Hattons announce 14xx / 48xx / 58xx

[rembrow]

Has anyone actually tried to remove the factory-fitted number plates yet, please?

 

I don't want to try, as they are fully recessed, the only way I can see of removing them is to try and pry them out. That risks damage to the plastic side of the recess, depending on how well they are glued in. That's why I'm going to see if etched plates will cover the existing ones. I'll let you know once mine arrive.

[Coppercap]

The Hornby version in Railroad format will be simple paint job but basically the same model. The traction tyres tend to disappear too when a loco gets railroaded.

The GWR County 4-4-0 when it was "Railroaded" went from the previous tender drive with traction tyres to loco drive.... with traction tyres. (As did the Midland Compound.)

[Ian Hargrave]

The GWR County 4-4-0 when it was "Railroaded" went from the previous tender drive with traction tyres to loco drive.... with traction tyres. (As did the Midland Compound.)

So following that logic,the tank will still be burning rubber ? Or will it ? Hmm ....Ashpangate,Plategate ,Rodgate,Oversizewheelgate,Can'tgethebodyoffgate,Rubbergate,Chunnergate...and so the world turns.

[toboldlygo]

So following that logic,the tank will still be burning rubber ? Or will it ? Hmm ....Ashpangate,Plategate ,Rodgate,Oversizewheelgate,Can'tgethebodyoffgate,Rubbergate,Chunnergate...and so the world turns.

 

You've forgotten Knobgate and Greengate

[coachmann]

.................and silvercouplingrodgate, 

[micklner]

The GWR County 4-4-0 when it was "Railroaded" went from the previous tender drive with traction tyres to loco drive.... with traction tyres. (As did the Midland Compound.)

 

and the D49 Shire/Hunt

[Ian Hargrave]

.................and silvercouplingrodgate,

 

Covered under Rodgate.....

[Guest 7007GreatWestern]

Perhaps they will take the same approach they adopted when they re-introduced the Hawksworth County in 2016? The most significant change was the replacement of the Ringfield motor with one of the new 3 pole units. The one I have runs very well indeed. However, there was no significant improvement in what was a very dated body. This is just a personal opinion: I have one of the Hattons/DJM 14xxs, it looks and runs superbly (after initial teething troubles). Having experienced first hand the Hattons/DJM model I wouldn't accept a Hornby re-hashed version of the 1970s Airfix 14xx if they were giving them away (other than to sell on for cash)!

[Limpley Stoker]

We've forgotten cabstepgate........

[lofty1966]

Covered under Rodgate.....

Please keep up at the back.

[No Decorum]

You've forgotten Knobgate and Greengate

Thinks ... “How could he forget greengate?”

[No Decorum]

and the D49 Shire/Hunt

and the 4F. The only reason I didn’t get one.

[PenrithBeacon]

This controversy makes me wonder just what could have been expected of the Hatton's King if it would have been brought to market.

 

Perhaps Hattons and the other retailers who employ DJM had better get down to writing specifications for DJM to follow. KISS might come to mind along with protypical fidelity.

[Ian Hargrave]

Thinks ... “How could he forget greengate?”

 All in good time.......

[Ian Hargrave]

This controversy makes me wonder just what could have been expected of the Hatton's King if it would have been brought to market.

 

Perhaps Hattons and the other retailers who employ DJM had better get down to writing specifications for DJM to follow. KISS might come to mind along with protypical fidelity.

The other retailer being Kernow who perhaps keep a much closer control over r&d and production via engineering samples etc. We don't really know,do we. In fact the term controversy may just apply to this forum.Reaction and sales in general are far too early to make a judgement call,especially as there are more variants in production some of them being the weathered versions which hopefully will disguise the garish silvered presence of the coupling rods.I think we can reflect that generally there are few issues with the Kernow O2 and Well Tanks and having seen and handled a DJM Kernow 1361,I have few qualms at this moment in time.

