Wainwright C-class 0-6-0

[orcadian]

As I've not been feeling too bright this afternoon, I decided to trawl my little colour albums for pictures of C Class locos - looking for those carrying the later BR emblem. Here's the results, which gives you (with Ian's, 31004 and 31068 - and RFS 31588) at least nine, or possibly even eleven to choose from and one caption that confirms that 13 went through Ashford works for general repairs and repaints during 1960. 31004 and 31068 were withdrawn in November and October 1961, respectively and 31588 in June 1962.

 

All the best, John.

 

John, Many thanks for this helpful post! Being slightly under the weather provides the perfect focus for a deep trawl through the book collection for me, too!

Hope you're feeling brighter today!

Richard

[Old Gringo]

Thanks Richard,

 

Much better today and have added the list of 21 locomotives that lasted into 1962 to post 24, along with a further correction in post 25.

 

All the best, John.

[phil gollin]

.

 

Now, how many of those had air pumps ?

 

 

.

[Old Gringo]

In Locomotives of the SE & CR, by D.L. Bradley, published by the RCTS, 1961, it says that No. 272 (built Ashford 2/1904, withdrawn 8/1959) and the batch built by Sharp Stewart, nos. 711-725 (12/1900 - 1/1901) were all fitted with both vacuum and (Westinghouse) air brakes. "The air pump of the Westinghouse being attached Chatham fashion, to the right-hand side of the firebox." So, of our list of December 1961 survivors, air pumps should be on 31717, 31719, 31721, 31722, 31723 and 31724.

 

Unfortunately, that's all the details appertaining to modifications and the only other relevant information I can find is that during the latter half of 1960 Ashford works gave general repairs to 31244, 31293, 31588, 31686, 31717, 31719 and that 31717 received new cylinders. It also mentions, on page 14, that "Tonbridge remained a bright spot, with 31588, 31590, 31592, 31684 and 31716 frequently working passenger turns to Brighton and Redhill and due to a continued shortage of motor-fitted tanks, occasionally even to Oxted."

 

Hope this helps.

 

All the best, John.

Edited April 6, 2012 by Old Gringo

[Ian Hargrave]

New releases have arrived.

[neal]

 

In the model shop at the right time yesterday. Sorely tempted by the Southern version as well!

Edited July 1, 2014 by neal

[Oldddudders]

I think those gorgeous Pre-Grouping liveries are seducing a lot of modellers, and if this continues it augurs well for more successful models from that era. Good news all round.

[Barry Ten]

I think those gorgeous Pre-Grouping liveries are seducing a lot of modellers, and if this continues it augurs well for more successful models from that era. Good news all round.

 

Indeed, and there's no inherent reason why it couldn't catch on and become another popular RTR modelling era - maybe not as big as the BR steam or contemporary periods, but big enough to justify some more commercial investment. After all there are lots of attractions to the pre-grouping/Edwardian period as well, from the adverts, period clothing, to horse-drawn road transport, and so on. I often think nostalgia is only part of the reason why we're attracted to a given period - there are so many other factors as well.

[Smiffy2]

The Downton Abbey effect? WW1 centenary?

 

Anyone remembering BR steam must be in their fifties. Modellers look to the past.

[JSpencer]

So has anyone had their pre-order bumped up from say £76 to say £97?

[Wicor Models]

So has anyone had their pre-order bumped up from say £76 to say £97?

Unfortunately the RRP is now £112.95 meaning that Bachmann's 15% rule makes the minimum price for this model £96, any less and we run a serious risk of losing our Bachmann account.

 

Dave

[RFS]

So has anyone had their pre-order bumped up from say £76 to say £97?

Hatton's have just fulfilled my pre-order at £76.46, which was the guaranteed price if you did pre-order.

[Roy P]

I think those gorgeous Pre-Grouping liveries are seducing a lot of modellers, and if this continues it augurs well for more successful models from that era. Good news all round.

