MikeOxon Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 I have 4 Triang brake 3rds to hack up, torn between doing a 4 wheel like your V5, or a big bogie full brake like the one at Didcot. Decisions decisions! An up date picture is needed when i get a chance, ebay has been kind to me during the house move and my supply of Triang clerestories has grown a lot. Ones that arrived 'lined' will be left as is, but the rest have a date with a saw blade. Some 6-wheeler ideas in this thread : http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/52620-6-wheel-coaches/?p=1203452 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan's Goldfish Posted November 3, 2015 Author Share Posted November 3, 2015 Some 6-wheeler ideas in this thread : http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/52620-6-wheel-coaches/?p=1203452 Interesting to see that 5 Triang compartment 3rd sections line up nicely with the chassis but the Ratio comparments don't. Wonder if the same applies for 4 Triang 1st/2nd compartments...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan's Goldfish Posted November 3, 2015 Author Share Posted November 3, 2015 Which (if any) rtr siphons may be close to a 1900 build? The Penrhos site is a goldmine for the short coaches but i still have gaps in my bogie and 'brown stock' wish lists. The one thing that does seem clear; build anything and there's probably a close prototype for it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted November 4, 2015 Share Posted November 4, 2015 1900 build SIPHONS were all six wheel*, non of which are available R-T-R, but the K's kit still turns up from time to time. The SIPHON F was the first bogie vehicle (again a K's kit). The outside framed SIPHON G from 1913 is the first available R-T-R, though it should have 'American' bogies. * There was an earlier 4 wheel SIPHON, but it involves a scratch build or possibly a kit modification. Early 'brown' vehicles are very poorly covered R-T-R. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan's Goldfish Posted November 4, 2015 Author Share Posted November 4, 2015 1900 build SIPHONS were all six wheel*, non of which are available R-T-R, but the K's kit still turns up from time to time. The SIPHON F was the first bogie vehicle (again a K's kit). The outside framed SIPHON G from 1913 is the first available R-T-R, though it should have 'American' bogies. * There was an earlier 4 wheel SIPHON, but it involves a scratch build or possibly a kit modification. Early 'brown' vehicles are very poorly covered R-T-R. That explains that then. I did stumble over a kit (scale scenes?) for a Siphon C to fit on a Ratio chassis with a bit of modification, The triang clerestories are fake enough that 1 of those on the Palethorpes chassis wouldn't be the biggest offence in the collection. I need to do a little more track planning as well, As this is likely to be my only code 100 layout and it needs to cater for turn of the century GWR as well as 85-99 BR to Privatisation stock, the balloon loop alone isn't going to cut it, it needs some continuous run. The station throat plan will likely remain the same but be on an upper level with a 2 track mainline looping around on a lower level, the 2 lines leaving the terminus will join onto the continuous run at opposite sides so the balloon function is still there. Hopefully that will allow some storage loops on the lower level too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted November 4, 2015 Share Posted November 4, 2015 (edited) Four 4-wheelers, there's always the Siphon C to consider, building commenced in 1906 I think. Photo below shows an easy conversion from a K's Siphon F [if you can source one cheaply enough to sacrifice it]. The chassis is an adapted and lengthened Ratio coach underframe. This model is almost finished and, dimensionally, is remarkably un-compromised. The lettering was an issue however and I have been unable to source exactly the correct size all around. More likely however, the K's moulding is too heavy in places to allow Pressfix to fit, hence 'Tare' remains incomplete and 'GW' is not quite the correct pattern. I can more than live with this... The roof was difficult also. It comes from the donor model but has been cut to fit. However, K's roofs often didn't fit well at the ends, in spite of fettling. Consequently, a certain amount of filler was required to close up the gaps. This isn't really noticeable post-painting. If a K's bogie 'F' cannot be sourced, I think Shire Scenes may [or did] do a brass overlay for a Ratio coach. Edited November 4, 2015 by Prometheus 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeOxon Posted November 4, 2015 Share Posted November 4, 2015 The 'Shire Scenes' Siphon C body is still listed, though 'temporarily out if stock' - see http://www.dartcastings.co.uk/shire/S104.php I've not built this kit but have done the V5 PBV,, described at http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/1405/entry-13204-v5-full-brake/ Mike 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted November 4, 2015 Share Posted November 4, 2015 ..........and very nicely it came out, too. V5's can be approximated from chopped up Triang Clerestories also. The panelling isn't as fine as the Shire Scenes etching, but they can be quite convincing nevertheless. Tony 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan's Goldfish Posted November 4, 2015 Author Share Posted November 4, 2015 As ever guys you bring me the best gwr pron! Just discovered the rather horrific Hornby 2900 class. This looks like a perfect candidate for another 'not quite right' engine for 'not quite right' carriages. But has anyone tried a 4-4-2 conversion on one? I'm aware to take 1 back as far as 1905 will require some frame straightening too... