The Eagle has landed...

[MikeHohn]

Sounds like the eagle has left the aerie . . .

 

. . . for now.

[shortliner]

I sometimes think that a point is reached where inspiration is triggered by starting over and going right back to basics, cutting everything down to the absolute minimum of track and starting over - big complicated layouts are wonderful in theory, but become a millstone in practice, and that is where the loss of mojo is triggered - ask yourself why the Great Lord Mindheim has started over with a much more simple design - expandable, but initially simple( r ) Currently considering something based around Jack Hills New Castle layout, in HO but in Florida with minimum pointwork

Edited March 16, 2015 by shortliner

[highpeak]

I think Simon has an excellent point: you should perhaps spend some time reflecting on what you are really looking for. 

I think it was Iain Rice in one of his books who suggested spending time browsing picture books to find something that appealed, and that's what I did. The books in question were the Morning Sun trilogy on Maine Central. There was never any question which road I would model, but I spent a long time trying to work out what aspects of the road appealed and what would fit into my available space (roughly comparable to your shed, a bit wider but not as long.)

In the end, it wasn't the pictures that gave me ideas, but the excellent narrative that accompanied them and gave me an insight into what each train was doing.

It would take a shrink to decide what it is about somewhat isolated, end of the line places that appeals to me, but it worked out well because there's really only space for a US equivalent to a branch line terminus anyway. So I set about creating a plausible settlement at the end of a north country branch line a bit similar to Beecher Falls but with the stone quarries that lay further north moved into the scene.

So my muse turned out to be attracted to a sense of place and a story behind the trains. Perhaps a spell of introspection along similar lines might be worthwhile.

[Andy Reichert]

I wonder if have things too simple and easy? And maybe too many choices of how to lay out the track,

 

While you're thinking about what you really would like, how about doing something limited, but far more challenging with what you currently have

 

For example, how about making a temporary hump and see if you can gravity feed your cars into different tracks. One day, someone is going to discover a way of making that work well. It could be you.

 

Or a working weighing scale track. Maybe a motorized transfer table in front of a diesel shed. Or a drive through loco washing unit. Perhaps a hopper filling conveyor system.

 

All of the above need lots of daytime thinking, and lots of evening experiments to try and keep moving forward.  And everything you do achieve could  end up on a future layout.

 

Hope this provides some stimulation.

 

Andy

[LNER4479]

Three desultory months on, and although I've jiggled the track and built some buildings I have to conclude I am not feeling the love any more - the industrial spur in America idea has just upped and died on me

 

Not sure what to do next, although I am tempted to start selling off the stock to free up some cash pending whatever happens next.

I wish I could help but - maybe I'm just 'lucky' or something - I don't really seem to suffer from this sort of problem. And it appears that you're not alone in that one reads of other threads which start full of enthusiasm then get 'stuck', have a re-think or worse ripped up all together.

 

A few questions spring to mind.

 

What's the 'best' layout that you ever completed or got close to completing? (you posted some pictures earlier in your thread of a US freight yard layout that looked quite interesting)

 

What's your favourite type of layout you see at exhibitions and why?

 

What's your favourite type of layout you see in magazines and why? (I think that's a slightly different question to the one above as this latter question is more above visual impact)

 

What's your favourite prototype railway 'genre' that gets the creative juices flowing. You obviously like US stuff - but if a quadruple-headed 100 car double stack container train pounding through the western deserts 'does it' for you then perhaps a switching layout, dealing with 3 or 4 vehicles at a time isn't really going to cut the mustard? I do appreciate though that you need an awful lot of space (not to mention time and money!) to recreate the 100 car train(!)

 

You do actually want to complete a layout in this life do you? (or do you? Maybe a 'test track' is good enough?)

 

If I were to offer an opinion, knowing only a limited amount about what you might want (and in lieu of answers to the above), I would go for a continuous run, stacked figure of eight (ie twice round the shed to complete the full circuit) with grades that would support running of a train up to 20 cars long, with at least one clear open stretch of line (in a desert, rocky outcrop setting), at least one yard and a couple of sidings dotted about. Yes, been done before and US mags are full of that sort of stuff - but at the end of the day it's difficult to come up with something TOTALLY original!

