jukebox Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 And one a little closer to home for you, Jeff: http://www.tatasteeleurope.com/file_source/StaticFiles/Business_Units/Long_Products/Projects/Monkwearmouth%20Bridge%20Strengthening.pdf (wonder how I knew about that one? ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 7, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2012 (edited) As far as the check rails are concerned, I'll have a look at some photos of S&C viaduct practice to see what may be needed. Jeff S&C viaduct practice seems to have been fairly straightforward - no guard or check rails. I have found a not very clear picture of Lunds viaduct in the late 1940s which looks as if there were no guard rails and a very clear picture of Dent Head Viaduct from the mid-late 1950s with no guard or check rails (which accords with my none to marvellous memory of the line from the early part of the 1960s up to the end of steam). It was not a 'requirement' to have guard or check rails in place on all viaducts but was effectively a discretionary thing left to the railway to decide. So that's one job out of the way Edited to add - in any case the arrangement for bullhead track differed from that for flat bottom (because it served a different purpose) so pictures of what is nowadays done on flatbottom track, especially on other than masonry viaducts, are likely to be misleading. Edited November 7, 2012 by The Stationmaster 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted November 7, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2012 Very good point Jonathan - you make me aware of things I'd not considered. I've been so used to sh***y radii on my old layout (max radius about 24") that I've never had the locos close-coupled. Should be ok now. You are dead right about running the locos. When it's up and running you'll have to come over and have a play!! Jeff I'd love too. Regarding coaches, if it was anything like like the Peak line, trains could be made up of a right rag-bag, Mk1s, all three Stanier "periods" and the odd Midland was not exceptional. Time to get some orders into Comet or you could push the boat out and give Larry a commission so that he can continue to live in the style to which he has become accustomed build that outdoor loop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinZaPint Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Ok, here is 45562 Jubilee "Alberta" heading into the station with a very light load and no driver! That viaduct really looks the bees knees, well worth the effort, very well done. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Jeff, I wouldn't put check rails over your viaduct. Been looking at pictures of S&C viaducts and yet to find one fitted with check rails. On any model the curves tend to be sharper than the prototype and by fitting check rails, this would only exaggerate the curvature. Just leave it be. Regards, Peter 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 Jeff, I wouldn't put check rails over your viaduct. Been looking at pictures of S&C viaducts and yet to find one fitted with check rails. On any model the curves tend to be sharper than the prototype and by fitting check rails, this would only exaggerate the curvature. Just leave it be. Regards, Peter S&C viaduct practice seems to have been fairly straightforward - no guard or check rails. I have found a not very clear picture of Lunds viaduct in the late 1940s which looks as if there were no guard rails and a very clear picture of Dent Head Viaduct from the mid-late 1950s with no guard or check rails (which accords with my none to marvellous memory of the line from the early part of the 1960s up to the end of steam). It was not a 'requirement' to have guard or check rails in place on all viaducts but was effectively a discretionary thing left to the railway to decide. So that's one job out of the way Edited to add - in any case the arrangement for bullhead track differed from that for flat bottom (because it served a different purpose) so pictures of what is nowadays done on flatbottom track, especially on other than masonry viaducts, are likely to be misleading. Peter, Mike - I've also been scanning through loads of images of S&C viaducts. Like you, Peter, I found no check rails. Thanks to Mike for providing the reason. So many thanks to all who've contributed to that - it could have been an essential add-on. As it is, I don't need to bother. Jeff 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 That viaduct really looks the bees knees, well worth the effort, very well done. David Hi David. I don't know whether you've read through the whole thread, but if you go back to about pages 5 - 8 you'll see that the original idea was to have two straight viaducts. Then some wit(s) on here - well, quite a lot of them - "suggested" it would look better with curved viaducts. I'd never tried anything like it before, so wanted a challenge. The branch viaduct is now redundant, but the main and branch took about 7 weeks to build. I'm quite proud of them and comments like yours are much appreciated. I just wish I had the space to build an even bigger layout with a much longer viaduct at its heart. Crazy or what? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 Scott - thanks for the info. I've NO idea why you're so familiar with THAT particular bridge!! Jonathan - wait 'til I get the fiddle yard built, the track bus fitted and at least one main line running. Then I'll clean the rails up and you can bring a few locos across and we'll have a play! If you like curry, even better. Btw, when's the wedding and when is the big THREE- OH (lol...)? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 A "Peak" on the viaduct would be nice..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 A "Peak" on the viaduct would be nice... If that's a request then I'll oblige when I go back into the bunker later on. I've a blue class 44, green class 45 and green class 46. I'll see what I can concoct!! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 7, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2012 A "Peak" on the viaduct would be nice..... .... as long as it's green Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 Oh it's green alright... Class 45 D95 heads towards the station... While D95 waits, class 46 D188 heads the other way... As requested by a number of people, the two Peters especially (Western Sunset and P.C.M). Jeff 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Linthorpe Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 That looks like a stunning viaduct to me Jeff. I have just gone back to the beginning but after a few pages I realised that you are probably working at a faster pace than I can read. I will now keep up though, and attempt to catch up on the early stuff as and when. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 (edited) That looks like a stunning viaduct to me Jeff. I have just gone back to the beginning but after a few pages I realised that you are probably working at a faster pace than I can read. I will now keep up though, and attempt to catch up on the early stuff as and when. A lot of people have plenty to say on this thread - so it's getting huge! But, hopefully, progress is being made. Thanks to the RMwebbers, in 6 months I've probably achieved what would have taken me 2 years without them. This is a great place to be, as you'll find out. Enjoy the thread! Jeff Edited November 7, 2012 by Physicsman Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 Michael - just spotted your name at the bottom of the page. Will PM a couple of pics to you - they aren't very good. Happy "gap hunting"!! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelW Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Ah, you spotted me having a sneaky peak before I leave work (hope no-one here did though). For the rest of you - the difference the sleepers have made is big - if you're lucky Jeff may post some pictures on here for you all... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted November 7, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2012 Scott - thanks for the info. I've NO idea why you're so familiar with THAT particular bridge!! Jonathan - wait 'til I get the fiddle yard built, the track bus fitted and at least one main line running. Then I'll clean the rails up and you can bring a few locos across and we'll have a play! If you like curry, even better. Btw, when's the wedding and when is the big THREE- OH (lol...)? Jeff 1 I'm only DC at the moment. 2 So long as it's not too hot, it makes me nose run! 3 April 2013 4 Nov 2014 Now stop playing those locos and get some more track down. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 1 I'm only DC at the moment. 2 So long as it's not too hot, it makes me nose run! 3 April 2013 4 Nov 2014 Now stop playing those locos and get some more track down. Yes, sir... yes, sir... They don't like it up 'em... Clive Dunn died today Put 6' of the branch - into the fiddle yard today. More SMP/Cobalts/Turnouts on order for the FY. If you are DC then you'll have to play with whatever I've got. No probs. Of course, there is no reason why I shouldn't start fitting the track bus shortly. A bit of underboard soldering might tidy the gazillions of droppers a little! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 John, is this the kind of thing you are referring to? This was from Ribblehead - a photo I downloaded (I think) from Flickr... Those are replacement rails Jeff; check rails are used for tight curves and are close up to the running rail. As Sandside has said those are not check rails... A moot point as it now appears to have been decided that there are none on the S&C viaducts. Those are not check rails, but neither are they loose replacements ( or an extra narrow gauge line or any other bizarre explanation). Apparently, they are guard rails, see this topic. I knew nothing about them either, before I read that. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schubert Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Hi Jeff, progress indeed. Your track work is looking good. I'll be out of a job soon if you continue mastering things at this rate! Re DC vs DCC - I'm sure we can temporarily set it up so that you can run dc for visiting loco's. Were Co-Bo's ever seen on the S&C? ;-) Al Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Without meaning to cause problems Jeff, are you going to give super elevation to the curves on the viaducts? Shoud be about a scale 1-2" higher on outside curve, or a wedge of cardboard under outer rail. I say this because I glued track down on my tabletop railway in 2005 and regretted not being able to add a 'cant' or super elevation to curves. You understand that it is spring down here, and the garden is full of busy birds, plants are growing madly, and anything is possible... Rob (NZ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 (edited) What people see on todays railway often does not apply to steam days, those check rails being a case in point. I sometimes forget how fast time has passed. I was fortunate to see the first 'Peak' (44) in Manchester Central with PM MacMillan on board in 1959....All very modern and yet the GCR Directors could still be seen.... The Co~Bo's worked a particular freight out of one of the sidings on the S&C....Got one on video but cannot remember where... Edited November 7, 2012 by coachmann Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 Without meaning to cause problems Jeff, are you going to give super elevation to the curves on the viaducts? Shoud be about a scale 1-2" higher on outside curve, or a wedge of cardboard under outer rail. I say this because I glued track down on my tabletop railway in 2005 and regretted not being able to add a 'cant' or super elevation to curves. You understand that it is spring down here, and the garden is full of busy birds, plants are growing madly, and anything is possible... Rob (NZ) Hi Rob. Good to hear from you - must be 10 pages or so!! The super elevation thing was discussed at length as Larry (Coach) has done this on his layout. I've decided not to as the long curves have some tricky turnout combinations and I don't want to add inclines which may cause additional problems. Hope you are enjoying the Spring. With our clocks altered it's dark in the UK at 5pm now. Nevermind, it'll soon be Christmas! If you've done any more, non-copyrighted, photographic masterpieces it would be lovely to see them! Best wishes, Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 Hi Jeff, progress indeed. Your track work is looking good. I'll be out of a job soon if you continue mastering things at this rate! Re DC vs DCC - I'm sure we can temporarily set it up so that you can run dc for visiting loco's. Were Co-Bo's ever seen on the S&C? ;-) Al Hi Al. Well, I've been laying the track for 3 weeks now. Pleased with the result. A jungle of (labelled) wires under the boards - 23 Cobalts so far, more to fit.... I'm enjoying myself though. I haven't done this much soldering for 30 years! Pop round at your convenience. And btw, you'll never be unemployed - I'll always have lots of stuff to ask you! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted November 7, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2012 A moot point as it now appears to have been decided that there are none on the S&C viaducts. Those are not check rails, but neither are they loose replacements ( or an extra narrow gauge line or any other bizarre explanation). Apparently, they are guard rails, see this topic. I knew nothing about them either, before I read that. Nick Cheers Nick. I'll take a look. I sometimes wonder whether there's a degree of pedantry in some of these terms. Check or Guard rails? Trap or Catch point? But then again, to the uninitiated, Mass and Weight are the same thing. Aren't they? NO NO NO NO!!!!! Jeff 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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