Oxford Rail announce OO gauge 6-wheeled GWR Toad Brake Van

[Nile]

From my previous post:

 

edit : axle length = 26.7mm, diameter = 2mm .

Edited November 19, 2017 by Nile

[Nile]

Here is the final batch of photos. Note these are over exposed by up to one stop due to the white background.

[Miss Prism]

And there you have it. The Oxford AA1 cabin end has been given the full bungalow ranch-style treatment from Planet Zog.

[tomparryharry]

And there you have it. The Oxford AA1 cabin end has been given the full bungalow ranch-style treatment from Planet Zog.

 

Hmm. Good to know I can pop along to B&Q for any replacement door handles. In fairness, the brake gear thus far is an improvement over what we've had for years. It's a big ask to come up to the current standard of the Hornby edition.

 

I'd suggest that we highlight what's right about the Hornby model. Any other competitor needs to understand that if the bar can be raised, then this is where the bar will go. Producing another sub-par model will only discourage other producers to come into the market, to the disadvantage of all.

 

Ian.

[BG John]

I'd suggest that we highlight what's right about the Hornby model. Any other competitor needs to understand that if the bar can be raised, then this is where the bar will go. Producing another sub-par model will only discourage other producers to come into the market, to the disadvantage of all.

My interest is in the 4-wheeler, not this one, but the bodies were almost identical. In fact I think the whole model will be identical, apart from not having the centre wheels. This particular model is unique in RTR models, as an early version without steel panelling, so there's no competition from Hornby or anyone else. Unless you count the old Tri-ang Hornby one, and in comparison with that the Oxford one could be considered perfect in every detail! No other RTR GWR brake van on the market is suitable for pre WW1 without very major surgery. So highlighting what's wrong with the Oxford one is important.

 

It looks as though all three end windows need drastic action, as they're the wrong size, or weren't windows at all.

What else?

[The Stationmaster]

 

And there you have it. The Oxford AA1 cabin end has been given the full bungalow ranch-style treatment from Planet Zog.

 

 

I could make a guess that if they scanned something GW brakevan like (a conversion therefrom perhaps?) that might well be what had happened to the vehicle end.   Clever research, wrong subject might well be the conclusion?  

 

All I hope is that this sort of sloppy, but no doubt cheap and quick, approach together with endless repeats of previous models with changed running numbers but incorrect detail and loss of the hi-fi end of the market is not the way the new regime and its 'consultant' are going to head Hornby railways.  Even with drastically educed prices (which I somehow doubt) they are going to damage the brand reputation almost as readily as 'design clever' did with the most abysmally mishandled piece of model railway marketing in recent history

[Miss Prism]

There's nothing clever about this, Mike. Zero, or at the most, profoundly dumb, research has produced an awful model.

 

John - the AA3 faults are listed in the AA3 thread.

[BG John]

John - the AA3 faults are listed in the AA3 thread.

I've just had a quick scan through the AA3 thread. Early on you said:

Looks like they have transferred the errors in the planked AA1 to the planked AA3.

Then on August 13th, you listed a variety of errors mainly in dates, liveries, and in sheeting, plus a few other errors mentioned in other places.

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/119217-oxford-rail-annouce-4-wheel-toad/page-5&do=findComment&comment=2819094

 

But there's little specifically about the fully planked version, which is what has just been released, which presumably has the same body as the AA3 will have. There's nothing I can see about the "full bungalow ranch-style treatment from Planet Zog" on the end. This is new to me, and Niles' photo is the first I've seen of it. There's some pretty major fiddly work involved in fixing it, from the few drawings and photos I've managed to find.

[Miss Prism]

There's nothing I can see about the "full bungalow ranch-style treatment from Planet Zog" on the end. This is new to me, and Niles' photo is the first I've seen of it.

 

Yes, and thankyou again, Nile, your pics have shown up new errors. The end window is the new howler from Oxford (the rear end was not shown in the previous production pic as seen a while back in Model Rail). I will update the AA3 error list when it appears, and which will presumably also have the fictitious window.

[BG John]

This photo of an AA3 on gwr.org.uk presumably shows what the end of an AA1 should be like too.

http://www.gwr.org.uk/notes/17539-aa3.jpg

 

It matches the drawing on page 199 of the combined Atkins, Beard et al, that shows the outer windows are one plank lower at the top than the inner "thing". They originally had a central horizontal glazing bar.

 

Was the "thing" in the middle ever a window? I had a feeling it was, but can't find a drawing that shows it. The BGS Data Sheet on the AA3 BG convertible of 1890 shows it with wood panelling. The Oxford one looks as though the guard who was allocated that van had taken one out of his house and installed it himself .

[tomparryharry]

Fictitious window?

 

Never!

 

The double glazing salesman was having a sale on. "Buy one, get one free...."

 

Thus far, I'm not too impressed. From the solebar down, it's pretty good. From the headstock up, there's a missed opportunity here. No doubt a company has agreed funds to develop this model, tooling, production, testing & evaluation, advertising, assembly, packaging & distribution. I don't doubt the integrity of the people involved. The signing off has allowed Oxford to produce a below-par model.  Research has let you down. The galling thing is this: There are hundreds of researchers out there on the web, who know the historical accuracy inside out, and back to front. The great majority of these researchers don't draw a salary; they do it for the prospect of seeing ever increasing fidelity in the models. To actually ask is not letting the company down; it's trying to achieve the highest possible standard in the model.

 

I'm trying to sound positive, but it's difficult.

 

Ian.

[The Fatadder]

Details aside, how accurate is the basic shape?