 

 

Indeed, and there's no inherent reason why it couldn't catch on and become another popular RTR modelling era - maybe not as big as the BR steam or contemporary periods, but big enough to justify some more commercial investment. After all there are lots of attractions to the pre-grouping/Edwardian period as well, from the adverts, period clothing, to horse-drawn road transport, and so on. I often think nostalgia is only part of the reason why we're attracted to a given period - there are so many other factors as well.

 

 

The Downton Abbey effect? WW1 centenary?

 

Anyone remembering BR steam must be in their fifties. Modellers look to the past.

 

I'm 53 and don't remember B.R. steam. I have a few vague memories of how the 1960's looked.

Nostalgia as such would be the '70s for me. That period doesn't hold my interest as much as what I ought to describe as historical.

To me, even as someone in their mid-fifties, I find B.R steam and pre-grouping / Big Four equally historical rather than nostalgic.

This might possibly explain why my "collection" increasingly resembles a museum. Long may it continue.

 

It makes things a lot easier that my son (born in 1993) has a rather nice collection of Rail Blue. Nostalgic for me - historical for him.

 

RP

[Jol Wilkinson]

Indeed, and there's no inherent reason why it couldn't catch on and become another popular RTR modelling era - maybe not as big as the BR steam or contemporary periods, but big enough to justify some more commercial investment. After all there are lots of attractions to the pre-grouping/Edwardian period as well, from the adverts, period clothing, to horse-drawn road transport, and so on. I often think nostalgia is only part of the reason why we're attracted to a given period - there are so many other factors as well.

If you look at what the "small suppliers" of kits, whether locos, rolling stock, infrastructure, etc. supply, it is already very well catered for. It is the lack of interest shown by the RTR manufacturers until the last few years that has created such a wealth of product.

 

I don't see the likes of Hornby and Bachmann getting too far into early stuff, other than locos, where the "Ooooh, I must have one" opportunity exists. In particular the early carriage liveries on panelled coaches are probably too expensive/difficult to produce at a price that most RTR modellers would be willing to spend.

[Roy P]

I don't see the likes of Hornby and Bachmann getting too far into early stuff, other than locos, where the "Ooooh, I must have one" opportunity exists. In particular the early carriage liveries on panelled coaches are probably too expensive/difficult to produce at a price that most RTR modellers would be willing to spend.

 

I would generally agree with that point but the R-T-R manufacturers may in medium or long term settle themselves into various sections of the market as they see it. Some buyers will seek niche products at a price and some will want the more basic (cheaper) stuff. Manufacturers of smaller volume hi-fi (or ornate) models will know their own market. A company trying to please all the people all the time (to maintain volumes) might struggle with such subjects.

I too doubt that we will see a tampo printed LNWR carriage any time soon but their is a certain pleasure in just imagining one.

Just out of interest, may I ask what "LNWR modeller" regards as "early stuff". In fact it would be fun to know how old something would have to be to have no appeal to anyone. 

RP

[JSpencer]

Hatton's have just fulfilled my pre-order at £76.46, which was the guaranteed price if you did pre-order.

Thank you.

The shop I did my pre order with 2 years ago just whacked it up £21.

[John M Upton]

My pre-order with Hattons arrived very promptly and the original price was honoured which I am chuffed about.

 

A crew in the cab, a lamp on the front and losing that weird shiny coal load for something a bit more realistic and it was ready to go:

 

 

Out of stock now though so its the higher price from here on in.

[Jol Wilkinson]

I would generally agree with that point but the R-T-R manufacturers may in medium or long term settle themselves into various sections of the market as they see it. Some buyers will seek niche products at a price and some will want the more basic (cheaper) stuff. Manufacturers of smaller volume hi-fi (or ornate) models will know their own market. A company trying to please all the people all the time (to maintain volumes) might struggle with such subjects.

I too doubt that we will see a tampo printed LNWR carriage any time soon but their is a certain pleasure in just imagining one.

Just out of interest, may I ask what "LNWR modeller" regards as "early stuff". In fact it would be fun to know how old something would have to be to have no appeal to anyone. 

RP

Pre grouping, which actually takes you into the early big four days. Even 1850's stock has interest for for some modellers but it is rather more difficult to model that sort of period owing to the relative lack of research material.