 

Either that, or abandon the US stuff entirely to the land of daydreams! You could then turn the above concept into a remote Scottish byway instead...

 

Incidentally, the only layout I ever 'abandoned' was a single track branch line terminus as - attractive location though it was - it wasn't really holding my attention from an operational point of view.

 

HTH

[switcher 1]

Another thought crossed my mind; most layouts on here seem to be for exhibition useage, which means they are designed differently from a home layout.

[Prof Klyzlr]

Dear Switcher,

 

Respectfully, I'm not sure I see what you're getting at?
What makes the refinements and layout design tech-developments that are "road proven" under the torture-test of show/exhibition work somehow invalid for use in a home layout environment?

 

Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

[Talltim]

I may be mis-reading Switcher1's post, but I thought he was commenting on layout concept and aesthetics rather than the technical side of making sure it works in exhibition conditions.

Layouts are all designed for an audience. That audience may be just you, you and your mates, fellow Espee fans, British railway modellers or the general public, to give a few examples. These audiences want different things so if you are comparing your stay-at-home layout, where oneself is the primary audience, with one designed for the general public, they are going to be very different, and it ends up being a not very helpful comparison. Some ideas may transfer, but many will not. An example close to home might be the nightclub on your layout, brilliant at exhibitions and on Youtube, but I bet you don't have it on all the time at home!

 

However, I get the impression that the good Dr's audience doesn't know what it wants...

Edited March 20, 2015 by Talltim

[Prof Klyzlr]

Dear Tim,

 

Good thing you're not a betting man then, I regularly use "Brooklyn" as a set of reference monitors for new LayoutSound mixes and sound-design,
so the 2+2.1 speaker system is always playing _something_,
and anytime I am operating (switching for my own enjoyment at home, not with an audience) I still run in full "3AM" lighting/sound/atmospherics mode... :-)

(OK, you got me, I don't run the Seuthe smoke gens quite soo hard at home, Seuthe smoke fluid is $$$$ down here! :-) ).

 

Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

Edited March 20, 2015 by Prof Klyzlr

[Talltim]

Changing the DJ in the club is cheating!

[CVSNE]

I sometimes think that a point is reached where inspiration is triggered by starting over and going right back to basics, cutting everything down to the absolute minimum of track and starting over - big complicated layouts are wonderful in theory, but become a millstone in practice, and that is where the loss of mojo is triggered - ask yourself why the Great Lord Mindheim has started over with a much more simple design - expandable, but initially simple( r ) Currently considering something based around Jack Hills New Castle layout, in HO but in Florida with minimum pointwork

Whoa, did I miss something?

Last time I saw Lance his Miami based switching layout was still filling his basement. He was talking about a LAJ west coast thing in a spare bedroom. Or did I miss something?

[CVSNE]

Of course I don't really understand the apparent obsession you Brits on here seem to have with (1) Big western modern railroading and (2) single track spurs. The former is difficult enough to harness in a 2500 square foot layout, let alone a small shelf (though in a space not much different than yours, and much smaller than Lance's Downtown Spur. Pelle manages to capture the essence of UP in the Mojave - no small feat!)

Yes the Downtown Spur has held Lance's interest for a while now, but when he was first designing it he told me he thought of it as a 6-8 year project.  Once he reached that threshold he'd do something else if the mood struck. He's apparently doing just that - building an LAJ layout in a spare bedroom.

Although our layouts are very different form factors they occupy about the same square footage. (I chuckle every time I read about how Lance is a one-trick pony with a small "shunty planks" his only accomplishment. He built a basement filling N scale layout, and then followed that up with a basement filling HO one. But everyone seems to think the Downtown Spur is some sort of SMALL layout - it isn't!)

 

What's all this mean? Perhaps, just perhaps an American "switching layout" or spur or whatever you guys call these things is just not right for your interests? Are you attempting to swallow the magic "model railroad nirvana" pill, and find it's taking more than a spoon full of sugar (or glass of something else entirely) to choke it down?

