Sutton's Locomotive Works class 24

[Ian Hargrave]

Wish it were under my tree.....cutely posed,must say.

[Porcy Mane]

Those wheels do look nice.

Demolition at Derby by Kevin Lane, on Flickr

 

P

[Downendian]

Well as this thread matures (in the cheese sense of the word) I'm still not put off by this model. Nothing that an etched grille between friends can't sort out. That aside, everything else looks spot on, having a Hornby-Bach hybrid 24/1 on the go, I can assure you the bottom of the cabs (a fiddly bit to get right) looks as good as it gets.

 

Going slightly O/T rail exclusive still have the 33/0s which state they are postponed on their website. Having lost track of this after they were let down by Heljan, is SLW going to amaze us with a 33 as well? I still have them on order I hope they emerge because we will be in for a treat.

 

Neil

[25901]

Going slightly O/T rail exclusive still have the 33/0s which state they are postponed on their website. Having lost track of this after they were let down by Heljan, is SLW going to amaze us with a 33 as well? I still have them on order I hope they emerge because we will be in for a treat.

 

Neil

 

I think any other releases will center on the chassis and from what pics I've seen will involve the rest of the 24/25 family as the only changes on this will be a swap over of the fuel tank and battery boxes

[Michael Delamar]

Not the clearest of shots but thought id share my dads shot of 24081 at Steamport Southport in the mid 1980s.

[PenrithBeacon]

I'm ever so glad that I'm providing much needed amusement on RMweb and perhaps the word 'substantially' was a bit OTT but the fact remains that this model costs £200+ and it's inaccurate.

 

Now elsewhere on RMweb people are complaining about inaccurate models which Bachmann and Hornby produce and cost, notwithstanding the price rises, a great deal less than this one. Has it occurred to those frothing about this model that they are giving Bachmann, Hornby and others free range to put the prices of their products up to match?

 

I dare say not, but I'll bet that the senior managers of those companies are absolutely delighted at the shear gullibility of their British RTR customers.

 

£200+ a pop! And for an inaccurate model! Utterly crackers!

[Derekstuart]

Sometimes people say things that are actually beyond parody.

 

It is only over £200 if you opt for a wheel conversion to a gauge other than standard 00. Don't forget that with your standard bach-by product you also need to factor in the wheel conversion too.

 

It is an inaccurate model and I think the proponents of it are being unfair describing it as accurate. For example it has only ONE motor, mounted in the centre, rather than 4 small ones, one on each axle. The power is taken from the rails rather than a diesel-gen set and as a result the power is adjusted by a controller and not a little man sitting at the front. I could go on, but I think I make the point.

 

As for these grills- whether they are right or wrong I could not say (though the opinion from those whom I respect is that they are wrong). But that is ONE aspect of the model. I think if you are waiting for 100% accurate models then you are going to have to invest in 1:1 scale. Even then you will find that things don't always look the same as the manual says it should.

I'm ever so glad that I'm providing much needed amusement on RMweb and perhaps the word 'substantially' was a bit OTT but the fact remains that this model costs £200+ and it's inaccurate.

Now elsewhere on RMweb people are complaining about inaccurate models which Bachmann and Hornby produce and cost, notwithstanding the price rises, a great deal less than this one. Has it occurred to those frothing about this model that they are giving Bachmann, Hornby and others free range to put the prices of their products up to match?

I dare say not, but I'll bet that the senior managers of those companies are absolutely delighted at the shear gullibility of their British RTR customers.

£200+ a pop! And for an inaccurate model! Utterly crackers!

Edited December 5, 2015 by Derekstuart

[Clive Mortimore]

Hi David

 

Have you viewed the real model or like me just the photos? Now I feel that the photos indicate that it is worth ME purchasing one. Now if your opinion is that you do not feel the need to buy one then that is up to you. Yes we have all taken on board your view that the grilles are wrong.

Edited December 5, 2015 by Clive Mortimore

[pauliebanger]

For those considering the sound-fitted option.

 

I've been inundated with an email asking if the sound  will be available to purchase separately.

 

Sorry, this custom sound project was conceived and created especially for the SLW Class 24. Having control of the decoder and speaker selection, the electronics, and speaker enclosure design has enabled the project to be optimised for this specific model. There are no plans for SLW or RE to release aftermarket versions of this project for use in any other model.

 

Futhermore, the advanced circuitry means that only the selected ZIMO decoder will operate sound and functions correctly. ESU Loksound decoders do not match up to the model's specifications.

 

The only way to obtain a fully functional, sound-fitted SLW Class 24 is to order it that way from SLW. Fortunately, SLW sound-fitted prices are very reasonable at the moment.

