Grantham - the Streamliner years

[beast66606]

t's only a signal!

 

 

 

 

[Nelson Jackson]

I think it's a work of art

[JCL]

Mrs4479 says 'waste of a cocktail stick; they're reserved for cheese and wine'(!)

 

And sausage onna stick, though I'd be cutting my own throat.

[AJ427]

Thank you for a cracking step-by-step - one that I'll be following myself in the future.

[LNER4479]

You make the whole process of making a signal look so easy, but I assume it looks that way from a lot of practice and experience over a number of years. Still I guess we all have to start somewhere

 

Mike

Thanks Mike. Actually, I hadn't made too many signals before the Grantham project BUT have taught myself to solder over a period of 20 (very) odd years of loco kit building, both whitemetal and etch brass, the latter of which I find the most satisfying, so I guess that qualifies as the practice/experience part. To anyone who is fearful of soldering all I can say is 'give it a go'. There's nothing like that instant satisfaction of knowing you've made a good joint. And if you haven't, simply heat it up, pull apart, clean up and start again - you can't do that with glue! (as a general rule)

 

It nay only be a signal to you Robert... that really looks great, a work of art.

 

I think it's a work of art

 You know guys? You're right! And that's not a comment on my work, rather the prototype items that I (and others) seek to recreate.

 

There's been a thread running these last few weeks in MM&M regarding the phrase 'modern image'. Inevitably, many of the comments refer to steam vs diesel/electric but in my view, semaphore signals versus lights-on-sticks (oh, alright then, colour light signals!) is every much a part of whatever is meant by 'modern image' (or not). IMHO, any semaphore signal, even the humblest single home arm on a post, has an elegance and charm simply not present in a colour light equivalent and absolutely stamps the era of a railway scene. So definitely worth the effort to include them on a model

[The Stationmaster]

 

 

There's been a thread running these last few weeks in MM&M regarding the phrase 'modern image'. Inevitably, many of the comments refer to steam vs diesel/electric but in my view, semaphore signals versus lights-on-sticks (oh, alright then, colour light signals!) is every much a part of whatever is meant by 'modern image' (or not). IMHO, any semaphore signal, even the humblest single home arm on a post, has an elegance and charm simply not present in a colour light equivalent and absolutely stamps the era of a railway scene. So definitely worth the effort to include them on a model

 

I beg to take issue sir.  Colour light signals on 'main line railways' in Britain have been around since the 1920s in ever increasing numbers and have embraced a whole range of styles and form which give them quite an interesting history - in many cases being as distinctive to owning Company or BR Region as were the semaphores they replaced.  It is only in the past couple of decades that any sort of truly common uniformity has emerged and that is only in new work with many distinctive structures clearly indicating their design office origin still in everyday use.

 

But i would agree wholeheartedly that they - even the older designs - do not have the elegance and visual appeal of the more impressive semaphore designs.

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

There's nothing like that instant satisfaction of knowing you've made a good joint. 

Ah, I remember that feeling well from my Art Student days....

 

oh wait, what? Soldering?

[LNER4479]

I beg to take issue sir.  Colour light signals on 'main line railways' in Britain have been around since the 1920s in ever increasing numbers and have embraced a whole range of styles and form which give them quite an interesting history - in many cases being as distinctive to owning Company or BR Region as were the semaphores they replaced.  It is only in the past couple of decades that any sort of truly common uniformity has emerged and that is only in new work with many distinctive structures clearly indicating their design office origin still in everyday use.

 

But i would agree wholeheartedly that they - even the older designs - do not have the elegance and visual appeal of the more impressive semaphore designs.

Fair point - I did stick an 'in my view' in advance of my outrageous statement! Interestingly, there was a small scale programme of colour light replacement in the Grantham area c.1937 in that the mechanical boxes/signals northwards on the ECML were replaced by colour lights (as a cost-saving exercise). I have the opportunity to portray a cameo of this as there are a couple of Maurice Earley pictures of the south end of Peascliffe tunnel in 1937 showing a lovely 'gallows' somersault signal (for northbound trains) and directly behind it the colour light that is about to replace it. I intend to replicate exactly that (ie the somersault still operational; colour light covered up) on my model.

 

It's true also that colour lights continue to evolve; witness the recent(-ish) change to LED technology such that four aspect signalling can now be provided by only two separate light clusters, hence the visual appearance of signals changes yet again. It was ever thus...

Edited December 2, 2013 by LNER4479

[The Stationmaster]

And of course one thing which was to be found not to far away from Grantham was a mechanical colour light signal (searchlight type, 2 aspect).

