Wright writes.....

[Clearwater]

There's a thread on cataloguing pictures for the GWR started by Rick (The Fatadder). Miss Prism consolidated the list here: http://www.gwr.org.uk/no-photo-database.html

 

There was an extensive debate on the thread, which I suggest isn't repeated here, on what fields to use, how to populate them etc etc

 

David

[Jamiel]

Is kit building and PAINTING going to be a thing of the past? Who else has seen this thread on 3D COLOURED printed models. I find these modern developments really interesting. 3D coloured printed model figures, buildings etc would be a great advantage to many modellers.

As well as the point Headstock makes, 3D printing has its own character, and for a lot of people it is a character they will not like. I have seen some lovely work done with 3D printing, but I wouldn't have it on my layout as its character is too different. There is also a resolution issue, curves are not true curves, but made of steps, and these will have to be worked into to get a result that some will require.

 

I have been impressed by the way it can replicated brickwork with the jumps in texture that has, and also broken and spalled bricks.

 

Just as cinema did not finish theatre, TV did not finish cinema, and the internet has not finished all before it, it will simply be another tool and one that brings its own character, it will appeal to some and not others, or be incorporated in part by some.

 

Jamie

[Tony Wright]

A spreadsheet is a grid based calculation programme where you can build linked calculations. E.g. If relationship X and relationship Y both hold then do calculation Z or if not Y.

 

People use it for all sorts of things from tracking sales, simple databases, calculating accounts, developing project plans etc. I'm sure some railway modellers will use it for putting together timetables. I use it as a database to keep track of what I own and information I collect (eg carriage formations). Excel is the most common brand. It's a free form programme where you can build what you want using the tools they give you. You can buy templates to use but others, myself included, prefer to build our own using some of the functions already built in (e.g. Annuity calculations or statistical functions). Things like the weekday count can be useful if you, for example, want to calculate a spike in prices/activity for a Saturday when building a budget. You can build a calculation that references a row of dates and tell the programme to Use 4 items if a Saturday or else 2 items

 

So to take an example, if you wanted to work out how much a product would cost under a number of scenarios, you can build the basic calculation (cost of inputs multiplied by number required multiplied by profit margin etc) but use a different row/column to put in a key variable, eg the cost per unit. The output cells in the table will then show you the cost for each scenario. Modelling of a different nature. Screenshot attached and apologies for off topic nature of post!

 

DavidIMG_0017.PNG

Thanks, David, for taking the time and trouble to post this information. I'm sure it'll be of some use to readers. 

 

I'm glad I know nothing about it because it seems hideously complicated to me. 

 

This morning I've been writing captions describing the minutiae of detail differences among the LNER loco types. I'll stick with my books and what's in my own head. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

No disrespect to Tony, but I suspect you are flogging the proverbial dead horse.

Why is there only one 'agree' icon? 

[Tony Wright]

so on a lighter note, i just ordered two of the London Road Models GNR/LNER tenders as a start of to kit building. 

 

Id like to know some pointers and starting tips please. i have a soldering iron, flux, solder and an assortment of files. What else does everyone think i need? 

 

If i get stuck, expect a lot emails, photos and queries Tony.

 

cheers everyone for the help.

 

Jesse 

Good afternoon Jesse,

 

I describe the building of just such a tender in my Crowood book, which should be on sale this week. 

[seahorse]

Excel is useful for station nameboards - use white text on maroon background in sans-seri font and scale to size

[Tony Wright]

Speaking of the detail differences among ex-LNER locos, anyone like to comment on this pair of shots, please? 

 

 

 

The latter (according to KRP's notes) was taken over a year later than the former, which is interesting. 

 

I've already written my notes, so it'll be interesting to see what others come up with. 

 

Thanks in anticipation.

 

The Booklaw book these'll be published in should be launched at the end of September (a month late - my apologies). 

 

 

[Richard E]

This morning I've been writing captions describing the minutiae of detail differences among the LNER loco types. I'll stick with my books and what's in my own head. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Thereby using the most powerful computer known to man ....

[St Enodoc]

While I cannot disagree with that description, with a bit of application Excel can be made to do much more.

 

For example, and perhaps of more interest to Tony, you could use it to catalogue railway photographs - and not necessarily only your own.

 

These could be catalogued under the following headings

 

Train, locomotive, stock used, where taken, date (if known), where the picture can be found (own photo book, name of book and page or plate number etc), who took the picture and so on.

 

Then when you have a vast list, you can use the sort and filter functions to find back pictures that might be of interest.