 

Kind regards,

 

Paul

[Downendian]

Now elsewhere on RMweb people are complaining about inaccurate models which Bachmann and Hornby produce and cost, notwithstanding the price rises, a great deal less than this one. Has it occurred to those frothing about this model that they are giving Bachmann, Hornby and others free range to put the prices of their products up to match?I dare say not, but I'll bet that the senior managers of those companies are absolutely delighted at the shear gullibility of their British RTR customers.£200+ a pop! And for an inaccurate model! Utterly crackers!

Perhaps we've been gullible accepting previous levels of detailing that are well below those that have been achieved by this model, and prices that aren't too far away from it. RRP for many new diesels is now approaching £130. As stated by many in this thread to which I totally agree , it's a game changer, Hornby, Bachmann et al could try and up their prices to these levels, but only if they match these specifications. I doubt they are rubbing their hands in glee, I think that this release may have put the cat amongst the pigeons.

 

I doubt very much if Bachmann will be releasing any further old tooling class 25s for example, 25 043 will I fully expect to be the last of the Bachmann old tooling, and I'm sure they're looking very carefully now at their new tooled 24/1.

 

Neil

Edited December 5, 2015 by Downendian

[dibber25]

Now that's not really true, is it Chris, and you know it? If said larger org was producing only one or two products a year, you might have had a point. But the spread of o/heads across many dozens, or hundreds, of products, the commonality of many parts, systems and distribution, the much greater volume of overall sales giving greater muscle with factories and distributors, and the ability to leverage at far lower cost, all combine to negate any benefit of a small supplier. On top of that, this small supplier is experiencing the full force of start up costs, having only ever commissioned via others before, and has not sought Kickstarter funding nor up-front deposits. He has made it/had it made, using only his or borrowed money and is now flogging it without much fanfare. The only missing items are marketing and retailer mark-up, and I do not see any great discounts to reflect that from the majors via their direct sales, in fact often the opposite, excepting their fire sales when they need some cash flow. If he can do it (assuming, and it is a great assumption at this stage, given what another new starter has recently revealed about his negative profit after pretty well selling out), then, once you add in retailer margin and marketing/distribution costs, a RRP of c.£200 would seem perfectly possible for the big boys and girls, for this level of detail, quality and verisimilitude. I agree with others that this really does set a benchmark they must follow.

I stand absolutely by what I said originally. (CJL)

[jjb1970]

There is a huge jump in going from a one or two person band with no premises beyond your existing home or retail unit or paid staff to employing designers, admin and logistics staff, a marketing person, marketing etc. On the other hand the bigger outfits will benefit from being able to negotiate better deals from the manufacturers, their costs are spread over a much bigger production program etc but nevertheless it is a huge leap to go from being what is in effect an enthusiastic amateur to having to cover the cost base of a large business making the same basic product.

[pauliebanger]

I stand absolutely by what I said originally. (CJL)

 

So did 'Comical Ali'. Didn't make him any more correct, though, did it? Lol

[Derekstuart]

Chris

 

As someone who used to run a business and clearly still involved at a reasonably senior level, you should know enough about business to be aware that economies of scale are not always a simple matter; sometimes there are economies, sometimes there aren't and sometimes there are negative costs.

 

For example. I want to publish a model railway magazine. I know that with the help of two people I can put together a copy in X days with Y hours per day at Z costs. I don't need a receptionist, company car and every colour of post it note ever made. I could run my office far, far cheaper than you could.

 

But now I come to print. I do not have a track record with a printing company and cannot commit to one run per month for X months as I need to make enough from issue 1 to pay for issue 2. I cannot get payment terms as I'm a new, un-tried, customer. I am also likely to run less copies than your established (and very good) magazine, so my cost per item will be higher.

 

In that couple of paragraphs I have proven economies of scale DO NOT WORK and ALSO THAT THEY DO WORK.

 

SLW is a unique business and will have unique costs and business methodology. I think it is un-wise to try and second guess any company and its inner workings without bona fide facts at one's disposal. (you could of course get this from Companies House in 2 years or so, assuming this is a ltd company and not a sole trader.

 

 

I stand absolutely by what I said originally. (CJL)

[37081LochLong]

I think if someone released the perfect loco with no flaws and sold it for £50, you would still get someone complain on RMweb that it was "too perfect" and there was nothing for them as a "modeller" to do to modify it and at that price it couldn't be any good so they would say they weren't getting one!

 

We are never all going to agree on something, but each to their own. I for one love the look of the model and will buy one or two and it brought me out of lurking on the forum and got me joining in (I've lurked for a few years now under a different name and not joining in because of the ones who seem to like to take the joy out of what is supposed to be a fun hobby)

 

Ok the grill may not be perfect, we get that, but the rest of the model is better than the Bachman offering (of which I have 5) but it won't make me sell those, I'll just mod them more and add heavier weathering I think there is a place for both in the market right now. If a highland version gets released I will buy the SLW ones instead of the Bachmann ones though.