 

Incidentally, and sorry to rabbit on, but having two separate light units to create the 4 aspects is nothing new - very 1950s in fact (and could be seen on the GN mainline among other places) but then it didn't involve leds of course.

 

But I do like your superb somersault signals - true works of art.

[gr.king]

I know I've not said much lately while busying myself with coaches, but I love those o-so-nicely-built semaphores. My "Bardney" 1939-ish really ought to have something better than Ratio LNER upper quadrants, although the latter may actually be correct as there was a modernisation of signalling on the Lincolnshire loop line in the mid-30s and the immedaite post war views certainly show upper quadrants at Bardney. What the Hell eh? I LIKE semaphores - but I do hate spending money.....

Edited December 4, 2013 by gr.king

[manna]

G'Day Gents

 

When I used to sit up the front of a diesel on a filthy wet and windy night, straining my eyes looking for that tiny tiny little green (hopefully) light 30 feet up in the air at Tempsford, how we wished the new colourlights had taken over from these ancient semaphores, but a couple of months after they had switched the new colour lights on, we begain to miss the old semaphores, they just gave something to the scene, that was the railway, and the sadness of all those empty signalboxes all cold and dark.

 

manna

[LNER4479]

Well, at 1252 this morning (yes, that's 52 mins past midnight!) the first signal arm was operated from the control panel. Here's how I got there:

 

Pictures so far of the signal on site have been a temporary lash-up. Time to fix it up properly. As Grantham is a transportable layout, I've designed all signals to be removable. I admire those who seem to manage with permanently planted signals on an exhibition layout but I just don't trust myself not to wipe one out in a moment's absent-mindedness whilst manipulating baseboards!

 

The rectangular hole, marked on the previous photo, is now cut out with one of the most useful tools in the box - the coping saw. No layout builder should be without one.

 

With the hole cut out, this is the start of the 'paddle box' (pardon?). A piece of brass from the spares box, bent to match the shape/size of the hole.

 

The heavy duty soldering comes out to solder up the paddle box. Here the bottom is being soldered in place and the top (the actual base that the signal will be attached to) awaits its turn. Note the holes in the top piece - these are where the operating wires will pass through (see below). There are equivalent holes in the bottom plate that is being soldered.

 

Here the box is being tried for size. It needs to be a tight push fit. A file is used to gradually shave off the sides of the hole where it's catching until the precise fit is achieved. Note the folded up tabs on the base plate; this is to help locate the signal post.

 

Now we can fix the signal in place. This needs to be a strong joint so plenty of heat and solder here. The square is used to ensure the signal is as near vertical as I can get it.

 

Removed from the layout, the remaining parts of the mechanism can be completed. Here I'm attaching the nickel silver actuating rods. These pass through the holes (mentioned above) in the top and bottom plates to keep things running straight and true. The one on the right has been terminated in a loop in the horizontal plane...

 

...and to these are attached the 'paddles' (aha!) These are simply flat plates where the cams will act on (see next pic).

 

These are the cam assemblies, again being knocked up using odds and ends from the spares box. The cams themselves (the sort of triangular pieces) are from 40thou (1mm) brass so they have a bit of substance to them. These items will be hidden from view so this part of the work doesn't have to be that pretty!

 

And here they are in position. We're looking up towards the base of the signal. A horizontal push on the cam causes it to engage with the paddle to create an upward push to activate the signal. The paddle and everything above it returns under gravity.

 

The magic ingredient - Viessmann signal motors, wonderful pieces of German miniature engineering. As they are designed specifically for signals I bought one to try and have not looked back since. I get mine through Gaugemaster.

 

I mount them in softwood blocks, which are then fixed to the underside of the baseboard.

 

Here's the first one fixed in place and attached to the cam. Note that I have introduced a 360deg loop into the motor actuating arm - this is for adjustment purposes. This completes the installation. The motor and cams stay where they are; it's just the paddle box and signal assembly that is removed for transportation.

 

Same view - but with the signal pulled 'off'! The motor has activated, pushed the cam, engaged with the paddle... well, I think you can see for yourselves! The motors are two way, ie requires an opposite feed to return them to danger. There's just a momentary click and then it moves silently in a lovely damped action.

 

Some finishing off to do (eg the addition of ladders) and the other motors to install but essentially, that's it folks! (I'll return with a post script when it's all done).

 

Thank you for your comments and compliments over the last week or so; it's nice that there's been some interest in this aspect of the layout. Definitely worth the effort (IMHO); signals add so much to a layout.