 

So you end up with a searchable library catalogue - which is something I have done with magazine and book articles.  Then when someone comes along and asks where they can find for example GCR coach drawings, I can in seconds come up with a list of entries.

Absolutely true Andy, but all that starts with sums, formulae, equations and logical operators.

[cheesysmith]

Differences between the two photos

 

Chimney

Domes

Washout plugs

 

Numbers?

[Willie Whizz]

Now Microsoft Excel (which many people have access to because it usually comes as part of the MS Office suite of programs on their PC) is one piece of modern technology I can use with a fair degree of confidence.  It can do some remarkably complicated and remarkably useful things remarkably simply ... once you get to grips with how to use it.

 

And thereby hangs the problem for the 'general user'; the instructions and so-called 'help screens' look like they were originally written by mathematicians, for mathematicians, and often use terminology that only those of a scientific and mathematical bent can probably fully grasp in all their glory.  But then, the same could be said of some of the wording in the instructions in model kits, wiring diagrams etc. for the none-too-electrically minded, like me.

 

The answer though is pretty much the same advice as keeps being given on RMWeb with regard to other things, from soldering to scenery : have a go - preferably beginning on something that it doesn't matter if you 'break', like say working out a basic monthly household budget and see what that ought to leave over for your modelling spend (it's highly unlikely you'd 'break' either the computer or the program itself, but of course you might 'break' the budget!).  Buying a book in the 'Dummies' style may also help.

 

Whoops, gotta go now - just had a call that 86-y.o. father-in-law needs scraping off the kitchen floor again, after yet another fall ... 

Edited July 19, 2017 by Willie Whizz

[Clive Mortimore]

Morning Clive,

 

only for people who don't like kit building and painting, perversely, they always seem to have been the majority in the hobby.

Hi Andy

 

I agree that 3D coloured models will appeal to those who find the concept of doing things hard, alien, scary etc. will like them but so would other modellers who will be able to concentrate their time on what they enjoy about the hobby. I enjoy all sorts of aspects, scratchbuilding, kit building, converting RTR and opening boxes.  I do not enjoy track making and when I was told I was not a real modeller because I use Peco track I did challenge the accusers to show me their scratchbuilt  4mm figures. So far they have not do  so. If you click on Pig Lane or Hanging Hill you can see some of mine.

 

Those of us who wish to make our own can still do so but the concept of a 3D model that does not need painting appeals.

[micklner]

Jesse - what you need is...

 

PRACTICE, PRACTICE and PRACTICE

 

Expect your first attempt to be a blobby mess. Keep it, to remind yourself in subsequent years how far you've come.

 

A little suggestion if I may? Remove the lovely etched parts from the etch - then practice just using the remaining scrap parts of the etch. Just try doing a few joints and try and get a feel for how much heat/time it takes before the solder 'flashes over' and becomes molten on the brass. For small parts this will be virtually instantaneous - where a larger part is involved it will take a few seconds longer (that's when you start to smell the burning flesh!). If you can 'crack' this then you'll be away.

 

There are others on here much more expert than me but my sixpenn'th for what it's worth...

 

Before you remove any parts from a etch either take a photo of the sheet or make a number of each part.

 

Instead of burning your fingers make use of Tweezers, Cocktail sticks, wooded pages , pliers etc . I don't like burnt anything it hurts !!.  Plan ahead before soldering any parts.

 

 

Soldering is dangerous !!

[Mallard60022]

Before you remove any parts from a etch either take a photo of the sheet or make a number of each part.

 

Instead of burning your fingers make use of Tweezers, Cocktail sticks, wooded pages , pliers etc . I don't like burnt anything it hurts !!.  Plan ahead before soldering any parts.

 

 

Soldering is dangerous !!

....and soldering is exciting too. Just a tip, those wooden stir sticks one gets in some coffe places..... they are good for holding against (say) a coach side if having to do a solder job on the inside because you have forgotten something or you are fitting a strengthener brace on a temp basis. Quite good too for holding stuff that a cocktail stick is too fragile to deal with. Good for stirring paint as well! You all knew that....................

Phil

[Tony Wright]

Differences between the two photos

 

Chimney

Domes

Washout plugs

 

Numbers?

And boilers - 60085 has an A4 boiler. 

[Tony Wright]

Before you remove any parts from a etch either take a photo of the sheet or make a number of each part.

 

Instead of burning your fingers make use of Tweezers, Cocktail sticks, wooded pages , pliers etc . I don't like burnt anything it hurts !!.  Plan ahead before soldering any parts.

