Bachmann - why price increases are necessary

[coachmann]

There is nothing wrong with detail and I for one would hope that Bachmann looks for ways of maintaining current high standards while looking for ways of reducing the number of time-consuming expensive to fit separate fittings. Plastic injection moulding is already used to this end but Hornby went way over the top a few years ago with its LNER coach bogies. Moulded door handles on carriages also look better than overscale chunky looking plastic separate fittings that are so vulnerable. Looking at the L&Y 2-4-2T, Bachmann certainly have their head screwed on with a weighty mazak running plate casting complete with cast steps and inner tanks onto which are screwed largish easy-to-handle components. This must keep production costs down.

 

We talk about alternatives like kits but I have yet to see a kit with the detail one routinely finds on RTR locos these days. Therefore back-tracking is not the way forward and if £15.00 to £20.00 is added to the cost of locos from new stock, how hard is it to put a few more pennies in the piggy and wait a week or two? Most things are pre-order nowadays so there is time to save. But RTR manufacturers have to play ball too and stop producing ridiculously short-runs that end up being pre-sold while lining the pockets of non-modellers on Ebay.

[MikeParkin65]

This makes me think about the changes in the detail on models tooled-up in the current environment and those of 2002 or thereabouts. To my mind there hasn't been much change since then, having just bought a Standard Class 5MT which is a 2002 design, although made in 2004, and presumably the same tools are being used today, albeit with a DCC decoder socket added after 2005. It cost me £70, Ebay, essentially new, boxed and so on, has a bag of spare parts and etched plates, unfitted in the photo, which unusually for me has no editing except the beginnings of a background. It is from three separately-focussed pics however.

 

My question is, 'what would it cost to tool-up and produce this model from scratch today?' The answer in Andy's OP is 'probably would bring retail to about £150...'? So it's the s/h market for me, I'm afraid. It is a superb model, as are all in the series, undervalued in my opinion.

 

 

Interesting that you use the Standard 5 as the example as I was chipping one yesterday (73158) bought in similar circumstances from ebay a few years ago. In removing the body I managed to destroy a small amount of pipe work from beneath the chassis. This no doubt took time (and therefore expense) to factory fit but isnt visible at all when the model is on the track and to my mind makes little or no difference to a successful rendition of the prototype.

[Phil Parker]

We talk about alternatives like kits but I have yet to see a kit with the detail one routinely finds on RTR locos these days.

 

Really? I'm not sure High Level Models or Martin Finney would appreciate that on the loco front. Modern Parkside wagons are easily a match for RTR too - in cases such as mineral wagons the kit sides are thinner than the RTR ones which (to my eye) makes them look a little better.

[Lochinvar]

I see that Bachmann's web-site is now showing some price changes. The new Thompson Corrs previously listed at £30.35 RRP (for the CC versions) now priced at "TBA". And the Stanier Port-holes seem to have disappeared altogether!  I'm hoping that this is simply because they have taken that area of the site down temporarily (perhaps for price changing),rather than for something more ominous!

 

DR

[pipparooba]

I seen a email saying that Bachmann are having to put a 20% price rise because Chinese people what a better standard of living so want pay rises. And materials are costing more. There isn't a lot of materials compeared to a bath now is there so I can't see were they get the % myself

[farren]

Why would the amount of a materials affect a percentage increase? Plus models have multiple plastics and metals all having to be paid for and delivered where a bath uses less materials but in Greater bulk which can cut prices.

[railroadbill]

Takes  deep breath -

I like sprung buffers on oo stock. I think it gives a touch of quality. I was disappointed when I got my Bach 37 251 model which was the version I was waiting for and found it didn't have sprung buffers. Mostly they look better as well due to the metal heads and polished metal shanks.  Like several posters on this thread I've managed to get sprung buffers to work  on curves with a lot of fiddling - but that's really a one off experiment on 36" radii curves. Despite the risk of those little springs pinging across the room, I've fitted sprung buffers to kit built locos because for one thing after market buffer sets enable the right shape of buffer stock to be used for that particular loco (which doesn't mean that more recent r-t-r locos don't have moulded parts that are spot on, of course).

Actually the best working buffers are Heljan imho which are very softly sprung but then they are plastic....

Keep the sprung buffers!

 

- whiffles on in a similar vein for 59 seconds until interruped by Nicholas Parsons.

[grahame]

With luck the summer buffers will be here soon and the spring buffers will all be tough and forgotten about.

 

Besides I vote against spring buffers unless we can have them on N gauge models as well. . . . . .

 

G.

[YesTor]

I'd go one step further and say they should not be glued in... I can forsee the chinese factories gluing buffers at funny angles, based on what I've seen on wagons. Less of an issue in the centre of a train of 20 vehicles, more of an issue on the front of a loco.

 

Totally agree - and to be fair much like many glued-on detail parts, a good example being the bogie steps on the Bachmann Class 66 - I own a good number and I've yet to find one where the steps aren't glued on at strange angles, totally spoils the appearance.  Sometimes I wish they'd simply include the detail parts in a bag, at least I'm capable of gluing them on straight!

[reevesthecat]

Can we have a new thread called what have you panic bought before the price rise hits! For me a colas 66 thanks to big jims working with colas thread but the derby lightweight also looks good at £85 for the blue example!

Mark

[Coombe Barton]

I seen a email saying that Bachmann are having to put a 20% price rise because Chinese people what a better standard of living so want pay rises. And materials are costing more. There isn't a lot of materials compeared to a bath now is there so I can't see were they get the % myself

May I suggest that you read this thread through as it contains some pretty good explanations of the economic argument, and that not only from Bachmann's perspective. It may serve to clarify your thinking.

