Peterborough North

[manna]

G'day Gents

 

I like that cavalcade . Pity there wasn't a lot of GN loco's left by then.

 

manna

[great northern]

G'day Gents

 

I like that cavalcade . Pity there wasn't a lot of GN loco's left by then.

 

manna

Yes indeed. I really would like a D2, for example, but no chance. We just have to make the best of what we have, so here is another view, this time from the bridge.

 

We are getting towards the end of the sequence now, an event which is always signalled by the arrival of the Colchester- Edinburgh through train. Gateshead's replacement engine is backing down into the bay to await the train's arrival.

[Liam]

Yes indeed. I really would like a D2, for example, but no chance. We just have to make the best of what we have, so here is another view, this time from the bridge.

three engines from above.JPG

 

We are getting towards the end of the sequence now, an event which is always signalled by the arrival of the Colchester- Edinburgh through train. Gateshead's replacement engine is backing down into the bay to await the train's arrival.

23 1.JPG

From Colchester? I never thought there would be that much demand for a direct train from there to Edinburgh. Still, I believe in the summer months the Norwich to Sheringham line in the 1950s/early 1960s was treated to direct trains to and from Liverpool Street

[jwealleans]

Wasn't that train originally primarily a Forces working?

[The Stationmaster]

From Colchester? I never thought there would be that much demand for a direct train from there to Edinburgh. Still, I believe in the summer months the Norwich to Sheringham line in the 1950s/early 1960s was treated to direct trains to and from Liverpool Street

 

Back to the days of Squaddy rail - lots of trains we wouldn't even think of nowadays in the timetable to meet the needs of those in the military travelling to/from postings/training and what have you.  A world long gone, along with its associated RTO offices at major stations.

[Liam]

Back to the days of Squaddy rail - lots of trains we wouldn't even think of nowadays in the timetable to meet the needs of those in the military travelling to/from postings/training and what have you.  A world long gone, along with its associated RTO offices at major stations.

My father used to work as a guard (before moving up in the ranks) for British Rail during the 70s, and one time on a train from Birmingham to Exeter there were two soldiers returning from leave to their barracks (possibly Lympstone, somewhere in the south west). Anyway there was a lengthy hold up, so at some point he phoned the barracks to say there were two soldiers who were delayed, and the reply was something like, "Ah, thank you for letting us know sir." I don't think the soldiers were soldiers for much longer after that!

[chaz]

Yes indeed. I really would like a D2, for example, but no chance. We just have to make the best of what we have, so here is another view, this time from the bridge.

three engines from above.JPG

 

We are getting towards the end of the sequence now, an event which is always signalled by the arrival of the Colchester- Edinburgh through train. Gateshead's replacement engine is backing down into the bay to await the train's arrival.

23 1.JPG

 

Was a brake van mandatory for such light engine movements? I don't remember such movements between Top Shed and The Cross (and in reverse) having a brake coupled.

 

How did we know that the A4 is one of Gateshead's without any need to be able to read the shed plate? I recall seeing Guillemot standing in Kings Cross with my father, sometime in the late fifties. His sarcastic comment was that he "thought it might have been repainted from its wartime livery by now".

 

Chaz

[great northern]

Was a brake van mandatory for such light engine movements? I don't remember such movements between Top Shed and The Cross (and in reverse) having a brake coupled.

 

How did we know that the A4 is one of Gateshead's without any need to be able to read the shed plate? I recall seeing Guillemot standing in Kings Cross with my father, sometime in the late fifties. His sarcastic comment was that he "thought it might have been repainted from its wartime livery by now".

 

Chaz

 I've tried to recreate some prototype pictures Chaz, and one sees all kind of combinations in those. They just seemed to hook up as much as possible into one rake, presumably to save line occupancy. One photo shows an N5, a 350hp shunter, a brake van and a tender first V2.

 

 I suppose Gateshead might claim some excuse for this A4's condition, as it is due for major overhaul very shortly. which may be why it is diagrammed for what is really a parcels train, augmented by two SKs and a CK.  It was allowed three hours to do the 112 miles from PN to York.                

[Donington Road]

Was a brake van mandatory for such light engine movements? I don't remember such movements between Top Shed and The Cross (and in reverse) having a brake coupled.

 

 

I'll stick my neck out and say.

A light engine movement is only one engine and in steam.

A movement of more than one engine with the other engine(s) in steam and crewed would not require a brake van.

A movement of more than one engine with the other engine(s) not in steam and not crewed would require a brake van.

[The Stationmaster]

I'll stick my neck out and say.

A light engine movement is only one engine and in steam.

A movement of more than one engine with the other engine(s) in steam and crewed would not require a brake van.

A movement of more than one engine with the other engine(s) not in steam and not crewed would require a brake van.

 

I wouldn't argue although technically the definition changed slightly as originally if there was more than one engine coupled it was signalled as a light engine assisted in rear but during the 1960s it changed to include 'engines coupled'.  Engines witha brakevan were signalled differently while dead engines (again they would have a  brakevan) would be treated as an exceptional or out-of-gauge load.

[great northern]

The combination I mentioned above had the brake van between the diesel shunter and the V2. I had assumed that all of the locos would be working back to new England at end of shift, the diesel and N5 either from South yard or perhaps Fletton, and the V2 possibly having come off an Up train a bit earlier. That might mean that the brake van was being returned with the diesel? Or have I got that completely round my neck?

[chaz]

I wouldn't argue although technically the definition changed slightly as originally if there was more than one engine coupled it was signalled as a light engine assisted in rear but during the 1960s it changed to include 'engines coupled'.  Engines witha brakevan were signalled differently while dead engines (again they would have a  brakevan) would be treated as an exceptional or out-of-gauge load.

