03060

Having posted yesterday I've now had a closer look into the wagon types used (there are some old threads on here) and need to correct myself, it's PABs that I was thinking of in the 1980's trains and not Covhops which seem to be more 60's and 70's. I also hadn't particularly picked up that the ex-grain wagons were in fact grey and not still blue ! I can appreciate the need to re-invigorate yourself but please keep the WHL4 pictures flowing as it's great to see how you transform bare baseboards into something that I personally recognise as the West Highlands. Regards, Ian.

Well, no major breakthroughs having looked through my DMU books in the loft, found a nice picture of a refurbished 3-car 101 unit at Oban in 1975 though with it's new coat of nearly all over white looking very smart. The best info that I've come up with is from the Rail-scot site which has 3 of the 8 Scottish based 122/131 units allocated to Eastfield in 1975, these being Sc55002, Sc55005 and Sc55007 so there's a good chance that it might be one of these. The 'Sandite' unit wasn't converted until 1983 for use with the sleeper service and was class 131 Sc55015, renumbered TDB977177 and named 'Sandra' in blue / grey livery and managed to survive until 1988. Two other 'potential' West Highland bubble cars were both class 121s used as Video Survey Units between 2001 and 2004 (in fact thinking about it I may have an article somewhere of one of these on the WHL.) Not sure whether single car Iris made it onto the WHL but I've found a picture of it at Kyle of Lochalsh. I'm also aware that the class 101 and 150 video units both visited the line. Thanks for the comments so far. Regards, Ian.

Great picture Alasdair, that's possibly the unit that I was thinking of although I think that it was a different location, possibly even on a DVD ....good enough excuse to watch through my collection again !

Thanks for the help with the links RFS, I didn't get chance to try them before having to go out, apologies to Russ P. Just going into the loft to see if I can find anything else out. Route learning was my other thought, also, although I like Coronach's suggestion. Regards, Ian.

https://rcts.zenfolio.com/buildings-and-infrastructure/stations-and-station-buildings-lner/ea0fab2fe https://rcts.zenfolio.com/buildinds-and-infrastructure/stations-and-station-buildings-lner/ea0faae4d I came across these two photos from 1974 the other day whilst looking for pictures of the original Fort William station which clearly show a single unit DMU waiting in the long siding / platform. So far I haven't come up with much information as to what it was doing there or where it might be going. It's got to be a class 122 or possibly 131 although the window pattern doesn't seem to match a quick reference check against a picture of the Dapol N Gauge model but this may just be down to the angle of viewing. One possibility, that I have read, is that they were converted and used as a 'Sandite' working proceeding the sleeper train, although I got the impression that this was late 1970's. I've more books to look at in the loft for possible info but would be grateful if anybody can shed any light as to what it was doing there. From my point of view this has now become a 'must have' model as with the exception of the 'Mexican Bean' class 104 and the six-loch cruise trains there don't seem to have been that many DMUs working there way up the West Highland, although I have a vague recollection of seeing a photo of a 1970's class 101/111 somewhere before. Regards, Ian. PS - hope that the links work as I couldn't work out how to copy and paste on my tablet !

I'd be interested to know which grey you find as a match, please, I have a rake of Peco N Gauge grain wagons that I intend to use for the same purpose although I need to look further into the subject. I know from photos that Covhops were also still being used during the 1980's, just to mix it up a little but I'm not 100% certain of the previous design of hopper but think that it was an LNER design for a 1970's train. Love the thread, by the way, you're really capturing the feel of the place. I'm afraid that I didn't 'discover' the West Highlands until around 1986 ....but I've been back virtually every year at least once since ! Need to go through and scan my slides. I have all the stock ready for a layout but really can't decide on which area to model ....I'm afraid that I want it ALL ...but haven't got the space to include all of the different varieties of scenery and styles, etc, found between say Loch Long and Mallaig, probably better to just do something rather than nothing. Your layout is a great source of inspiration though, thanks. Regards, Ian.

Tom Noble's 'The West Highland Extension' has a photo of a blue 25 on Glenfinnan viaduct heading for Mallaig, unfortunately the number is not stated and the front 3/4 view prevents identification. The date is stated as 5th Aug 1978 on a SRPS railtour named Lothian Coast Express. Regards, Ian.

