darren01 Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 HI would nice to see some blood and custered push pulls ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 HI would nice to see some blood and custered push pulls ? AFAIK the Maunsell sets only came to be in 1959/60 and would therefore be too late to appear in blood and custard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 I'm sorry but I don't agree with this. That's fine, I didn't ask you to. The simple point is that just because kits are made does not constitute a reason for RTR for a model not to be considered. I didn't say it was did I? Just my personal preference. In fact, I think a decent kit should mean demand is there for a decent RTR model. Which is why RTR manufacturers have picked out the best selling kits from the likes of DJH for their models I think! I think kit building has a place but to rule out great swathes of regional interest just because kits are available i think is nonsense. So what place is that then? You missed the point I made entirely! I'd rather see RTR take on subjects initially (providing there's a market for it) where an alternative route is inferior. From my own persoanl point (that is my opinion aloone) if there's a decent kit and no RTR then I'm happy to build a kit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Something I haven't noticed in the 2012 announcements are any more of the 'S&D' coach sets - I hope that Hornby will produce more of them over time and not just leave us with set 390. While it's not that difficult to renumber such a set, I would prefer to see further examples produced to Hornby's excellent finish. As you say, renumbering is not difficult, so perhaps it might be more useful to produce another one of the series (i.e. not 390) in blood and custard. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Graham_Muz Posted January 11, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 11, 2012 HI would nice to see some blood and custered push pulls ? AFAIK the Maunsell sets only came to be in 1959/60 and would therefore be too late to appear in blood and custard. Andy is correct that the BR(s) conversions, sets 600 to 619 as per the Hornby release only appeared in BR(s) green. Even the earlier Pull Push sets on the Southern Region did not appear in blood and custard (as only the main line stock on the SR gained B+C) but either retained Malachite (heavily varnished), all over crimson or later BR(s) Green. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 11, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 11, 2012 As you say, renumbering is not difficult, so perhaps it might be more useful to produce another one of the series (i.e. not 390) in blood and custard. Hornby still have quite a lot of scope in terms of new liveries and numbers for existing Maunsell models. Almost all the olive vehicles until now have been low-window, while the other three liveries have been more or less exclusively high-window. Set 392 has been done in olive, with set number - did it ever run on the S&D in that livery? Anecdotally there were significant numbers of olive vehicles post-1948, so there's a chance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 ...Set 392 has been done in olive, with set number - did it ever run on the S&D in that livery? Anecdotally there were significant numbers of olive vehicles post-1948, so there's a chance. There are photos of what appear to be this type in 1950-1 in a single colour which overlap with the earliest that I've seen in blood and custard. Would they have been more likely to be malachite or olive? Nick edit: 399 was still in a single colour in October 1954. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 There's a picture of one of these working on page 61 of Southern Region Flashback (Noodle Books, 2011), showing the end of one coach. Unfortunately the coach number is not legible but it's not on Gresley bogies and it has window bars. The caption notes that the stock was air braked and LBSC Atlantics and K-class moguls were used. Oh for a time machine... Bill Thanks for that Bill, I shall ask Kevin if he has any more such shots! Bradley records that 18 LBSCR and 4 SECR locos were used on those trains - as they needed Westinghouse braking equipment. Has anyone made progress on that time machine yet?!!!! . . . JE Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 There's a few more photographs of the O1 prototype in this month's Railway Modeller. It looks amazing, two views of it giving different angles. Of particular note - the running plate is exquisite, as is smokebox and boiler. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RedgateModels Posted January 11, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 11, 2012 It'll be in Hornby mag too, and yes it looks very tasty esp in hi-res Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Graham_Muz Posted January 11, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 11, 2012 I have also posted an image of the O1 pre production sample from the Hornby Media day here on my blog Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Thanks Graham, that's lovely Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
reevesthecat Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Anyone else notice in the catalogue page 113 the special feature of the super GUV is its interior detail! It has no windows! mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBill Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Thanks for that Bill, I shall ask Kevin if he has any more such shots! Bradley records that 18 LBSCR and 4 SECR locos were used on those trains - as they needed Westinghouse braking equipment. Has anyone made progress on that time machine yet?!!!! . . . JE Please ask him (nicely) for a volume 2 Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluex5 Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Quick question - were the Thompson 01's really rebuilds of the 04's or was it an accountancy thing to disguise the building of new locos? Just that for a loco that supposedly recycled the driving wheelsets from the 04, the wheelsets in Graham's pic are quite different to the 04 ones. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 ... blood and custered push pulls ? Particularly as applied to the covered wagons of Hathewekela, Munsee and Tsimshian design? Quick question - were the Thompson 01's really rebuilds of the 04's or was it an accountancy thing to disguise the building of new locos? ... Colonel Rogers comes down pretty heavily on the 'new construction' side of the line: the only parts of the original locomotive that remained were the main frames, and some driving wheel centres. That said though, those O4's that went through this process were supposed to be those whose boilers were coming up for renewal, and they may well have needed other major parts renewing. From the business perspective it is entirely sensible to renew such parts with better (and in the case of the boiler also cheaper) alternatives to deliver a significantly upgraded machine, if the revenue account would have been charged in any case to put an O4 unchanged back into service. (There are of course other costs to be considered in design, spares provision and the like; carpet, lift, sweep.