the other. Then if you factor in time since repaint and the effects of wind, rain and sun no 2 locos would appear the same at any time. 

 

To me the 2nd one looks more ex-works than the 1st but both look close to BR blue to me

[brushman47544]

The BR blue used on 40075 looks similar to the blue used by Bachmann on earlier releases of its Mk1 and Mk2 coaches. IIRC there was a general consensus that it was too dark and so Bachmann changed to the brighter version as on 40159. Personally I think the later version is closer to what I remember but as Ed-farms said both are close enough and lighting conditions outdoors would have changed our perception of the actual colours. Heljan's BR blue on its latest 45s is closer (probably even darker) to the earlier version which also looks too dark to me.

 

You take your pick!

[Simon Bendall]

To illustrate the point, both tins used were BR blue. Issue was said to be due to poor mixing of one. 

[MattR]

Thank you for the explanation, gentlemen. I shall weather away then!

[SulzerPeak]

The 2014 one is perfect for an ex works loco and to my eyes is the best. The first photo matches an age worn one. Whats jumps out though is how crude that model looks now. Low hanging fruit with decent sound springs to mind!

[APT Fan]

3 hours ago, MattR said:

Thank you for the explanation, gentlemen. I shall weather away then!

 

Just curious, does weathering tend to add value to a loco when you move them on?

[Fair Oak Junction]

The hobby seems to be fairly split between those who love and those who loathe weathering, so any added value will depend on the buyer.

If the weathering job is good, then there will be a market for it.

[adb968008]

3 hours ago, APT Fan said:

 

Just curious, does weathering tend to add value to a loco when you move them on?

Depends how good it is…

its Darwinian, over time the bad will waste away in the market, leaving the pristine and the very good weathered.. both which will carry a premium.

 

unless someone retools it with a better model, then all bets are off.

 

dont weather for commercial reasons, do it for your enjoyment.

 

if your new to weathering, pick something cheap to practice with.. 1970’s Hornby coaches cost nearly nothing, so nothing lost if it goes wrong.

 

Edited February 2 by adb968008

[Halvarras]

The shade of BR blue seen on 40075 above was also used on Bachmann's Classes 08, 24, 25, Warship, Peak and Deltic of similar vintage (not sure about the 47, perhaps someone with a 47035 can confirm?) It looks a bit murky to me but I live with it as life's too short to respray a blue loco blue (Dapol's first Class 22 releases excepted - but then no way was that BR blue!)

 

40075 also suffered from undersized numbers, and hails from that thankfully brief period when Bachmann mysteriously lost the knack of printing accurately-proportioned BR double-arrow logos; I have Deltic 55020 like that, truly awful - when I changed its identity to 55003 'Meld' (in memory of the real one's Paddington - Cardiff run in October 1975) I had to change the logos as well - wrong shape and size!

 

 

[97406]

Even the later retooled 40s show differences in the shade of blue applied. The later ones can be patch painted with Railmatch BR blue and it’s a perfect match. The earliest batch from 2014 is a slightly different shade, though close they got a full respray when I did the windscreens as the difference was noticeable.

[97406]

8 hours ago, APT Fan said:

 

Just curious, does weathering tend to add value to a loco when you move them on?

 

The concept of selling a loco on is alien to me. They either get kept or used for spares in a small number of cases. I run very little straight out of the box and numerous collector’s editions have been radically altered. There’s no fun to me in getting a loco and just running it on the layout, almost all end up having something done to them. The aim is to  set the scene so I can sit back with a coffee or beer and enjoy a little slice of the 80s like I remember it.

[Great Waterton]

I'm pleased someone has brought this up as these sort of discussions always fascinate me.

 

Personally speaking I've always preferred the darker, more used/worn shade of BR Blue so in this case the first Class 40 picture above. By the time I was old enough to remember BR Blue in use it was well on its way out but there were still many items of it kicking around. Most of what I remember seeing was workworn/weathered to say the least which is no doubt why I prefer the darker shade. More of a general workhorse colour if you see what I mean. This also seems to tally with old photographs and footage, though of course this isn't conclusive for various reasons as discussed many times. 

 

The lighter shade with a more green tinge seems to be what preserved BR Blue loco's wear these days, so is arguably the 'correct' colour (assuming they use the official paint colour!) When you see most of these they're immaculate and while there's an attraction to that, to me personally I like to see a bit of muck.. 

 

The beauty is you can do whatever you think is best. I'm happy to have a few varying shades across the layout as long as the difference isn't too glaring! Most of it is subtlety weathered anyway.. 

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

15 hours ago, SulzerPeak said:

Whats jumps out though is how crude that model looks ...

Perfect representation of this large ugly lump then! For my taste it doesn't look sufficiently dented and tatty. Plenty of filth on my disc headcode all over BR green EE type 4, this class swiftly became very mucky as used initially  on express traffic.

