Smallest terminus served by HSTs?

[PLD]

P.S. There was a GNER HST into/out of Hull in the early 2000s. Then Hull Trains was born!!

 

Still is a once a day (Mon-Sat) East Coast Service... Custom did drop off a bit when Hull trains was launched, but it is still well used being the first direct train to London and for some reason custom increased again when Hull Trains replaced the Pioneers with Adelantes...

[Mallard60022]

 

 

BBR11--027 Executive saloon.jpg

 

 

That 'degreasing coach' is a Gresley. Wonder if it lasted into preservation?

[45125]

Still is a once a day (Mon-Sat) East Coast Service... Custom did drop off a bit when Hull trains was launched, but it is still well used being the first direct train to London and for some reason custom increased again when Hull Trains replaced the Pioneers with Adelantes...

2nd direct train, Hull Trains run one about 6:20.

[Swindon 123]

Intrigued by the view of 43085 in March 1983 in Executive livery. I thought the first were the power cars of WR unit 253028. Here we see them on their "back-to-back" test run to Burton from Derby Loco Works on 6th Sep 1983.

Hello Western Sunset I've found more of my notes for that day that add a little more detail. I saw 43085 in the morning and it was painted in "Executive" livery on one side only and it was repainted back into what was then "ordinary" blue livery in the afternoon.

 

That 'degreasing coach' is a Gresley. Wonder if it lasted into preservation?

 

I've always wondered what that coaches origins where. Here are some more shots. Over to the coach experts.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Paul J.

[Joseph_Pestell]

I'm not an expert but that appears to be a Great Eastern-section 51' coach. From the window arrangement, a 1st class.

[ThaneofFife]

Yes Milford Haven used to have a through service train from Paddington BR days circa 1982-3 ish and I think Haverfordwest was served too. 

 

I remember seeing them speed along the sea wall outside Llanelli.  Not sure if MH is or was a smaller station than Pembroke Dock - for the more recent FGW HST service that served it (not sure if The Pembroke Coast Express still does now), it may have been withdrawn after last summer but its basically a single one sided platform terminus.  Probably about as small as you can get but offers no operational interest other than out and back moves so not a great choice for a model railway IMHO.  I think it has a loop still but whether its ever used now is another question. It may have offered run round facilities in the 70/80s BR days for loco hauled.

 

Has the HST ever graced Barry Island ?

[Saddletank]

Not sure if anyone has mentioned it directly, but have you considered using a small through station as a temporary terminus during a line blockage or track maintenance? I know from experience, though haven't got any photos to prove that Stonehaven, the small through station about 20 miles short of Aberdeen, has been the terminus when the last portion of the ECML is closed, and has done so on at least 2 occasions I've used it in the last few years.

 

DMUs only would normally carry on the truncated service from Dundee during engineering work but I have boarded a HST (GNER/National Express, can't remember) that has slunk over from the up line, following a weekday freight derailment near Craiginches yard on the south side of Aberdeen. Buses completed the last leg to Aberdeen from the station forecourt. From what I remember there was limited catering provision as trains normally get cleaned and restocked in Aberdeen.

 

There's a trailing crossover at the north end of the station used to transfer from up to down lines and they don't hang around long once pulled back into the down platform in terminus mode. (For the sake of the model you may wish to pretend the crossover is south of the station and pull into the up platform, back out to the fiddle yard, and pull back into the down before setting off south again?) HSTs always stop at Stonehaven anyway going north or south (as does the sleeper and most DMUs) and IIRC the platform is a little too short, so the leading 1st class carriage or 2 doesn't get platform access and announcements are made on the train to this effect.

 

Lovely little sandstone station, located on a small overbridge at the top of an embankment, with the old goods shed still in use as a car garage, and semaphores and an operational signal box still present. A bay platform at the north end abandoned to grass and track removed (ballast piles sometimes dumped in the old goods yard area). The main buildings on the down platform are intact although shrunk from their original form, and the up platform buildings are demolished with a bus shelter covering the underpass steps and ticket machine. White picket fence still present on both platforms. All in all a pretty wee place, mostly forgotten by the march of progress. No phots of HSTs on the railscot site passing through Stoney, but trust me they do all the time!

 

http://www.railbrit.co.uk/location.php?loc=Stonehaven

[Fat Controller]

Yes Milford Haven used to have a through service train from Paddington BR days circa 1982-3 ish and I think Haverfordwest was served too. 