 

There is also the thorny question of budgetary considerations.,We want this detail or that,this facility or the other.Fine but then the cost rises.Hattons have to decide the cut off point where this model is commercially viable. Let's say for the sake of argument at £100 it will sell well. Design in more ,correct this or that,maybe production slot is lost,say the cost rises to £120.Will it now sell or trigger an outbreak of price gripe on a well-known forum ?

 

Yes,there are things with this model I don't particularly like either and yes,Hattons do have form with the BG which was quite obviously subject to budgetary constraints with consequent failings in operation.

Of course one factor over which there is little control is the actual point of manufacture....in China....which is a long,long way from Liverpool.

 

It would be ideal to pay a visit chez Hattons to see and get a hands on of one of these tanks I'd love to but negotiating the current traffic on the M6 and the roads around their shiny new emporium make that unlikely.

[JSpencer]

This controversy makes me wonder just what could have been expected of the Hatton's King if it would have been brought to market.

 

Perhaps Hattons and the other retailers who employ DJM had better get down to writing specifications for DJM to follow. KISS might come to mind along with protypical fidelity.

 

I do feel that Controversy is perhaps too strong a word especially one that just came second as OO gauge steam loco of the year, behind the Peckett but ahead of the USA tank in the RM web poll.

 

Reading these posts:

Upside on the model, everything above the waist is brilliant and out classes the old Airfix 14xx and the new Bachmann 64XX by a wide margin.

Downside - the wheels are too large.

 

Can be positive or negative :

Running - you either get one that is perfect or one with a problem that cannot be cured (it would seem reading these posts).

Etched plates - they either sit squarely into nice holes like here but are too flush OR you have the Dapol 68 symptom of wonky plates

                         Nice experiment but maybe the lesson here is printing the things on and supplying plates for end user to fit is best approach afterall...

 

Concerning Writing Specification -

I would be surprised if one was not actually written. The problem is how far do you take that spec? Either you accept the factory standards in place (most cost effective) or you start providing CADs yourself asking the factory to build to them. The latter adds cost and delay.

Given that DJM (or the man responsible) and presumably the very same factory have produced award winning models (Well tank, O2), it would have been hard to justify specifying a different approach to the chassis design which would need to be copied and developed. Likewise the last people to do a steam loco for Hattons was Heljan which has drawn an equal amount of flak despite using a more classic drive (if doubled).

 

We could easily conclude from this that maybe Kernow are better in development of their exclusives than Hattons, but that would negate excellent models like the class 14 and class 28. And Hattons are taking a much more closer approach today than they were before.

We could also easily conclude that maybe Great Western railway modellers are more fussy than Southern ones.

I don't think the last pair of statements are true though.

Edited February 24, 2017 by JSpencer

[57xx]

We've forgotten cabstepgate........

 

And groovearoundthebaseofthebuffersgate, groovearoundthechimenygate, superfluousholesinthecabfrontgate, domeblendsseamlesslyintotheboilergate, copyingpreservationpaintworkgate, batteryboxonthe58xxgate, boxopenersarelosersgate, and howdareyoucritisedjmgate, but other than that, life is peachy. 

[Hilux5972]

And groovearoundthebaseofthebuffersgate, groovearoundthechimenygate, superfluousholesinthecabfrontgate, domeblendsseamlesslyintotheboilergate, copyingpreservationpaintworkgate, batteryboxonthe58xxgate, boxopenersarelosersgate, and howdareyoucritisedjmgate, but other than that, life is peachy.

Are you on something? Lol

[lofty1966]

Are you on something? Lol

He's on the gate , not sat on the fence.

[Limpley Stoker]

Living in a gated community?

[Izzy]

It would be ideal to pay a visit chez Hattons to see and get a hands on of one of these tanks I'd love to but negotiating the current traffic on the M6 and the roads around their shiny new emporium make that unlikely.

 

I think this is one of the main downsides for all these limited edition/online only/one retailer models isn't it? Most have to rely on reviews and posted images/opinions from others as they won't appear in local model shops for the vast bulk of modellers to look at and gain a personal opinion as to how good they are. Even if they don't personally want one it always helps should another later model that they do be released. Just the way things are now though. And of course it doesn't help the small shops at all.

