SOS Junction. If anything happens would someone wake me up please..

[ian]

Surely you're referring to Welsh Wales...………….?

 

Well, 'oop north' is above that on my map.

 

Note: Alternative cartographic presentations are available.

[eastwestdivide]

So it's an actual place then.

Named after the spot where a Lancashire actress/Absolutely Fabulous star crashed her Fiesta.

[Captain Kernow]

And Kernow is also a long way from anywhere up north...……………..

 

Cheers,

Mick

It's not too far from the Isles of Scilly.

[Mallard60022]

It's not too far from the Isles of Scilly.

Don't be scilly CK. It has cooled off now so you can come out of the fridge.

Duck.

[Siberian Snooper]

It's not too far from the Isles of Scilly.

Wot! America?

[ian]

It's not too far from the Isles of Scilly.

Explain, pray, how that is a benefit.

[Benbow]

Don't be scilly CK. It has cooled off now so you can come out of the fridge.

Duck.

 

Not here it aint! 

[brianusa]

Don't let the heat get in the way of playing with the trains, says he where its 24C, right now!

       Soon it might be 34C though, time to turn on the A/C

 

              Brian.

[Mallard60022]

Not here it aint! 

Oh bad luck. We have had cloud cover all day (almost) and a nice breeze and it is at least 10* cooler today than yesterday. It has been such a relief and I was able to spend time up The Junction. Didn't achieve much other than finding that my second, smaller Cab is not dead after all....hoorah, and I can't work out why the DCC 80s are not playing on some points. So, as suggested earlier, a test track/point will be set up and the DCC 80s put to the sword.

There will be some news from The Junction later in the week.

P

Edited July 9, 2018 by Mallard60022

[timbowilts]

Don't let the heat get in the way of playing with the trains, says he where its 24C, right now!

       Soon it might be 34C though, time to turn on the A/C

 

              Brian.

A/C, what’s that? Some thing that soft yanks use?

 

(Duck & run for cover)

 

Tim T

[Mallard60022]

I'd have some A/C if it was feasible but what's the point in a loft? It isn't 'airtight' for obvious reasons so would be a waste of time. My loft is actually not too hot with the foil style insulation, however it isn't comfortable to spend time up there when it is as hot as it has been this last week. Elsewhere in our house it could be useful as I believe there will be more of these extended periods of hot and dry weather in coming years. 

P

[bgman]

I'd have some A/C if it was feasible but what's the point in a loft? It isn't 'airtight' for obvious reasons so would be a waste of time. My loft is actually not too hot with the foil style insulation, however it isn't comfortable to spend time up there when it is as hot as it has been this last week. Elsewhere in our house it could be useful as I believe there will be more of these extended periods of hot and dry weather in coming years. 

P

 

I was thinking of going for the Colonial Conditioning Unit..... DCC operated though !

 

 

P.Unkawallah

[devonseasider]

I was thinking of going for the Colonial Conditioning Unit..... DCC operated though !

 

I tried the CCU approach over the weekend but Mrs DS couldn't keep her fanny thing moving for long enough to have any noticeable effect.

 

Down here within spitting distance of the real SJ there's no let-up.

It's still 73 F in our living room now (sorry, don't know what that is in new money) but it hit 84 around 8pm-ish & that's after a day with windows & patio door wide open and two cold-air blowers switched on.

 

 

F. Inhot

Edited July 9, 2018 by devonseasider

[St Enodoc]

I tried the CCU approach over the weekend but Mrs DS couldn't keep her fanny thing moving for long enough to have any noticeable effect.

 

Down here within spitting distance of the real SJ there's no let-up.

It's still 73 F in our living room now (sorry, don't know what that is in new money) but it hit 84 around 8pm-ish & that's after a day with windows & patio door wide open and two cold-air blowers switched on.

 

 

F. Inhot

No wonder you're feeling the heat.

[St Enodoc]

I was thinking of going for the Colonial Conditioning Unit..... DCC operated though !

 

4.jpg

 

P.Unkawallah

Where's Michael Bates wen you need him?

[Mallard60022]

I've got two large fanny things up The Junction and both are working a 12 hour shift every day.

P

[ian]

I've got two large fanny things up The Junction and both are working a 12 hour shift every day.

