The Derby Line, Four Track LNER J6

[dibateg]

Thanks Martyn! - mine are the larger ones, but the 6" should be quite adequate Mark...

 

 

 

I have noted a few amendments to the instructions and deviated from them where it comes to adding the boiler fittings. Let me know if you are interested and I can pm them to you.

 

Regards

 

Tony

[dibateg]

Next job was to attach boiler and smokebox to the cab. Then clean up and put on the boiler bands and other detail. The boiler bands were put on in their entirety and then ground back where not required. I deviated from the instructions and made the pipe conduit up as a separate unit, as I was not confident I could solder the cover on neatly enough next to the boiler. It is a separate item in any case and is only attached at it's bolting on points.

 

 

Flat headed pins pass through holes in the mounting frame into the boiler:-

 

 

So both engines are now at this stage:-

 

[3 link]

Thanks Martyn! - mine are the larger ones, but the 6" should be quite adequate Mark...

 

 

 

I have noted a few amendments to the instructions and deviated from them where it comes to adding the boiler fittings. Let me know if you are interested and I can pm them to you.

 

Regards

 

Tony

 

 

Hi Tony,

 

 Sorry I butted in, I was just surmising as usual which when I think about it is not a good idea on here .

 

I must treat myself to a MOK kit, although it would have to be the 8f for me, so sooner or later I will be hassling you for any tips or pointers .

 

ATB,

 

Martyn.

[dibateg]

You are always welcome Martyn - I hope we will meet up at Telford!

 

Oh yes - go for the 8F mate!

[3 link]

You are always welcome Martyn - I hope we will meet up at Telford!

 

Oh yes - go for the 8F mate!

 

I would have loved to have gone to Telford, but I have a wedding to go to and SWMBO has already read me the riot act regarding possible excuses. Seriously though the chap getting married is an old fire brigade pal of mine and I wouldn't miss it for the world, we are like a brotherhood .

 

So hopefully we can have a catch up at Bristol in the new year .

 

ATB,

 

Martyn.

[dibateg]

 I decided to strip those lovely coaches in a previous post. they look tidy enough in the pics, but I think spraying in sunshine was a mistake, the paint dried too quickly and the surface was too rough to recover, so they have been dunked in cellulose thinners today.. a depressing and messy job. Ah well, always learning..

I was roughly analysing the time spent, the parts for this afternoons session had mostly been prepared yesterday evening, with the addition of the rear ends for the frames cutting out and preparation ( 1hr ), soldering - 2hrs, and cleaning up - 1.5 hrs at least, I am up to this stage:-

 

Out of interest, here are my cleaning up tools, a ground off broken file and the emery sticks, that were obtained from a model car stand at the Bristol show last year - they are invaluable. Blame Dikitriki for my fanatical cleaning up regime!

[JeffP]

Great idea...I've made similar sticks by wiping PVA glue onto lolly sticks and wooden bettens, laying them glue side down onto wet-or-dry paper and emery paper, leaving to dry, and cutting round the stick with a scalpel/craft knife.

 

You can get a lot of wet-or-dry sticks from one sheet.

[dibateg]

Thanks Jeff, let's hope we bump into each other at Telford. I'll try and remember to wear my dibateg badge.

 

I wondered what that little icon at the top of the page with a highlighted number was. Thanks to everyone that has given a rating!

[dibateg]

After hawking the loco's around Telford ( sorry I didn't catch up with you Jeff ), I've been pressing on. The platforms, sandboxes and upper steam pipes are now added.
I had to back track, as I had fitted washout plugs and not mud holes to the boiler. So I sweated those out and replaced them with circular covers recovered from my Andrews 2P etches. I thinned them down a little after soldering on. From the photos, the retaining nut is either very small or non-existent. It looks like in BR days the covers were often retained, surprisingly, only occasionally being missing. So here is the first difference between the two locos, 43156 has two covers missing. I managed with a little gynaecology work to insert two mud hole castings next to the firebox.

