RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted March 14, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 14, 2017 (edited) D6xx Warships were indeed A1A-A1A, with the end wheels of each bogie powered by gearing to the final drive shaft and the centre ones carrying, to keep axle weight and riding reasonable; they were a good bit heavier than the D8xx series which could get away with B-B.. Like the production Warships and the Westerns, not to mention Deltics, they were effectively 2 locos in one body. with separate diesel engines, hydraulic pumps, torque converters and fuel supplies, though there was IIRC only one fuel tank. This was a significant 'selling point' at the time, as it was held to increase the loco's reliability in service; if one end went down with a fault, the other one would get you home even if you lost a bit of time on the way! Other regions went for extensive double heading to increase reliability in this sense and to gain sufficient power to pull the trains. It is not easy nowadays to appreciate how powerful an argument this was in 1958; drivers were terrified of the new fangled diesels breaking down on them ('we could always limp home with steam, nothing to go wrong on 'em, see'), and it was fairly well embedded in railway culture at all levels that diesels, if they were to work well, needed a lot more intensive maintenance of a type that the available skillsets were not well versed in. Edited March 14, 2017 by The Johnster Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted March 14, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 14, 2017 (edited) Go forward about 10 images & see what is behind the 2-10-0 Could they be fish vans The innards of that loco are very interesting Will the drive for the model be similar I.E. motor in body(electric vs hydraulic) with drive shafts & gears to the wheels If I an seeing correctly the D6XX an A-1-A Will the model be a "C" type bogie(not very prototypical but OK by me) John I went forwards about 15 images and found the atomic locomotive, powered by Uranium-235 !!!https://www.flickr.com/photos/ausdew/24783531925/in/photostream/ That one would glow in the dark !!! It's easy to see why the Fell diesel was a failure, but it gives a good indication how it could work in OO form using that same gear tower design !!! - that manufacturer / retailer that keeps hinting it should take note !!! https://www.flickr.com/photos/ausdew/24690031231/in/photostream/ Edited March 14, 2017 by adb968008 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted March 14, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 14, 2017 Go forward about 10 images & see what is behind the 2-10-0 Could they be fish vans The innards of that loco are very interesting Will the drive for the model be similar I.E. motor in body(electric vs hydraulic) with drive shafts & gears to the wheels If I an seeing correctly the D6XX an A-1-A Will the model be a "C" type bogie(not very prototypical but OK by me) John 2B or B2, that is the question........ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
miles73128 Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 I purchased some salmon last night but upon putting it in the pan found the pan was warped, which is strange because it cooked other foods perfectly. You need to cook with Le Creuset. Iron never warps! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted March 14, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 14, 2017 I went forwards about 15 images and found the atomic locomotive, powered by Uranium-235 !!! https://www.flickr.com/photos/ausdew/24783531925/in/photostream/ That one would glow in the dark !!! It's easy to see why the Fell diesel was a failure, but it gives a good indication how it could work in OO form using that same gear tower design !!! - that manufacturer / retailer that keeps hinting it should take note !!! https://www.flickr.com/photos/ausdew/24690031231/in/photostream/ More mazak rot! The problem is worse than we thought... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel_H Posted March 29, 2017 Share Posted March 29, 2017 Sorry to be a killjoy, but is this thread getting too far off topic now? I know the long development period for this model has caused people to start to speculate quite a lot, but now this thread is getting silly. There are threads on the forum for jokes, but for those of us who wish to keep up to date on what is happening with the Kernow D6xx this thread is becoming rather hard to follow. Jamie Somehow, we need to pass the time while waiting for news, and have a little fun... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted March 29, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 29, 2017 Other regions went for extensive double heading to increase reliability in this sense and to gain sufficient power to pull the trains. Even the WR used double-headed 37s on some expresses for a time. That's something I have never seen modelled yet would be very easy to show. Every day these 600s get a little closer. I can hear the distant chug of one even now coasting down the bank with an overnight working from London and easing back for the Hayle stop. