Aspergers - Adult Diagnosis

[laurenceb]

If I was offered this treatment, like Chris I would say no. Heck I think I would be off running! I am Aspergers and allways have been and it would be like cutting part of me out.

[alastairq]

I watched the program too, having a vested interest, so to speak.

 

I was interested in the differences between the US views regarding Autism, and our own, [uK?]  views.

 

As Mr PAckham observed.....with the US trying to find a 'cure' for autism [impossible, it's not an illness]....he demonstrated the significant differences between US society, and our own.

 

NAmely, the US seeks 'cures' so as to enable Autistic folk to 'fit in with' [be acceptable] to society...whereas Mr Packham observed, Society should adapt & fit in, with Autism..

 

Interesting to also observe the views of those who dominate Silicon Valley?

 

Who openly admit, much within our computerised world would have been impossible without Autistic folk working within the industry....and thus, are happy to accommodate.

[phil-b259]

If I was offered this treatment, like Chris I would say no. Heck I think I would be off running! I am Aspergers and allways have been and it would be like cutting part of me out.

 

To an extent diagnosis is less about being 'cured / treated' and more about getting evidence.

 

In any case, as my GP commented last week when I saw him about this issue, unless it is affecting your ability to hold down a job / live independently, the NHS really doesn't have the resources to do much.

 

Where a diagnosis can help is if you do encounter difficulties at work - employers, managers and individual work colleagues have a duty to 'take note' of it in the event difficulties arise.

[30801]

Where a diagnosis can help is if you do encounter difficulties at work - employers, managers and individual work colleagues have a duty to 'take note' of it in the event difficulties arise.

 

Which is where I started off down the diagnosis route. My employer has a new 'diversity' policy which seems oblivious to the actual meaning of the word 'diversity' and seems intent making everyone fit the same pigeonhole. Missed out on this year's bonus for flunking some non-specific goal about 'communication' despite being good at doing the actual job part of my job.

[MarcD]

Which is where I started off down the diagnosis route. My employer has a new 'diversity' policy which seems oblivious to the actual meaning of the word 'diversity' and seems intent making everyone fit the same pigeonhole. Missed out on this year's bonus for flunking some non-specific goal about 'communication' despite being good at doing the actual job part of my job.

 

 

Been there don't that got the t-shirt your experience could be a carbon copy of what happened to me.

 

Marc 

[EddieB]

It was a fascinating programme, as I respect Chris Packham’s knowledge of the natural world and that he’s also a fairly decent photographer. Unfortunately, I think his “success” has allowed him to over-indulge his eccentricities when he would be able to adapt to most social situations and conventions. Turning down a wedding invitation with his partner, for example, came across as being rather selfish. Some of the flashbacks to his troubled late teen years and early twenties were quite disturbing. Also disturbing (as he identified) are the multi-stimulatory environments that the Americans think will help autistic children.

 

I agree with his conclusion that, if there were a treatment, it would be better to stay as he is - being able to celebrate the best aspects of being different. Many that we recognise as geniuses would fit a similar profile.

 

But there’s a whole range of more extreme forms of autism beyond the band of the spectrum where CP lives. I’ve met many (mainly kids) that inhabit these regions and I fear they are almost as alien to CP as he thinks his own brand of Asperger’s is to “normal” (whatever that is).

[Ian J.]

Autism is a spectrum - both wide and deep. The most severe cases (the Rain Man types) are at one end, with the Aspergers in the middle, and the rest of us are in a more subtle category lower down. They are numbered as levels, with 3 for severe, 2 for middle, and 1 for subtle. There isn't an exact match up with the 'old' names of just Autism and Aspergers, and unfortunately those names will probably forever 'stick'. I'm a 1 with some elements verging on 2, while I expect CP is a closer to a 2.

 

Another radio programme to check out is this one: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/disability-41608303/i-m-wearing-a-tight-t-shirt-so-i-know-where-i-end?intlink_from_url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bbc.co.uk%2Fnews%2Ftopics%2F5f2d9eba-0c20-48a1-a75e-6d37c01d9d9a%2Fautism&link_location=live-reporting-map, transcript here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/disability-41609693

 

Mention is made that Autism affects all sufferers of the condition differently. I feel, and I believe it's recognised, that each person with it is different, sufficient that each of us is effectively in a world of our own, with no easy way to connect with the rest of society as each of us requires a different 'adaptor' to be worn by others to be able to cope with and understand us.

