Adventures in code 55

[Gloucester Road]

Thanks for pictures chaps. Those will come in handy, order has been placed and should be winging its way to NH soon.

[Gloucester Road]

Its funny how you get a notion stuck in our head and then there no shifting it until it has been thourghly worked over. Having decided to work on the trunking and ballasting on the upper level I have spent a good portion of today looking at real and model images. I have also given some thought to where all of this trunking should go. Some part of me said it would go to an off scene signal box, but then a vague image of a signal box/equipment box came to mind that was in a portable office. I couldn't remember if it was on here or the old rmweb, however after searching here and on the wider web for 'modern signal box' I came up with Relocatable Equipment Building or REB (examples on Banbury and Horseley Fields). So after a visit to Elliot Railway Solutions website and some other REB manufactures I saw many examples. Some of which were in modified double stack portable offices. I have one of the Farish examples of these and could easily make it into an REB. I could now have a location for all of the trunking to go.

 

I then came up with a plan for cabling, trunking, REB and point motors

 

And plonked down an office block to see if it would fit

 

I then wondered if the lower level freight only line would have manually operated points or point motors. See plan below, thoughts about this ?

 

 

 

 

Thanks for sugestions

Stephen

Edited January 30, 2013 by Gloucester Road

[roundhouse]

Stephen

 

To me the concrete ducting routes look about right on your plan.

 

I would position the REB a little further from the mainline tracks though, possible in line with the viaduct walls (but probably worth searching more photos for that first).

 

Also dont forget the ducting to the signals, even if off scene the concrete ducting will run to them.

 

Your low level yard would tend to be manual turnouts so you wouldnt get much cableways / ducting there.

 

Ian

[Gloucester Road]

Ian, thanks for your help.

 

I was hoping to avoid the signals but if im going throug the trouble of motors and cabeling i gues there should be some general representation of signaling. So my plan has been modified slightly.

 

 

Sort of tough to see but as trains travel right to left on the south bound track then run into a signal with a route indicator(feather). This signal either sends you into the station or right through the points and into the avoiding line, this area is bidirectional and might have some representation of ground signals. Once in this are you are released to travel back onto the south bound track by a signal that is after the point exiting the station. If you are in the station there is a signal adjacent to the platform on the left of the track.

 

Travelling north left to right there is another feather signal that sends you into the avoiding line or the station, your exit is controlled by a signal close to the point for the branch. Your exit from the station is controlled by a signal on the right at the end of the platform.

 

I want to keep this simple as i know signaling can be a minefield, but does this seem logical?

 

Thank you

Stephen

[Gloucester Road]

Managed to find the image i had in mind for the modern signalbox/ REB.

 

http://www.wirralfinescale.com/images/layouts/widnes/12012008/CRW_9953.jpg

 

Something like this should be on Gloucester Road in the near future.

[MichaelW]

Hi Stephen,

 

I'm not sure I follow your signalling plan - I think you should be looking at something like this:

 

 

Remember, signals are there to control trains, and a signal with a proceed aspect gives the driver permission to travel as far as the next signal.  Essentially, you need a signal wherever you want to be able to control a train to stop.  

 

So, approaching the station from the South, you reach a feathered signal a little way before the junction (to allow for overrunning the signal).  From here you either are given a proceed aspect on the main line, or a proceed with feather for the loop.  Either way, you reach a signal before the junction at the other end of the station, which controls you over the left-hand junction to carry on down the mainline.

 

Coming from the North, again, the feathered signal is a little way before the junction.  This also has a feather for the avoiding line.  At the other end of the loop, again a pair of signals control access across the junction.

 

What is the purpose of the spur in the top right of your diagram?  If it is intended as a running line, you would probably get feathers on the two signals at the right end of the loop.  If it isn't, then it's more likely that shunt signals would be used.

 

Michael

 

Edit for inability to tell left from right...

Edited February 1, 2013 by MichaelW

[Gloucester Road]

Hi Stephen,

 

I'm not sure I follow your signalling plan - I think you should be looking at something like this:

 

adventures signals.jpg

 

Remember, signals are there to control trains, and a signal with a proceed aspect gives the driver permission to travel as far as the next signal.  Essentially, you need a signal wherever you want to be able to control a train to stop.  

 

So, approaching the station from the South, you reach a feathered signal a little way before the junction (to allow for overrunning the signal).  From here you either are given a proceed aspect on the main line, or a proceed with feather for the loop.  Either way, you reach a signal before the junction at the other end of the station, which controls you over the left-hand junction to carry on down the mainline.