 

 

Soldering is dangerous !!

Nothing beats asbestos fingers!

 

I'm afraid my years in teaching kick in - do as I say, not as I do. 

 

I've fiddled with all the various 'safety' devices you describe but they never hold the bits to be soldered together as well as human digits. 

Edited July 19, 2017 by Tony Wright

[glo41f]

Gentlemen

 

Something for the brains trust. I have the sad task of disposing of some models following the passing of a dear friend. One of them was a super model which had been professionally painted and worked like a charm. The finish included the brake blocks being painted a rusty colour and other small touches which both the late owner and I thought added to the model. (I have never seen a loco with black shiny break blocks. The ones in the store at Bridgnorth are rusty before they are fitted!)  However the potential purchaser on looking at this exclaimed that the model had been weathered and as such was not as marketable as if the brakes had been painted black!  If this is true, then it to me reflects a perception of perfection which never existed. Now I like seeing models that look workmanlike and purposeful such as those that grace LB. They are entirely believable. Am I in a minority here or do you chaps feel that models should be pristine just out of the works paint shop with no fire set in the firebox?

 

Martin Long 

[Headstock]

Hi Andy

 

I agree that 3D coloured models will appeal to those who find the concept of doing things hard, alien, scary etc. will like them but so would other modellers who will be able to concentrate their time on what they enjoy about the hobby. I enjoy all sorts of aspects, scratchbuilding, kit building, converting RTR and opening boxes.  I do not enjoy track making and when I was told I was not a real modeller because I use Peco track I did challenge the accusers to show me their scratchbuilt  4mm figures. So far they have not do  so. If you click on Pig Lane or Hanging Hill you can see some of mine.

 

Those of us who wish to make our own can still do so but the concept of a 3D model that does not need painting appeals.

 

Evening Clive,

 

What you enjoy about the hobby is the important thing. If folk like building and painting kits, yet this was consigned to the past, it would be a tragedy in my opinion. My own experience of working with 3D and 2D software, in order to match the quality that can be produced by using traditional methods and materials, it would require the budget of a small country. I think that 3D colour printing has along way to go yet, out of interest, are the doors on the example featured above printed on? If so this would seem a backwards step in my opinion. Personally, I can't see kit building and painting completely disappear, as long as there are people who get enjoyment out of the process. I am quite capable of using the technology and have the creative skills required, however, I would have to except a poorer finished product or remortgage my house to get anywhere near a standard that I would find expectable from using traditional materials.

[Fat Controller]

Gentlemen

 

Something for the brains trust. I have the sad task of disposing of some models following the passing of a dear friend. One of them was a super model which had been professionally painted and worked like a charm. The finish included the brake blocks being painted a rusty colour and other small touches which both the late owner and I thought added to the model. (I have never seen a loco with black shiny break blocks. The ones in the store at Bridgnorth are rusty before they are fitted!)  However the potential purchaser on looking at this exclaimed that the model had been weathered and as such was not as marketable as if the brakes had been painted black!  If this is true, then it to me reflects a perception of perfection which never existed. Now I like seeing models that look workmanlike and purposeful such as those that grace LB. They are entirely believable. Am I in a minority here or do you chaps feel that models should be pristine just out of the works paint shop with no fire set in the firebox?

 

Martin Long 

Has he ever seen a brake-block? They arrive from the foundry ready-rusted, are never painted and get darker with age.

[jwealleans]

Am I in a minority here

I'm with the minority.

[Atso]

And boilers - 60085 has an A4 boiler. 

 

 

Hello Tony,

 

The photos you've posted are around 25 years later than I model and therefore I'm struggling to work out how to identify the A4 boiler. Could you, or someone else, please tell me the secret?

 

A second question as well. In regard to the A3 with the round dome, would this indicate that this locomotive is fitted with a Thompson boiler?

 

Many thanks

Edited July 19, 2017 by Atso

[Clive Mortimore]

Evening Clive,

 

What you enjoy about the hobby is the important thing. If folk like building and painting kits, yet this was consigned to the past, it would be a tragedy in my opinion. My own experience of working with 3D and 2D software, in order to match the quality that can be produced by using traditional methods and materials, it would require the budget of a small country. I think that 3D colour printing has along way to go yet, out of interest, are the doors on the example featured above printed on? If so this would seem a backwards step in my opinion. Personally, I can't see kit building and painting completely disappear, as long as there are people who get enjoyment out of the process. I am quite capable of using the technology and have the creative skills required, however, I would have to except a poorer finished product or remortgage my house to get anywhere near a standard that I would find expectable from using traditional materials.