 

I remember seeing them speed along the sea wall outside Llanelli.  Not sure if MH is or was a smaller station than Pembroke Dock - for the more recent FGW HST service that served it (not sure if The Pembroke Coast Express still does now), it may have been withdrawn after last summer but its basically a single one sided platform terminus.  Probably about as small as you can get but offers no operational interest other than out and back moves so not a great choice for a model railway IMHO.  I think it has a loop still but whether its ever used now is another question. It may have offered run round facilities in the 70/80s BR days for loco hauled.

 

Has the HST ever graced Barry Island ?

Haverfordwest is on the Milford line, and is probably more significant in terms of passenger numbers. Both Milford and Pembroke Dock were strange, in that they were terminii for passenger services, but the track continued on into port facilities (though the Pembroke Dock one had gone out of use a long time ago). Into the early/mid 1970s, there was a daily loco-hauled sleeper train from Milford to Paddington every evening. This used to pick up a TPO at Carmarthen, which was then detached (not sure if it was at Swansea or Cardiff) to form part of a Bristol working. Even in to the mid 1980s, the Milford service was largely loco-hauled, whilst the loco-hauled workings on the Pembroke line were summer-only, and only as far as Tenby. 

I do wonder if the survival of the sleeper service from Milford (which was only ever a couple of vehicles at best) was down to the considerable military presence in the area (Brawdy, Castlemartin and Milford itself); certainly, I don't think it was for the convenience of holidaymakers or locals.

[newbryford]

The NMT covers all parts of the network for which it's route-cleared, as required.

 

It's cleared for my local line, even though it's C3 clearance, but hasn't yet been here....

 

It's principally used on the major main lines, I believe on a two-week cycle, although it does venture over the likes of the S&C every now and then. As for route clearance, it's not allowed on third rail territory due to the intermediate vehicles having long swing link bogies (short link only cleared for 3rd rail)

 

Cheers,

Mick

[eastwestdivide]

 

I've always wondered what that coaches origins where. Here are some more shots. Over to the coach experts.

 

Not an expert, but a quick search reveals...

That degreasing van is on departmentals.com, where it says formerly E22118E, an NER SO, still exists on the GCR.

And this site on NER coaches, http://www.imber.me.uk/ner.htm, has it as a 1922 Restaurant First, no 2118 then 22118

More info here (scroll down): http://www.dapsites.com/gcr/stock/wood.htm

[freightliner_bond_57007]

Cleethorpes had a double track approach until resignalling in 1985. Before then, all 6 platform faces were fully signalled as passenger platforms, although platform 6, which is now just a kickback siding for accessing the carriage sidings, was little used as it's very narrow and usually a bit sand-dune-ish. There was a 100-lever signalbox and some pretty complex pointwork in the throat.

 

It all got much simplified when the line was signalled, but kept the carriage sidings (usually empty but for a couple of four wheel oil tanks) and a release crossover for platform 2, as the South Transpennine route had gone back to loco haulage a few years earlier, usually with a Class 31/4 and 5 Mk1s.

 

The HST service started in early 1983 - I've seen references to 83 in print, but first travelled on it myself in Feb that year. Before then there had been a more frequent London service, hauled by 47s, or by Deltics in their last few years; when the HST was introduced it meant Grimsby, Cleethorpes and Lincoln were all reduced to a single direct London train daily, stock berthed at Cleethorpes overnight. It survived the ECML electrification briefly but had gone by privatisation.

My dad was a shunter at Cleethorpes at the time so I have a pic somewhere (probably undated) of me stood in front of the first HST to the town.

 

I think the set stabled on a Sunday, or ran to a different timetable as I remember being on board for a run through the washing plant.

 

Also, when the set used to arrive first class leading it was turned on the Brocklesby / Ulceby / Habrough triangle to ensure that it arrived correctly into London the following day. Seem to recall this meant a later finish than normal for one of his shifts !!!

 

Cheers

Alan

[Gwiwer]

Going back to the OP a moment I'm with all those who suggest Newquay as the smallest station with a regular timetabled HST service albeit not year-round.  It does however see multiple HST sets (and from different operators) on summer Saturdays.

 

The mortal remains of what was once a decent station are probably now smaller than Carmarthen; just a basic shelter and a single bare platform.  Fishguard Harbour has more than that.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Yes, trackwise Newquay is the most basic terminus a HST visits - just a single track; that's all. However the platform is longer than Carmarthen. At Carmarthen an 8-car HST JUST fits the platform with the power car cab doors by the top of the ramp at each end of the station.

