What have you done with your Keyser kit

[hayfield]

 

Agree, but they can be a real trial sometimes. However, with a little work [and imagination], moderately good results can follow. This is a K's 57XX mated with parts of an adapted Bachmann cab to backdate it [i wanted circular windows at the front]. The chassis is pure K's but the wheels Gibson and the motor a Portescap. Sadly, the motor [or, rather, the gear train] is quite noisy at slower speeds.

 

{note - photo shows loco fitted with a DS10 - later changed for a Portescap]

 

 

 

Tony

 Tony

 

A super model and simply shows what can be achieved with a bit of added detail, I see you have the early cab version, I was totally unaware this version was available untill about 4 years ago

[Penlan]

This is my Terrier Kit, made when they first came out.

 

1.  The loco body on the original Chassis and K's wheels

......- again the colour is BMC 1100 / Marina or something, it was the 1970's.

2.  The K's chassis and as can be seen, a hole made in the frame - similar to the prototype ?

3.  A Chassis I believed was Gibson, but as it's Nickel Silver, it must be somebody else's.

....The wheels are, I believe, original Sharman's, but just might be Gibson's.

4.  Then finally a top view showing the difference in the frame material thickness's -

......Both are for EM (I've been EM since the late 1950's).
The lettering 'PENLAN', is from WCJS / LNWR Coach Pressfix transfers.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 1, 2018 by Penlan

[Penlan]

PS - The later chassis, for some unknown reason has never really performed that well, I originally thought it might be the motor and gears, but out of the chassis they work a treat. 

That is why the brake gear etc., isn't finished off. 

- And no, it's not because of all those counter-weights on the wheels countering nothing - 

 The current idea, in order to get the loco back into service, is to go back to the K's chassis and put in a new Sagami motor with flywheel and a Branchlines 51:1 gearbox.

 

To be honest, I think I prefer the K's Chassis, as seen under the body, than the later one.

 

To answer a Q. I sometimes get, the boiler bands are 3M's 'Magic Tape' sprayed white and a black line drawn on it, then trimmed so as to give a reasonable width of white either side.

Edited January 1, 2018 by Penlan

[John_Hughes]

Not really; travel was by no means as easy as it is now.

 

I don't know what the percentage car ownership was in those days, but it was a fraction of what it is today. Even if you did have a car, journeys took ages before the days of motorways - to get from Leicester to Cornwall by car involved an overnight stop.

 

Train travel wasn't cheap, either, and you needed to write off for a pass - by no means always granted - to get on railway property to measure up stock.

 

Ignorance was bliss - if it looked like a XXX Class, it was an XXX Class - and we didn't query the position of the lamp irons because there weren't any; (or brakegear for that matter).

 

Fortunately, there wasn't the internet, either - imagine the furore there'd have been when Hornby Dublo released their 'Deltic', or Tri-ang their 'Hall' !!

 

.... but we did have fun in the good old days.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

 

Well, yes, sort of. But 'Pop' Keyser only needed to get himself on a Metropolitan Line train up to Paddington to take a gander at some Great Western locos in their faded splendour, and some engines - like the gloriously buffed-up Buckjumper that was Station Pilot at Liverpool Street  - were certainly well-known to the enthusiasts of the period, so it's a little surprising that Bob Wills made such a mish-mash of his first loco kit; and the reviewers in the magazines informed themselves no better.

 

But you're quite right that there was a happy attitude that 'if it looks OK then it is OK'; the Groves' lovely 2mm model of a Jinty was apparently scaled down from the Triang OO version, whose accuracy they simply took for granted. Sancta simplicitas! Perhaps now we've gone too far the other way?!

[cctransuk]

... so it's a little surprising that Bob Wills made such a mish-mash of his first loco kit; and the reviewers in the magazines informed themselves no better .....

 

But you're quite right that there was a happy attitude that 'if it looks OK then it is OK'; the Groves' lovely 2mm model of a Jinty was apparently scaled down from the Triang OO version, whose accuracy they simply took for granted.

 

Accuracy - what's that? Did it exist (or matter) when the only alternative was the standard ranges of Hornby Dublo or Tri-ang?

