The Eagle has landed...

[Zomboid]

How is that not an "up to date switcher"? Looks to fulfill the brief pretty comprehensively to me.

[Andy Reichert]

How is that not an "up to date switcher"? Looks to fulfill the brief pretty comprehensively to me.

 

It does have useful Arizona snow ploughs fitted.

 

Andy

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

It's a little bigger than folks were expecting, and the visibility in reverse leaves a little to be desired.  That's why some day soon, there'll be another one on the roster

 

There are - or were - several well known SD40T-2 switchers, including 50 and 51 on the Pacific Harbor Lines at Long Beach, and another, WRIX2940, at Cargill Grain at the foot of Cajon Pass

Andy, those are for shovelling sand and rocks!

Edited May 25, 2015 by Dr Gerbil-Fritters

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

I've been tweaking the plan slightly - again,  I've reversed the direction of the line, so that where formerly there were two spurs and the staging track, the line now comes to an end in a warehouse complex.

 

 

 

The other two corner industries remain as they were...

 

 

 

The switching this evening was in the hands of the tatty BNSF GP38 pair.  I still haven't changed the numberboards!

 

 

Incidentally, I spent some of the bank holiday watching various videos and dvds featuring the SP and ATSF in California and Arizona in the early nineties.  I expected to feel saddened by the lack of variety these days compared with then, but I was more surprised to notice that the freight cars were almost entirely free of graffiti!  

 

Sometimes rose tinted specs are correct.  The rail-scene in the early 90s was more interesting than now, with a small number of first generation EMDs still on the roster of both roads, the dominant muscle provided by 645 powered 40s and 45s in various flavours including 4 axle, 6 axle, dash 2, tunnel motors, and cowl units, early 710 powered units of GP60 in standard cab, comfort cab and booster versions, elderly GEs such as B39s, SF30Cs and C30-7s, early dash 8 models like B40s and C40s, proper paints schemes, and clean freight cars...

 

My first trip west in 2003 was ten years too late.

[F-UnitMad]

Agree about the graffiti. I have DVDs of the Soo Line circa 1970s/80s, & although I haven't scrutinised every single car shown, I reckon there is no graffiti at all, on any of them.

[Andy Reichert]

I was around LA in 75, and now I can't remember if I saw any graffiti at all back then.

 

I certainly have no interest in modelling any, no matter what the era.

[F-UnitMad]

Whilst I don't like graffiti, regardless of prefefence it's become one of those things that helps define an Era. Like BNSF patch jobs...

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Thoughts this week have turned to the viability of double decking,,,

 

Using the current surface for a staging level and adding a top deck...

 

The current lack of staging irks me.

 

In other news, I found this rather lovely model railroad by the excellent expert, John Signor.  The concept is very interesting, I would put it firmly into the early 90s school of design, pre-dating the later linear yard to yard plans that became vogue in the latter part of the last century.

 

Made me look longingly at my plan for the coast line that requires a space of 30 x 20 minimum....

 

Oh well, back to switching one or two cars at a time.

[Goatboy]

Been following this for a while now, unfortunately I am stalled modelling for a while, a recent operation on my hand is taking a while to heal.. so it's all planning in my head.

I understand yours is evolving, but have you got an up to date track plan now?  .  I work on the railway so i understand how a track plan can look too 'model like' with way too much crammed in it. I have been hankering after a Mindheim'esque plan, but space is limited and  i still cannot get my head around planning one without a runround loop.

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

GB, here is the current plan.  I expect it'll change again shortly

 

 

Overall size is 13'6" x 7' 6" (a 14 x 6 shed doesn't actually give you the full dimensions once the framing, insulation and internal walls are taken into account, and those 'missing six inches' are sorely needed.)

 

There is a very short (around seven cars) double ended siding, which can be used for run rounds if needed.

 

Biggest problem is still the staging, I just can't seem to get it right... when it's in plain sight it annoys me, and there's not enough of it to stop having to handle cars on and off the layout.  

 

Hope the hand gets better soon.

Edited May 27, 2015 by Dr Gerbil-Fritters

[Zomboid]

I'd say if you feel you need a run round, put one in. It'll definitely be a feature of what I hope to build if I find myself blessed with sufficient space.

