DH71Tiger Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Hi guys, I have some Porthole coaches, the bogie design is Interesting, shall we say ...................... I was looking at a review of the Blue Pullman in an old Model Rail mag and the bogie design is the same as the Portholes. I don't have time at the moment, I'm just painting a 1/4 scale P51D Mustang, the culmination of a 2 year project, but I wondered if drilling out the indented copper wheel carriers, having first removed them from the plastic moulding, to accept a soldered brass top hat bush might locate the wheels a bit more accurately. I presume that the bogie was designed this way to allow for carriage lighting, as the B. P. I look forward to your replies ................... Keep yer udders wet this time of the year ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted July 23, 2014 Author Share Posted July 23, 2014 (edited) Run the bogies until they're useless then replace proper bogies is the answer. If the Bachmann BR Mk. I bogie and LMS 'Porthole' bogie are compared, Bachmann has effectively cut a chunk out of the design leaving it open ended and weak. Why would they do this? I was critical of some Hornby design features 18 months ago but design-nicht-clever has migrated.... Edited July 23, 2014 by coachmann 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 I got my rake today. I think the bogie has been left open as the best compromise to allow the close coupling mech to work. Two of these open ends were loose enough to allow the wheels to rub the under frame/flooring and obviously were not centred. I removed the wheels, twisted the open bogie sides back in and now the coaches run fine. Though there is no doubt about the wheels looking a little off centred. I suspect over time creep will force them apart again. Fixing some sort of bar (that avoids the coupling) is required I feel. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DH71Tiger Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 I too noticed the mobile coupling mechanism, seems to work very smoothly and provide greater clearance around bends, thus allowing closer coupling ! ! is this a new idea from Bachmann ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefrk Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 I too noticed the mobile coupling mechanism, seems to work very smoothly and provide greater clearance around bends, thus allowing closer coupling ! ! is this a new idea from Bachmann ? No, this type of arrangement has been in use for many years but the bogies have been better designed before. Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 No, this type of arrangement has been in use for many years but the bogies have been better designed before. Dave. Indeed the 4-CEP uses the exact same system only the bogie sides are around twice as thick. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted July 24, 2014 Author Share Posted July 24, 2014 (edited) I too noticed the mobile coupling mechanism, seems to work very smoothly and provide greater clearance around bends, thus allowing closer coupling ! ! is this a new idea from Bachmann ? I have shown the BR Mk.I bogie in post #75, This coach also has the swing link NEM socket but the bogie has closed ends. Therefore was no reason to leave one end open as on Bachmann's latest (LMS) bogie. Edited July 24, 2014 by coachmann Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Sidelines Posted August 11, 2014 Share Posted August 11, 2014 (edited) Hi Larry As usual I go in awe of your work. The opportunity was taken to buy a Hattons 'bargain' Bachmann BR Mk.I corridor brake composite at the same time. Consistency is apparent in the matching blood & custard. The Mk.I was also fitted with a corridor connection at its inner end....As an alternative to fitting additional corridor connectors I have gone down the route of close coupling the portholes / Hornby Staniers / Bachmann Mk1s using a combination of Hornby R8220 couplers and Roco 40270 types. Porthole Left, Bachmann Mk1(BG)Right There are some more pictures and and details in my Blog. Regards Ray Edited August 11, 2014 by Silver Sidelines 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted August 11, 2014 Author Share Posted August 11, 2014 I have a boxful of Roco and Hornby Roco type couplings that used to be fitted to my Gresleys. They were never tried on the latest Porthole coaches, as I simply cut a chunk off the NEM sockets and sank the couplings further in with glue. I preferred to standardise on Bachmann couplings then trains could be re-shuffled at will. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrobuscp Posted August 11, 2014 Share Posted August 11, 2014 Initially, I tried fitting Kadee couplers to the Porthole coaches, but they were quite "sloppy" and the train behaved rather like a concertina - worse than a train of Bachmann Mk1s. The Roco couplers certainly do the job well on these coaches, and I've used them also to close couple the old/new coupler height Bachmann MkIs using their 40287(I think that'sthe correct reference) coupler. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rshakes3 Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 Hi all - I also have purchased 4 corridor 3rds and a brake 1st and I`m very happy with them but I do have a question for Coachmann - Is there a 'proper' method to disassemble the coaches? I`d really would like to fit some lights however I have not had a lot of luck 'gently prising the sides apart'. Seems like I only succeed in breaking the small steps when I`ve used a fine screew driver. So I thought I`d ask before I break something that I can not correct - so any advice would be welcome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted January 14, 2015 Author Share Posted January 14, 2015 Hi all - I also have purchased 4 corridor 3rds and a brake 1st and I`m very happy with them but I do have a question for Coachmann - Is there a 'proper' method to disassemble the coaches? I`d really would like to fit some lights however I have not had a lot of luck 'gently prising the sides apart'. Seems like I only succeed in breaking the small steps when I`ve used a fine screew driver. So I thought I`d ask before I break something that I can not correct - so any advice would be welcome. Wow, it's a good job I look around at various threads otherwise I would have missed this. I'm afraid the quick answer is I haven't dismantled a 'Porthole' as yet. I fully intend to merely to see if the glazing can be easily removed. Maybe another member will read this and give us a few clues.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 Like Larry I've not attempted to dismantle my copy, but I have found that a credit card or similar run around the body works well on Bachmann dmus. I use an old AA membership card. HTH, regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rshakes3 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Like Larry I've not attempted to dismantle my copy, but I have found that a credit card or similar run around the body works well on Bachmann dmus. I use an old AA membership card. HTH, regards Hi team, thank you for that, I`ve re visited the task and had success without causing any damage. - thanks again - Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
6959 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Recently I bought a couple of the new Bachmann so-called Porthole coaches and they are excellent except for the low ride height which makes them look almost HO when coupled to similar Hornby, Dapol or Replica stock. After reading through this thread several times and experimenting I decided I was onto a loser in trying to fix a design fault. Assembly problems I can usually fix but short of redesigning the bogie or using some from the Hornby Stanier coaches I am stuffed. For a coach costing over 30 quid at best discount I should not have to redesign the thing so to pass the ball back into Bachmann's court I sent the following email message to the service department..."I have bought some porthole LMS coaches and find that he wheels are very loose in the bogies which causes the coach to ride very low compared to other similar coaches. One bogie has been dismantled to find a cure but it seems to be a design problem and is difficult to resolve. Can you supply improved bogies for porthole coaches. I want to buy more of these soon but I have put off buying more until they are updated or alternative bogies are available as a spare part. Thanks". his is their (prompt) reply... "Thank you for your enquiry: I'm sorry to hear of the problem. You should find that bending the phosphor bronze strips in a touch to ensure that the axle points are in the middle of the cup will resolve the matter". Me again. I have already tried bending the strips inwards but it does not cure the fault because the bronze cups have a gert big radius in the bottom yet the axles have needle points which cause the axles to fit like a gentleman's appendage in a top hat. My next move will be to try to solder or glue some pin point bearing cups into the strips (when I can find the tobacco tin they are in). Another option could be to remove the bronze strips from the plastic bogie (they come out easily without wrecking the whole thing) and flattening the cups in a vice. Then drilling a small hole about 1mm diameter to locate the pin point axles. To prevent tilted axles it may need a simple drill jig. This process is irreversible so I will wait until I can get some spare bogies. With respect to other posters, the fix of using a spacer to raise the body is doing the wrong thing for the right reason but is OK for temporary use and is reversible. When I looked at some real Stanier coaches I noticed that the gap between the top of the bogie side frame and underside of sole bar is not very big. Bachmann have probably got this right with the porthole models. This is a bit of a catch 22 situation because the corridor third coaches are now sold out at Bachmann so it is a case of buy whilst you can and sort out the problem later. In a way this could be good news because Bachmann might do another batch of 39-450 with a different running number. Maybe with improved bogies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted January 15, 2015 Author Share Posted January 15, 2015 (edited) I raised all my Portholes with plastikard spacers. Nonetheless, the bogies are a complete puzzle, after all there is absolutely nothing wrong with the design of the old Mainline bogies which Bachmann continues to produce for the GWR and SR stock. Edited January 15, 2015 by coachmann Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodger5591 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 The latest issue of LMS Review (no 2) has an article on upgrading the Bachmann Portholes (and their 1F as well) Rodger Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