 

And who knows this grill problem that some people are so upset about may well be sorted out to their satisfaction on the next version? Whether it's a modified one with the extra grills on the side or a headcode box version. I'm sure SLW are watching this thread and taking notes (and cringing at other bits) and will be happy to improve what is already a superb looking model in the photos. I say we support the likes of SLW DJModels and Rapido etc... for their input into the British scene and not heavily criticise them. Yes they may not get everything right but with friendly worded constructive criticism and helpful suggestions they can only improve. I will still look to the big names for models but I also like to see the smaller ones succeed too, there is a place for them all.

 

Can't wait for the day I can order mine I just wish it wasn't so close to Christmas! It's meant delaying some other purchases (Dapol 73s) but I'm sure it will be worth it!

 

(Edited for iPad autocorrections)

Edited December 5, 2015 by 37081LochLong

[37114]

I am going to have one as changing an iffy grille and fitting Laserglaze (when Brian does it for this loco) is not a particularly challenging project to create a loco that will be near as dammit an accurate class 24.

[No Decorum]

I think if someone released the perfect loco with no flaws and sold it for £50, you would still get someone complain on RMweb that it was "too perfect" and there was nothing for them as a "modeller" to do to modify it and at that price it couldn't be any good so they would say they weren't getting one!

 

See post 379. Why would anyone pay £165 or even £50 for a Hornby Merchant Navy when apparently you can get one for £2.03 in Tesco? As has been said, we are entering a new golden age.

[No Decorum]

For those considering the sound-fitted option.

 

I've been inundated with an email asking if the sound  will be available to purchase separately.

 

Sorry, this custom sound project was conceived and created especially for the SLW Class 24. Having control of the decoder and speaker selection, the electronics, and speaker enclosure design has enabled the project to be optimised for this specific model. There are no plans for SLW or RE to release aftermarket versions of this project for use in any other model.

 

Futhermore, the advanced circuitry means that only the selected ZIMO decoder will operate sound and functions correctly. ESU Loksound decoders do not match up to the model's specifications.

 

The only way to obtain a fully functional, sound-fitted SLW Class 24 is to order it that way from SLW. Fortunately, SLW sound-fitted prices are very reasonable at the moment.

 

Kind regards,

 

Paul

That's a pity. I think £100 for a fully fitted sound system is very reasonable. The more so compared to what other manufacturers are charging and bearing in mind that this is a twin speaker fitment with special enclosures. The pity is that it, or something derived from it, won't be available for other 24s.

[Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71]

I'm ever so glad that I'm providing much needed amusement on RMweb and perhaps the word 'substantially' was a bit OTT but the fact remains that this model costs £200+ and it's inaccurate.

 

Now elsewhere on RMweb people are complaining about inaccurate models which Bachmann and Hornby produce and cost, notwithstanding the price rises, a great deal less than this one. Has it occurred to those frothing about this model that they are giving Bachmann, Hornby and others free range to put the prices of their products up to match?

 

I dare say not, but I'll bet that the senior managers of those companies are absolutely delighted at the shear gullibility of their British RTR customers.

 

£200+ a pop! And for an inaccurate model! Utterly crackers!

 

The main reason that people are amused PB is because the only price for a DC 24 in P4 until mid December can be £180....£160 for the loco and £20 for the wheelsets. This is because until mid December only loyal customers can buy them and this is the price to them.

 

Dave

[luke_stevens]

Finally gave in to temptation and have ordered D5000 with sound, perhaps if I wrap it up and put it under the christmas tree nobody will ask any questions when it appears?

 

Martin

Yup, my idea too!

 

Luke

[No Decorum]

Yup, my idea too!

 

Luke

Honestly, you rich chaps. I can't afford a Christmas tree now. 

[newbryford]

Honestly, you rich chaps. I can't afford a Christmas tree now. 

 

It may not be a tree, but at least you can have something green to stand in the corner.

 

Cheers,

Mick

[luke_stevens]

Honestly, you rich chaps. I can't afford a Christmas tree now.

 

I didn't say I could afford it. I've restructured several bits of spending, both hobby and not, and will still have to do some more revenue generating, mainly ebaying stuff of less importance.

 

But I do understand that for some people things are not good at the moment, and I feel for them. May 2016 be a more prosperous year.

 

Luke

[No Decorum]

It may not be a tree, but at least you can have something green to stand in the corner.

 

Cheers,

Mick

For that, I would have to dig out my Bachy D5000. Oh well, 73124 will have to serve as a glaucous pine. At least I'll have nice red lights. One too many, it seems. I think I'll send mine back as faulty because both tail lights light up at once.

[No Decorum]

I didn't say I could afford it. I've restructured several bits of spending, both hobby and not, and will still have to do some more revenue generating, mainly ebaying stuff of less importance.

 

But I do understand that for some people things are not good at the moment, and I feel for them. May 2016 be a more prosperous year.

 

Luke

Last month I did a litlle bit of creative accounting. This month I shall do a little more. I'm beginning to realise that there is no such thing as creative accounting.