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRman Posted March 29, 2017 Share Posted March 29, 2017 Even the WR used double-headed 37s on some expresses for a time. That's something I have never seen modelled yet would be very easy to show. Every day these 600s get a little closer. I can hear the distant chug of one even now coasting down the bank with an overnight working from London and easing back for the Hayle stop. There was a brief experiment with a pair of regeared class 37s on the WR, where they were allowed 100 mph running. It wasn't deemed successful enough to persevere with, but I don't know the reasons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted March 29, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 29, 2017 (edited) There was a brief experiment with a pair of regeared class 37s on the WR, where they were allowed 100 mph running. It wasn't deemed successful enough to persevere with, but I don't know the reasons. May not be the only reasons but IIRC challenges with diagramming of a restricted pool of locos plus unsuitability were cited according to "The Western since 1948" Phil Edited March 29, 2017 by Phil Bullock Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted March 29, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 29, 2017 (edited) There was a brief experiment with a pair of regeared class 37s on the WR, where they were allowed 100 mph running. It wasn't deemed successful enough to persevere with, but I don't know the reasons. Landore (87E) used a pair of its recently delivered 37's to haul the XP64 stock (protptype Mk2's) on a Swansea-Paddington return working with faster timing in the summer of 1966.Sampled it once berween Bridgend and Cardiff.It was then the last word in rail travel ......o tempora ! etc.... Edited March 29, 2017 by Ian Hargrave 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted March 29, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 29, 2017 May not be the only reasons but IIRC challenges with diagramming of a restricted pool of locos plus unsuitability were cited according to "The Western since 1948" Phil Yes - I think the real problem was a relatively restricted pool of locos which didn't allow reliable operation of the 100mph services. Let's not forget that locos involved had to have the right type of bogie, had to be physically capable of working in multiple with each other and needed the maintenance to keep them there. All for an extra 10 or 5 mph of top speed and a small improvement (if any) in acceleration. Great idea but ultimately one that would be difficult and expensive to sustain especially for the limited return it offered. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith George Posted March 29, 2017 Share Posted March 29, 2017 As far as I know the Bullied diesels are being sold by Kernow in the usual way of ordering then paying when the model is ready for dispatch. They are looking for payment up front for the D6xx, why the difference? Keith. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted March 29, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 29, 2017 As far as I know the Bullied diesels are being sold by Kernow in the usual way of ordering then paying when the model is ready for dispatch. They are looking for payment up front for the D6xx, why the difference? Keith. That is an option offered to pre orders,yes. Another option open for your query in particular is to contact Kernow for further information which might ( or might not ) satisfy your curiosity on the matter.I have to say that it is not exercising mine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rembrow Posted March 29, 2017 Share Posted March 29, 2017 As far as I know the Bullied diesels are being sold by Kernow in the usual way of ordering then paying when the model is ready for dispatch. They are looking for payment up front for the D6xx, why the difference? Ke ith. If you order a D600 at the full price of £169.99 you won't have to pay up front, it's only pre payment if you want a pre order discount of £10, which applies to new orders and existing orders affected by the price increase. The Bulleid is now priced at the same £169.99 but without any discount option. The other difference is that kernow have advised with the Bulleid, that they may be able to maintain the original price for pre orders depending on exchange rates nearer to production. Kernow are dealing directly with the factory for the Bulleid, which may be the reason for the price policy differences Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted March 29, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 29, 2017 (edited) Additiionally, and as Kernow MRC stated when they finalised the pricing of the D6xx, the upfront payments will mean the goods can be produced sooner and the business would carry a smaller loan - if any at all - for their production. It is an option. It was done to mitigate the price rise which had to be imposed as the original was set under the old regime when everything coming out of China cost a lot less. If you have pre-ordered a 600 and have received an email from Kernow advising of payment options then if you wish to take advantage of prepayment you may only be out of pocket an extra £5 overall. The actual cost of the loco has risen £30 of which £10 is offered as a discount for pre-paid orders and £15-worth of credit applied in addition to your loyalty account (for UK customers only) mitigating the rise very