[Tove]

 You mention the idea of double decking the layout to have the staging.Well, how about just dropping the line across the door,and going under the industries along the one wall and above the work bench?.

You should have enough length for a fairly easy grade.My thinking being, you only need enough room to get your hand over the top of a couple of tracks,so about 4 inches in depth?.

 

Just a quick thought!.

 

Brian.

 

[Adrian Wintle]

 You mention the idea of double decking the layout to have the staging.Well, how about just dropping the line across the door,and going under the industries along the one wall and above the work bench?.

You should have enough length for a fairly easy grade.My thinking being, you only need enough room to get your hand over the top of a couple of tracks,so about 4 inches in depth?.

lower level staging.jpg

 

Just a quick thought!.

 

Brian.

 

At 4% (1 in 25), which is pretty steep, you would only get down about 2" in the space marked in red.

 

Adrian

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

It would actually be easier to build the staging on the existing boards, and go up, as a glance at these pictures will show.

 

That would allow me to build a couple of different detachable 'tops' one of which could be a Highland BLT, a version of the Lyme Regis branch for the new Oxfornby Radial Tank etc etc....

 

[Tove]

At 4% (1 in 25), which is pretty steep, you would only get down about 2" in the space marked in red.

 

Adrian

I should have made the line longer!

 

It would actually be easier to build the staging on the existing boards, and go up, as a glance at these pictures will show.

 

 

Ahhh, i see what you mean......

 

Brian.

 

[Andy Reichert]

There can be a construction where the entire layout, (except perhaps for the sidings where cars need to be parked) is made as a continuous gentle grade and spirals ever upward around the inner edge of the building. Providing the (constant) gap between the layers is sufficient, then you can continue looping around until the maximum convenient height (and lower level) is reached.

 

If the inter layer height gap is not large enough, then  intermediate layers can be pushed much further back as hidden, narrow single single track routes.

 

Andy

[Goatboy]

I have an unfinished job in the garage, this seems to have a good potential range of operations, sugar beet plant (coal, beets, and numerous tank cars) team track, warehousing etc but very tight curves and lots of points....but the garage is in a state of leaking...  This is the new plan I have been kicking around, runround included, but it still looks too busy to me..

 

                          

[Prof Klyzlr]

Dear Dr,

 

I'm probably too late to the conversation, but I can;t help but want to dig a little deeper here...

 

 

 

Biggest problem is still the staging, I just can't seem to get it right... when it's in plain sight it annoys me, and there's not enough of it to stop having to handle cars on and off the layout.  

 

If you don't mind, some questions so I can understand better:.

 

- What is it that annoys you about visible staging?

- Is it a case of what ammount to a "classification yard" somewhere on the benchwork?
- Do you not _want_ a classification yard in visible space?

(and it's totally OK if you don't.. I'm just trying to understand... :-) )

- Is it a case that the resulting "classification yard" would not be performing verifiable "prototypicial work"?
(NB that a model class yard does similar work to a proto class yard, just adapted to the range of actual functional industries on the modelled layout)

- What about straight-up "interchange track" staging?

- What about "fade to black" siingle-track staging?

(Offshoot thought, single-track "fade to black" staging implies "the train that just departed 'to points other' in this session will be the same train that arrives to start the next session".
Now, appropriate paperwork can explain this away, but it's human to get antsy over the fact that _you_ as the usual-operator know "its the same train, the same cars, the same consist order", even if _technically_ the consist for the session is entirely defensible).

 

Now, re "stopping to handle cars on/off the layout"

What is the actual issue? Is it:

- there is not enough cars available "on rail" to change the starting-consist for every session

OR

- just the issue of physically having to manhandle _any_ equipment?

 

The first part directly addresses online car _capacity_, and can only be addressed by sheer track-space
(which you've previously noted is a hot-button problem for you, risking the "too cramped/busy" look)

 

the second is simply a "material handling" issue, and can be addressed by suitable staging systems,
(thinking cassettes, LocoLifts, and other "virtual" and "parallel" staging systems which avoid the need to physically touch Fingers to Models)

 

Please don't mishear me, I'm not trying to badger you into a layout design choice,
Rather, I very much am a keen observer of your personal layout design "headspace" and ruminations,
and want to understand "what it is that's actually niggling at you" about the design...