 

For me, I've been feeling like I'm a jigsaw piece that doesn't fit the puzzle. On one side I'm fine, on another I'm a bit bruised but ok, the third is scarred, and the last is bleeding. All this because the rest of the world keeps trying to force me to fit where I don't belong.

Edited October 20, 2017 by Ian J.

[alastairq]

The view that Chris Packham was"over indulging" his 'eccentricities' .....in this instance, the wedding issue, is rather failing to understand some of the problems autism presents,or raises.

Very much a view that we must fit into what society expects....rather than society adapting to individual needs.

Does society only allow an individual the freedom of choice, when, and only, if it suits society?

 

Who and what are we to decide what is essential social behaviour?

 

The refusal to attend the wedding, is nothing more than the personal acknowledgment of the extreme difficulties of finding oneself trapped within a crowd, especially where any attempt to so-called 'socialise' is a psychological impossibility?

I cannot blame him for not wishing to spend the day gritting his teeth for the sake of a societal duty.

 

Living with autism in all its variety is very much about understanding the difference between whim & fancy....... & sheer need.

 

Diagnosis ( Statementing) is very much about accessing essential support, especially at an early age. For, sadly, our society, despite its acclaimed diversity, is incredibly inflexible.

 

Personally I think a large proportion of our population has, to a greater or lesser degree, some aspect of autism within their characters.

Except, that minor autistic trait is not recognised as such...... and folk find themselves considered as anti social, or shy, or a nerd or 'anorak', or some other, similarly so-called abnormality?

After all, people, someone who deliberately seeks to live alone can't be 'right', can they?

 

Or, can they??

[Ian J.]

As I learn more about autism, I have come to the current conclusion that it may be the case that those in the population that society labels as introverts are likely to have traits of autism that are a bit more than minor annoyances.

 

I believe (though I can't remember where I read/heard it) that about 30% or so of the population is towards introverted. Combine that with some U.S. research that indicated that as many as 1 in 68 of the population are believed to have autistic traits and I think you can see where I get such a correlation from.

 

If so, then the 'reach' of significant autistic traits into the general population is actually quite deep, deeper than the 1% figure often quoted in this country. I think it has to be said though, that the 1% probably relates to diagnosable autism (based on current understanding), while the rest (29% or so) probably don't have sufficient problems for a diagnosis.

 

For me, my diagnosis was primarily about dealing with employers and government and other public bodies (DWP, NHS, etc) whose personnel in the past have often become quite exasperated with me when I don't fit their idea of what someone in front of them should or should not be. Now I have the 'label' for why that happens, hopefully when such issues come up they will be able to understand and adapt (though I wouldn't be surprised if some still don't 'get it').

[wamwig]

For someone who has, like CP lived with this for years without diagnosis (actually diagnosed at 50 by my now wife, who works with autistic children) and learned coping strategies for many situations there are still some things (that may appear small or trivial to others) but that completely floor me. My own situation is similar to CP, except I do live with my very understanding wife, and his story almost echoes my own, and like him to the outside world I can usually give the appearance of being quite 'normal', whatever 'normal' is! The thought of being in a social situation making 'small talk' to people I don't know completely fills me with dread though.

 

Now as I rapidly approach retirement I reflect on what has actually been a fairly successful life.  I attained a good management position in my chosen career (although I have now taken a couple of steps down), have two wonderful children (now adults) but it has not been easy and there have been many difficult times, although like CP if you could offer a 'cure' as a teenager (where I knew I was different just not how) I'm also not sure I would have taken it.

[EddieB]

The refusal to attend the wedding, is nothing more than the personal acknowledgment of the extreme difficulties of finding oneself trapped within a crowd, especially where any attempt to so-called 'socialise' is a psychological impossibility?

I cannot blame him for not wishing to spend the day gritting his teeth for the sake of a societal duty.

I agree with most of what you say, particularly that society is becoming less tolerant of differences that don't fit its so-called "liberal" values.

 

It may be a fine line, and different for different people, but to a greater or lesser extent there are occasions where we all have to balance our own feelings against a perceived greater good.  For example today we will be hosting one of my cousins and his family - I'd much rather be somewhere else, but will go through with it because I can see a bigger picture.  I may be wrong, but what struck me about CP  is that he has the ability to recognise wider benefits to certain actions and situations (which is not universal with his condition), but chooses to use his condition as an excuse when it suits him.  However, I fully accept that others have a different threshold.