 

The point was that you could build something different WITHOUT having to try and get hold of a drawing - accurate or not.

 

Just follow the instructions and, with care, you would have a runner that was different from what most of your mates had, and that looked reasonably like something that might run on the real railway.

 

If you didn't fancy building a chassis, you bought a bodyline kit, that had been 'adjusted' to fit an RTR chassis. The fact that the wheels and splashers were in the wrong place, and / or the overall length wasn't spot-on, didn't matter in the slightest.

 

It's only with the benefit of hindsight, and the capabilities of modern technology, that we have had the ability to know that some things weren't quite right - let alone to produce something better.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

PS - The later chassis, for some unknown reason has never really performed that well, I originally thought it might be the motor and gears, but out of the chassis they work a treat. 

That is why the brake gear etc., isn't finished off. 

- And no, it's not because of all those counter-weights on the wheels countering nothing ...

Most likely the familiar old story of the mechanism distorting very slightly when the body is fitted to it. I rather favour grossly overscale frame thickness for its non-bendy tendencies with a fairly heavy body atop. Simpler than diagnosing just where the trouble is occuring, lazy, I know...

[Steamport Southport]

 

 

 

 

This 44xx Prairie tank looks like an earlier model with pre-quartered wheels and should have the Mk1 motor

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4mm-OO-Keyser-Ks-GWR-44xx-Small-Prarie-Whitemetal-Kit-built-loco-good-runner/202153931789?hash=item2f1150340d:g:kTEAAOSwIGJaN8pb 

 

 

Went for £60 + P&P.

 

If anyone is desperately after one, Hattons have one for £32.

 

http://www.hattons.co.uk/314541/Keyser_K_s_KB584_KB_Class_45xx_2_6_2T_4407_in_Great_Western_Green_Pre_owned_built_from_K_s_white_m/StockDetail.aspx

 

 

 

 

Jason

[Lecorbusier]

Most likely the familiar old story of the mechanism distorting very slightly when the body is fitted to it. I rather favour grossly overscale frame thickness for its non-bendy tendencies with a fairly heavy body atop. Simpler than diagnosing just where the trouble is occuring, lazy, I know...

I quite like Iain Rice's solution (I think propounded in his chassis construction book but not certain) .... he rarely mechanically fixes his loco's to the chassis (and then only at one end). He advises a much gentler approach such as a lightly sprung  locating tab. Indeed he tells that in many a loco surgery at exhibitions he has simply slackened or removed the locating screws occasionally substituting blue tac as a temporary measure, and the locos have then run smoothly. 

[hayfield]

Went for £60 + P&P.

 

If anyone is desperately after one, Hattons have one for £32.

 

http://www.hattons.co.uk/314541/Keyser_K_s_KB584_KB_Class_45xx_2_6_2T_4407_in_Great_Western_Green_Pre_owned_built_from_K_s_white_m/StockDetail.aspx

 

 

 

 

Jason

 

Well worth a punt at that price, especially as it looks to have a set of Romford wheels which would cost as much as they are asking from Markits. Certainly a candidate for a rebuild. Rough running could be badly fitted or dirty pickups, might be a duff motor, could just be a bit of easing the holes in the coupling rods

 

Still had I not got two or three of these would have been worth a punt

 

Hattons have a K's Terrier in a RTR chassis at £30

http://www.hattons.co.uk/335506/Keyser_K_s_L20_KB01_Stroudley_Terrier_0_6_0T_2678_on_Southern_Green_Pre_owned_built_from_Keyser_ki/StockDetail.aspx

 

This one looks to be well made, but needs a chassis. Would be a stunner with a Comet chassis but the cost of wheels/motor/gears would be quite high

 

A better buy is the J72 which has a set of Romfords on it

Edited January 1, 2018 by hayfield

[Golden Fleece 30]

Slightly off topic but relating to a comment on here about Wrenn pointwork.

 

 

The Wrenn double junctions were also available in 3-rail for Dublo use.  They were all easy to wire up especially if you got it mounted on its card.  The instructions would normally give two options as well 1) for one controller and 2) for two controllers.  No matter how course they were as there was no frog drop any wheel went across very well.  The main issue (apart from a fibre base) was at the start steel rail was used which corroded but the later nickel ones were a big improvement.