 

Coming from the North, again, the feathered signal is a little way before the junction.  This also has a feather for the avoiding line.  At the other end of the loop, again a pair of signals control access across the junction.

 

What is the purpose of the spur in the top right of your diagram?  If it is intended as a running line, you would probably get feathers on the two signals at the right end of the loop.  If it isn't, then it's more likely that shunt signals would be used.

 

Michael

 

Edit for inability to tell left from right...

Michael,

 

Thank you very much for the input. Looking at your plan makes sense, there will be feathers for the two signals coming out of the loop as the right hand spur is a running line.

 

Stephen

[Gloucester Road]

Had a poke around the pdf file from Elliot Railway solutions and they have an REB that has a brick base to it. Now its nowhere near as elaborate as the one on Widnes Yard from a few entries ago, but using what i had ive cobled together one to see how the REB might look with a brick base.

 

I think it will work nicely once the signals, trunking are installed.

 

 

 

Stephen

[Gloucester Road]

Freightliner 57003 captured heading south with some empty HHAs.

 

 

[Gloucester Road]

After 57003 had crossed over the down line and propelled its wagons to the powerplant 60054 was pulling some JGAs. These are pulled into the run around at the station were the loco swapps ends and then proceeds to the lower level.

 

[Gloucester Road]

Made it home just before the worst of the nor'easter hit NH on Saturday. Last flight into Boston before the airport was closed. My reward was 5 hours of plowing and snowblowing our 550ft drive from under 2.5ft of snow.

 

So for a break I opened the package that came certain retailer that arrived while away. In it were the point motors, trunking and a set of farish intermodal bogie wagons.

 

So today following the suggested plan from earlier I test fit the motors and trunking.

 

This is the left side of the platform. I have used some off cuts to represent three signals; they are, upper left is a feather signal controlling the downline entrance to the station and the runaround, upper right is a signal controlling the exit from the runaround back onto the up line via the cross over and the signal on the lower left controls the upline exit from the station.

 

 

The trunking runs from the motors and signals via the cabling and trunking back to the nearside wall where it runs to the REB at the other end of the station.

 

Here is a close up.

 

This is going to be a fiddly detail that may well get lost in the rest of the details, however when test running trains past the point motors and trunking it really looked the part.

 

Time to work on the other end of the station.

[MichaelW]

If I may suggest, I think the signals are a little too close to the junction - there should be a clear length of track between the signal and the junction it protects (allows for a train driver accidentally over-running the signal without serious consequences).  The signal bottom right looks to have this, but the top left could do with being moved back a bit (possibly to halfway down the loco in the picture) and the top right one should be before the loop point.

 

The rest of the trunking looks good - I particularly like the way you have the trunking running to everything that needs electrical connections.

[Gloucester Road]

If I may suggest, I think the signals are a little too close to the junction - there should be a clear length of track between the signal and the junction it protects (allows for a train driver accidentally over-running the signal without serious consequences).  The signal bottom right looks to have this, but the top left could do with being moved back a bit (possibly to halfway down the loco in the picture) and the top right one should be before the loop point.

 

The rest of the trunking looks good - I particularly like the way you have the trunking running to everything that needs electrical connections.

Thanks for the suggestions; all signals have been moved back. Unfortunately the one protecting the loop exit is as far as it can go due to space constraints.

 

 

 

Stephen

[Lee m22]

Hi

 

Trackside details are looking great. Only thing I'd suggest is toning the red down on the cable tubing. It's normally an orange plastic that fades to quite a pale colour (for being exposed to the sun I guess).

 

Network Rail has run through Bletchley on the WCML recently, replacing old signal gangtry's with new LED signal gangtry's and come rather hefty systems to support (Several large containers full of signalling computers I guess all fenced off and installed around the embankments) This has mean't a lot of work to signal trunking and relay boxes. Interesting how often they leave the trunking uncovered or how many sectons of trunking lay discarded around the lines.

 

I walk my dogs along the line regularly so if you want pictures of any more of the clutter, just shout

 

Anyway, once this is scene is ballasted, the details you've added will really set the scene

 

Regards

 

Lee

[Gloucester Road]

Hi

 

Trackside details are looking great. Only thing I'd is toning the red down on the cable tubing. It's normally an orange plastic that fades to quite a pale colour (for being exposed to the sun I guess).

