RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 10, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 10, 2012 James, that is one hell of a long Lego bridge: over 140cm - I'm not surprised there's a bit of sag! At today's prices it would also cost a King's ransom. It's very refreshing to see the many varied solutions to "crossing a gap" - and I know you are very fond of your Lego. I never thought to look at your main thread in the layout section. Thanks for the link. Btw, I really wish I'd had the chance to build a larger viaduct! cheers, Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 10, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 10, 2012 Hi Jeff Nice layout the S&C is one of my favourite routes, my suggestion for a loco would be one of the A3's Holbeck shed had for the anglo scottish express' from around 1960-61 for a year. Only 60038 Firidausi stayed there longer, this was transfered away sometime in 1963. There is a wealth of pictures of locos allocated to holbeck in a book about the shed, I'll find my copy because I can't quite remember the name of the book at the moment. Thanks Rob Glad you're enjoying the thread, to date. I've barely got started - that's one of the joys of railway modelling, always things to build and improve upon. Please do dig out any relevant loco information. It may be shocking, but I haven't got any A3s amongst my rolling stock. Well, I do have the obligatory "Flying Scotsman" from way back, non-DCC and long since retired! Cheers, Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 10, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 10, 2012 Mike, I've made those measurements for you. These are for a rail-to-rail separation of 32mm, with closest approach being your kinetic-whatever (front of one coach to middle of the next!)... With adjacent radii of approx 39"/42" closest approach = 5mm With adjacent radii of approx 45"/50" closest approach = 8mm As you probably suspected would happen, the 24"/30" (approx) tightest approach lead to a collision. I've had to modify one of the lines so it moves away from 32mm. Not a problem as it soon disappears into the tunnel, bottom RHS. Thanks for bringing up these worst-case scenarios! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 10, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 10, 2012 Aside from playing with coaches on curves, a few small jobs have been done today. My switches have arrived, so I've tried out a mock-up to check the wiring arrangement. After one cock-up, which lead to a short-circuit, the wiring worked fine. So large-scale production can start, leading to the mimic board to switch the point blades. I've also got another 6 x 60" turnouts, so the fiddle yard can start to be constructed. I think I'm going to be busy from Monday - having a day out of the bunker tomorrow. Probably spend half of it on the Forum! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 10, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 10, 2012 Well, I couldn't resist doing something! So a suitable sheet of 6mm MDF has been cut to size and the first few holes drilled into it for the switches. A positive and negative power line has been fitted at top and bottom and soldering wires to the switches has begun. I'll post some photos in due course, though it might be teaching readers to "suck eggs". Tomorrow's "day off" has been cancelled as the bug has struck once again! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted November 10, 2012 Share Posted November 10, 2012 Hi Rob. Good to hear from you - must be 10 pages or so!! The super elevation thing was discussed at length as Larry (Coach) has done this on his layout. I've decided not to as the long curves have some tricky turnout combinations and I don't want to add inclines which may cause additional problems. Hope you are enjoying the Spring. With our clocks altered it's dark in the UK at 5pm now. Nevermind, it'll soon be Christmas! If you've done any more, non-copyrighted, photographic masterpieces it would be lovely to see them! Best wishes, Jeff Thanks Jeff, it's a pleasure to see progress on Kirkby Luneside, and I will think of something in the line of pictures which might have a bit of the moorland atmosphere instead of recent southern counties softness! An unrebuilt Patriot on a fitted frieght is likely. Did the Standard Britannia class work over the S & C in the 50s or early 60s? A lot were shedded nearby in their last years. Also an A3 would be nice in a pic., I shall have to choose number name and detail to get it close to authentic (I don't aim for perfect authenticity...!) Rain and grey weather here, but a luxuriant 10C ... Rob (NZ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 10, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 