[pipparooba]

May I suggest that you read this thread through as it contains some pretty good explanations of the economic argument, and that not only from Bachmann's perspective. It may serve to clarify your thinking.

i did only see the tail end of the thread as i was on my phone it wasnt until i got home i read the thread but still 20% is a large rise in one go 

[Coombe Barton]

i did only see the tail end of the thread as i was on my phone it wasnt until i got home i read the thread but still 20% is a large rise in one go 

Not unexpected, not alone in manufacturers - there's a lot of evidence in this thread to say why it is necessary. Bachmann deserve the credit for honesty and openness. 

 

It's unavoidable and a fact of life.

[Kris]

Not looked at the OO stuff, but many of the n gauge coaches have gone up by £3.50ish an increase of about 16%. The locos that I have looked at have not gone up much however it is noticeable that some have gone from having a price to being TBA. I'm taking this to mean that these are a long way down the line and may well not appear until after the next round of price rises. 

[Retro_man]

I see Bachmann are now showing the new pricing on their website.

 

What is interesting is that there are no MK1 coaches (other than suburbans) shown and several types of steam loco are missing completely - e.g. L&Y tank engines.

 

Hopefully these items will reappear...

[ThaneofFife]

Not unexpected, not alone in manufacturers - there's a lot of evidence in this thread to say why it is necessary. Bachmann deserve the credit for honesty and openness. 

 

It's unavoidable and a fact of life.

loving the barbed parting opinion.....

[spackz]

Apologies if this has been mentioned before, I received an E-mail from a retailer today suggesting prices of stock already held will be increasing. My question is if the stock is already paid for and not subject to the price rises due to the wage increase in China how can retailers increase the price of this stock. Surely its only new stock released from Bachmanns warehouse that is subject to any price increases.

 

The price increases will mean I will buy less, however already having most of what I need will not be buying large quantities of new locos. Where it will hit me is with wagons as you never buy or need just one, a realistic rake of wagons will now cost nearly double that of a loco..

[andyman7]

Apologies if this has been mentioned before, I received an E-mail from a retailer today suggesting prices of stock already held will be increasing. My question is if the stock is already paid for and not subject to the price rises due to the wage increase in China how can retailers increase the price of this stock. Surely its only new stock released from Bachmanns warehouse that is subject to any price increases.

 

The price increases will mean I will buy less, however already having most of what I need will not be buying large quantities of new locos. Where it will hit me is with wagons as you never buy or need just one, a realistic rake of wagons will now cost nearly double that of a loco..

A dealer can do what they like, nothing illegal there. Some slavishly follow current list price and mark the stock up, others will sell at the 'prevailing' list price for when the stock was bought in, others will set their own price.

[Grovenor]

As was mentioned a few pages back in this topic, the retailer needs to bring in enough to replace his stock as well as feed his family, if he sells at the

old price he will likely have to go round to the bank for more working capital, not a good prospect in today's economy.

Keith

[Retro_man]

I received an E-mail from a retailer today suggesting prices of stock already held will be increasing. My question is if the stock is already paid for and not subject to the price rises due to the wage increase in China how can retailers increase the price of this stock. Surely its only new stock released from Bachmanns warehouse that is subject to any price increases.

 

 

If the trade price of certain new items is higher than the advertised price of items in stock, the retailer may be ensuring he gets sufficient income to replace his sold items.

[darren01]

Hi

The price increases is OK ,but will not be any good to them unless they get the models to market on time and not in small panic buying rushes.

[darren01]

Hi Mickey

I agree that it would help there cash flow, But having such short runs on new loco's is a real pain, i had the C Class on pre-order last year and still did not get one.

I don't want to pre-order every thing that comes out, as i would like to buy it when i want too, and not have get it just then or i will not get one.

Darren

[farren]

If bigger runs where done surely this would help to bring costs down by a good amount I admit maybe not 20% but every little helps

And maybe this would make runs easier as the same model world not need to be tooled up every year opening up time for others. Plus Bachmann and retailers would not get it in the ear when customers are let down.

[brushman47544]

I don't want to pre-order every thing that comes out, as i would like to buy it when i want too, and not have get it just then or i will not get one.

Darren

 

I'm convinced we're heading towards pre-order or risk you won't get it as the norm. The first time it's happened to me, a Roco Italian outline loco in the 2013 catalogue I was waiting for has been cancelled due to a lack of pre-orders.

 

I'd be happy to pre-order more, provided what arrives matches EXACTLY the description in the catalogue, and in sufficient detail. Unfortunately that is too often not the case.

[Coach bogie]

It's called Last In First Out accounting (LIFO). It means that you have sufficient funds to purchase the replacement stock at the new wholesale price, cover your expenses and maintain positive cash flow. The alternative is FIFO, which can put the business at risk if there have been substantial wholesale price increases.

 

Of interest, not that it will affect Bachmann UK, this weeks 2015 US Budget, LIFO accounting methods are to be eliminated as it is seen as a tax avoidance loophole with tax liability usually less under LIFO compared to FIFO.

 

I know it is a popular accounting method, especially when costs are rising, as it allows fro the increased costs of replacing stock, but  international finance standards/UK tax authorities do not allow LIFO for stock valuation. It can also leave older stock unsold for longer periods making financial record keeping more complex and expensive over successive years.

 

Mike Wiltshire