[wamwig]

I agree with most of what you say, particularly that society is becoming less tolerant of differences that don't fit its so-called "liberal" values.

 

It may be a fine line, and different for different people, but to a greater or lesser extent there are occasions where we all have to balance our own feelings against a perceived greater good.  For example today we will be hosting one of my cousins and his family - I'd much rather be somewhere else, but will go through with it because I can see a bigger picture.  I may be wrong, but what struck me about CP  is that he has the ability to recognise wider benefits to certain actions and situations (which is not universal with his condition), but chooses to use his condition as an excuse when it suits him.  However, I fully accept that others have a different threshold.

 

While I cannot comment on CP's own thoughts, for those of us that are on the spectrum there are things that others would find trivial or easy, like attending a wedding, but which are difficult for us, its not simply a case using it as an excuse, for me there are some situations which still have the ability to terrify me and I will avoid them if I can! Last weekend my wife was invited to something but she went without me as she knew that situation would be very difficult for me!  I understand that it doesn't appear to be rational but for me the fear is all too real.

Edited October 21, 2017 by wamwig

[alastairq]

I agree with most of what you say, particularly that society is becoming less tolerant of differences that don't fit its so-called "liberal" values.

 

It may be a fine line, and different for different people, but to a greater or lesser extent there are occasions where we all have to balance our own feelings against a perceived greater good.  For example today we will be hosting one of my cousins and his family - I'd much rather be somewhere else, but will go through with it because I can see a bigger picture.  I may be wrong, but what struck me about CP  is that he has the ability to recognise wider benefits to certain actions and situations (which is not universal with his condition), but chooses to use his condition as an excuse when it suits him.  However, I fully accept that others have a different threshold.

It really is about balancing one's awareness of the 'greater good'.......and acknowledging the presence of 'fear' of the impending situation.

 

A big problem autism presents in our society , to the Autistic person is the personal  development of ''coping strategies''....

 

It really is about time the 'Greater Good' adapted itself to individual needs.

 

It's a bit like telling someone with a genuine fear of heights, to 'not be such a wimp'...

 

Or, genuinely feeling [and telling?] someone in the depths of Depression to 'get a grip' of themselves....

 

It is often the Autistic person's 'coping strategies' that present what many would deem as 'strange' or 'unusual' behaviours.

 

Certainly, Packham's decision to decline the invitation wouldn't be brought about by a mere whim....something he didn't 'feel like doing'...

 

All of which is where many on the Autistic spectrum get 'misread' by others.

 

It is awareness of this 'misreading' by others that often gives the Autistic person such trouble.

 

Being so self-aware, of the effect one's 'behaviour' may have on others, can hardly be deemed as 'selfish'?

 

Packham's decision would also have been influenced by his awareness that his 'coping strategies' with the wedding process [mainly, all the tripe that goes with it?]....may well be misinterpreted by others....which could lead to negativeness by the rest of the 'greater goods' out there.....spoiling the whole affair for not just the one individual.

[62613]

The view that Chris Packham was"over indulging" his 'eccentricities' .....in this instance, the wedding issue, is rather failing to understand some of the problems autism presents,or raises.

Very much a view that we must fit into what society expects....rather than society adapting to individual needs.

Does society only allow an individual the freedom of choice, when, and only, if it suits society?

 

Who and what are we to decide what is essential social behaviour?

 

The refusal to attend the wedding, is nothing more than the personal acknowledgment of the extreme difficulties of finding oneself trapped within a crowd, especially where any attempt to so-called 'socialise' is a psychological impossibility?

I cannot blame him for not wishing to spend the day gritting his teeth for the sake of a societal duty.

 

Living with autism in all its variety is very much about understanding the difference between whim & fancy....... & sheer need.

 

Diagnosis ( Statementing) is very much about accessing essential support, especially at an early age. For, sadly, our society, despite its acclaimed diversity, is incredibly inflexible.

 

Personally I think a large proportion of our population has, to a greater or lesser degree, some aspect of autism within their characters.