As others have said, determine whatever it is that fires you up about railroading -every continent/railway/region/era offers something appealing - identify what those things are for you. From what I can tell from this and other threads you've authored the "micro-modeling" doesn't fire you up much. The challenge you face is to identify what that is.

 

Of course, you could also just have a case of a modeling disease known around these parts as "The blahs." I had them for a while this winter - instead I built a sailing ship model for the family room.

 

Good luck!

Marty

Edited March 20, 2015 by CVSNE

[shortliner]

Whoa, did I miss something?

Last time I saw Lance his Miami based switching layout was still filling his basement. He was talking about a LAJ west coast thing in a spare bedroom. Or did I miss something?

Probably not, Marty - I saw that he had sold one - East Rail?? - and was going to build LAJ - My brain(?) connected the two and made an assumption. Non-the-less it will be interesting to read his take on the new area.

[CVSNE]

That's what I figured. the East Rail layout was fun to switch. I haven't been over to see the Downtown Spur in a while - it's hard to find time to drive across the river to Maryland - but I need to get over there at some point.

[shortliner]

 

- instead I built a sailing ship model for the family room.

 

 

 

I read that too fast - had an instant vision of you doing a "Gibbs" from NCIS and filling the basement!

Edited March 20, 2015 by shortliner

[Andy Reichert]

Of course I don't really understand the apparent obsession you Brits on here seem to have with (1) Big western modern railroading and (2) single track spurs.

 

SNIP

 

Not me!

 

Andy

[F-UnitMad]

IIRC one who liked to 'detract' from Lance's accomplishments was "JWB" (located in the USA), who eventually (& thankfully!!) stopped coming on here as he reckoned us Brits idolised Lance far too much. He turned several threads into "Anti-Lance" Rants unfortunately, and was the main protagonist which drove Lance himself to comment about it in one of his Blogs - equally unfortunately making it seem as it was modellers in Britain giving him a hard time.

 

Re "Brit attractions to US Railroads".... I think we can sum it up by saying it's everything we don't have here.

For instance;

Multi-engine lash-ups - more than two locos, anyway.

Multi-engine lash-ups on mile-long trains.

Double-stack Container trains - even our single containers have to go in low-deck wagons with roller-skate wheels to clear the loading gauge!!

Short Lines.

Long, single track, freight only branches with such rickety track that our rolling stock would fall off....

 

The list could go on, but I'm sure you get the idea...

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Keep going lads, I'll be back in a bit.  Actually laid some track over the past few evenings.  Also took my bass and amp to the shed, so that's another distraction.

[Prof Klyzlr]

Dear Dr,

 

 

 

Also took my bass and amp to the shed

 

ah, another "Brooklyn 3: AM" in the making? 

 

Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

[Prof Klyzlr]

Dear Tim,

 

Given that "B3:AM" uses a DreamPlayer and an MP3 player as the sound sources,
with automatic "random play" function and a combined storage capacity of over 10 hours,
I rarely hear the same sound/song twice over between sequential op sessions, 

 

indeed it usually takes 6 or 7 sessions before UltraSonic's "1-2-3-4" rolls around....
(I happen to know that "1-2-3-4" is the first file/"soundtrack" in the system... ;-) ).

 

Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

[The Bigbee Line]

Three desultory months on, and although I've jiggled the track and built some buildings I have to conclude I am not feeling the love any more - the industrial spur in America idea has just upped and died on me

 

Not sure what to do next, although I am tempted to start selling off the stock to free up some cash pending whatever happens next.

I've been there many times. Sometimes it's the doing that keeps it going. I had lots of fun with some code 100 in the garage in 2008. Here are a few pictures of the 6th version. What made it most fun was running a couple of Athearn GP35s. I'd got them cheap as mechanisms to go under GP30 bodies. I put chips in and off they went. Kind of attached to the paint schemes.

 

What it did do was give me my first opportunity to really run with DCC. It was running trains that galvanised the track layout. Unfortunately a job change scuppered everything.....

 

You will note the flat crossing. For me that what differentiates it, without question, from UK outline (yes I know about Retford etc, but that's unusual).