 

Izzy

[tender]

Just read John's (You-Choos) account of sound fitting the 14xx.

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/120317-djm-14xx-with-zimo-sound-quick-install-guide/?p=2631098

Seems odd making the model supposedly easy for sound fitting but then not leaving enough room for the decoder without having to remove the six pin decoder socket and hardwiring the decoder. Must admit this wasn't a problem with the DJM/Kernow O2 but looking at the pictures it looks like half the boiler space is taken up with additional weight on the14xx.

Edited February 25, 2017 by tender

[Ian Hargrave]

I think this is one of the main downsides for all these limited edition/online only/one retailer models isn't it? Most have to rely on reviews and posted images/opinions from others as they won't appear in local model shops for the vast bulk of modellers to look at and gain a personal opinion as to how good they are. Even if they don't personally want one it always helps should another later model that they do be released. Just the way things are now though. And of course it doesn't help the small shops at all.

 

Izzy

And the joke is that if the roads were clear,I could be there in 90 minutes.As it is,Hattons seem isolated in a gridlocked urban wilderness.One other point perhaps worth making is that apart from a couple of isolated specialist appearances,Hattons do not attend shows or exhibitions.It would be more than helpful if they did,I think.Then we would be able to make a clear unambiguous judgement at first hand.

[Guest 7007GreatWestern]

I think this is one of the main downsides for all these limited edition/online only/one retailer models isn't it? Most have to rely on reviews and posted images/opinions from others as they won't appear in local model shops 

 

True, it is inconvenient not being able to inspect a model in person. Having said that surely the greater inconvenience is having such models not produced at all?

 

The two established manufacturers have done sterling job in recent years. For the GWR modeller, all the four-cylinder express classes are available to a high standard (excepting "The Great Bear") and with the arrival of the 47xx this year there will be almost complete coverage of the eight coupled freight engines which ran on the GWR. Beyond that there are very significant gaps in what is available despite the frequent protestations of those who follow the 'other' Railways.

 

Personally I'm pleased that the likes of Kernow, Hattons, Heljan and Oxford Rail are developing models to fill those gaps because there is no evidence that either Hornby or Bachmann are planning to do so (Bachmann 94xx excepted).

 

Yes, the Hattons models are available solely through Hattons. But then they have taken the (probably quite considerable) investment risk on this project and if they need to control the  retail side of the project in order to maximise their return then surely that is their prerogative? That was also the "business model" of Hornby until very recently I believe.

[sp1]

True, it is inconvenient not being able to inspect a model in person. Having said that surely the greater inconvenience is having such models not produced at all?

 

The two established manufacturers have done sterling job in recent years. For the GWR modeller, all the four-cylinder express classes are available to a high standard (excepting "The Great Bear") and with the arrival of the 47xx this year there will be almost complete coverage of the eight coupled freight engines which ran on the GWR. Beyond that there are very significant gaps in what is available despite the frequent protestations of those who follow the 'other' Railways.

 

Personally I'm pleased that the likes of Kernow, Hattons, Heljan and Oxford Rail are developing models to fill those gaps because there is no evidence that either Hornby or Bachmann are planning to do so (Bachmann 94xx excepted).

 

Yes, the Hattons models are available solely through Hattons. But then they have taken the (probably quite considerable) investment risk on this project and if they need to control the retail side of the project in order to maximise their return then surely that is their prerogative? That was also the "business model" of Hornby until very recently I believe.

I agree. However, if Bachmann or Hornby had done these we could have looked forward to re-runs at fairly regular intervals - I think Kernow have produced re-runs of some of their models, but will Hattons do this? If the release of these had been staggered over a longer period I would have purchased most of them, but to find the money for half a dozen locos in one go is difficult.

 

On the same note, but off topic, now that the problems with the Garratt are known and it appears that there are fixes I wonder if Hattons would consider repeating these. They were obviously built down to a price - although outside the area I model I would have loved one, but returned to modelling at the tail end of these and was put off by the horror stories. If done properly I think a price of £3-400 would not be unreasonable given recent price rises - Bachmann certainly seem to think this is the case (Blue Pullman?) for niche items.....