P

Ah, I think I've seen the photograph...

 

[81C]

Vicki Michelle drool drool        

[bgman]

Vicki Michelle drool drool        

 

I wouldn't know what to do anymore !        

 

S.Weatypalms

[Clive Mortimore]

I been up the Junction today, things still ain't right with the electrickery. I will give a summary after checking with Phil to make sure we are both thinking the same still. Even more confused now that France have won.

 

Lovely day. No SR locos were risked in any testing but no one tell the good Captain that a pannier tank was the chosen victim splendid trial loco. I would have liked to have sorted out the problem before I had to head off home. Nice lunch at the nature reserve Mr Duck inhabits when not up the Junction. We also visited Retford station and saw two of the new class 800 and /or 801s under test as well as the wall  "Sir" use to sit on when shouting abuse at the poor locomotives if they were not a cop.

 

He has some nice Bull Eyed coaches in multiple unit green up the Junction.

 

Cheers for a good day.

Edited July 10, 2018 by Clive Mortimore

[Mallard60022]

Today I had the opportunity to take a slow and thoughtful look at what is not right about the layout. Monty very kindly drove for hours to keep me focused and systematic.
It would appear that there is not enough power getting into the track from one BUS. My task now is to examine that BUS and see if there is something draining the volts. It seems that more voltage is required to drive the DCC80s and they are not dead! I have a brand new 1. 5 A supply coming , (only have a 1A at the moment). I shall rig that, use the meter to read the track volts and if it is still less than 14/15 then examine the weak BUS with a magnifying glass to try and trace anything that could be draining power.
However, tomorrow I will be visiting a layout that works to get inspired.
Duck.

 

Edit: forgot to say that the most power we got from a BUS today at the track was approximately 11.8 V and that was consistant. The weak BUS was only producing about 10.5/8 V. Enough to drive a loco but not enough to drive a DCC 80 frog juicer. I also discovered that my two Hex Juicers 'steal' 1V from the track.

The whole thing is weird, (not wired....... )

Edited July 10, 2018 by Mallard60022

[St Enodoc]

Today I had the opportunity to take a slow and thoughtful look at what is not right about the layout. Monty very kindly drove for hours to keep me focused and systematic.

It would appear that there is not enough power getting into the track from one BUS. My task now is to examine that BUS and see if there is something draining the volts. It seems that more voltage is required to drive the DCC80s and they are not dead! I have a brand new 1. 5 A supply coming , (only have a 1A at the moment). I shall rig that, use the meter to read the track volts and if it is still less than 14/15 then examine the weak BUS with a magnifying glass to try and trace anything that could be draining power.

However, tomorrow I will be visiting a layout that works to get inspired.

Duck.

 

Edit: forgot to say that the most power we got from a BUS today at the track was approximately 11.8 V and that was consistant. The weak BUS was only producing about 10.5/8 V. Enough to drive a loco but not enough to drive a DCC 80 frog juicer. I also discovered that my two Hex Juicers 'steal' 1V from the track.

The whole thing is weird, (not wired....... )

Did you do the classic "coin test" to make sure that the power trips when there is a short at the furthest point from the power connection? If it doesn't that means you have high resistance somewhere - dry joint, partly-broken wire, etc.

[Clive Mortimore]

Did you do the classic "coin test" to make sure that the power trips when there is a short at the furthest point from the power connection? If it doesn't that means you have high resistance somewhere - dry joint, partly-broken wire, etc.

Yes we did, using a 2p. It tripped instantly and restored power as I put the coin back in my pocket.

 

Phil took out a resistor and capacitor which were supposed to take out the "chat" between decoders and that did help a tad. With nothing that conducts electricity on the tracks we had, 11.9 V as an output from the controller.

The outer track circuit bus was reading 11.9V when it was the only one connected, no difference = no problem.

The inner circuit bus was reading 11.4V when it was the only one connected, very slight increase in voltage when the two frog juicer circuits were disconnected but not enough to consider they were the problem.

Adding the two fiddle yard buses to the system did not make any difference, so no problem with them. The testing was done with them disconnected once we concluded they were not a problem.

 

When both track circuits were connected to the output of the controller both read as low as 10.4V. They are feed from the same multi-way connectors and are in parallel.