Only just found this thread Matt, as a massive WHL fan with a cupboard full of N-gauge stock just waiting for a layout on which to run I will look forward to watching with interest. Now that you've made the first cut good luck with the rest. Regards, Ian.

Thanks Tim, I've just got an iphone (2nd hand from the wife) ....I'll consult my technical assisstant (daughter) and see what we can come up with! It's about time that I started photographing things to post. Whilst I build mainly in 3mm I find the work that you 2mm chaps do quite inspiring and it never fails to impress me, I follow more 2mm threads than anything else. Looking forward to seeing the rest of Valour's build. Many thanks, Ian.

Tim, The photos are very good, with what do you take them please? Sorry if this has already been explained earlier in the thread. Regards, Ian.

Hello Stephen, The latch on all of these type of couplings (B&B, DG, etc) is to prevent the loop from re-coupling to the hook having been lifted by the magnet. The theory being that you can have say one electrically activated magnet at the beginning of a fan of sidings and as you propel the train over the magnet you can effectively uncouple the required wagon(s) from the train and push them to a random drop off point in a siding. This saves you having to put magnets at all of your potential drop of points. It generally works very well if you have a smooth running loco but recoupling can occur through jerkiness. Hope this is what you were querying. Regards, Ian.

Excellent idea Bob, I've been thinking about doing this myself as I also follow similar 2mm and 7mm threads by some very good modellers but have always deemed my progress as being too slow as to keep people interested. Just exhibiting my S&DJR Masbury layout at the Leeds show this weekend but will try and post some things in future when I work out how to load up photos preferably via my phone. Anyway, looking forward to seeing others work and ideas. Regards, Ian.

Slight correction to the layout list mentioned above....the TT (3mm) layout is Masbury, not Midford. Whilst prototypical S&DJR and LMS stock will feature in the main we will be keeping a fairly relaxed mind on running rights ....so visitors from other regions and eras may appear at times ....if only to show what is available in this 'ideal' of scales !

I'd have to agree with Eaton wholeheartedly, I enjoyed the whole exhibition, Cheddar, Bridgewater and Hewisbridge all held my attention ....but then I came to Whithorn which really captured the nature of that part of Scotland for me from the low hills and just a glimpse of a Loch on the painted backscene to the undulations of the spongy, mossy terrain nearer to the front of the layout. Had a great, good long friendly chat with the chaps aswell who were all full of enthusiasm for the layout and let out some future Scottish ambitions that should hopefully appear on their next creation.....I can't wait. Thanks again to all for a great show which made the journey to the 'dark side' of the hills well worth it, again ....but now safely back in God's own county ....with a head full of ideas ! Cheers, Ian.

Well I for one enjoyed watching the layout Tim (even on my minimum sleep level.) Admittedly I probably understood the original's trackplan and operating methods a bit more than your average customer but I was very interested in how you've managed to adapt all this into an 'oval' type layout particularly with the different levels involved. I probably studied the fiddle yard as much as the front of the layout and it made me realise the distance travelled by a pilot loco from shed to station and back to shed again. Good information provided along the layout front. Afraid that you were rather busy concentrating on getting trains and people organised for me to make contact, it was coming up to lunchtime on day one when I was there but we have spoken several times before, mainly at the Leeds MRS show when I've been showing my 3mm Masbury layout. Anyway, I enjoyed the show very much and was particulary taken with the N gauge Sandy Bay layout aswell, glad that your layout tempted me out of bed on my long W/end for night working. Regards, Ian.

Having been looking for literally years and years I have finally managed to just get hold of the BBC Tales of Para Handy series with Gregor Fisher at my local HMV as it was closing down. I shall settle down to watch it now ....for research purposes ...before I send off for a Puffer kit. Thanks Ian for the blog on how you've built Lyra, very inspirational. Cheers. Ian.

A bit late to the thread but having seen the article in the RM (and kept it) and coming across you at Shipley on Sat can I just say how impressed I was with the layout, simply lovely and you've definately caught the feel of that section of the coastline, so much so that I came back for a second look before I left. One question, why did you keep the traverser quite short and not straddling the baseboard joint, was it just to keep it permanently fitted to just the one board or because it could have maybe fouled up with harbour backscene section ? I would have complimented you on the day ....but you were deep in conversation with the "secondman" ....didn't like to disturb. Kind regards, Ian.