 

 

The Irwell book is an essential source of information, and the lightening holes are not etched out in the drag beam, and I didn't want it plain, so with a little estimation and careful drilling, and probably no - one will ever see this once they are finished - but I will be able to sleep at night:-

 

 

And then as fitted:-

 

 

And the real thing, although I doubt that part is original !:-

 

 

I managed on Monday to clamber all over the real thing and get a whole load of detail shots, or am I just making more work for myself!

So it is back to the chassis next, and I need to workout how I will fit my home made plunger pick ups.

 

[JeffP]

Home made plunger pickups? Pray tell.....

[dibateg]

I can't claim originality! Its an idea from the O gauge Guild Gazette, Gladiator models and a mate. Basically double sided pcb, with the inner side soldered to the frames. A brass tube with a 1mm rod plunger passes through from the outside face of the pcb ( with appropriate insulation gaps ) to behind the wheels. a small phosphor bronze loop spring creates contact pressure.

 

I'll post some pics when they are made up.

 

Regards

 

Tony

[ozzyo]

I would have done just the same as you and fitted washout plugs on the top of the boiler barrel like in this photo,

 

The fixing bolt that holds the mud hole door cover in place is small about 1/2" AF. It's in the centre of the cover and screws into the stud that holds the saddle clamp in place.

 

It's now granny and egg time. We all know about mud hole door covers but how many of us know what a mud hole door looks like.

You boy at the back can you tell me?  

 

Yes sir, it's them five? Things that are on the running plate in the photo below.

 

The boy at the back is correct them five things on the running plate are the mud hole doors. Five, that's interesting, why? You have four on the topside of the boiler/firebox on this side, so does the fifth one belong in the firebox side below the running plate?

The other thing that I've noticed is that there are two types of saddle clamp in use, the bridge type (I'm used to that type) then the flat bar type (a replacement?). 

 

Daft info. time. The clamp did not really hold the doors in place, but bedded the seal in place between the "boiler" and mud hole door (this was an oval shaped gasket about 1/4" thick and 3/8" wide) after the loco was in steam the pressure would hold it in place. When I were a lad we covered it in graphite grease to try and stop it sticking (I don't know if it worked, as the damned things were a bu99er to get loose). One thing that you did not want to do was drop one into the boiler. The reason being that it would bridge the water space between the firebox and the outer firebox and cause a hot spot (that's what I was told, god knows what all of them stays did then).

 

Removing them was always fun? First job remove cover if the bolt would come out. Second job slacken off the nut on the saddle clamp. Third job go and get a bigger hammer and some packing, then knock hell out of the stud to get it to come loose . Forth job turn it through 90 degs. keeping the clamp in place and get the bu99er out. It was about the same putting them back in apart from the big hammer.    

 

OzzyO.

Edited September 12, 2013 by ozzyo

[dibateg]

Thanks Ozzy - I think I saw you at a distance at Telford!

 

The flat bars seem do show in some period photos ( page 13 in the Irwell book of 43050 being built ). On loco's that have the circular cover in place, the nut that would be in the middle don't seem very prominint, ( 43037 on Page 10, any form of securing is invisible! )  but maybe they are smaller than I am expecting... a case for some scale hardware once I get enough evidence.

 

Yes - I don't supose it was much fun getting them out!

 

Best Regards

 

Tony

[Horsetan]

What lovely work! Are there any photos of the two injectors under the cab offside?

[JeffP]

I can't claim originality! Its an idea from the O gauge Guild Gazette, Gladiator models and a mate. Basically double sided pcb, with the inner side soldered to the frames. A brass tube with a 1mm rod plunger passes through from the outside face of the pcb ( with appropriate insulation gaps ) to behind the wheels. a small phosphor bronze loop spring creates contact pressure.

 

I'll post some pics when they are made up.

 

Regards

 

Tony

Can't picture it, so pics would be great, thanks.

[ozzyo]

Hello Tony all,

 

pity we did not get a chance to meet up at Telford. As I always like to meet fellow Rmwebers, more so if they build locos. Some may say that's the best way to see OzzyO, at a distance!

 

A couple of photos that may help you a bit. 