 

For the price I’m prepared to get a couple to improve, but only if the basic shape is there about. (Likewise I’m happy plateing over ends / sides, but wouldn’t want to have to add planking!)

[The Johnster]

I do not have the erudition to state that the 'thing in the middle' was ever a window in the sense of a glazed opening to let light in, never mind the twee bungalow version Ox have provided, but it was a window in the sense that it was a hinged wooden panel that could be opened, in order for the guard to access the tail lamp bracket when the van was running veranda leading, i.e. about half the time.  It opened inwards, so no trace of the hinges or handle is visible outside the van.

 

Mine will be modelled in the open position to enable viewing of a fully detailed interior, as will the veranda end door.  AFAIK all the glass window on toads were fixed and did not open.

[The Stationmaster]

I do not have the erudition to state that the 'thing in the middle' was ever a window in the sense of a glazed opening to let light in, never mind the twee bungalow version Ox have provided, but it was a window in the sense that it was a hinged wooden panel that could be opened, in order for the guard to access the tail lamp bracket when the van was running veranda leading, i.e. about half the time.  It opened inwards, so no trace of the hinges or handle is visible outside the van.

 

Mine will be modelled in the open position to enable viewing of a fully detailed interior, as will the veranda end door.  AFAIK all the glass window on toads were fixed and did not open.

 

Agree - as far as I know (and I have never seen one which was different in either the real world or in photos) it was simply a wooden panel which opened inwards to allow access to the tail lamp bracket.

[coachmann]

Faults on locomotives and carriages often stand out even before I start making comparisons with photos of the prototype. Wagons for some reason are different. When I look at a wagon, I have to wonder if it is correct on a wooden chassis or should it have a steel chassis. Only research unearths the truth. Then again i have to research to see if a van is a GWR or a BR derived version. 

 

Whatever the facts, this GWR 6-wheel goods brake looks like a GWR goods brake and I'll be buying a BR grey version. Maybe I will discover they left BR metals in the early 1950's and that the end needs modifying, but whatever goes on underneath the chassis that I can't see can stay as it is.  Experience tells me Oxford models are usually reliable, smooth runners and inexpensive. I certainly cannot complain about Oxford when I have had to ditch a number of dud performers from other RTR companies. I presume some people will buy a kit.

Edited November 20, 2017 by coachmann

[tomparryharry]

I do not have the erudition to state that the 'thing in the middle' was ever a window in the sense of a glazed opening to let light in, never mind the twee bungalow version Ox have provided, but it was a window in the sense that it was a hinged wooden panel that could be opened, in order for the guard to access the tail lamp bracket when the van was running veranda leading, i.e. about half the time.  It opened inwards, so no trace of the hinges or handle is visible outside the van.

 

Mine will be modelled in the open position to enable viewing of a fully detailed interior, as will the veranda end door.  AFAIK all the glass window on toads were fixed and did not open.

 The non-verandah end of your toad did in fact, is normally openable. I'm doing a restoration job on one, where the middle door is openable above the drawhook,  the two smaller windows open above the buufer headstocks. As you say, the two smaller windows left & right of the verandah middle door is fixed shut, and glazed in place. 

 

Ian.

[The Johnster]

 The non-verandah end of your toad did in fact, is normally openable. I'm doing a restoration job on one, where the middle door is openable above the drawhook,  the two smaller windows open above the buufer headstocks. As you say, the two smaller windows left & right of the verandah middle door is fixed shut, and glazed in place. 

 

Ian.

 

 

This is good news for my intended interior project, tph; one end window modelled open to give an even better view!  I assume they open inwards like the centre panel?

[BG John]

I suppose the Oxford CAD image they published early on should have set off alarm bells!

http://oxfordrail.com/76/picture_library/OR76TOA003.JPG

[TheSignalEngineer]

..................... Maybe I will discover they left BR metals in the early 1950's .............................

At least one was in Engineers' use until at least September 1955, see my earlier linked photo. 

 

One was photographed on the Halesowen Branch on what appears to be an Engineers train on Sunday 4th September 1955 

http://www.photobydjnorton.com/RailwayPictures/58143AppHunningtonViaductKM.jpg

 

Any advances on that date?

In my parallel universe it will survive for at least another four years. That picture is about 7 miles from my layout site, and on the other side of the van's probable home depot

[81C]

This might be where the ranch window came from I noticed it on the last RM Web tour this year and this photo confirms it I wonder who signed it off.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/svr_enthusiast/36632994895/

Edited November 20, 2017 by 81C

[tomparryharry]

This is good news for my intended interior project, tph; one end window modelled open to give an even better view!  I assume they open inwards like the centre panel?

Yes, you are quite correct.

 

Ian.

[tomparryharry]

This might be where the ranch window came from I noticed it on the last RM Web tour this year and this photo confirms it I wonder who signed it off.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/svr_enthusiast/36632994895/

 

The van would be shorter in length, but the room is needed for a hitchin' rail, and a spittoon....

[tomparryharry]

I suppose the Oxford CAD image they published early on should have set off alarm bells!

http://oxfordrail.com/76/picture_library/OR76TOA003.JPG

 

The bells were ringing, but no-one listened....

[lofty1966]

This might be where the ranch window came from I noticed it on the last RM Web tour this year and this photo confirms it I wonder who signed it off.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/svr_enthusiast/36632994895/

Who’s gonna be the first to hang some curtains in the double glazed bungalow window then ?

[81C]

Who’s gonna be the first to hang some curtains in the double glazed bungalow window then ?

Patio doors on the veranda with a BBQ, flower pots and an ivy covering any other error the thing might have.   

I pulled the one I have apart today and that window what should be a door is a 5 minute fix for me and for you as well with the modeling skills you have.