 

Fair enough. I suspect all light engine movements, however many were coupled together to save pathing, in and out of The Cross would have had all locos in steam (and crewed?).

[chaz]

The combination I mentioned above had the brake van between the diesel shunter and the V2. I had assumed that all of the locos would be working back to new England at end of shift, the diesel and N5 either from South yard or perhaps Fletton, and the V2 possibly having come off an Up train a bit earlier. That might mean that the brake van was being returned with the diesel? Or have I got that completely round my neck?

 

Seems likely to me. Mists of time job anyway, with very few if any crew, signalmen etc with personal experience surviving. I think you are on safe ground if you rely on photos depicting such workings....

 

Just one point to bear in mind - it was often the unusual workings that were photographed. Just think about the number of clean WDs you can find in the albums - certainly far from typical!

Edited March 16, 2017 by chaz

[great northern]

Seems likely to me. Mists of time job anyway, with very few if any crew, signalmen etc with personal experience surviving. I think you are on safe ground if you rely on photos depicting such workings....

 

Just one point to bear in mind - it was often the unusual workings that were photographed. Just think about the number of clean WDs you can find in the albums - certainly far from typical!

I think I'm safe with these, as they were not the main point of focus of the pictures. Invariably they are shots of a Down express leaving either on the main or from the excursion platform, and the formations I'm referring to are all waiting on the Down slow, so they have been treated as peripheral content, if you see what I mean.

 

Line occupancy was so intensive that I reckon running one mass movement instead of individual light engines must have been an essential practice.

Edited March 16, 2017 by great northern

[Liam]

The combination I mentioned above had the brake van between the diesel shunter and the V2. I had assumed that all of the locos would be working back to new England at end of shift, the diesel and N5 either from South yard or perhaps Fletton, and the V2 possibly having come off an Up train a bit earlier. That might mean that the brake van was being returned with the diesel? Or have I got that completely round my neck?

It must have been interesting riding in the brake van, yet unusual because the combined haulage of those locos is probably around twelve or thirteen, and the three locos are only pulling what is essentially a third of a coach.

[great northern]

Next we have the arrival of the Edinburgh, and the Colchester B17 that started the journey has managed to get all the way here.

30E have kept most of the shine that was applied at Doncaster when 61666 received its last ever overhaul in April. The very low late evening sun plays havoc with photography.

[manna]

G'day Gents.

 

To make up to Gilbert, who unfortunately (LOL) models BR, I give you a cavalcade of GN locos, a D2 (in green) a J4 and a Q1, with and without brakevans, they are all travelling tender first, as there are not turning facilities on the Edgware branch.

 

manna  

[great northern]

As most people seem to like B17s, we shall continue to watch 61666 progress along Platform 6, until it comes to a stand alongside the relieving engine.

The knee injury is a grade 1 medial ligament tear, which I am assured is healing well, so I may be able to put some weight on it to get around the railway room later. First though I have a lift to do some shopping. Only another week till I can start driving again.

[45156]

Gilbert

 

I am really enjoying following your pics of PN, and am pleased to say that I did vote for it in the awards.  Two things that I need to raise here, though.

 

First, when are you going to post images of the layout that you have built of the location now that you have pictured it in real life.

 

Second - my first consideration in looking at any layout is to start with the track and then look upwards.  Some layouts look really realistic, even in 16.5mm, and some S4 layouts look less convincing - yours is the former.

 

Regards

Stewart

[New Haven Neil]

Those GN locos look like they have a Swiss Croc about to join them....

 

Gkad to hear your knee is mending, Gilbert.  These injuries are so debilitating.  Oh, and a B17 with a decent tender - not too bad!

[Grasshopper John]

Or how about a video Gilbert,

[great northern]

Gilbert

 

I am really enjoying following your pics of PN, and am pleased to say that I did vote for it in the awards.  Two things that I need to raise here, though.

 

First, when are you going to post images of the layout that you have built of the location now that you have pictured it in real life.

 

Second - my first consideration in looking at any layout is to start with the track and then look upwards.  Some layouts look really realistic, even in 16.5mm, and some S4 layouts look less convincing - yours is the former.

 

Regards

Stewart

Hi Stewart,

 

That is very kind of you. I'm always conscious though of the need to keep my feet firmly on the ground, and to remember that this is an impression of PN, but by no means a scale model. I'm getting quite crafty now at cropping out the bits which show it up! Having said that, I am delighted with the way it has turned out,and I don't think it is too far out, given the constraints of the site into which it had to fit.

 

Commissioning Norman Saunders to build the track was one of the best decisions I made, along with getting Peter Leyland to do the buildings, but the reality is that it couldn't have been done with RTR, and I'm not capable of doing things to anything like their standards, so otherwise it wouldn't have got done at all, which I think would have been a shame.

 

I'm still looking at little tweaks and improvements, so hopefully it will become better than it is now, but in the meantime I'm glad that it seems to give enjoyment to quite a lot of people.

[great northern]

Or how about a video Gilbert,

 That requires technical ability which at the moment is beyond me, I'm afraid. I'll try and persuade that nice Mr York, next time he visits.

[The Blue Streak]

Or how about a video Gilbert,

 

Here's one that appeared on Youtube a couple of years back

 

https://youtu.be/dbHEo2HXsi8

[great northern]

Nothing much else going on around the station, so we carry on watching the engine change on the Edinburgh. First the B17 pulls away.

and then the A4 slowly backs on.

Two rather ordinary pictures, so we shall have an extra one tonight.