 

Network Rail has run through Bletchley on the WCML recently, replacing old signal gangtry's with new LED signal gangtry's and come rather hefty systems to support (Several large containers full of signalling computers I guess all fenced off and installed around the embankments) This has mean't a lot of work to signal trunking and relay boxes. Interesting how often they leave the trunking uncovered or how many sectons of trunking lay discarded around the lines.

 

I walk my dogs along the line regularly so if you want pictures of any more of the clutter, just shout

 

Anyway, once this is scene is ballasted, the details you've added will really set the scene

 

Regards

 

Lee

Thanks Lee,

 

So had a look around the house for thin orange wire, then hit upon the idea of orange thread with some white glue to stiffen. It works and presto, orange cabling. Think this looks much better.

 

 

[Lee m22]

Bingo!

[roundhouse]

Keep that orange thread straight as its not cable but plastic ducting so it might bow under the rails but will generally be straight. The cable will run inside the ducting.

 

Looking good though.

 

Ian

[shanks522]

Coming along nicely Stephen, Once the ballast train has run over it a few times its going to look spot on.

 

Graham.

[Gloucester Road]

Thanks for all the kind comments. This is the right hand side of the station heading towards the country section. This was prior to the thread experiment so still has red wire.

 

 

This and the main station have all been lifted now. With the experimenting over this section of track needs glueing and painting. Why this wasnt done earlier is one of those mysteries of modelling. So there are currently many odd things weighing down the track.

 

Once glue has set painting will ensue. Had to order ballast too as that seems to have been used up.

 

Stephen.

[MichaelW]

Hi Stephen,

 

That looks much better now you've moved the signals - and the orange thread is much more convincing than the red wire.  Looking forward to seeing it done with the track relayed and ballasted.  Generally the trunking will be the edge of the ballast (it forms a nice barrier to it spreading), but in some places the ballast will have spilled over the top - especially if the permanent way teams have been along toping up the ballast shoulders.  On the line near me you can barely see the trunking under the ballast...

[Gloucester Road]

Many odd things applying pressure for adhesion.

 

[1977joey]

Hi Stephen,

 

I've just read all through your thread. An amazing layout you have here, really love the 2 levels & sweeping curves (something I wish I had the room for). Cracking detail & attention to detail too

 

All the best,

Mark

[ian b]

Fantastic stuff! Normally the concrete troughing runs alongside the line (usually one side or the other), the cables then come out of a junction, through the orange tubing under the track, and then run over or slightly under the ballast to point motors.

 

The usual exception to the rule is if there is a distance between the junction/ location box but this doesn't happen very often.

 

Even on four track main lines it would be unusual to get troughing between lines- 99% of time it is on an outside edge (cess).

 

It's a heavy job installing it and its only worth doing if there are a number of power/ signal cables that need protecting. As a thought troughing lids often get dislodged/ damaged/ left off exposing the cables inside...

 

Hope this helps!

 

Ian B

[Lee m22]

I agree with Ian regarding lids being missing etc. Really quite shocking how much sometimes.

 

Where they are making hardstandings for the signal containers (unsure what they are called) I mentioned above, they have used cable troughs as an edge restraints On the trackside, I guess this makes it easy to run cables out of the container and up the embankment, but it's been used to large effect.

 

The WCML past my estate is quadlined, and trunking runs along the external sides of the track. It does seem to run as far as I can see mind. At bridges and restricted areas, the trunking tends to rise into a more narrow format, fixed to retaining walls and in metal trays...It also seems to split into multiple runs.  I do wonder if the density here is due to the renewal works being carried out.

 

Regards

 

Lee

[ian b]

On the wcml there is every possibility you are in an axle counter area which does lead to more cabling and troughing. The signal containers are called location cabinets (or 'lokey boxes'!). The axle counters are at each end of the signal section on each line so need lots of secure, safe cable runs to keep it neat. Hence it being on both cesses!

 

It's not unusual to have troughing disappearing into a pile of ballast that's been over-zealously dropped or even buried under part of an embankment. On older bridge structures with tight clearances the cables can reappear, be strung up on hangers along the bridge, and drop into more troughing the other side.

 

Also a more modern version is made of a kind of plastic which is lockable to stop sticking fingers trying to nick the cable inside! It's a darker grey than the concrete and has a textured top, making it also suitable to walk along.

 

When you do your PTS you are told to never use troughing as a path as the concrete can be in shocking condition! Difficult to resist the urge when walking a couple of miles on ballast!!!