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted November 4, 2015 Share Posted November 4, 2015 Four 4-wheelers, there's always the Siphon C to consider, building commenced in 1906 I think. Photo below shows an easy conversion from a K's Siphon F [if you can source one cheaply enough to sacrifice it]. The chassis is an adapted and lengthened Ratio coach underframe. This model is almost finished and, dimensionally, is remarkably un-compromised. The lettering was an issue however and I have been unable to source exactly the correct size all around. More likely however, the K's moulding is too heavy in places to allow Pressfix to fit, hence 'Tare' remains incomplete and 'GW' is not quite the correct pattern. I can more than live with this... The roof was difficult also. It comes from the donor model but has been cut to fit. However, K's roofs often didn't fit well at the ends, in spite of fettling. Consequently, a certain amount of filler was required to close up the gaps. This isn't really noticeable post-painting. If a K's bogie 'F' cannot be sourced, I think Shire Scenes may [or did] do a brass overlay for a Ratio coach. I think the Pressfix is a bit oversize, but managed to fit it by squeezing the letters closer together on mine (must refit the underframe which has come unstuck). Mine is chocolate, but I wonder if it should be crimson for the mid twenties. I would agree about the roofs. They are far too thick and need thinning down considerably. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richbrummitt Posted November 4, 2015 Share Posted November 4, 2015 There was a bloke on here called knobhead that did a 4-4-2 conversion, iirc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted November 4, 2015 Share Posted November 4, 2015 I think the Pressfix is a bit oversize, but managed to fit it by squeezing the letters closer together on mine (must refit the underframe which has come unstuck). Mine is chocolate, but I wonder if it should be crimson for the mid twenties. I would agree about the roofs. They are far too thick and need thinning down considerably. This is chocolate, it's the exposure that's the problem [if that's what you meant] ! It's has its first coat of varnish since the photo was taken and that has quietened the finish down considerably. The roofs are a pain - one of the reasons that I am putting of rebuilding a K's Siphon F. Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagonman Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 Four 4-wheelers, there's always the Siphon C to consider, building commenced in 1906 I think. Photo below shows an easy conversion from a K's Siphon F [if you can source one cheaply enough to sacrifice it]. The chassis is an adapted and lengthened Ratio coach underframe. This model is almost finished and, dimensionally, is remarkably un-compromised. The lettering was an issue however and I have been unable to source exactly the correct size all around. More likely however, the K's moulding is too heavy in places to allow Pressfix to fit, hence 'Tare' remains incomplete and 'GW' is not quite the correct pattern. I can more than live with this... The roof was difficult also. It comes from the donor model but has been cut to fit. However, K's roofs often didn't fit well at the ends, in spite of fettling. Consequently, a certain amount of filler was required to close up the gaps. This isn't really noticeable post-painting. If a K's bogie 'F' cannot be sourced, I think Shire Scenes may [or did] do a brass overlay for a Ratio coach. To be pedantic these vehicles were dual vacuum/westinghouse fitted and came in two widths: 8ft and 8ft 6in... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 (edited) This is chocolate, it's the exposure that's the problem [if that's what you meant] ! It's has its first coat of varnish since the photo was taken and that has quietened the finish down considerably. The roofs are a pain - one of the reasons that I am putting of rebuilding a K's Siphon F. Tony I saw that yours is chocolate. I was just wondering whether mine should be or not (it'll probably stay that way!). Built in 1906/7*, they would have been due their first repaint in the 1912-22 crimson era. I suppose it is not inconceivable for a milk van to wait 15 years for its first repaint and then remain chocolate. It would not be the highest priority in any case and WW1 would have delayed matters. There is of course the debate as to whether SIPHONS were repainted crimson. (Possibly using left over stocks of brown paint? - I can't see they all avoided repaints.) For the roofs, I scrape away a channel of plastic from inside each end, so that it fits neatly (or as neatly as I can manage) on the end and then file along the sides if necessary so that it fits properly. Further discussion on roofs here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/103227-upgrading-a-k-kits-gwr-6-wheeler-diagramme-u27/page-4 *There were two widths of SIPHON C - these are the same as the donor SIPHON F obviously (8 feet - lots 1125 (1525-1542) and (part of) 1133 (1515-1518) - 1907 and 1906 according to Russell - I would have thought that lot 1125 would be before 1133, but the date could be completion of the lot rather than issue date?). (Slinn and Clarke give 1907 for Lot 1133, which would seem logical) Edited November 5, 2015 by Il Grifone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeOxon Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 There was a bloke on here called knobhead that did a 4-4-2 conversion, iirc. Indeed he did - lots of useful tips in the thread at http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/67914-castle-to-north-star-4-4-2/ Or just jump to the inspirational photos at http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/67914-castle-to-north-star-4-4-2/page-4&do=findComment&comment=1453001 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan's Goldfish Posted November 5, 2015 Author Share Posted November 5, 2015 That Knobhead is full of very inspirational stuff! 