Very much looking forward to seeing this at Wigan. Regards, Ian.

The PO Wagons of Somerset has a good 'official' side on view of a Hard Stone Firms Ltd, Bath 3 plank 10t wagon on p.185 but the reference is for Edward Free of Hallatrow. I loved the Corsham photo in the link that you provided as it also shows wagons from Kilmersdon Colliery and Camerton Collieries as well as the Midland wagons, etc. Might be a useful link if you could also post it in the S&DJR circa 1902 thread, please, Compound. Regards Ian.

Yes, this is the cover photo of Kelham's volume, nicely enlarged. It shows two of the lettering formats, the difference being Huish or Foxcote being applied on the second plank down on the left. Kilmersdon colliery's wagons were similarly lettered except for a large K replaced the W on the door. I'm finding the PO wagon subject rather absorbing at the moment having built some 5 plank kits recently thinking that they would be fairly common representatives on the line for quarries and collieries ....only to find that the quarries mainly used 4 planks ....and the collieries 4 and 6 planks ! I've spent rather a lot of time recently trying to find correct liveries for the type of wagons that I've built that did or could have travelled along the the S&DJR, Garners book helps point me in the right direction though as a starting point. Regards, Ian.

Austin p.18 fourth wagon back is a Writhlinton colliery wagon, probably a 4 plank going by the top plank lettering (5 planks in this livery have an unlettered top plank) as seen in Richard Kelham's PO Wagons of Somerset.

Thanks again Compound, the two lower photographs in the linked article appear in the "Portrait of the Pines" book. A later 1920's formation would suit my needs so with a bit of the dreaded 'modellers licence' I am looking at MR and Periods 1 & 2 LMS stock kits but whilst there are quite a few in the range of Worsley Works, not all mentioned in this thread are available; by the way I hope I'm not hijacking your OP circa 1902 theme or leading it too far away ....but I for one am finding all of the information coming out from across all of the years very interesting. Regards, Ian.

Very useful info for me personally Compound, as I was only yesterday trying to work out possible coach diagrams for a 1920's 'Pines Express' in 3mm scale based on a table on p.70 of Stephen Austin's other book 'Portrait of the Pines Express' which gives examples of typical train formations. He gives as a mid-week Pre-war example: BCK-TK (Brad-Bmth)-BCK-RCO-RT-CK-TK-BTK (Man-Bmth)-BCK-TK (Lpl-Bmth)-BCK (Lpl-Sou) On the previous page he mentions that the minimum would be a 7 coach train with one BCK being used for each of the portions from Bradford and Liverpool (the TK's being the strengtheners) and a 4 coach set from Manchester which could give a formation of possibly BCK (Brad-Bmth)-BCK-RCO-RT-CK (Man-Bmth)-BCK (?) .....Which almost fits your identifications ! As we have previously mentioned regarding photographers mid-week occupations ....a Saturday working is likely "when there were no through coaches from Liverpool, their place being taken by further accommodation for Manchester, often using vestibule composites or thirds, to make up the full load, so that such a train had fewer brakes in it." (Which might help identify the last coach as a third or something else.) Your information will help me to order some more appropriate kits from the Worsley Works lists although the 2 Bain clerestory kits I already have are for a CK and a TK, so may or may not be useful. Many thanks, Ian.

That's given me a dillema ...I'm on 12hr nights that W/end and had decided that I would have to miss the show this year....but now I know that this will be there it looks like I'll just have to have a 3 hour sleep (same as today ) and come the couple of miles down the road for a butchers. No pressure Tim ! Regards, Ian.

Hello Compound, Glad that you're not disappointed with your purchase. Very interested in your identification of the above coaches, even to my untrained eye (no pun intended) I could see the differences between the 1st coach and the other 3 coaches on p.58, although I suppose it depends how much you read into the caption. Any thoughts as to what livery the S&D coach is carrying, the photo having been taken in the 1930's ? The ex.LSWR coaches look to me to be in a dark olive green so I'm thinking that the S&D coach would be still in blue but with Southern branding, although I can't see anything other than the door Class numbers and what could be the 'new' coach number between the 2nd and 3rd compartments. There is also, I presume, a wrongly stated comment regarding the "ancient S&D coach" mentioned in the caption for the picture at the top of p.37, going by the date, roof rainstrips and coach length ? Regards, Ian.