Class 800 - Updates

[The Stationmaster]

On 20/05/2019 at 14:55, adb968008 said:

Anyone know which LNER IET (and why) it was at North Pole depot on saturday amongst the GWR ones ?

It was still there yesterday morning but I didn't notice it when passing in the evening.

 

Mrs Stationmaster was quite impressed by the interior in her first seated journey on an IET () set yesterday evening - thought it nice and bright and pleasant and thought the seat was firm but not uncomfortable (the previous time she travelled on one we were standing in a vestibule so she didn't see much of the coach interior!).

 

The ride was also interesting in that it was pretty good but what actually impressed me was when we were crossed to the Down Relief at Ruscombe due to a broken rail at Twyford West (Land's End) and the ride through the 70mph running junction was remarkably good, certainly better than an HST with some mileage on the bogies and way better than a 16X unit.  So they do have their good. points.  Oh and the reservation system was working, and the set was the right way round.

[Mallard60022]

 

800111 in that telephoto looks a teeny bit like and 'Alien' head...…..through squinty eyes and in the gloom. Just expect the coupling thing to come whizzing out from the yellow panel.

Be afraid, be very afraid.

A. Ripley.

[4630]

After a short period of overnight testing of TPE's new 802/2s, it would seem as though that, after a few false starts over the past week, daytime testing is now underway.

 

On 22nd May, destined for TPE but not yet vinyled up, 802202 worked along the Huddersfield line with 5Q54, 07.57 Heaton T&RSMD to Manchester Airport and 5Q55 return.

 

Here is 5Q54 at Colne Bridge...

 

 

...new passes 'old' as 185145 passes with 1E31, 09.56 Liverpool Lime Street to Scarborough...

 

...and exiting the west portal of the Standedge Tunnel at Diggle.

 

 

 

802202 returned with 5Q55, 13.22 Manchester Airport to Heaton T&RSMD.

 

Here it is at Heaton Lodge Junction.

 

 

A short video of 5Q54 and 5Q55 is here.

Edited May 22, 2019 by 4630

[Mallard60022]

On ‎22‎/‎05‎/‎2019 at 18:50, 4630 said:

After a short period of overnight testing of TPE's new 802/2s, it would seem as though that, after a few false starts over the past week, daytime testing is now underway.

 

On 22nd May, destined for TPE but not yet vinyled up, 802202 worked along the Huddersfield line with 5Q54, 07.57 Heaton T&RSMD to Manchester Airport and 5Q55 return.

 

Here is 5Q54 at Colne Bridge...

 

 

...new passes 'old' as 185145 passes with 1E31, 09.56 Liverpool Lime Street to Scarborough...

 

...and exiting the west portal of the Standedge Tunnel at Diggle.

 

 

 

802202 returned with 5Q55, 13.22 Manchester Airport to Heaton T&RSMD.

 

Here it is at Heaton Lodge Junction.

 

 

A short video of 5Q54 and 5Q55 is here.

TPE using those then but on the York, Leeds, Sheffield route?

Also, could anyone in the know let me know when further LNER services, other than the Leeds, are to be introduced please?

Lovely pics by the way. Looks slightly odd with that space ship style item running through what is an almost ageless area.

Phil

Edited May 24, 2019 by Mallard60022

[4630]

I understand that none of the 802/2s have yet been handed over to TransPennine Express.  The test/mileage accumulation runs are in the hands of GBRf drivers.

 

I can't help with your LNER query, sorry, but I too would be interested in the answer.   

[Richard E]

A bit of 800 action at Peterborough today;

 

 

801108 and 801109 about to depart for Shaftholme Junction.

 

 

And 800110 also seen. It was arriving from Retford.

 

[iands]

47 minutes ago, Richard E said:

A bit of 800 action at Peterborough today;

 

 

801108 and 801109 about to depart for Shaftholme Junction.

 

 

And 800110 also seen. It was arriving from Retford.

 

Nice photos Richard. Re your first photo. Shaftholme Junction seems a bit of an odd destination. Do you know if the working actually 'terminates and reverses' at Shaftholme, or is this just the nominated location for "traction changeover" (e.g. from electric to diesel) before continuing north to York? 

[Richard E]

28 minutes ago, iands said:

Nice photos Richard. Re your first photo. Shaftholme Junction seems a bit of an odd destination. Do you know if the working actually 'terminates and reverses' at Shaftholme, or is this just the nominated location for "traction changeover" (e.g. from electric to diesel) before continuing north to York? 