Hi Andy

 

I fully agree with what you are saying but as technologies improve and become widespread the costs normally come down. It was only a few years ago that rapid prototyping entered the model railway world. I think by the time my hands refuse to model make printed 3D coloured models might be the norm, no RTR or kits. It doesn't stop those who want to make things from scratch from doing so......................my hands not working might.

[46256]

Gentlemen

 

Something for the brains trust. I have the sad task of disposing of some models following the passing of a dear friend. One of them was a super model which had been professionally painted and worked like a charm. The finish included the brake blocks being painted a rusty colour and other small touches which both the late owner and I thought added to the model. (I have never seen a loco with black shiny break blocks. The ones in the store at Bridgnorth are rusty before they are fitted!)  However the potential purchaser on looking at this exclaimed that the model had been weathered and as such was not as marketable as if the brakes had been painted black!  If this is true, then it to me reflects a perception of perfection which never existed. Now I like seeing models that look workmanlike and purposeful such as those that grace LB. They are entirely believable. Am I in a minority here or do you chaps feel that models should be pristine just out of the works paint shop with no fire set in the firebox?good afternoon Martin...how long is a piece of string? And other such unanswerable questions...I know purchasers who buy the latest model only if it is in its unopened original packaging. Any model opened previously and test run for example..then returned to the box, is not acceptable to these buyers. In my case I survey my vast fleet of locomotives and stock. This has been purchased / created from a number of sources, over a lot of years. I have thought about listing these for my heirs to assist in realising a realistic price when the time comes for disposal. Pauses for a moment to reflect on that sad thought and the heartbroken reaction this will cause to the nation.....ok to my local licensee...returning to realistic prices...as written before by Tony, what price can we put on our own works of art...?

that others might view less favourably.....lets be honest most if not all of us make...purchase models not as an investment, unless they have a certain provenance...and even then. ....

A recent antiques roadshow to the nearby metropolis of Dudley ( Dugleey to those, unlike me, born hereabouts)..unearthed the most expensive find ever....a faberge creation

Let me fast forward you , fifty years hence...Fiona Bruce ( still with us courtesy of cgi ) ".today on the roadshow. We were delighted to find a rare example of a GBL jinty skilfully adapted by the late lamented Brian hughes, interest from as far away as Hong Kong and moon station 1 has seen an unbelievable sum paid for this item....and still my DJH big Bertha to bid for...if only I could be there to see it!

 

Sorry for this flight of fancy more serious modelling will return

 

[Izzy]

Gentlemen

 

Something for the brains trust. I have the sad task of disposing of some models following the passing of a dear friend. One of them was a super model which had been professionally painted and worked like a charm. The finish included the brake blocks being painted a rusty colour and other small touches which both the late owner and I thought added to the model. (I have never seen a loco with black shiny break blocks. The ones in the store at Bridgnorth are rusty before they are fitted!)  However the potential purchaser on looking at this exclaimed that the model had been weathered and as such was not as marketable as if the brakes had been painted black!  If this is true, then it to me reflects a perception of perfection which never existed. Now I like seeing models that look workmanlike and purposeful such as those that grace LB. They are entirely believable. Am I in a minority here or do you chaps feel that models should be pristine just out of the works paint shop with no fire set in the firebox?

 

Martin Long 

 

Sorry to hear of your close friend, but blow me Martin, that would mean that nearly all the locos I built for people in the past were only fit for the scrap bin when I handed them over. I only ever remember one or two odd ones that were left in 'just out of shops' condition. Most modellers I have encountered, as opposed to collectors, seem to want stuff in what could be termed 'working condition', clean, tidy, but looking as if they actually work for a living rather than sat in a museum.

 

best wishes,

 

Izzy

[davidw]

Speaking of the detail differences among ex-LNER locos, anyone like to comment on this pair of shots, please?

 

A3 60085 York 3.5.58 2193 small.jpg

 

A3 60092 York 17.08.59 2445 small.jpg

 

The latter (according to KRP's notes) was taken over a year later than the former, which is interesting.

 

I've already written my notes, so it'll be interesting to see what others come up with.

 

Thanks in anticipation.

 

The Booklaw book these'll be published in should be launched at the end of September (a month late - my apologies).

Manna: Double chimney 107 boiler. Streamline non corridor tender

 

Fairway : Single chimney 94hp boiler. Streamline non corridor tender. I think 60092 was the last to receive a double chimney. I think Sandwich was the last on the southern end of the ECML

Edited July 19, 2017 by davidw