6959 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 The latest issue of LMS Review (no 2) has an article on upgrading the Bachmann Portholes (and their 1F as well) Rodger external link... http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0236/3059/products/LMS-Review-1_large.jpg?v=1419004583 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
6959 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 The latest issue of LMS Review (no 2) has an article on upgrading the Bachmann Portholes (and their 1F as well) Rodger The coach shown in previous post seems to have a black roof. Bachmann models have a grey roof. Can someone explain how each colour roof fits year-in-service-wise? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
6959 Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 I am wondering if the Bachmann 'porthole' coaches in crimson and cream are getting near to saturation as far as sales are concerned. The TK is shown as sold out in Bachmann list but the BFK, FK and FO seem plentiful. The BTK is promised soon. Most of these coaches are all the same price at dealers (-15 percent of list) but there a few bargains now and then. Watching sales on various web sites they do not seem to be snapped up even if the price is down to minus 30 percent off list. Some buyers may be put off by comments about the bogies but not every buyer is an RMWebber. In real life these first class coaches were built in very small numbers which limits their inclusion in model railway formations especially where five coaches is a long train on many layouts. There were twenty-seven BFK in four batches of which only fifteen were D2168 porthole coaches. In total there were eighty-two corridor firsts plus one prototype, and three conversions for Coronation sets. Of these only fifteen were porthole variety to D2162. Presumably as there were fifteen of each of these two porthole types (BFK + FK) they ran together. There were two batches of FO totalling seventy-one vehicles of which twenty were porthole stock to F2160. Has anyone got any realistic sales information about these Bachmann that they can disclose here? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Sidelines Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 (edited) A quick visit to Hattons (website) shows a full house - bargain packs of four corridor thirds still available. Ray Edited January 17, 2015 by Silver Sidelines Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 As usual the best information is contained in photographs of ones chosen period. Bachmann's 'Porthole' stock looks good but has compromises that might put some railway modellers off who could build their own coaches. Probably many folk just want something to hang behind the loco. The poorly designed bogie has been well aired but less so are the solebars, which have been set wider apart than on the real thing. I assume this is to help bogie wheel swing on trainset curves...............It was done previously on Hornby's Gresley corridor coaches. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iak Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 How much wider apart are the solebars please Larry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 How much wider apart are the solebars please Larry. LMS chassis drawing shows 7ft 10ins over solebar angle (just under 32mm and 30mm over solebar face). Bachmann 'Porthole' coaches are 33mm over solebar angle and a smidgen less over solebar face (narrower footboards compensate). Not a lot in measurement terms but sufficient to make solebars appear not sufficiently under the body. RTR companies have to make allowances for curves that are perhaps not encountered by those who want detailed RTR models, plus there is the inherent thickness of plastic to contend with. Slimmer solebars in the vicinity where wheels need clearance is a workaround, nevertheless, I personally think Bachmann has gone slightly overboard to the detriment of appearance. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 I am wondering if the Bachmann 'porthole' coaches in crimson and cream are getting near to saturation as far as sales are concerned. The TK is shown as sold out in Bachmann list but the BFK, FK and FO seem plentiful. The BTK is promised soon. Most of these coaches are all the same price at dealers (-15 percent of list) but there a few bargains now and then. Watching sales on various web sites they do not seem to be snapped up even if the price is down to minus 30 percent off list. Some buyers may be put off by comments about the bogies but not every buyer is an RMWebber. In real life these first class coaches were built in very small numbers which limits their inclusion in model railway formations especially where five coaches is a long train on many layouts. There were twenty-seven BFK in four batches of which only fifteen were D2168 porthole coaches. In total there were eighty-two corridor firsts plus one prototype, and three conversions for Coronation sets. Of these only fifteen were porthole variety to D2162. Presumably as there were fifteen of each of these two porthole types (BFK + FK) they ran together. There were two batches of FO totalling seventy-one vehicles of which twenty were porthole stock to F2160. Has anyone got any realistic sales information about these Bachmann that they can disclose here? Of the other porthole types, there were 100 TK, 240 CK and 439 BTK. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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