Thank you - not bad for a little pocket camera. Lots of spotters and picture takers around at lunchtime.

 

Shaftholme appears to be the termination point, they stop briefly at Doncaster and I think they change over to diesel there. I suspect they leave the ECML at the junction before making a reversal back into Doncaster. I guess it avoids blocking a platform there whilst doing the reversal as there are only 4 through platforms and I believe the bay platforms aren't big enough for an 800. It definitely doesn't continue to York according to Realtimetrains (nor in my experience when I was travelling daily to York). Reversals at Peterborough are easier with 7 through platforms available and more slack in the timetable although, at one point, all 7 were occupied. One of those was an up freight that left to go via March. The rest were passenger stock and the freight avoiding line was occupied by a down freight.

 

As an aside the 801's had a Hitachi technician riding in the cab so I assume they are acceptance runs. The driver was taking photos of the 801's himself on his iPad when he changed ends!

 

Finally, unlike the GWR sets (or so it seems) all three sets had First Class at the London end. The 801's were showing coach letters and a destination (A through M and Aberdeen) whilst the 800 was just showing Not in Service on the destination screens. Both the 800 and the 801's have a yellow surround to the top marker light at the First Class end only. The yellow 'dot' just below the cantrail orange line is the OHLE warning label. All three were remarkably clean with very little or no dirt apparent on the running gear.

 

Both runs have been going on for about two years now.

Edited May 24, 2019 by Richard E

[Mallard60022]

55 minutes ago, Richard E said:

Thank you - not bad for a little pocket camera. Lots of spotters and picture takers around at lunchtime.

 

Shaftholme appears to be the termination point, they stop briefly at Doncaster and I think they change over to diesel there. I suspect they leave the ECML at the junction before making a reversal back into Doncaster. I guess it avoids blocking a platform there whilst doing the reversal as there are only 4 through platforms and I believe the bay platforms aren't big enough for an 800. It definitely doesn't continue to York according to Realtimetrains (nor in my experience when I was travelling daily to York). Reversals at Peterborough are easier with 7 through platforms available and more slack in the timetable although, at one point, all 7 were occupied. One of those was an up freight that left to go via March. The rest were passenger stock and the freight avoiding line was occupied by a down freight.

 

As an aside the 801's had a Hitachi technician riding in the cab so I assume they are acceptance runs. The driver was taking photos of the 801's himself on his iPad when he changed ends!

 

Finally, unlike the GWR sets (or so it seems) all three sets had First Class at the London end. The 801's were showing coach letters and a destination (A through M and Aberdeen) whilst the 800 was just showing Not in Service on the destination screens. Both the 800 and the 801's have a yellow surround to the top marker light at the First Class end only. The yellow 'dot' just below the cantrail orange line is the OHLE warning label. All three were remarkably clean with very little or no dirt apparent on the running gear.

 

Both runs have been going on for about two years now.

Platforms 6 & 7 at Donny (North bay for Leeds stoppers workings) could take a 5 car I think. The others, 2 and 5 at the south end, too short I am sure.

I concur that many 800 trains still NIS, are showing timetabled exterior signs and a few weeks back that caused confusion at Retford, with a Unit waiting in Platform 1 (at Retford). It was showing something like the 10.40 to London Kings Cross and that was actually the next booked in service arrival due into P1. The Station Staff were not out on the platform at that point (about 10.36) and so muggins was advising a number of people attempting to board that the train was a test train and not their service, including one chap that attempted to press the door entry button for what he thought was his coach, as the thing flew away south at a rate of knots!!!!!! Normally the Staff are far more on the ball....maybe there was a problem elsewhere?

Phil

Edited May 24, 2019 by Mallard60022

[iands]

44 minutes ago, Richard E said:

Thank you - not bad for a little pocket camera. Lots of spotters and picture takers around at lunchtime.

 

Shaftholme appears to be the termination point, they stop briefly at Doncaster and I think they change over to diesel there. I suspect they leave the ECML at the junction before making a reversal back into Doncaster. I guess it avoids blocking a platform there whilst doing the reversal as there are only 4 through platforms and I believe the bay platforms aren't big enough for an 800. It definitely doesn't continue to York according to Realtimetrains (nor in my experience when I was travelling daily to York). Reversals at Peterborough are easier with 7 through platforms available and more slack in the timetable although, at one point, all 7 were occupied. One of those was an up freight that left to go via March. The rest were passenger stock and the freight avoiding line was occupied by a down freight.

