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Results - Wishlist Poll 2014

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#1 BMacdermott

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 21:37

Results of The Wishlist Poll 2014

By Brian Macdermott (on behalf of The Poll Team)

 

Firstly, very many thanks to everyone who voted this year. From the many messages of support we received, it seems that you enjoyed the experience. We have listened to the comments for improvement and additions, and will do our best to include them for next time.

 

Whilst The Poll Team is solely responsible for the content of The Poll, it wouldn’t have been possible without the help of others. We would like to thank:

  • David Baverstock (Chairman NGS) for help with the N Poll;
  • Simon Bendall for help with post-steam items;
  • Jeff Sanders for help with the Standard Gauge Industrial category; and
  • ‘Fris’ Friswell for help with the Underground category.

 

News of The Poll was spread far and wide by numerous magazines, societies and web groups – there are far too many now to name individually, but thanks for what you all did. It was much appreciated.

 

Finally, there wouldn’t be a Poll with the continued help and support of MREmag editor Phil Parker and RMweb’s Andy York. Andy arranges the ‘computerised aspects’ for us and did a fine job this year, as we’re sure you will all agree. Our grateful thanks to them both!

 

OK….the results are as below. If you only want ‘the highlights’, you’ll find all you need in the ‘Most Wanted’ pdf. The other two give you full detail from two different viewpoints.

Attached Files


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#2 Thom

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 01:48

Thanx for the Poll and all the hard work involved. I learned a lot from the Poll itself. As for the results, with the SR Merchant Navy – Air-smoothed Casing 4-6-2 (35001-35030) being the second most requested loco, hopefully Hornby will finally figure out they need to produce it.


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#3 Gwiwer

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 02:22

Thank you one and all.  

 

Those who set  up an administered the polls and those who took time to respond.  

 

One thought for a future poll; can we include a section for pre-formed track panels?  Many options are available in the most popular scales / codes but there are still significant omissions.  For example there is no diamond crossing with one track curved making it impossible with ready-to-use track panels to accurately replicate a double-track turnout since the diverging route across the diamond must be straight.  For now.


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#4 Ozexpatriate

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 03:14

As for the results, with the SR Merchant Navy – Air-smoothed Casing 4-6-2 (35001-35030) being the second most requested loco, hopefully Hornby will finally figure out they need to produce it.

Or someone who already might have CAD data in N scale.
 
It's interesting to see trends in the data year by year. These are from the ranked list of steam locomotives.

BR Standard Class 2 2-6-0 (78000-78064)
2012 ... 5
2013 ... 1
2014 ... 1

SR Merchant Navy – Air-smoothed Casing 4-6-2 (35001-35030)
2012 ... 11
2013 ... 12
2014 ... 02

And my favourite:

GWR Steam Railmotor (preserved at GWS 2011)
2012 ... 22
2013 ... 13
2014 ... 03

By the nature of the poll (as higher ranked items are announced and introduced) it makes sense for items to increase in popularity. I have to say, that steam railmotor has hill-climbing potential. Talk about (chocolate and) cream rising to the top.

The highest scoring vote is increasing too. Hopefully that means more people are participating. (Perhaps there is more consensus? Or both?)

2012 ... 253 (14%) ... BR Mk2d/e/f Air-conditioned stock (including DBSO)
2013 ... 353 (19%) ... Level crossing – working – steam era gated (single/double track)
2014 ... 457 (23%) ... Level crossing – working – steam era gated (single/double track)
 
EDIT: (Thanks Brian)

Voters:
1812 ... 2012
1843 ... 2013
2014 ... 2409

So yes to both. More people and more consensus.


Edited by Ozexpatriate, 07 November 2014 - 19:12 .

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#5 Ozexpatriate

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 04:16

This I found really interesting. From the top 25 steam locomotives for each year the 'regional' mix changed pretty dramatically in 2014:
 
2012:

10 .. SR
05 .. LNER
05 .. BR
04 .. GWR
01 .. LMSR

2013:
10 .. SR
06 .. LNER
06 .. BR
03 .. GWR
00 .. LMSR

2014:
08 .. GWR
07 .. SR
05 .. BR
03 .. LNER
02 .. LMSR
 

Nice to see more Midland presence this year but they're still at the bottom. Are LMSR fans well served?

 

Did the GWR fans vote more this year, or does this reflect the high number of LNER locomotives that has been announced in the last year or two? Except for the Black Motor and the Brighton Atlantic, most of the SR items are still in the top 25.