[Merfyn Jones]

Did anybody mention Blaenau Ffestiniog, which had 2 HST specials in 1993 and 1994, one a 9 trailer set which fitted the platform, not bad for a single track terminus with one platform.

Merf.

[sub39h]

Thank you all for your suggestions. Some great information to work with. I'd like to add at this point that I was looking for something like a 3 or 4 track terminus. I had no idea that stations as small as 1 platform would have been long enough for HSTs! 

 

I am probably going to continue with Cleethorpes as a basic outline but I'm not looking to base my layout in a specific geographical location so I'll tweak it to fit my purposes. It is useful to know that Cleethorpes started with a 2 track approach as operationally and aesthetically that is what I'd prefer.

 

Many thanks again to all who have contributed! 

[Saddletank]

I'd like to add at this point that I was looking for something like a 3 or 4 track terminus.

If its a 3-4 platform terminus you're after, Aberdeen is still a decent choice. It's got the requisite 4 bay platforms (+unused parcels platform) plus 2 through platforms on the line north to Inverness, all still covered by original canopies. Also, the original glass roofed concourse remains as does the bulk of the station buildings (although these have recently been incorporated into the atrium of a large shopping mall situated in the old goods yard adjacent.

 

It's THE destination for the ECML, the northernmost point on that mainline and is the actual terminus of both east coast and formerly west coast mainline trains that continue beyond Edinburgh (although most XC services now terminate at Dundee). It's also the originating point of one portion of the sleeper service, plus frequent DMUs travelling south to edinburgh an Glasgow, some of which also originate north of Aberdeen and alight at the through platforms.

 

Until XC took over, it was an interesting scene to have GNER and Virgin HSTs facing off on opposite sides of the same platform. I've been told a few times by a colleague who formerly worked at the station that the old LNER / LMS rivalry was still much in evidence, as drivers waiting to depart south placed wagers on who would reach their respective London terminus first!

 

Alternately, though I don't know too much about the place I believe Inverness was the terminating point for HSTs in their earlier days and I believe its quite a small station compared to Aberdeen.

[Gwiwer]

Inverness and Aberdeen are broadly comparable in size though Aberdeen is probably of greater architectural interest.   Inverness continues to see a daily HST from Kings Cross via the ECML as it has done for many years.

[Saddletank]

Ah right thanks for the clarification, I've never gone to Inverness by train so don't know what the station is like or anything about services, just recall seeing a photo of an original liveried HST passing tiny Insch station on its way from Aberdeen northwards. Thought it was just sleeper and DMU operating up to there now.

[Kris]

Inverness didn't strike me as being small. Not with the lines going in both directions. 

[Bruce Depot]

I was thinking of Inverness as well, although perhaps a bit big. Has the HST been to Oban or Fort William much (or at all?)

 

Keith

[Saddletank]

Inverness didn't strike me as being small. Not with the lines going in both directions.

 

I was thinking more in terms of what the OP was aiming for: a 3-4 platform terminus. I've never been to Inverness train station so not even sure how many platforms it has, but was working on the presumption that it would be smaller than Aberdeen. Granted its not really a terminus, more of a junction station with trunk routes down to Perth and Aberdeen, or north to Wick, but its smaller than Kings Cross and bigger than Newquay!

[Kris]

It's either 6 or 7 platforms from memory.

[JZ]

A bit tongue in cheek, but a special ran to Portbury earlier this year. Not even a platform there.

[Catkins]

I was thinking more in terms of what the OP was aiming for: a 3-4 platform terminus. I've never been to Inverness train station so not even sure how many platforms it has, but was working on the presumption that it would be smaller than Aberdeen. Granted its not really a terminus, more of a junction station with trunk routes down to Perth and Aberdeen, or north to Wick, but its smaller than Kings Cross and bigger than Newquay!

It's either 6 or 7 platforms from memory.

The layout of Inverness is effectively a 'V' formation, with four (IIRC) slightly curving platforms making the right arm of the 'V' - these lines are for all the services from the south, and are long enough for a full 2+9 HST set, or 11 Mark 1s and two 37's. The left arm of the 'V' is formed by three sharply curving platforms, that are used by services to Wick/Thurso, and Kyle of Lochalsh.

The two 'arms' are not connected in the station - any through traffic has to run past the depot, and then set back into the platforms. There is a dividing wall that supports an overall roof at the concourse end of Inverness, it would be quite possible to model the 'Mainline' platforms, whilst representing the 'Far North' lines on the back scene.

 

I hope that helps.