 

I took readings from various places around the two track circuits and the only variation was 0.1 V and that could be how I was holding the probes on the track. No massive voltage drop around the circuits. The way the bus and droppers are wired any dry joint or broken wire I think would only effect the length of track it supplies not drop the voltage for the whole circuit.

 

The few locos we did run ran OK.

 

The DC80s appear not to be working as there is insufficient power to enable the relays to operate fully. We did test using an AC 16v feed off an old controller and the relays were clicking but when connected to the layout the same relays were not working. The resistors on their circuitboards at times were getting hot when we attempted to change the points but cold when in normal position. I think this is where the relay was trying to draw power but not enough to operate. I am sure when Phil gets his replacement 1.5A power supply this will resolve itself.

 

Why such a low output voltage, only 11.9V. I am no DCC expert but isn't the norm about 14V.

 

What is causing the low voltage on the inner track circuit? No stock on the track so it should be an open circuit, but with the voltage drop it seems there is something across the tracks absorbing power? The only things connected to the bus are the frog juicers and the DC80s? As above the DC80s with the points in the normal position were not causing a problem so would not be drawing power.

 

Why when both buses are connected in parallel does the voltage drop even more, especially as there appears to be no problem with the outer track circuit?

 

We physically checked to see if there was anything in circuit with the inner bus but could not see anything.

Edited July 11, 2018 by Clive Mortimore

[Mallard60022]

Thanks Clive, that explains things very clearly. I was mulling things over late last evening after watching the footy (by gum, those teams were good) and I remember testing the track voltage some time ago and it was around 14.6V all around the layout. I'm going to do a 'reset' as with a PC. I shall, as part of my thorough examination, 'unplug' some droppers I attached in recent months that had not been attached before; they were not needed for around 18 months so why did I connecr them I ask myself? I thought it was just 'security'. 

I'm also tempted to replace on of the Hex Juicers with Micro Switches as they would be off scene. However, I am moving 'up' to a 5A System in the future, so there should be plenty of oomph available then.

Thanks again Clive. I do hope your drive back to deepest yellow belly land was not too hot?

Phil

[St Enodoc]

Yes we did, using a 2p. It tripped instantly and restored power as I put the coin back in my pocket.

 

Phil took out a resistor and capacitor which were supposed to take out the "chat" between decoders and that did help a tad. With nothing that conducts electricity on the tracks we had, 11.9 V as an output from the controller.

The outer track circuit bus was reading 11.9V when it was the only one connected, no difference = no problem.

The inner circuit bus was reading 11.4V when it was the only one connected, very slight increase in voltage when the two frog juicer circuits were disconnected but not enough to consider they were the problem.

Adding the two fiddle yard buses to the system did not make any difference, so no problem with them. The testing was done with them disconnected once we concluded they were not a problem.

 

When both track circuits were connected to the output of the controller both read as low as 10.4V. They are feed from the same multi-way connectors and are in parallel.

 

I took readings from various places around the two track circuits and the only variation was 0.1 V and that could be how I was holding the probes on the track. No massive voltage drop around the circuits. The way the bus and droppers are wired any dry joint or broken wire I think would only effect the length of track it supplies not drop the voltage for the whole circuit.

 

The few locos we did run ran OK.

 

The DC80s appear not to be working as there is insufficient power to enable the relays to operate fully. We did test using an AC 16v feed off an old controller and the relays were clicking but when connected to the layout the same relays were not working. The resistors on their circuitboards at times were getting hot when we attempted to change the points but cold when in normal position. I think this is where the relay was trying to draw power but not enough to operate. I am sure when Phil gets his replacement 1.5A power supply this will resolve itself.

 

Why such a low output voltage, only 11.9V. I am no DCC expert but isn't the norm about 14V.

 

What is causing the low voltage on the inner track circuit? No stock on the track so it should be an open circuit, but with the voltage drop it seems there is something across the tracks absorbing power? The only things connected to the bus are the frog juicers and the DC80s? As above the DC80s with the points in the normal position were not causing a problem so would not be drawing power.

 

Why when both buses are connected in parallel does the voltage drop even more, especially as there appears to be no problem with the outer track circuit?

 

We physically checked to see if there was anything in circuit with the inner bus but could not see anything.

Hmm, I'm as mystified as you too now...