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#6 Mikkel

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 05:46

Did the GWR fans vote more this year, or does this reflect the high number of LNER locomotives that has been announced in the last year or two? Except for the Black Motor and the Brighton Atlantic, most of the SR items are still in the top 25.

 

Could it also reflect that the poll now has a wider reach? Ie, bringing aboard other types of modellers who are biased in a different direction. Eg new and/or less "specialized" modellers. Although if that were the case, I suppose BR might also have moved towards the top?



#7 Phil Bullock

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 06:36

Many thanks to the poll team - and nice to see the Class 120 DMU coming to the top of the pile!

Phil
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#8 Legend

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 08:29

Yes indeed thanks to the team.

 

I'm disappointed again that no Scottish Loco has emerged to be a clear winner!   I'm wondering if I see an effect here, based on the way I voted. I note a Caley Jumbo scores 125, A J36 scores 124., a Glen 132 and even a Class 126 Ayrshire Swindon dmu  111, from which I gather there is a hard core of about 110 that voted for anything Scottish!


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#9 reevesthecat

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 08:55

Nice to see the class 87 fairly high on the list hopefully not long before we see it produced. Wonder what an 86 would have polled!
Mark
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#10 Oldddudders

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 09:26

As an SR person, I'm nevertheless delighted to see the GWR Railmotor scoring so high - a most uplifting piece of restoration, I think, that should ensure a model flies off the shelves.

 

The Merchant Navy is interesting. After all, this poll is largely responded to by discerning modellers, not kids looking for a new toy. Yet here is a Class 8 pacific, which really needs a good length train to haul, and we all know how hard it is to find the space for such. Clearly big is still beautiful in its own right.

 

May I join with many others in thanking the Poll team for their time and efforts, and Andy Y for making the results available on here. Now, over to the manufacturers!


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#11 Mark Dickerson

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 09:48


The Merchant Navy is interesting. After all, this poll is largely responded to by discerning modellers, not kids looking for a new toy. Yet here is a Class 8 pacific, which really needs a good length train to haul, and we all know how hard it is to find the space for such. Clearly big is still beautiful in its own right.

 

Meanwhile, if you allow industrials and LT into the main Top 50 Steam list things start to look very interesting. :locomotive:

 

That said, this could all be an outlier - I'm surprised some LNER items weren't higher (or LMS suburbans). But maybe there's a market for impulse-buying pretty small locos, too.



#12 47845

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 10:06

Interesting to note there appears to be more post steam models in the N gauge top 50 than the 00 gauge top 50...



#13 phil gollin

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 10:33

.

 

As with the others, first a big "thank-you" to the poll team for all the hard work.

 

On an examination of the "high pollers" it would seem that the Southern (Region) and (Great) Western really are anxious for new models (despite an awful lot of froth from the LNER supporters).  I can't really complain about 3 out of the top 4 steam choices (BR Standard 2-6-0 2MT, GWR Steam Railmotor, LSWR/SR S.15), but whilst I really like the Merchant Navies (number 2 choice) their very short lives and numerous variations really mean they are awkward choices for a manufacturer.

 

Whilst the SR and GWR seem to dominate the top of the lists it is interesting to note that whilst the GWR is well represented at the top of most categories (PRESUMABLY showing a general need for new or updated models) the SR really tops the steam loco chart, AGAIN PRESUMABLY showing that Southern modellers are STILL looking for the basic wide selection of locos for their layouts.   The poor showing of Southern coaches really confused me  -  maybe everyone still believes that Bachmann will re-do their Bullieds ?

 

I am EXTREMELY PLEASED that an operating gated level crossing came top and that various Brakedown cranes (PRESUMABLY well detailed) also showed up reasonably well.

 

So, an S-15 and a GWR Steam Railmotor for my Christmas 2015 list  ( ! )

 

.


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#14 The Stationmaster

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 10:35

This I found really interesting. From the top 25 steam locomotives for each year the 'regional' mix changed pretty dramatically in 2014:
 
2012:

10 .. SR
05 .. LNER
05 .. BR
04 .. GWR
01 .. LMSR

2013:
10 .. SR
06 .. LNER
06 .. BR
03 .. GWR
00 .. LMSR

2014:
08 .. GWR
07 .. SR
05 .. BR
03 .. LNER
02 .. LMSR
 

Nice to see more Midland presence this year but they're still at the bottom. Are LMSR fans well served?