10, 2012 Thanks Jeff, it's a pleasure to see progress on Kirkby Luneside, and I will think of something in the line of pictures which might have a bit of the moorland atmosphere instead of recent southern counties softness! An unrebuilt Patriot on a fitted frieght is likely. Did the Standard Britannia class work over the S & C in the 50s or early 60s? A lot were shedded nearby in their last years. Also an A3 would be nice in a pic., I shall have to choose number name and detail to get it close to authentic (I don't aim for perfect authenticity...!) Rain and grey weather here, but a luxuriant 10C ... Rob (NZ) Hello Rob, I've a lot of photos showing the Britannia on the S&C. As I write this I'm looking at "S&C Steam Finale" by Michael Welch. Lots of photos of Jubilees, Black 5s, 9Fs etc, but including: July 1967 Thames Clyde Express St Pancras - Glasgow 70016 Ariel August 1964 Carlisle - Bradford Forster Square 70035 Rudyard Kipling April 1967 Skipton - Carlisle 70028 Royal Star So I'm guessing they were relatively frequent visitors. The A3s made a brief sojourn in 1960-61. I've just come out of the bunker: 12C inside, 5C outside. Cool!! Always a pleasure to hear from you! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 10, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 10, 2012 Mike, I've made those measurements for you. These are for a rail-to-rail separation of 32mm, with closest approach being your kinetic-whatever (front of one coach to middle of the next!)... With adjacent radii of approx 39"/42" closest approach = 5mm With adjacent radii of approx 45"/50" closest approach = 8mm As you probably suspected would happen, the 24"/30" (approx) tightest approach lead to a collision. I've had to modify one of the lines so it moves away from 32mm. Not a problem as it soon disappears into the tunnel, bottom RHS. Thanks for bringing up these worst-case scenarios! Jeff Thanks Jeff - very useful information and I see my subtle approach worked . I didn't want to appear rude or 'clever' (or wrong!!), but I was a little dubious about maintaining the same 6 foot dimension on the tighter curves however what you have shown is that it does work quite well at 39"/42" radii below which it is probably sensible to start widening the 6 foot interval and definitely widen it if down to 30" radius on the outer line in a curve. BTW regular/more frequent appearances of Brits came to the S&C fairly late although I believe they had been seen earlier on the 'Thames - Clyde'. You also need to be careful with numbers and smoke deflectors as with the general migration of the Class to the northern part of the LM the fleet included locos from elsewhere with such things as WR pattern smoke deflector handholds which wouldn't have been seen in the vicinity until the Western finally got rid of them in them in the earlyish 1960s. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted November 10, 2012 Share Posted November 10, 2012 (edited) Thankyou Jeff, Yesterday I made a picture of Hornby's lovely Britannia 70000 and I turned it into an unauthentic unlined green 70033 'Charles Dickens' which was a Carlisle engine after I think about 1964, certainly by 1966. 70035 might be possible in the same style in a suitable country scene with lots of rain cloud and/or sunshine. Working on it! Here is the shed scene I did yesterday, Bachmann 4-road shed, Hornby other bits including track, my bullhead rail is still under construction. Also posted similar pic in Hornby profit warning thread. Best, Rob Edited November 10, 2012 by robmcg 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 10, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 10, 2012 (edited) Mike, it's ok. I saw through your subterfuge! Lol. What I've done is to move the line separation out to 40mm and the coaches now pass each other with more than 5mm clearance, keeping the same radii. Thanks for the subtle hint. Don't worry - I'd rather you made me aware of a problem than watched me dig myself into a hole. Btw, my mods are minor - have you noticed that Larry has carried out some "minor modifications" today? cheers, Jeff Edited November 10, 2012 by Physicsman Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 10, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 10, 2012 Very interesting image, Rob. Hornby's 70000 was in the original unlined black, if memory serves me right. I really ought to have bought one, but, having seen 70000 on a number of occasions in green, I decided not to. The lighting on your photo almost gives the loco a green tint. Very nice! Jeff PS. I will certainly endeavour to have a couple of these magnificent locos running on Kirkby Luneside!