 

The first one is of 43104 in 1953 showing just about a full set of mud hole covers. You can make out the holding bolts on all three covers. If you down load it you should be able to blow it up to a good size as its approx 1.8mb.

 

The second one is of 43129 in 1961, showing no mud hole covers. By this time this loco had got AWS you can see the conduit running below the running plate, O/H warning flashes on the boiler/firebox, different pipe runs etc. You can just make out the cleat for the second boiler band on the top of the boiler, this looks to have been common practise as it appears on a number of photos in this position. 

 

 

OzzyO.

Edited September 12, 2013 by ozzyo

[dibateg]

Thanks Ozzy - thats very helpful.

 

Both my two loco's had AWS in the era I am modelling, I have to work out how to make all those clips for the conduit.

 

Good spot on the cleats - I shall have to trawl the Irwell book again, to check for a typical arrangement.

 

regards

 

Tony

[ozzyo]

Hello Tony all,

 

when I'm fitting clips for the AWS (or ATC most of the time) I fit short lengths of 1mm (or1.25mm) X 0.010" brass strips behind the valance (in your case it maybe better to have them as an inverted L). Then using a spacer (about 15 thou. it looks like you may need about 40 thou.) with a slot cut into it to clear the strip. Then with the conduit (I use 0.75mm tinned copper wire) and spacer in place bend the clips back over the wire and then trim them to length and solder in place.

 

It may not be 100% but it looks the part. The important part is the gap between the valance and the conduit keeping this parallel. If you want to fit a representation of the joints you can get some micro bore tube from Expo.

 

OzzyO.

[Blandford1969]

Nice locos,

 

The fifth mudhole can be found on the front of the firebox in between the frames. I honestly don't know why the one is a flat bar. On the photo of the pig a Bridgnorth, its worth remembering that it is not quite as in BR condition. The regulator on the firemans side was removed, from foklore after knocking out a fireman in the 70's. Also the brake originally had a fitting as well on the firemans side with a rod connecting it to the valve. The mounting studs are still there (you can just see them in the photo) and she is a wonderfull machine which is adorable to drive.

 

Regards

 

Duncan

[dibateg]

Thanks Ozzy - Thanks Duncan

 

 A holiday, and a return to some fitness, with corresponding dry weather has kept me outside on renovation work, but a 48 hour cold put me out of action, and the only thing I could do between sniffles was clean up castings. There are plenty of them for the cylinders and associated parts. So after a good few hours work I was ready to tack the first unit together:-

 

 

[JeffP]

Are ALL the castings nickel silver?

[dibateg]

Hi Jeff -

they are mostly brass, the slidebars and valve guides appear to be nickel-silver. It's remarkable how light coloured brass goes when it is polished up.

 

Regards

 

Tony

[Blandford1969]

Wow, lovley. I am looking forward to seeing these finished, did you get photos of the injectors for your build when you crawled over her, if not I took a couple before we set off for Kidder with the goods.

 

Regards

Duncan

[dibateg]

Hi Duncan - yes I was able all the photos that I need thanks.

 

Well it's taken a little while to assemble these cylinders. Firstly making sure all the castings line up and then ensuring slide bars and valve guides match the appropriate crossheads.

So here we have unclean - and nearly clean!

 

Omitted from the kit are the core plugs? ( I bet Ozzy will know what they are! ) They are not visible on the preserved 43106, but were in evidence in BR days. I also drilled and added fine tube for the lubricator pipes, here they are being added:-

 

Finally there is a 2 pot oiler on a bracket above the valve gland. So I scratched up a bracket and added a modified oiler and pipes:-

[PAD]

Superb work and beautifully clean! Like the method of attachment of the boiler conduit. Is that fixed with epoxy via the pins after painting to ease the lining process? I made the handrails and regulator rods detachable on the Duke to aid lining but never considered making the conduit detachable. Maybe next time. I built the College Models Kit of the "flying pig" some years ago. It made a very nice model but the kit lived up to the loco's nickname in that it was an absolute PIG to build. The MOK kits looks to be in a different league though and I would guess much more pleasurable to build. Cheers, Peter.