considerably. Kernow are to be commended for this and for supporting their very patient customers who have waited a long time for these locos. If you wish to pay in the more usual way namely full payment once the locos arrive then you are of course at liberty to do so though you will then pay the full shelf price. The Bulleid locos have not been caught up in a change of manufacturer but as with the 600s they have to be created from drawings and photos as no survivor exists to scan. This takes a lot longer than a project which can be laser-scanned so they are still some way off yet. Edited March 29, 2017 by Gwiwer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45568 Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 If you have pre-ordered a 600 and have received an email from Kernow advising of payment options then if you wish to take advantage of prepayment you may only be out of pocket an extra £5 overall. The actual cost of the loco has risen £30 of which £10 is offered as a discount for pre-paid orders and £15-worth of credit applied in addition to your loyalty account (for UK customers only) mitigating the rise very considerably. Kernow are to be commended for this and for supporting their very patient customers who have waited a long time for these locos. Kernow are also putting the 15GBP credit into a loyalty account for overseas customers too! Mine has already been placed there, (and spent), they are working on offering all customers access to a loyalty account. As Gwiwer says, Kernow are to be commended for the way they have handled a difficult situation. Cheers from Oz, Peter C. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted March 30, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 30, 2017 Kernow are also putting the 15GBP credit into a loyalty account for overseas customers too! I shall stand corrected on that point. I had thought the loyalty scheme was only for UK customers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted March 30, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 30, 2017 The Bulleid locos have not been caught up in a change of manufacturer but as with the 600s they have to be created from drawings and photos as no survivor exists to scan. This takes a lot longer than a project which can be laser-scanned so they are still some way off yet. I presume you missed this one Rick?https://grahammuz.com/2017/03/25/kernow-mrc-bulleid-diesels-break-cover-along-with-gate-stock-livery-samples-Bachmann-birdcage-set-livery-sample-and-other-sr-model-news/ They are in front of the D600s now, a nice surprise from Kernow. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted March 30, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 30, 2017 I presume you missed this one Rick? https://grahammuz.com/2017/03/25/kernow-mrc-bulleid-diesels-break-cover-along-with-gate-stock-livery-samples-Bachmann-birdcage-set-livery-sample-and-other-sr-model-news/ They are in front of the D600s now, a nice surprise from Kernow. Neil I had completely missed that Neil so thanks for drawing it to my attention. I did note that KMRC made a comment to the effect that they "would not be bullied into giving away .... " details of something and I interpreted that as meaning "Bulleid" not "bullied". However given the amount on my plate right now in the midst of an international removal it's hardly surprising that I missed that post! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted March 30, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 30, 2017 (edited) With a £1000+ of pre orders, and 2 paid in advance, I'm a bit disconcerted that the only way I am hearing from kernow is via this forum. I get the weekly mail, and my login is my email, so it's not as if I'm hard to reach. I can only presume this offer is selective based on who they feel is worthy of contact. I've never had luck with the whole points thing either, with years of past orders, I've asked a few times about the points but never got an answer either. I will of course call them, but given what I read, I can only deduce my money isn't wanted, and I've been excluded, which isn't a nice feeling. I'll most likely hit the reset button, cancel all, refund the 2 and see how it goes down the road if I resume or decide to pass. At the end of the day it's a hobby, not a job., when the fun stops, stop... and reading of secret deals to select customers, on stuff I ordered years ago isn't fun. Edited March 30, 2017 by adb968008 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted March 30, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 30, 2017 Before cancelling anything might I suggest phoning Kernow MRC just to check they have your email address correctly on file? You won't receive much correspondence if that has been recorded wrongly, what ever the reason might be. