Model Rail Limited Editions news

[Budgie]

If they can get it right on some models, why can't they get it right on all of them? To me it's as though they don't know what they are doing.

 

An example of one where they got it right: http://tinyurl.com/o3gp8a6

[griffgriff]

Not going to argue with that but unfortunately it has tended to be the mysterious way of Heljan.

[muddys-blues]

Ok Gent's here is the first of the MR Red Star 128 model, kindly posted by Tony Walker in the Heljan 128 thread, so I thought it would be prudent to post it on here as well......my opinion for what it's worth ? I am still very unsure about the top half blue shade

 

 

 

Heljan 128.pdf

[the-gog]

Ok Gent's here is the first of the MR Red Star 128 model, kindly posted by Tony Walker in the Heljan 128 thread, so I thought it would be prudent to post it on here as well......my opinion for what it's worth ? I am still very unsure about the top half blue shade

 

It's way off. I've taken the liberty of using one of the images in Tony's PDF - I hope he didn't mind - and first corrected the lighting to give a neutral balance. (My monitor is hardware calibrated). This is 55993 from the factory:

 

 

and this is what it should look like:

 

[Pete 75C]

It's a lovely model but that shade of blue has killed it. What a shame.

[the-gog]

The red band also looks too light. For the record, I have a slide taken by a friend of mine in nice sunshine of 55993 in this model. I scanned it on a calibrated slide scanner, so I know the colours are spot on. I also compared it to photos on the net of 55993 in this livery.

 

RWJ

[muddys-blues]

Regarding the 128, aah well, at least it will keep somebody busy in the returns department of Kernow MRC...........such a shame after such a long wait and a good number of chances to get the colours right.

[muddys-blues]

Just a question on returning an item to Kernow MRC on behalf of MR, does the return postage cost get credited back on to your card also along with the cost of the model ?

 

Best regards

Craig.

[the-gog]

At least they'll go cheap on eBay if anyone wants spares.

[the-gog]

Just a question on returning an item to Kernow MRC on behalf of MR, does the return postage cost get credited back on to your card also along with the cost of the model ?

 

Best regards

Craig.

Dunno, but firstly it'll be covered by the Distance Selling Regulations. Second, it's faulty and not as described, purely because it isn't what it was supposed to represent. Imagine trying to sell a model of 4472 in neon green paint. Craig and I pre-ordered it, so we can be considered to have bought it blind.

 

RWJ

[muddys-blues]

If an item is sold that does not match your expectations then I think the return postage should be honoured, especially if you have had the item on pre-order, then to be £10 out of pocket in returning the item is not on really.

 

Best regards

Craig

[woodenhead]

This is a difficult one, correct livery versus perception of the correct livery.

 

Looking at images online of the prototype (and that's all we have to go off) then it may appear to be too light at the top. But like Dibber points out, lighting, exposure and dirt will impact what the image shows versus the reality.

 

With GOG's impression of the livery whilst it is his perception of the correct livery I would perceive his image is too dark.

 

So who is right, GOG, me or Dibber25?

 

Dibber has access to the person who painted it, we have access to flickr but no one has access to the prototype as it was in 1987.

[the-gog]

This is a difficult one, correct livery versus perception of the correct livery.

 

Looking at images online of the prototype (and that's all we have to go off) then it may appear to be too light at the top. But like Dibber points out, lighting, exposure and dirt will impact what the image shows versus the reality.

 

With GOG's impression of the livery whilst it is his perception of the correct livery I would perceive his image is too dark.

 

So who is right, GOG, me or Dibber25?

 

Dibber has access to the person who painted it, we have access to flickr but no one has access to the prototype as it was in 1987.

 

One of the photos I worked from was a slide scan I did on a calibrated scanner of a friend's picture. It's of a clean 55993 in the sun. I can assure you, I'm confident of the colour match I made.

[muddys-blues]

This is a difficult one, correct livery versus perception of the correct livery.

 

Looking at images online of the prototype (and that's all we have to go off) then it may appear to be too light at the top. But like Dibber points out, lighting, exposure and dirt will impact what the image shows versus the reality.

 

With GOG's impression of the livery whilst it is his perception of the correct livery I would perceive his image is too dark.

 

So who is right, GOG, me or Dibber25?

 

Dibber has access to the person who painted it, we have access to flickr but no one has access to the prototype as it was in 1987.

 

I suppose if I run my MR Limited Edition Class 128 Red Star Parcels model, in it's Sky Blue livery, and put my Ray Ban's on, it may look like the real thin inside the tunnel   ???

[the-gog]

I suppose if I run my MR Limited Edition Class 128 Red Star Parcels model, in it's Sky Blue livery, and put my Ray Ban's on, it may look like the real thin inside the tunnel ???

 

As well as being too light (i.e. too much luminosity), the incorrect light blue shade is too biased towards cyan. Regarding perception of livery, we all agree that the bottom darker blue is correct, don't we? I'd say there's a bit too much magenta in it, but it may have been photographed under a non-tungsten light source, thus with a low CRI, but really, it's quite marginal. If it's the same blue as on my banger blue 128, it's correct.