 

As an aside the 801's had a Hitachi technician riding in the cab so I assume they are acceptance runs. The driver was taking photos of the 801's himself on his iPad when he changed ends!

 

Finally, unlike the GWR sets (or so it seems) all three sets had First Class at the London end. The 801's were showing coach letters and a destination (A through M and Aberdeen) whilst the 800 was just showing Not in Service on the destination screens. Both the 800 and the 801's have a yellow surround to the top marker light at the First Class end only. The yellow 'dot' just below the cantrail orange line is the OHLE warning label. All three were remarkably clean with very little or no dirt apparent on the running gear.

 

Both runs have been going on for about two years now.

Thanks for your detailed reply Richard. Thinking about it, the Askern branch at Shaftholme is the only logical location to reverse the set without clogging up the station and keeping other running lines clear.

[70b]

3 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

TPE using those then but on the York, Leeds, Sheffield route?

Also, could anyone in the know let me know when further LNER services, other than the Leeds, are to be introduced please?

Lovely pics by the way. Looks slightly odd with that space ship style item running through what is an almost ageless area.

Phil

Hi Phil, I noticed an advert on Platform 1 the other day saying 'arriving 27th' which is bank holiday Monday, that suggested to me that one of next weeks diagrams that actually stops at 36E may be converted to 80x from Monday, though I may have extrapolated from too little information. I.

[Mallard60022]

3 minutes ago, 70b said:

Hi Phil, I noticed an advert on Platform 1 the other day saying 'arriving 27th' which is bank holiday Monday, that suggested to me that one of next weeks diagrams that actually stops at 36E may be converted to 80x from Monday, though I may have extrapolated from too little information. I.

Oh ta. I shall go and ask the 'lads'. Not sure they CBA to look but they may need to be aware for the 'customers' who get confused as the train looks different etc!!!!!

Phil

[4630]

4 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

TPE using those then but on the York, Leeds, Sheffield route?

 

Phil

 

 

I think you may have edited your original post Phil, so I can now add a bit more detail to this.

 

TPE will be using their class 802/2s on services on the 'North Trans Pennine' route (as TPE calls it) between Liverpool, Manchester, Newcastle and Edinburgh.  In 'TPE speak' these are called Nova 1 sets.

 

See here for a bit more - Nova 1

 

For the sake of completeness;

 

Nova 2 are all electric sets built by CAF and will operate between Manchester Airport and Liverpool to Glasgow and Edinburgh via Preston.  These will replace the Siemens Desiro class 350/4 which are currently used.  A bit more detail here - Nova 2

 

Nova 3 are the CAF built Mark 5 sets that will operate with class 68s on services between Liverpool, Manchester, Scarborough and Middlesborough.  A bit more detail here - Nova 3

 

As far as TPE services via Sheffield are concerned, the 'South Trans Pennine' route as TPE calls it, these will continue to be operated by the current class 185.  I believe the plan though is to operate services with 2 units rather than a single unit which operate the majority of services currently.

 

HTH

[4630]

1 hour ago, Mallard60022 said:

Platforms 6 & 7 at Donny (North bay for Leeds stoppers workings) could take a 5 car I think. ?

Phil

 

Just had a quick look at the Sectional Appendix - they won't fit.

 

Doncaster P6 is 109m and P7 is 105m.

 

Carriage length for 802/2 (per Wikipedia, so not guaranteed) is 26m per carriage. 

[St. Simon]

1 hour ago, 4630 said:

Carriage length for 802/2 (per Wikipedia, so not guaranteed) is 26m per carriage. 

 

Yep, 26m long coaches for all the Class 80x, so a 5-Car is 130m long, 9-Car is 234m and a 10-Car is 260m.

 

Simon

[Ken.W]

10 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

 

Also, could anyone in the know let me know when further LNER services, other than the Leeds, are to be introduced please?

Phil

 

Current rumour has it as August for operation to Newcastle. Any definite info however is rather scarce

 

7 hours ago, Richard E said:

 

Shaftholme appears to be the termination point, they stop briefly at Doncaster and I think they change over to diesel there.