2-2-2 Dean Single looks superb too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeOxon Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 That Knobhead is full of very inspirational stuff! 2-2-2 Dean Single looks superb too. Yes, well worth looking at the photos at http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/60625-triang-lord-of-the-isles/?p=803494 Just the thing to take charge of a train of clerestories! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan's Goldfish Posted November 7, 2015 Author Share Posted November 7, 2015 The 'ready' secret collection... And the project pile!.... Did the GWR have a little 0-4-0 saddle tank like that at all?! offered the 6 wheel chassis up to the clerestory bodies, as previously discussed 5 third compartments line up nicely on the chassis, and it looks like 4x 1st/2nd compartments leave enough length left over for a central pair of luggage doors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 Did the GWR have a little 0-4-0 saddle tank like that at all?! No, but it didn't stop me converting one to broad gauge! I really must finish it one of these days!!! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan's Goldfish Posted November 7, 2015 Author Share Posted November 7, 2015 Well I suppose fictitious carriages are happening and that would be an easy fictitious station pilot locomotive to repaint. I've been tinkering with the track plan, i'm much preferring the full round rather than just balloon loop, the plan has been mirrored so that the Minories part is now the correct orientation. This also allows the single slip onto the through line at the front to be 'trailing'. The track would be on 3 levels with 40mm between each level so where the return curve is under the station there's 80mm of head room. I've drawn it as 2ft scenic width, 1ft hidden, but it would be possible and probably more sensible to do it as 1ft6in scenic and hidden. Plenty of space for more hidden tracks. This way also leaves enough length at the 'TMD' for a couple of carriage sidings too and goods can just be running round the bottom so goods facilities don't need to be squeezed into the terminus. The station and scenery will still be using basic train set parts, i have a couple of the Hornby 'subway' platform parts which can be used for a pretend access to platforms 5 and 6 on the through lines. The below plan isn't really 'to scale', i'm not sure how long i want the trains to be yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 I think you might want to think about your gradients. If I'm reading if right you have about three feet to get down 40mm which is 40 in ~ 900 or 1 in 22.5. Your fictional saddle tank will be fine going downhill... Best Simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan's Goldfish Posted November 8, 2015 Author Share Posted November 8, 2015 I think you might want to think about your gradients. If I'm reading if right you have about three feet to get down 40mm which is 40 in ~ 900 or 1 in 22.5. Your fictional saddle tank will be fine going downhill... Best Simon it's a 'not to scale' (despite the scales!) work in progress Gradients aren't the only issue there but it's giving me a starting point. Train length/weight will dictate gradient after some experiments. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devo63 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 As ever guys you bring me the best gwr pron! Just discovered the rather horrific Hornby 2900 class. This looks like a perfect candidate for another 'not quite right' engine for 'not quite right' carriages. But has anyone tried a 4-4-2 conversion on one? I'm aware to take 1 back as far as 1905 will require some frame straightening too... I'm in the process of doing just such a conversion. I had a pile of 2900 class bodies in the spares box and decided to convert some to the straight frame versions. The 4-4-2 version is going to be loco powered using an old spare Triang Hall chassis with suitable re-wheeling. I have chickened out on modifying the boiler to a half cone version and will stick with the full cone with a shortened smokebox. This narrows the choice of prototypes down to a couple of locos. I'm not trying for a showcase model but something that looks the part. The biggest stumbling block at present is the side frames for the trailing wheels. I've made three different versions but they either looked wrong or failed to work. Any suggestions an suitable parts would be appreciated. If I can bring myself to stop spending my pension on model railway items and buy a new camera I may be eventually able to post some pictures. Dave 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 (edited) Buy that camera Dave - I'd really like to see how this progresses. Tony Edited November 9, 2015 by Prometheus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Any suggestions an suitable parts would be appreciated. If I can bring myself to stop spending my pension on model railway items and buy a new camera I may be eventually able to post some pictures. Dave You will have to modify the angles of the spring hangers but the casting from a K's 14xx/48XX is a good starting point. I have seen one used to modify a Will's Saint to an atlantic. MIke Wiltshire Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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