 

Richard

[woodenhead]

i'm not saying you are wrong, I am saying it is very difficult to prove who is right, but you are fully entitled to your perception and equally to your decision whether you can live with the model or not.

 

In one image I have seen there is a sprinter in it's original provincial livery which does look very close to the upper body colour on 55993 (in model form) whilst the prototype does look darker than the sprinter.

 

I can look at images on different machines and get different results, certainly on my PC the top looks lighter than it did on my iPad.

[muddys-blues]

I am just hoping that when my model arrives and I look at it in the day light i am proven wrong.........but deep down, I cannot help thinking the picture that Tony put on the forum, the model still looks too much like the picture that MR used for the initial advert, which a few people said was way to light.

 

Here's hoping

Craig.

[the-gog]

i'm not saying you are wrong, I am saying it is very difficult to prove who is right, but you are fully entitled to your perception and equally to your decision whether you can live with the model or not.

 

In one image I have seen there is a sprinter in it's original provincial livery which does look very close to the upper body colour on 55993 (in model form) whilst the prototype does look darker than the sprinter.

 

I can look at images on different machines and get different results, certainly on my PC the top looks lighter than it did on my iPad.

 

The light blue that Heljan have used is more or less the light blue Provincial as used on the original 150/1 when new. It's far too cyan and far too light for 55993 in this livery.

 

To judge colour accuracy, I only use my calibrated monitor.

[DaveF]

The debates about correct colour always fascinate me, especially in the context of models such as this one.

 

Remember though that no one has perfect colour recall and that no two people will see any colour in exactly the same way.

 

Also the accuracy of colour rendering in any colour photograph depends on the light (i.e. the colour temperature of the light), the specific film emulsion - every slide film and negative film reproduced colours slightly differently and the conditions in which the images were stored before scanning.  There is also the question of the accuracy of the scanner which depends in part on the light source used in the scanner and the software.  Even digital cameras of different makes (and even models of the same make - look at the magazine tests of cameras) will show the same colour as different.

 

I have learnt that even with a calibrated monitor I cannot guarantee the accuracy of any colour, even if I have the object in front of me.  How colours appear on to my eye on my monitor also depend on the colour temperature of the light in my room.

 

Having said all this it is still possible to say if a colour is way out, but exact accuracy is (almost) impossible.

 

David

[the-gog]

Most scanner software come with settings that take in account the emulsion used. You can even get IT8 targets on different emulsions (Ektachrone, Fuji, Agfa, and so on). I scanned the reference slide on Ektachrome setting, as it was an Ektachrome slide, having first calibrated the slide scanner with an Ektahrome IT8 target. With reference to cameras, I calibrated my D200 with each lens I have with a Gretag Macbeth colour chart. I use the right profile when processing in Adobe Camera Raw.

 

Going back on topic, I've gone after someone's opinion on the Heljan light blue. He used to see 55993 very often in the 80s.

[woodenhead]

This is the image at Crewe with the Sprinter

http://www.railphotoarchive.org/UIH/uih_v32.php?icb=0629021303000|f||wm_0|4|||j|0|

 

Which does suggest the colour is closer to your reproduction but if that is the case why did ModelRail get it so wrong.  Heljan have history of getting some models so wrong whilst others have been so right, but a commission from a reputable model railway magazine should have had it's homework done right.

[the-gog]

This is the image at Crewe with the Sprinter

http://www.railphotoarchive.org/UIH/uih_v32.php?icb=0629021303000|f||wm_0|4|||j|0|

 

Which does suggest the colour is closer to your reproduction but if that is the case why did ModelRail get it so wrong.  Heljan have history of getting some models so wrong whilst others have been so right, but a commission from a reputable model railway magazine should have had it's homework done right.

 

That's one of the photos I referred to when I did the colour replace.

[muddys-blues]

This is the image at Crewe with the Sprinter

http://www.railphotoarchive.org/UIH/uih_v32.php?icb=0629021303000|f||wm_0|4|||j|0|

 

Which does suggest the colour is closer to your reproduction but if that is the case why did ModelRail get it so wrong.  Heljan have history of getting some models so wrong whilst others have been so right, but a commission from a reputable model railway magazine should have had it's homework done right.

 

Tomorrows meeting at the MR office...."So how has the Heljan 128 limited edition gone down then ?"

[muddys-blues]

This is the image at Crewe with the Sprinter

http://www.railphotoarchive.org/UIH/uih_v32.php?icb=0629021303000|f||wm_0|4|||j|0|

 

Which does suggest the colour is closer to your reproduction but if that is the case why did ModelRail get it so wrong.  Heljan have history of getting some models so wrong whilst others have been so right, but a commission from a reputable model railway magazine should have had it's homework done right.

 

Meanwhile at Kernow MRC Returns Department, "can you put this 128 in the pile with the others just behind Tim over there ?"

[the-gog]

I've had a reply from my pal about the livery. I sent him both images - Heljan’s original by Tony and my colour replaced one. His reply:

 

It's a complete f**k up as far as that upper panel is concerned. I bet Model Rail are hopping mad! Even you correction seems a tad on the light side as I recall it.