 

Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

 

PS personally dbl-decking sounds like overkill, and represents far more potential drawbacks than solutions.
Better to properly and completely call out the "niggling concerns" for what they are,

and address them head-on... :-)

[Gary H]

I went all the way through the lack of staging PITA and in the end I had to install it below the layout itself.

This job was one of the most challenging aspects of my whole build, that is, adding it to what was a completed layout.

Far better to do it now than later, speaking from bitter experience!

I also found that to keep grades at an exceptable level, the road bed had to make one complete circuit of my 12"x9" to maintain a 2% grade.

This though easily takes double stacked containers.

 

Oh the pain-

(to illustrate the point, trying to fit and adjust all this in spaces where you could only get one hand  was a whole lota fun!)

The following shot shows a double stack car in the distance.

The riser on the left with the figure '5' on shows the cross brace its screwed to. The top of that x-brace is the level of the track the

loop starts from that leads to the staging.

Basically, what your seeing is one track going down 2% and the left track climbing at 2%.

Needles to say it was whole world of pain to build in that staging after I finished the main layout,

never again.

I have ended up with 5 decent spurs though that will fit 30 car trains.

 

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Another day, another 'adjustment'.  As an interim, I laid in three staging tracks where the warehouse formerly was - I have enough warehousing, and didn't need a third corner with one on.  It didn't really sit right, visually.

 

What I did want was a pad for unloading centre beams (not that I have any as yet!) 

 

So this is the current set up, and the staging tracks hold up to 20 cars which allows me to ring the changes without having to man-handle stock on and off the railroad.  The 20 are also well hidden, although the actual buildings are only place-holders at the moment, and will be replaced by the proper buildings for a builders supplies yard in due course.

 

Two spurs that form the builders supplies.  The one on the right will be the pad for unloading centre beams.  Remember, CBs have to be unloaded from both sides, so it's common to  see the spurs curve quite sharply in order to get forklift access to both sides of the cars.  The spur on the left will be a dock for boxcars. On the furthest left is the switch lead. Traffic to this spur will be my version of the Rialto Local that I photographed back in April...

 

I've been moving buildings about too, to gauge the effect.  Quite like this set up.

 

The staging tracks are designed to look somewhat like another industry, or perhaps an interchange.  

 

 

The buildings block the staged cars quite effectively, without 'breaking the fourth wall' for want of a better phrase.

 

I'll cut back the spur at this point to allow road access to the supplies yard, and replace the building with one that has the doors round the corner.  A few other appropriate buildings and shelters for materials and this should be an interesting little corner to work.  And the 20 or so cars I don't want to see, I can't see.  So they don't exist, and break my suspension of disbelief. The brain is an idiot sometimes.

 

An afternoon switch job was to remove the empty tanks from the tank spur.

 

Grubby tank cars.  No idea what's in them, they look too grimy to be foodstuffs.... I should probably replace the with cleaner ADM cars.

Edited May 30, 2015 by Dr Gerbil-Fritters

[Goatboy]

^{Can you use one of the longest sides for hidden staging? Run a large warehouse approx 150-200mm from the bench edge, run a single line here with a spur disappearing off into the factory, or between buildings and putting your staging in there?  No need for an exit loop onto the main either, as long as you have space for a loco release}

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Well, another weekend featuring track lifting!

 

It's all up, and I'm back to bare boards which will get a refresh pending whatever happens next.

 

I operated the thing a few times, but boredom set in quite quickly, so I'm back to square one.

[Goatboy]

radical move Dr GF, are you still taking inspiration from Lance Mindheim and the Grimes lines style of layout? or are you after a complete change?

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Not sure yet.  The pike worked fine, was reasonably authentic, yet I just didn't have any love for it.  I am still looking for an emotional connection, but it's proving elusive.

[Tove]

Well, another weekend featuring track lifting!

 

It's all up, and I'm back to bare boards which will get a refresh pending whatever happens next.

 

I operated the thing a few times, but boredom set in quite quickly, so I'm back to square one.

As i  build my latest HO venture, i too have had the wobbles again,so i know exactly how you feel sir!.

But this time i`m determined to get it to a fairly finished state. Especially as i `ve never finished a layout since i was fifteen.

Which, all bar a few years is nearly thirty years now....   how time fly's...!

 

Brian.