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted March 30, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 30, 2017 (edited) Before cancelling anything might I suggest phoning Kernow MRC just to check they have your email address correctly on file? You won't receive much correspondence if that has been recorded wrongly, what ever the reason might be. 100% yes they do.. my login is my email, and I get their weekly letter too, I also have the original order confirmations spanning several years in my inbox.I have spoken on the phone in the past and never quite seemed to have gel'led with them, their calls have always felt a bit "short" as if I'm bothering them, so I've tended to minimise it. The offer/deal etc has been rumoured on here for a few months now, and I've waited patient and silent, knowing their busy, but at this stage I felt it's appropriate to speak up as the dates quoted have passed and no communication was received on any objects I preordered. As I said when the fun stops stop, they seem to busy and I don't feel my business is of interest. I then don't want to push water uphill, the models, whilst exclusive will inevitably appear on ebay, and having waited 6 years for some, I can wait a few more months. With regards the diesels, I have 2xD600's, 2x 102xx, 2xclass 71/4 as well as gate stock, railmotor etc etc on preorder. I've logged into my account and see with regards the d6/102x the prices have now been zeroed out, from their original value indicative of either a price change or cancel by their end. I don't want be a downer on the subject or labour it, kernow clearly have a huge fan base and support, but in this case I'm not appearing to have met the criteria. I will add I've never had an issue with instock orders or deliveries only the subject of pre-orders, communication of which I've found wanting, cancelling all items and ordering on release may be a better route, though I have no issue paying up front in advance, the fact I've been missed out of the oppourtunty is the part that grates, which leads to want to decline and pass. I wish them the best and success the models deserve. Edited March 30, 2017 by adb968008 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted March 30, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 30, 2017 100% yes they do.. my login is my email, and I get their weekly letter too, I also have the original order confirmations spanning several years in my inbox. I have spoken on the phone in the past and never quite seemed to have gel'led with them, their calls have always felt a bit "short" as if I'm bothering them, so I've tended to minimise it. The offer/deal etc has been rumoured on here for a few months now, and I've waited patient and silent, knowing their busy, but at this stage I felt it's appropriate to speak up as the dates quoted have passed and no communication was received on any objects I preordered. As I said when the fun stops stop, they seem to busy and I don't feel my business is of interest. I then don't want to push water uphill, the models, whilst exclusive will inevitably appear on ebay, and having waited 6 years for some, I can wait a few more months. I don't want be a downer on the subject or labour it, kernow clearly have a huge fan base and support, but in this case I'm not appearing to have met the criteria. I will add I've never had an issue with instock orders or deliveries only the subject of pre-orders, communication of which I've found wanting, cancelling all items and ordering on release may be a better route, though I have no issue paying up front in advance, the fact I've been missed out of the oppourtunty is the part that grates, which leads to want to decline and pass. I wish them the best and success the models deserve. Rather than be so down on them, perhaps it is simply an oversight? Any system that involves people is, unfortunately, prone to errors. On my part, my experience on phoning Kernow has always been very positive. Roy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted March 30, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 30, 2017 100% yes they do.. my login is my email, and I get their weekly letter too, I also have the original order confirmations spanning several years in my inbox. I have spoken on the phone in the past and never quite seemed to have gel'led with them, their calls have always felt a bit "short" as if I'm bothering them, so I've tended to minimise it. As I said when the fun stops stop, they seem to busy and I don't feel my business is of interest. If then don't want to push water uphill, the models, whilst exclusive will inevitably appear on ebay, and having waited 6 years for some, I can wait a few more months. I don't want be a downer on the subject or labour it, kernow clearly have a huge fan base and support, but in this case I'm not appearing to have met the criteria. Although Chris Trerise and his team have an ambitious seemingly ever expanding programme,they are in fact a comparatively small outfit with a busy workload combined with regular visits to shows far away from West Cornwall.In such circumstances maybe occasionally things might slip.My "secret" email arrived well behind some other forum members but it DID eventually materialise and I accordingly agreed to advance payment.Nothing sinister there .Like you I am just a long term (happy) customer and not a member of Mebyon Kernow Best advice...Pick up the phone and talk as Gwiwer has advised. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clearwater Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 I agree with Ian- if you call, you can always ask how it is progressing. When I did, I got quite an informative answer on that and other projects David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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