[MattR]

18 hours ago, APT Fan said:

Just curious, does weathering tend to add value to a loco when you move them on?

 

Not sure. The 2003-tooling version was the only one I've sold on that I've weathered. I only had one bid on it (the winner) but then again the market for British outline stuff isn't that big on eBay here in the U.S.

 

9 hours ago, 97406 said:

The concept of selling a loco on is alien to me. They either get kept or used for spares in a small number of cases. I run very little straight out of the box and numerous collector’s editions have been radically altered. There’s no fun to me in getting a loco and just running it on the layout, almost all end up having something done to them.

 

When you're limited on cash, sometimes you have to sell things on to fund something you'd like to have more. I really enjoyed weathering the 2003-version and I had wanted a Class 40 for so long that I was happy to finally have one. However, when the big Hatton's pre-Christmas sale had the 2014 version for £75, I couldn't resist. Everyone says how much better the newer version looked, plus it has lights and was £30 cheaper than the 2003 version I had bought. So I sold on the weathered one and used the proceeds to pay for the new one. I agree about altering locomotives though. Since I'm trying to go for locomotives that were allocated to Bury shed (26D), I've pretty much renamed/renumbered everything.

 

3 hours ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

Perfect representation of this large ugly lump then! For my taste it doesn't look sufficiently dented and tatty. Plenty of filth on my disc headcode all over BR green EE type 4, this class swiftly became very mucky as used initially  on express traffic.

 

Agree! I love a filthy workhorse. Once I get the new numbers on, the Class 40 and also a WD 2-8-0 are gonna get filthy-ized. Fun times ahead.

 

Also, here's how my weathering looked on my old Class 40 that I sold.

 

 

Edited February 2 by MattR

[Great Waterton]

Whilst we're on the subject of Bachmann Class 40s, is it the 2014 models onwards that have lights fitted please? Not particularly bothered about cab lighting but forward lighting would be good. 

Edited February 3 by Great Waterton

[97406]

21 hours ago, Great Waterton said:

Whilst we're on the subject of Bachmann Class 40s, is it the 2014 models onwards that have lights fitted please? Not particularly bothered about cab lighting but forward lighting would be good. 

Yes, they have lighting.

[Great Waterton]

3 hours ago, 97406 said:

Yes, they have lighting.

Thank you. 

[Butler Henderson]

On 01/02/2024 at 16:33, Ed-farms said:

Paint would be mixed locally at the time of use, so a different person on a different day in a different works would make the blue for one loco over possibly the other. Then if you factor in time since repaint and the effects of wind, rain and sun no 2 locos would appear the same at any time. 

 

To me the 2nd one looks more ex-works than the 1st but both look close to BR blue to me

Running a rake of coaches through a carriage wash would soonm change the appearance of a loco

[Halvarras]

2 hours ago, Butler Henderson said:

Running a rake of coaches through a carriage wash would soonm change the appearance of a loco

 

It certainly changed the appearance of many diesel-hydraulics......😀!

[Albie the plumber]

7 hours ago, 97406 said:

Yes, they have lighting.

Excellent work on the front cab window frames . looks the business .

[MattR]

On 04/02/2024 at 02:12, 97406 said:

Yes, they have lighting.

 

Yep, my 2014 version has front, rear and cab lights, all of which can be turned on or off with three tiny switches on the underside of boiler.

[HarryLamb2]

Doesn't really matter how many more 'novelties' are added to this model it's stiil badly let down by those awful cosmetic plate frame bogies. My own Bachy EE Type 4 is a beautiful runner on it's Penbits bogies but the outside frames........ are a No-No! If Kernow, a smaller supplier can manage a much better 4 axle bogie, why hasn't Bachmann made an effort with the various updates?  The Derby built Bachmann 'Peak' models are no better either. Those long plateframes are a very prominent feature of some of the early type 4 locomotives and really do require an upgrade to something like. Regards. HL   

[40002]

On 03/02/2024 at 09:59, Great Waterton said:

Whilst we're on the subject of Bachmann Class 40s, is it the 2014 models onwards that have lights fitted please? Not particularly bothered about cab lighting but forward lighting would be good. 

I have one of the last 21pin versions and the latest plux22 version. Annoyingly on the 21pin version under DCC you cannot individually turn off the tail lights, so i will probably just switch off perm the tail lights with the switch underneath. On the plux22 version you can individually turn off the tail lights.

 

Color wise my two Blue class 40 match but then they are both fairly new and match reasonably with my other Bachmann Loco's which are also new. My Heljen 25 is a bit darker but not too bad unlike the Heljen 45 which was so dark it had to go. I prefer not to weather my Loco's so too much color variation is difficult to hide and given the period I'm modeling they are mostly Blue.