 

I don't think you'll ever see tampo printed panelled carriages in pre group liveries. Those of us that want to model the Victorian and Edwardian periods have recognised that there is no point in waiting for someone else to do It for you but just get on with it.

[SRman]

Bachmann have listed the SECR 'birdcage' stock as coming in SECR livery, so I would assume they will be suitably lined out and decorated.

The SECR C, latest issue is very tempting and I keep fighting with myself to resist spending money I don't have. The fact that it is selling out very quickly may save me from myself!  

I do have the original fully lined out release and am very happy with that model.

[darren01]

Hatton's could not have got many c class in, as I had one on pre-order and did not get on at the old price, and when I did phone them they where all sold out.

[Jol Wilkinson]

Bachmann have listed the SECR 'birdcage' stock as coming in SECR livery, so I would assume they will be suitably lined out and decorated.

The SECR C, latest issue is very tempting and I keep fighting with myself to resist spending money I don't have. The fact that it is selling out very quickly may save me from myself!  

I do have the original fully lined out release and am very happy with that model.

The difficulty with lining panelled coaches is getting the lining around the edge of the panel and against the beading. It is possible to cheat and line the edge of the beading, which is what I do with LNWR livery.

 

As the beading is prototypically about 1.5/2 inches wide, so less than 1.0mm in 4mm scale, then accurately aligning a tampo tool will be difficult to do consistently.

 

The SECR or MR single colour livery with lining is probably the most straightforward, but I wonder if the production difficulties and therefore probable final price will make it practical.

[7013]

Picked up my SE &CR 271 yesterday, beautiful loco so well detailed and runs smoothly from the off, Now have 592 and 271 and look forward to appropriate coaching stock. I would be interested to know what sort of freight stock these locos would have worked. Does anyone know of any online references to the wagons of the period?

[7013]

On another point, I did have 20% lumped on my preorder price as it was not guaranteed. In future I will ensure that the pre order price is guaranteed.

[Dunsignalling]

Bachmann have listed the SECR 'birdcage' stock as coming in SECR livery, so I would assume they will be suitably lined out and decorated.

 

The SECR C, latest issue is very tempting and I keep fighting with myself to resist spending money I don't have. The fact that it is selling out very quickly may save me from myself!  

 

I do have the original fully lined out release and am very happy with that model.

Now we know the price of the LMS Inspection Coach, it seems inevitable that my desired Birdcage 3-set in plain BR Vermilion, is going to cost me at least £150.  

 

Even before Bachmann's recent announcement on pricing, this was close to the ball-park figure I had in mind. I only want one set so I can live with it. 

 

Hornby were candid about the extra cost of producing complex multi-layer tampo printed liveries over simple ones on their Gresleys and I would be surprised if a fully lined-out SECR liveried set could hit the shelves at a price too far south of £200 for the three.

 

The manufacturers put themselves between a rock and a hard place with this sort of model. By any definition, they are niche products which are unlikely to be profitable if they sell only to those whose modelling interests they 'fit' at what we regard as r-t-r prices.

 

There is also a need to make those with a more 'scatter-gun' approach to the hobby fancy some too. The difficulty is, the very purchasers required to top-up sales to a viable level are those uncommitted to the prototype and most likely to be scared off by the price that realistically has to be charged. 

 

My own feeling is that the way Rapido Trains do things is the only sustainable way forward for less 'mainstream' models of any era; float the idea, invite orders and, if you get enough, make the models. Kernow Models did something similar (if a little 'looser') with their Well-tanks and 'Thumpers' and it seems to work OK. 

 

John  

 

Edited to get the words in the right order!

Edited July 2, 2014 by Dunsignalling

[RFS]

Hatton's could not have got many c class in, as I had one on pre-order and did not get on at the old price, and when I did phone them they where all sold out.

Cheltenham Model Centre claim to have 35 of the BR version in stock at £93 - http://www.cheltenhammodelcentre.com/products/23808-Bachmann-31-465-C-Class-0-6-0-31579-BR-Black-Late-Crest/