 

The switch diamond was a far better crossing than a standard diamond one and it inspired me to make a curved one for my layout in the mid 70's.

 

Garry

Edited January 3, 2018 by Golden Fleece 30

[BlueLightning]

Don't expect any updates anytime soon as I have other projects ahead of it in the queue and I need to buy a chassis, but my K's Terrier is currently part way to being converted into an LB&SCR E1!

 

 

The boiler is from a Jinty from the "Great British Locomotives" magazine. other than that it is the K's kit and some Plasticard at the moment, although a lot of filler will be needed!!

 

I already have wheels for it and I plan of getting an etched chassis from EB Models. Hopefully it should make a good model!

 

Gary

[bike2steam]

Don't expect any updates anytime soon as I have other projects ahead of it in the queue and I need to buy a chassis, but my K's Terrier is currently part way to being converted into an LB&SCR E1!

 

IMG_20180106_181413.jpg

 

The boiler is from a Jinty from the "Great British Locomotives" magazine. other than that it is the K's kit and some Plasticard at the moment, although a lot of filler will be needed!!

 

I already have wheels for it and I plan of getting an etched chassis from EB Models. Hopefully it should make a good model!

 

Gary

 

Like it, the Brighton E1 was always referred to as the 'Stretched Terrier'.  

[BlueLightning]

Thanks Paul,

 

That nickname is what made me think of trying to convert it!

 

Gary

[gaf2u]

Looked through this thread with interest. I had quite a collection of K's kits gathered together from EBay with a view to learning how to solder and assemble these before moving onto more taxing kits.

 

Generally I have binned the tenders, and the chassis, and replaced same with Comet variants, keeping only the loco bodies and further detailing same as part of assembly. I have only 1 remaining unassembled kit for a Black 5, which I will get to in due course.

 

Here's the end results:

K's Princess Royal

 

K's Black 5

 

Fowler 2-6-2T. I love this one actually, and am in the throes of finishing a Gibson chassis for it. The Valve gear is pretty poor, and I'm replacing the lot, including crossheads. There'll be a bit of scratchbuilding required for this.

 

THis was my first ever kit. I've only this past week or so removed the K's Chassis with a view to replacing the drive/gearbox, but will also have to replace the wheels, and beef up the connecting rods

 

Last one - from the K's Silver Jublilee kit. My first effort at lining a full LMS passenger livery. Again Comet Chassis and Tender

 

All the best

Darren

 

 

 

 

[hayfield]

Looked through this thread with interest. I had quite a collection of K's kits gathered together from EBay with a view to learning how to solder and assemble these before moving onto more taxing kits.

 

Generally I have binned the tenders, and the chassis, and replaced same with Comet variants, keeping only the loco bodies and further detailing same as part of assembly. I have only 1 remaining unassembled kit for a Black 5, which I will get to in due course.

 

Here's the end results:

IMG_2195.JPG

K's Princess Royal

 

IMG_2217.JPG

K's Black 5

 

IMG_2222.JPG

Fowler 2-6-2T. I love this one actually, and am in the throes of finishing a Gibson chassis for it. The Valve gear is pretty poor, and I'm replacing the lot, including crossheads. There'll be a bit of scratchbuilding required for this.

 

IMG_2223.JPG

THis was my first ever kit. I've only this past week or so removed the K's Chassis with a view to replacing the drive/gearbox, but will also have to replace the wheels, and beef up the connecting rods

 

IMG_1981.JPG

Last one - from the K's Silver Jublilee kit. My first effort at lining a full LMS passenger livery. Again Comet Chassis and Tender

 

All the best

Darren

 

 

Daren

 

See most/all wheels changed to Romford/Markits, the Coal tank may benefit from a gem Chassis.

 

Nice collection of locos

[Jol Wilkinson]

Daren

 

See most/all wheels changed to Romford/Markits, the Coal tank may benefit from a gem Chassis.

 

Nice collection of locos

London Road Models also sell their Coal Tank chassis separately. 