 

Keep some track on the boards and play trains now and again, it's inspiring:

 

 

 

 

 

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Right then, if you fall off the horse the best thing to do is get back in the saddle.  So here's an update of some steady progress over the past few evenings.  It helps that it's daylight longer and a tad warmer of course.

 

This is the current state of iron on the ground, I actually need three more turnouts to complete this.  They're on order.

 

Taking a trip along the line, we start at the east end of the line at the silos.  Either Cemex or General Mills, to be decided later.  There are 16 more silos to finish this spot.

 

Just along the spur is the ready mix plant and a glimpse of the building supplies warehouse...

 

with a couple of boxcars spotted at the loading doors

 

Next industry is a short spur for chemical cars for the adjacent paper recycling plant

 

This occupies the western corner of the line as it swings north.  The local switcher set is parked up for the weekend, so that's a nice catch.

 

The switchers are worth a second shot, as they're in pretty good nick considering its almost 20 years since the Santa Fe took over the western world and became BNSF.

 

Following the line as it curves from north to east, we arrive at the junction with the main, and are in luck as a pair of UP switchers have parked up on the yard lead for the weekend.

 

The UP yard job won't be working any time soon, as the track gang have cleared off leaving the job half-done...

 

Looking back west towards the junction, there is a new siding going in north of the main to facilitate run round moves, and some new turnouts to install to complete the yard tracks.  This is where incoming loaded cars will be spotted and empties stored pending a trip back to the main yard a dozen miles further east.

 

That concludes our quick weekend visit to the line to see what's going on.  Hopefully the track gang will reconvene soon and full operations will be restored, as the local customers are getting restless and looking at the local truck companies.

 

 

[Gary H]

Now personally, I don't see anything wrong with that.

If you want to simply switch cars, Its fine. (yes, I know I'm stating the obvious)

Sometimes I think we strive to much for the perfect layout and AFAIC your never going to achieve that!

On my layout, Ive tried to achieve the switching aspect and the roundy-roundy  and for me anyway, I wish I'd gone with one or the other, not both!!

 

Ive a feeling that once you start to get some scenery going (not my favourite aspect either I hasten to add!) put some semi's and cars in there, you'll be surprised how much fun it'll be!

 

 

 

[Gary H]

Doc;

 

As someone who's been going through this same process for the last several months - in the end I took Mike Coughill's advice, at least I think it was his advice, and modelled what I wanted. I love 40' Hi-Cube appliance cars, corn syrup tankers (the short ones), Railbox series cars, and older B-B locomotives. I love first mile, last mile railroading and the interaction between the railroad and the customer.

 

So I am building the HVRR to meet my needs. A yard as the central action, industries as the secondary action, and lots of short work to allow me to have many short (30 minute) operating sessions per week.

 

Sometimes you simply have to go back to first principles, and lay track, forget the plan, until you get to something that makes you happy when you view it.

 

Good luck, and make yourself happy.

Excellent post, Andrew!

Good advice.

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Longer evenings and shorter working days (temporarily) and some enthusiasm for the little pikelet.

 

Here's what's been happening lately...

 

 

 

I've relaid the staging yard/yard tracks again... just call me Son of Coachmann. I'm hoping this time they'll look better and function more logically. And ironically, almost back to how they were when I started out.  There must be a lesson there, somewhere.  Clearly I missed it....

 

 

I also had some fun with my latest acquisition, another Kato SD38-2.  This one didn't fight me so hard on fitting all the grabs and hand rails, so I must have learnt something from the previous experience.   I've also renumbered it, applied the yellow safety stripe (including round the porches and anti-climbers this time) and applied the switcher chevrons.  Handsome beast, now all I need is a couple of Kato late model SD40-2 to renumber into the 16xx series to complete the set.

 

 

The BNSF GP38 pair got a run out as well, and I had some fun trying out a variety of different photo opportunities.

 

 

 

 

 

All in all, most satisfying.  And I have a whole week off work coming up, some kits to build, some wiring to complete and some time to do some proper operations.  I will also finish weathering the locomotives and some more freight cars,

 

Nice.