 

As an aside the 801's had a Hitachi technician riding in the cab so I assume they are acceptance runs. The driver was taking photos of the 801's himself on his iPad when he changed ends!

 

Finally, unlike the GWR sets (or so it seems) all three sets had First Class at the London end. The 801's were showing coach letters and a destination (A through M and Aberdeen) whilst the 800 was just showing Not in Service on the destination screens. Both the 800 and the 801's have a yellow surround to the top marker light at the First Class end only.

 

As I posted a few weeks ago, the traction changover point is now Darlington, and I've been doing so on training runs this week.

 

The 801s certainly won't be changing over, they're the 'all electric' sets (801 = 1 engine). I believe they are acceptance runs, being done by GBRf, as this is the first time I've actually noticed 801s running.

 

Yes, most LNER sets that I've noticed seem to have been the correct way round. It's also easy to identify the First class end by the end three blanked windows in the space occupied by the kitchen. The 801s showing Aberdeen as the destination? Hmm that would be erm, rather challenging, it's challenging enough up there for the 800s!

 

[Oldddudders]

Meanwhile, back on Planet GWR, that 802114 that I detected dead at Totnes the other week is now haunting me. As I was seeing-off family at Newton Abbot on Thursday, it ran in on a down service, and this morning is on the 06.57 Plymouth - Padlington, as am I, en route Railex. 

[Richard E]

11 hours ago, Ken.W said:

The 801s certainly won't be changing over, they're the 'all electric' sets (801 = 1 engine). I believe they are acceptance runs, being done by GBRf, as this is the first time I've actually noticed 801s running.

 

Can you clarify how the reversals are being done at Shaftholme in that case?

[4630]

In addition to the photos that I've recently posted of 802202 in this topic, taken on 22nd May along the Huddersfield line, I've added some further photos of 802202 on test taken subsequently on 23rd and 24th May.

 

For those interested these can be found in this gallery on my website;

 

May 2019 Gallery

[Mallard60022]

5 hours ago, Richard E said:

Can you clarify how the reversals are being done at Shaftholme in that case?

I've forgotten how the 'new chord' works from the down main but I suspect it just 'turns left' onto the branch, crosses over to the up on the branch and then runs back onto the up main? However  my Track Atlas is out of date so I am surmising and CBA to go and look as it is about an hour away by road.

P

 

[Richard E]

39 minutes ago, Mallard60022 said:

I've forgotten how the 'new chord' works from the down main but I suspect it just 'turns left' onto the branch, crosses over to the up on the branch and then runs back onto the up main? However  my Track Atlas is out of date so I am surmising and CBA to go and look as it is about an hour away by road.

P

 

But there is no OHLE on the branch iirc so it must be done on the 'go the last mile' diesel if that is possible.

[Mallard60022]

Just now, Richard E said:

But there is no OHLE on the branch iirc so it must be done on the 'go the last mile' diesel if that is possible.

Ah I see. I might be up in Donny tomorrow afternoon and I'll ask my lad to drive me out there to take a look. Alternatively I could ask my mate who is a signaller at Donny Panel. I'm sure he could tell me or find out.

P

[royaloak]

4 minutes ago, Richard E said:

But there is no OHLE on the branch iirc so it must be done on the 'go the last mile' diesel if that is possible.

It is possible, although they are slow, really slow on the one engine they will keep going.

[Richard E]

I guess it must be up to the junction, drop the pan, coast into the branch and then exit on the diesel until they can pick up the OHLE again. Looking on Google Earth there isn't any OHLE on the branch. Just seems strange that they would choose Shaftholme Junction for reversal when the yards at Doncaster are wired although they are used for diversionary routes at times (I've been that way in a 225).

[4630]

21 minutes ago, Richard E said:

But there is no OHLE on the branch iirc so it must be done on the 'go the last mile' diesel if that is possible.

 

19 minutes ago, Mallard60022 said:

Ah I see. I might be up in Donny tomorrow afternoon and I'll ask my lad to drive me out there to take a look. Alternatively I could ask my mate who is a signaller at Donny Panel. I'm sure he could tell me or find out.

P

 

The IEP that reverses at Shaftholme Junction (5Q63 and 5Q64) seems to be a bit of fixture in the schedule at the moment, although it runs as a 'short term plan'.  It appears to be in the schedule for next week, so if I get a chance I'll take a drive out and see if I can photograph what happens.