 

Did the GWR fans vote more this year, or does this reflect the high number of LNER locomotives that has been announced in the last year or two? Except for the Black Motor and the Brighton Atlantic, most of the SR items are still in the top 25.

I think part of it is the fact that things move up the leader board as previous leaders are scooped off by manufacturers - who increasingly seem to take notice of wishlists as part of their market research.  Thus next year it is likely to be different again ... oops shouldn't have said that should I - but I bet it will be.

 

The  'original'  Merchant Navy is - as Ian has identified already - an interesting one but it gets even more interesting when one asks 'which version?', maybe that is what has put manufacturers off in the past with far easier targets.  However at least one version of it would be a natural, I think, for Hornby and would complement their range of SR pacifics and their continuing interest in 'big engines' although one might ask 'is it different enough' from some very similar looking locos they already offer as far as the mass market is concerned?

 

And, as others have already said, thanks to Brian and the team plus Andy's 'puting skills for again bringing us an easy to follow poll with well tabiulated results.


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#15 phil gollin

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 10:47

.

 

OH !  

 

And of course, the  4-COR "Nelson" EMUs, number 33 overall and number two "electric".

 

Their time will come.

 

.


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#16 G-BOAF

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 10:49

Interesting results.

Pleased with the BPOT. Hopefully this will encourage Invicta to confirm the project!

 

I can see Dapol doing a level crossing, as this fits could build on their their signals and fits with their catenary and other ‘scenic’ items; although how have their functional signals been selling?

 

Re the MN, it has polled highly for a while, there is the complexity of variants, and now Hornby's added spanner in the proverbial chain(!) that models are to be tooled with all parts and not use tooling from other models (due to distributed manufacturing), so the argument that they already have loco and tender chassis possibly goes out of the window. Room for Bachmann, Dapol Heljan or DJM?

 

Regarding variants, my guess is that the 'final form' front end would be the easiest, as it would allow the final 10 to be built without much trouble, and many of the others to be captured in BR livery, which the data tell us is what the majority of steam modellers want. Or maybe this would have been the solution 10 years ago, but not acceptable to today's market who want detailed differences? How about DJM doing 21c1 and Hornby announcing the rest.


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#17 trisonic

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 10:58

Yes, a lot of time and effort go into this - kudos to everyone involved. Brilliant job. I’m sure what The Stationmaster says is right.

 

To be honest, I don’t really like polls like this because  John Adams’ “tyranny of democracy” comes into effect. The majority expect their “wants” to reproduced slavishly and are disappointed when they are not and conversely everyone else is just disappointed!

 

Best, Pete.


Edited by trisonic, 07 November 2014 - 10:59 .

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#18 robertcwp

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 11:03

Interesting results.

Pleased with the BPOT. Hopefully this will encourage Invicta to confirm the project!

 

 

I can only comment on the 00 poll.

 

The BPOT in the poll was an earlier diagram than the one announced by Invicta.  My personal view is that Invicta chose the wrong diagram as the earlier one would have been better, although we would need an early POT too to make up the full West of England TPO of the early 1960s.

 

I was pleased to see one of my personal top items high up - the Swindon Class 120 cross-country unit - but it still baffles me how the Class 117/118 polls more highly than the far more numerous and widespread Derby Class 116.

 

Good to see the Mark I BSO very high up - the most numerous Mark I passenger type that has not been modelled RTR.  I would have liked to have seen the RB and Diag 73 FO a bit higher up as these are the only other Mark I passenger types of which over 100 were built that have not been modelled recently in 00 - the Mainline RB came out around 33 years ago and the Replica FO around 1990 if I recall correctly.



#19 BMacdermott

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 11:13

Yes, a lot of time and effort go into this - kudos to everyone involved. Brilliant job. I’m sure what The Stationmaster says is right.

 

To be honest, I don’t really like polls like this because  John Adams’ “tyranny of democracy” comes into effect. The majority expect their “wants” to reproduced slavishly and are disappointed when they are not and conversely everyone else is just disappointed!

 

Best, Pete.

 

Hello Pete

 

Thanks for the positive comments above. In respect of the second sentence, I have attached what we said in the Q&A.

 

Regards

 

Brian (on behalf of The Poll Team)

 

Does The Poll Team expect ‘the top items’ to be made?