Except, that minor autistic trait is not recognised as such...... and folk find themselves considered as anti social, or shy, or a nerd or 'anorak', or some other, similarly so-called abnormality?

After all, people, someone who deliberately seeks to live alone can't be 'right', can they?

 

Or, can they??

 

Can I just say what an excellent post this is. So close to my thoughts on the matter. I too have problems interacting with people, particularly strangers; quite often in social situations you will find me, even when I'm with people I've known for years, standing aloof, observing and not interacting. I also wonder if my terror of any form-filling has anything to do with AS.

 

I haven't had a formal assessment; but my mildly autistic no. 1 daughter spotted the traits

Edited October 21, 2017 by 62613

[30801]

Amythest Schaber has an excellent series of videos in which she explains various autism subjects.

 

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLAoYMFsyj_k1ApNj_QUkNgKC1R5F9bVHs

[laurenceb]

Even with people I know I cannot cope with a three way conversation and drop out. With larger groups I end up in a corner hoping no one will come over. It is not a case of not wanting to do it,I just cannot

[Ian J.]

I was disappointed to hear of and read the news of Hans Asberger's previously unclear links to the Nazis becoming somewhat more clear:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-43820794

 

If this is further corroborated by a book that's due to be published in the next month or two, then I see the term Asperger being dropped. I may have to edit the thread title to reflect it.

Edited April 21, 2018 by Ian J.

[chris p bacon]

I understand your thinking, but I'd wait until it's clear as it could easily be a controversial claim just to sell a book.

 

At present people understand the term 'Aspergers' and finding the thread is easy should they need some info.

[jjb1970]

To be honest I really didn't find this surprising. If you look at what was going on with the euthanasia program and the various medical experiments in the death camps, the role of doctors in the Eastern ghetto's etc it is very clear that a large part of the Austro-German medical profession was happy to embrace Nazism (for balance, the Soviets also never had any problems in that respect). And over the last couple of decades more and more of the "I didn't know" or "I resisted" excuses have fallen by the wayside.

[30801]

If this is further corroborated by a book that's due to be published in the next month or two, then I see the term Asperger being dropped. I may have to edit the thread title to reflect it.

Aspergers has been dropped as a diagnosis from the DSM for a while now.

You get Level One ASD or something instead. Makes it sound like you didn't try hard enough.

[Kickstart]

I am one of those who have difficulty with eye contact and wear dark glasses as a means of coping.

For me it is a learnt habit. Although often easier to look behind someone, just to the side of their eyes.

 

I believe (though I can't remember where I read/heard it) that about 30% or so of the population is towards introverted. Combine that with some U.S. research that indicated that as many as 1 in 68 of the population are believed to have autistic traits and I think you can see where I get such a correlation from.

Maybe down to my interests (computer programmer, bit of model railways, wargames, etc), but 1 in 68 seems like an incredibly low number to me.

 

Katy

[Ian J.]

Aspergers has been dropped as a diagnosis from the DSM for a while now.

You get Level One ASD or something instead. Makes it sound like you didn't try hard enough.

 

Actually I was advised by my assessor at my post-diagnosis follow-up to continue using the term 'Aspergers' despite it not being official any more, as the name is what the rest of the world still uses. In general though I don't use it, I prefer to say I have 'Subtle Autism' (my term, I was diagnosed with level one ASD).

Edited April 21, 2018 by Ian J.

[laurenceb]

I was diagnosed as high functioning Autistic

[laurenceb]

I have been accused of only seeing jokes by appointment    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/disability-46555014

[alfsboy]

My wife has diagnosed me  with ADHD ,She is normally pretty good at getting such things right and a quick check with my doc suggested she is on the right track .At 71 I am not going to lose sleep  about but it explains a lot like being  bored ta school unless I was interested ,going off projects half way through and moving on .I was rated intelligent and passed my 11 plus but at about the age of 13 or so it all went wrong .I am a bit annoyed for had I known I would have altered certain aspects of my life .Although I was good at military dioramas etc I would get bored half way through and give up .I was OK on  sculpting  and painting single figures .In the end I worked at F1  type models and some F1 journalism  and also painting brass locos ,and sculpting small figures .I would get bored with big ones and too much detail like hussars  kills me .Anatomy is all .I use to keep jobs about three years  before quitting and looking for another.Models always kept us in bread and even butter.

Edited December 15, 2018 by alfsboy