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilwell Park Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Catalogues have now arrived in the shops, Hornby have informed that they are NOT issuing a price list with the catalogue. Interesting move.... I went to Ian Allan at Waterloo this morning and bought a B1, very nice. I asked about the catalogue and was told that they had arrived but could not be released yet as Hornby wanted all shops to release them at the same time. They also said they were waiting for price lists so they could insert them in the catalogue. Roger. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilwell Park Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Particularly as applied to the covered wagons of Hathewekela, Munsee and Tsimshian design? Colonel Rogers comes down pretty heavily on the 'new construction' side of the line: the only parts of the original locomotive that remained were the main frames, and some driving wheel centres. That said though, those O4's that went through this process were supposed to be those whose boilers were coming up for renewal, and they may well have needed other major parts renewing. From the business perspective it is entirely sensible to renew such parts with better (and in the case of the boiler also cheaper) alternatives to deliver a significantly upgraded machine, if the revenue account would have been charged in any case to put an O4 unchanged back into service. (There are of course other costs to be considered in design, spares provision and the like; carpet, lift, sweep.) According to the RCTS the frames, pony truck, wheels and side rods were all original. It was originally intended to fit the L1 pony truck and wheels, shorten the main frame by 9" and fit a group standard tender. These latter proposals were dropped on cost grounds. Initially the state of the engine received into works determined the extent of rebuilding. If new cylinders were required it became an O1, if cylinders were OK, and a spare GC boiler was not available it became an O4/8. If a spare GC boiler was available it remained in its original state. Roger Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Have I missed them or are there no new liveries/versions of either of Hornby's recent Engineers' wagons in the shape of the Trout and the Shark? JE Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 ... It was originally intended to ... shorten the main frame by 9" ... I've seen that noted in the LNER Encyclopaedia; am I missing something, or would it really have made any difference? Initially the state of the engine received into works determined the extent of rebuilding. If new cylinders were required it became an O1, if cylinders were OK, and a spare GC boiler was not available it became an O4/8. If a spare GC boiler was available it remained in its original state. That makes sense, cheers for that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Godfrey Glyn Posted January 11, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 11, 2012 Picked up the 2012 catalogue at Alton Models on Monday, together with a price list, so they are out at some shops. Godfrey Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RedgateModels Posted January 12, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 12, 2012 I have also posted an image of the O1 pre production sample from the Hornby Media day here on my blog Having another good look at this today it looks ready to go almost. The slides look like they need a bit more work and of course I have no idea if the pre-prod sample actually goes but for me paint it black and slap it in a box! Can you tell I'm getting excited about an RTR loco for the first time since the Hattons class 14 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 I have not stopped looking at the pics in Model Rail and Railway modeller of the O1. I don't think I've personally been this excited since the L1...! But that's the attraction, this is a model you wouldn't normally be able to pick up and play with without either hiring someone to build it for you, or do it yourself. I personally don't think my skills are up to building one, so an RTR O1 is such a boon for me. Of course, that means I can move onto the stages of modelling I like, renumbering/rebranding and weathering! I suspect a similar state of excitement can be found amongst Western modellers right now! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 ... It was originally intended to ..shorten the main frame by 9" ... I've seen that noted in the LNER Encyclopaedia; am I missing something, or would it really have made any difference?... Technically the frame only has to be as long as required to hang all the necessary tackle on - that much is obvious - and the O4 as originally constructed does look a mite generous in this respect. (Before the opinion of civil engineers firmed up on axle loadings and distribution over the wheelbase in terms of applied static load - which seem so obvious now - there were theories running around that it was weight per unit length that mattered. In consequence locomotives were built with overlong frames to increase length so that weight per unit length came to an acceptable value. In other words, they were heavier than they needed to be, in order to make them light enough for the civil engineer. That affliction took particular hold in some of the export markets much served by Beyer-Garratt: and of course the GCR works was next door. I have no proof that this idea filtered across...) But back to the O1 rebuild, shortening the frames would have in no way altered the success of the loco, but should have lightened it. The expense of making this modification would require justification; and most likely that would be for operational advantage by a significant improvement in route availability. That it was not proceeded with may well mean that no route availability improvement was possible. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted January 12, 2012 Share Posted January 12, 2012 Looking at that white boiler and cab on the Hornby 01, I wonder if we can expect an 04/8 as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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