We would ask pollsters to appreciate that manufacturers lay plans anything up to three years in advance and have to continually balance requests against their current models and proposed portfolios – as well as those of their competitors. To us, it’s a hobby; to them, it’s a commercial decision. 


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#20 34theletterbetweenB&D

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 12:55

Interesting to note there appears to be more post steam models in the N gauge top 50 than the 00 gauge top 50...

In just about every way, RTR N gauge is more adequate at representing diesel and electric traction than steam; much bigger gap in this respect than in OO RTR, so i'd expect that to be a factor. Is the diesel and electric traction roster in N less well filled than in OO too?

 

...Yet here is a Class 8 pacific....

But only some of the time. Sometimes they were 7P, and did the Southern even bother with power ratings? More variation to cope with...



#21 Horsetan

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 13:32

.... the SR Merchant Navy – Air-smoothed Casing 4-6-2 (35001-35030) being the second most requested loco, hopefully Hornby will finally figure out they need to produce it.

 

They will need to need to figure out which of the three "series" of Original "MN" they would like to have a go at making. They weren't all the same!


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#22 The Stationmaster

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 14:26

Hello Pete

 

Thanks for the positive comments above. In respect of the second sentence, I have attached what we said in the Q&A.

 

Regards

 

Brian (on behalf of The Poll Team)

 

Does The Poll Team expect ‘the top items’ to be made?

We would ask pollsters to appreciate that manufacturers lay plans anything up to three years in advance and have to continually balance requests against their current models and proposed portfolios – as well as those of their competitors. To us, it’s a hobby; to them, it’s a commercial decision. 

Quite agree with that comment Brian as it obviously is a commercial decision but it has become more noticeable of late there is some 'wishlist scooping/cherrypicking' clearly happening in the industry and also that such an approach is resulting in, or nearly in, considerable duplication of effort if not necessarily production (witness four concerns working on the Adams radial and some of them have been developing their work for a considerable time, although not necessarily for a 'wishlist scooping' reason in one case).

 

However I do get the impression with some companies that their market research extends little further than looking at the top end of the wishlist poll with no other sort of strategic (for their business) consideration.  Obviously this is not the fault of the wishlists and - as I've already said - thanks for developing and giving us such a well organised poll but I do get more than a hint of unbalance in manuufacturers' etc decisions as a consequence.  Or is it mere coincidence that the poll results coincide so closely with their own research and market soundings - albeit hardly something a newcomer is likely to be able to do?

 

Some companies have formulated longer term plans built around a strategy and a business plan and it is rather galling, if one knows of such plans, to see others step in to what must obviously be someone else's likely territory if only they paid more attention to the hobby around them rather than proceeding with their head down and nose in the trough.  All's fair in love and business of course but I sometimes wonder who is the ultimate loser?


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#23 TheSignalEngineer

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 14:36

Thanks to the team for a great effort.

 

Unfortunately for the bank balance, 12 of my top twenty hit list appear in the top fifty. Could be an expensive time, as most of the others are in the top few of their category.


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#24 Dunsignalling

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 14:47

They will need to need to figure out which of the three "series" of Original "MN" they would like to have a go at making. They weren't all the same!

Far from it, and the early ones received frequent modifications during their first few years in traffic. I once met a chap who reckoned he could date any pre-1948 photo of a first series MN within a month-or-so from what bits the loco had on it. 

 

Fortunately for those who have to take commercial decisions, the war years are not a widely modelled era so I'd expect any models to start from around the date of nationalisation by which time things had settled down a bit.

 

Very few remained unmodified by my modelling period and 35006 as running in 1958 would be perfect for me but I'd be just as happy if Hornby just made a 5000 gallon tender for their rebuilt MN so they could 'do' a few of my lower-numbered favourites.

 

John



#25 G-BOAF

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 14:49

 

The BPOT in the poll was an earlier diagram than the one announced by Invicta.  My personal view is that Invicta chose the wrong diagram as the earlier one would have been better, although we would need an early POT too to make up the full West of England TPO of the early 1960s.

 

I actually hadn't noticed that, and with all other items I voted for I checked diag numbers, but for this just assumed.

Personally I WOULDN'T buy the earlier diag, only the later, and wouldn't have voted... always check manifestos properly :-)

 

but this is not a 'I would buy xyz'.

 

Was there not a wishlist poll once indicating how many of a particular item you would buy?


Edited by G-BOAF, 07 November 2014 - 14:50 .








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