 

[gaf2u]

Thanks Jol - just reached out to LRM to get an order in process for the chassis.

Much appreciated

Darren

[hayfield]

London Road Models also sell their Coal Tank chassis separately. 

 

CT chassis 1.jpg

 

Thanks Jol, knew John did the Watford tank chassis, not too certain what else he does

[Jol Wilkinson]

Thanks Jol, knew John did the Watford tank chassis, not too certain what else he does

John,

 

the various chassis, etc. are listed at the bottom of the relevant "railway" locomotive kit page.

 

The chassis which John Redrup has made available has been in response to repeated customer requests. They have usually been for "older" white-metal kits. Several others that are not listed can be made available on specific request but a number of the older kits, including some of the former George Norton kits, aren't suitable. That is because some of the chassis parts, such as brake gear, is on the body etch. 

 

If any one wants a chassis to fit another manufacturers kit they should research what would fit before enquiring about availability. Emails asking "which of your chassis fits so and so's kit" are time consuming and often a waste of time.

 

Jol

[hayfield]

Jol

 

Thanks for the info, I think your advice about doing either a bit of research and or being willing to adapt the chassis to the kit is well founded.

 

In short John's chassis are designed for John's kits. If used on another make alterations may be required. Same goes for Comet eg the K's 14xx is a few mm too short, the Comet chassis was designed to go under the Airfix RTR plastic body, it will only fit the K's chassis if shortened, same goes for the Perseverance chassis for the same loco if my memory is correct 

[Penlan]

I've used LRM's chassis kits on various GEM etc., kits*, I don't recall any problems, but that maybe because whatever I have, I use as a basis for completing a models.  Being a modeller who started in the 1950's, I evolved during the period when one just got on with it, added what was missing etc.,

* = Upgrading existing/original chassis.  

[hayfield]

I think that if the chassis have flat tops (Perseverance) or a flat base line like Comet chassis no issues other than check that the buffer heights are correct,

 

Some chassis like the older Southeastern / Wills Finecast chassis which are designed to replace some RTR chassis have the appropriate body fixings (for example the Jinty and R1 replacement chassis both have internal body fitting extensions above the footplate) to fit inside the body

 

As you say, if its a different body to which the chassis has been designed for, some alteration may be needed

[bike2steam]

 

As you say, if its a different body to which the chassis has been designed for, some alteration may be needed

 

I agree, I found the best chassis to fit my two K's Stanier moguls was the Comet Stanier  2-6-4T chassis - suitably modified. 

 

 

I know, nothing like the new Bachmann examples.

[EHertsGER]

I think that if the chassis have flat tops (Perseverance) or a flat base line like Comet chassis no issues other than check that the buffer heights are correct,

 

Some chassis like the older Southeastern / Wills Finecast chassis which are designed to replace some RTR chassis have the appropriate body fixings (for example the Jinty and R1 replacement chassis both have internal body fitting extensions above the footplate) to fit inside the body

 

As you say, if its a different body to which the chassis has been designed for, some alteration may be needed

Then some smartypants decides to fit a Finecast chassis to a PDK body and wonders why it sits a bit low. Finecast bodies have cast footplates, which are a lot thicker than brass ones...

 

Ask me how long I sat there unable to fathom why the cylinder centre line didn’t line up with the axle centers...

[DCB]

I am just wondering why K's made such good models of LMS GC and LNER types and such awful models of the GW 28XX and 42XX.   The 44XX with a late front end and early short bunker and hideous oversize cylinders dragging almost on the ground. I have had my 44XX 45 years now and its still on my to do list to lengthen the bunker get it running.   The 28XX is beyond all hope replaced by a Hornby Tender drive body on a Hornby Dublo loco drive Chassis and so will shortly be on Ebay while I hope to make the 42XX into something vaguely like a 42XX if I can lower the firebox and raise the cab roof or find a GEM 56XX cab roof. Last iteration had a Hornby Dublo Ringfield and would pull a house down until it snapped its coupling rods.    Why didn't K's take a tapeand Kodak Brownie round Barry scrapyard when designing these kits?