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 10, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 10, 2012 (edited) Mike, it's ok. I saw through your subterfuge! Lol. What I've done is to move the line separation out to 40mm and the coaches now pass each other with more than 5mm clearance, keeping the same radii. Thanks for the subtle hint. Don't worry - I'd rather you made me aware of a problem than watched me dig myself into a hole. Btw, my mods are minor - have you noticed that Larry has carried out some "minor modifications" today? cheers, Jeff All sorted at the right time Jeff and we've all got some useful data out of it as well thanks. And yes I've seen Larry's latest - I think he took one look at the pic he posted at No.375 in his thread and carried on from there - photos tell us an awful lot that the eye doesn't register so perhaps cameras should be kept away from layouts under construction (and leave us with nothing to talk about? - no way!!!). Forgot to add - 70000 ran in unlined black for a matter of a few weeks on trials when new and it was the only BRit to ever run in a colour other than green (although I think one might have run for a while in a rather peculiar shade of (mixed) green for a little while near the end of its life - otherwise they spent their life in lined green with the GE ones the cleanest of the lot followed by, probably, the Western ones while they were at Canton although I think the early days of the Class on the LM saw some kept quite well, by the mid '60s they were generally filthy like so many other locos. Edited November 10, 2012 by The Stationmaster 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 (edited) Thankyou Mike, I think only one Britannia got an unlined green repaint late in BR days and it quickly turned to ash soot and rust colours so memorably recorded in so many photos of the class in 1965-67, but I cannot recall where I read that, thus I took liberties with the appearance of 70033. Also 70034-6 all received smooth-sided deflectors, not sure about Charles Dickens. Some of the photos I've seen show various of the class in very sad condition externally. The photo was of the pristine black 70000 so all the tones and effects are by way of experiment. I have half-done the same view of the engine in a wide valley not unlike West Yorkshire at the head of a line of maroon Mk1s also Hornby, and will post that here in a day or two. I have a Hornby model with flush deflectors in pristine Brunswick green, as well as a Bachmann unrebuilt Patriot for a fitted freight, so I shall be busy! Also want to build my bullhead rail track, and might for Xmas give myself a TMC weathered engine... a Brit certainly would be nice, or another Spam Can... ah what a hobby. Marvellous. Rob Edited November 11, 2012 by robmcg Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach james Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 The Brits were also used on the anhydrite train, as both a mileage train (wring out the last few before the general overhaul) and as a break in after the overhauls. There is an account in one of the backtrack's about that. I know they were more limited in their haulage than a 9F or even a 8F, which isn't a big shock given the rather larger wheels. I have 71038, which is totally wrong for the S&C, but since my 3.5" gauge one is also '38, I was kind of stuck with it in any case. James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 11, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 11, 2012 To be honest, the Britannias are such impressive machines, I would say "to hell with the prototype" and run them on KL, irrespective! Agree totally with you Rob - what a hobby, marvellous. Is there any other that gives such a sense of satisfaction and well-being at a job well done? Having said that, what is it about a 100 ton lump of metal that appeals? It's probably inexplicable! It's early morning coffee, followed by work on the mimic board. It'll only be a basic route switcher job, no flashing LEDs etc. For now I just want it to do a simple task. Clever stuff can come later. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 (edited) well here you are.... 100 tons making easy work of a grade near Kirkby Luneside, those Derby boilers really could steam! Have a nice Yorkshire morning. I have seen The Last of the Summer Wine and it's always sunny... Edited November 12, 2012 by robmcg 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 11, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 11, 2012 Eee lad! Those were the days!! 5C outside, a bit nippy and, Rob - in true "Last of the summer Wine" fashion - it's sunny outside! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Hi Jeff, I hope you are well, back from my hols and WOT DO I SEE! some wonderfull pics of a couple of Brits, well I must have at least one and maybe a Clan, the Hornby ones are lovely so I did have another 8f put by for next week but I think that will now be a Brit or Clan, progress is looking good but, well done BUT STLL NO GRASS, :no: HAHAHAHAHHA hehehe, all the best Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 11, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 11, 2012 Hi Jeff, I hope you are well, back from my hols and WOT DO I SEE! some wonderfull pics of a couple of Brits, well I must have at least one and maybe a Clan, the Hornby ones are lovely so I did have another 8f put by for next week but I think that will now be a Brit or Clan, progress is looking good but, well done BUT STLL NO GRASS, :no: HAHAHAHAHHA hehehe, all the best Andy Welcome back from your hols Andy. I've been busy, though nothing obvious to show for it. Currently soldering switches - enjoyable, but gets a bit tedious after 4 hours. More soldering tonight and more tracklaying this week. Hopefully I'll post some pics as well. Cheers, Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Yes mate, I know what you mean about soldering, Ii is a very tiresome job and the only way to tackle it is to keep saying to yourself that once it is out of the wat you can do the control panel and wire the track. then you can PLAY TRAINS, DONT LET THE FUMES GET TO YOU Andy. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 11, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 11, 2012 (edited) Yes mate, I know what you mean about soldering, Ii is a very tiresome job and the only way to tackle it is to keep saying to yourself that once it is out of the wat you can do the control panel and wire the track. then you can PLAY TRAINS, DONT LET THE FUMES GET TO YOU Andy. I love the fumes! Lol. Actually just switched the soldering iron off. Half the panel is done - all tested and it works fine - so far. Of course, thats just the panel. Then there's the messing around under the board to get the wires TO the panel. And the panel is only for the point blades. Then there's the track bus and the polarity changing... It's fun though - when it works! Jeff Edited November 11, 2012 by Physicsman 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelW Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Hi Jeff, sounds like you're making good progress there. Don't forget to enjoy the track-laying/soldering/fumes while you can! How are you powering your cobalts? Have you thought how you're going to split up the track bus so you don't lose all power if you get a fault? More importantly of course, the same divisions will make it a lot quicker to locate the fault. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 11, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 11, 2012 (edited) Hi Jeff, sounds like you're making good progress there. Don't forget to enjoy the track-laying/soldering/fumes while you can! How are you powering your cobalts? Have you thought how you're going to split up the track bus so you don't lose all power if you get a fault? More importantly of course, the same divisions will make it a lot quicker to locate the fault. Evening Michael. I haven't given much thought to the track bus yet - other than the fact I'll have a radial arrangement this time - I used a ring last and, contrary to what some people say, had no trouble at all. The Cobalts are being powered from a labpack I "borrowed" from my previous employment. Voltage stabilised DC and AC, 0 - 16V. A very nice unit! And I'm afraid the fume-addiction continues - the iron is now back on, so I'll fit another 8 switches tonight. Jeff Edited November 11, 2012 by Physicsman Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 The smell of flux and solder gives me that comfortable at home feeling........you know, build a coach to indie-shoegazer-electro-orchestral-Celtic pop .....go for a walk with the Yngwie Malmsteen backpack ...... rip up some track..... everyday stuff ... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 11, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 11, 2012 (edited) The smell of flux and solder gives me that comfortable at home feeling........you know, build a coach to indie-shoegazer-electro-orchestral-Celtic pop .....go for a walk with the Yngwie Malmsteen backpack ...... rip up some track..... everyday stuff ... And it's entirely legal!! No need for those multi-leafed plants growing under UV in your roof, or fifteen pints of beer. Just a few hours imbibing the flux. I know what you mean Larry. And it IS actually a very pleasant smell. Electronic incense of a kind!! Hope to get the mimic completed tomorrow. Itching to do a bit more tracklaying. Done any of that recently Larry? Oops! Jeff Edited November 11, 2012 by Physicsman 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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