 

'Robert'

Edited December 6, 2013 by LNER4479

[micklner]

Is the Distant fixed or is there another motor to be fitted  ? Do the motors have their own power supply ?

 

 

 

 

Nice work.

[LNER4479]

Thanks Mick,

 

I have two more motors to fit, one for the distant and one for the left hand arm (signalling an arrival into the bay platform - the old plat.1)

 

The motors are wired exactly the same as, say, a Peco point motor, ie a common side to the supply and then two wires, one for up and one for down (or 'off' and 'on' to use correct terminology). The big difference tho' is that once the motors get the pulse to move they instantly dis-arm themselves from that direction (the spring/damper does the rest). So they can be worked off AC or DC and either a passing contact or simple two-way switch. Very flexible.

[Joseph_Pestell]

Totally agree with you, Robert, that operating signals add so much to  a layout. It really does not seem like a railway without them. That said, not too many people have been brave enough to model somersault signals.

 

On the colour-light/semaphore issue, the semaphore commends itself by having more movement but the sequence of lights on a 4-aspect signal as the train goes away is also appealing. Banbury has the best of both worlds with some of each.

[Kenokie]

Robert

 

Yet another brilliant "how to" step by step series od photo's - most of the "how to" sections in the magazines would benefit from following your style -

 

Its all so simple - when you know how ..... and now I do  

 

Thanks

 

Chris

[islandbridgejct]

The site wouldn't let me click 'thanks', 'agree', 'informative' and 'craftsmanship' all at the same time, so: I agree with the sentiments about semaphores; found the explanation of your method of constructing them highly informative; and think that, with the combination of lattice posts, somersault arms, and working mechanism, your signals are works of great craftsmanship. Thanks for posting them. Alan

[George Leacon]

Awesome work, thanks for posting this - I've never seen that method of making signals detachable before, but it looks (reasonably) simple and effective.

 

RE the semaphore vs colour lights comments above, there are still secondary main lines (such as the ex-Midland Hope Valley Main Line in the Peak District) that use semaphore signals, so they aren't utterly obsolete yet!

 

Ben

[LNER4479]

Thanks George and others for kind comments over the last few days - they are, as ever, much appreciated.

 

I happily confess to being a semaphore spotter(!) and always pleased to see them in action  (even if some have been somewhat mutilated by being plonked atop rather more modern structures). I'm not aware of any mainline somersaults surviving (although is the one at Boston docks still extant?) but you can still enjoy the experience thanks to the good chaps at Nene Valley (there may be others) on this rather fine gantry arrangement at Wansford.

 

 

Meanwhile, in other news, the layout has been in action over the weekend as we've had a 'training' and Barrow Hill planning session. All sorts going on and fantastic stock projects being worked on by co-conspirators (the layout looks rather bare again this morning after it's all gone!). Unfortunately, we were all so busy trying to work out how the layout functions that there was limited photography going on. However, I believe one or two snippets may emerge over the next couple of days. All I can say is that, with grateful input from others, we're doing our best to make sure we put on a good show for the first outing, which is now less that nine weeks away (gulp!)

 

Oh - and an honorary mention for 3279's magnificent P1 that now holds the layout haulage record of 55 (loaded) coal wagons (something we can replicate at Barrow Hill). You should see how the baseboards sagged as this leviathan made its way round (only kidding )

[jwealleans]

There will be the former Falsgrave gantry at Grosmont once it's erected and commissioned, although I don't know how many dolls they're planning to put up there.

[Jason T]

Can't believe that I've not commented on your fantastic thread before but I am now and that is to say thanks for the motivation to get on with building my own signals.

 

P.s. Grantham is lovely but I am looking forward to seeing what you do with the next project on the proper side of the Pennines

[LNER4479]

Grantham is lovely but I am looking forward to seeing what you do with the next project on the proper side of the Pennines

So am I (looking forward to it that is) - but gotta get this one finished (hah!) first

 

I'm sure signals will be a breeze for you. Be great to see them sprouting up - give that lovely signalbox something to do

 

(ps - do give us a shout if you're heading up Hamsterley Forest way with that bike of yours. We're not too far away from there)

[Jason T]

I've not been up to Hamsterley Forest in years, the last time being when there was a fair bit of snow on top of ice and three of us tried to ride the Downhill course.

 

I will definitely give you a shout; I even have spare bikes, helmets, etc. if you fancy it

[gr.king]

For some of us it is not so much a question of which side of the Pennines. Much more important is the question of which side of the Humber......

[LNER4479]

I even have spare bikes, helmets, etc. if you fancy it