wombatofludham Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 I done a test with this earlier at work in my team of 11 people, I asked who had heard of the National Railway Museum? 2 had, but had never visited (didnt know where it was). I then asked if they had heard of Flying Scotsman, all said yes. I told them that the NRM own Flying Scotsman, I then noticed some of my team on the net looking at the NRM's website, and one of them had clicked right through to the Flying Scotsman souvenirs page. And there you have it in one paragraph. The fact that Flying Scotsman has been all over the television, social media and news outlets like a dose of the clap around Catterick Barracks and only two people had heard of the NRM until you pointed out the connection to what is supposed to be an ambassadorial advertising masterstroke for the Museum. It's not really achieving that recognition for Brand NRM that some seem to think it is. Pretty much confirms my belief that Joe and Joanna Normal seeing the loco do not recognise it as part of the National Collection and therefore are unlikely to consider visiting the NRM or buying any products associated with it unless they happen to see something fall out of a magazine - or someone tells them to their face as you did. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 40-something Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 And there you have it in one paragraph. The fact that Flying Scotsman has been all over the television, social media and news outlets like a dose of the clap around Catterick Barracks and only two people had heard of the NRM until you pointed out the connection to what is supposed to be an ambassadorial advertising masterstroke for the Museum. It's not really achieving that recognition for Brand NRM that some seem to think it is. Pretty much confirms my belief that Joe and Joanna Normal seeing the loco do not recognise it as part of the National Collection and therefore are unlikely to consider visiting the NRM or buying any products associated with it unless they happen to see something fall out of a magazine - or someone tells them to their face as you did. The general public wont know that Flying Scotsman is part of the National Collection, same with any loco they see. Spending £6.8 on another loco, or 2 or 3 would have the same effect, ie the public wont know. However, chances are more people may make a point of going to see Flying Scotsman than another steam loco, more people will pay to travel behind Flying Scotsman, and there is more chance of them finding out about the NRM by doing so. If they show an interest then they may google Flying Scotsman, which will take them to the loco's website, which is an NRM website. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 At least, as the cameras were attached to Flying Scotsman, it's the one locomotive you won't get a proper view of. Don't count on it! The "Country Bus" programme had plenty of long shot segments showing the bus perambulating the Dales, they'll do the same to make sure you see Flying Scotsman and there will also be plenty of drone shots to pep things up too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted December 2, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 2, 2016 Before you start rushing to judgement of people "moaning" lacking "vision, drive and enthusiasm" you should check out your facts. For all you know those of us criticising the NRM's spending of resources on an entertainment project rather than it's core remit might well be involved in other visionary projects and be driven to do something about it, in areas less glamourous or popular with the public. There was no "vision" or "drive" to acquire Flying Scotsman, it was pandering to a populist agenda to favour a not particularly outstanding example of locomotive design with an excessive amount of financial and management resource in a sector suffering from financial pressures even before the austerity programme. The real vision and drive would have been to resist the clamour for popularity and fame, and instead to direct resources to less popular areas which help fulfil the NRM core remit of education Speaking as a lifelong railway enthusiast, I can see where you are coming from and I personally find the less glamorous aspects of our railway history just as interesting, if not more so, than the more obvious excitement of a big, famous express loco. I also accept that people who feel that way are in the minority. Taking my railway enthusiast hat off and putting myself in the shoes of a member of the general public with no particular railway interest, I cannot see any merit in the idea that big, glamorous, famous Flying Scotsman must be a bad thing and a humdrum, workaday project must be a good one. To most people, the sight and sound of a big express loco at the head of a train is as good as railways get. I am not particularly a Gresley fan, my interests lying more in the artistry of J G Robinson but the Gresley A1/A3 cannot be dismissed as "not particularly outstanding" in terms of design. They were the first successful class of Pacifics, which apart from the GWR became the standard top link class in the country. Once tweaked, they became a superb design and in the later form, as Flying Scotsman is, they were as good as anything that ran in the country. There is also the fact that the LNER is poorly represented in preservation compared to the other "Big 4" companies, so having at least one of the class around has to be a good thing. I have known a number of people involved in restoration and preservation, as well as new build projects. The people I know and have known would always be very vociferous in support of their own projects but I have never, ever, heard any of them attacking the projects of other people. It is just not regarded as "the done thing". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Dream on, the vast majority of the TV audience really couldn't give a damn and Flying Scotsman is, I believe, capable of being driven slowly.... How hard can this be. The Flying Scotsman is the most famous locomotive in the country, it will draw the largest audience. . The vast majority of the viewing public won't be watching. If it was ITV showing this programme then I would agree. It's not, it's BBC Four which is not dependant on viewing figures. Even with Flying Scotsman you are talking about a few thousand viewers who would probably watch it if it had an industrial tank or diesel. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 Is there a single person who has contributed to the purchase of Flying Scotsman who didn't have a free choice as to whether they wanted to part with their money? Whether it be by purchasing a lottery ticket or by making a direct donation, each of us had a choice. If any of us wants to have a problem with how the lottery people decide to spend their money, that is a separate matter. There have been many grant applications declined and some that I thought were a waste of space approved but we can all object by not buying tickets. As in all such major projects, like Tornado, Prince of Wales etc. there are always going to be some people who would prefer that efforts and funding go into something else. I often find that in life, there are two sorts of people. Those who have the vision, drive and enthusiasm to get on and achieve things and those who will moan about them not doing something else instead. I was replying to the notion that all the money spent on Flying Scotsman was donated specifically for Flying Scotsman when it clearly wasn't. Was the Lottery money well spent? I don't think so. I think it was very poor value for money when you consider how much it cost compared to other projects. How much did Tornado cost for example? As for other projects, I contribute financially to two "new build" projects. Neither of which is reliant on Lottery money. But that's my choice. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 The vast majority of the viewing public won't be watching. If it was ITV showing this programme then I would agree. It's not, it's BBC Four which is not dependant on viewing figures. Even with Flying Scotsman you are talking about a few thousand viewers who would probably watch it if it had an industrial tank or diesel. Jason Whatever Jason, if you want to throw a tantrum because they've used the wrong loco, fine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 It's not a tantrum. I'm just fed up with having Flying Scotsman constantly rammed down our throats when there are other locomotives available. It's not even like it was a unique locomotive, just one of a class of virtually identical ones. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimbus Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 It's not even like it was a unique locomotive, just one of a class of virtually identical ones. But it is now! The Nim. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted December 5, 2016 Share Posted December 5, 2016 The vast majority of the viewing public won't be watching. If it was ITV showing this programme then I would agree. It's not, it's BBC Four which is not dependant on viewing figures. Even with Flying Scotsman you are talking about a few thousand viewers who would probably watch it if it had an industrial tank or diesel. Jason Much more interesting if it had been an industrial tank or diesel They could have used a Peckett W4, or a Sentinel 4DH....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted December 5, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 5, 2016 I have an idea. Why don't those who have such deep felt objections to Flying Scotsman just ignore both the TV program and the loco. If they don't think about it, perhaps their angst will subside after a while. They are quite entitled to hold their views. We know how they feel. We know they won't change their minds and quite frankly, I can do without all the negativity. My problem is really with so called railway enthusiasts making dreadfully negative comments about projects that others support. What exactly does that achieve for anybody? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesg Posted December 13, 2016 Share Posted December 13, 2016 Just saw a teaser trailer for the programme on BBC Four. A short trailer might not be much to go by, but the point is made of it being filmed on the Severn Valley Railway - hopefully an indicator that the programme is as much about the line as the locomotive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
2750Papyrus Posted December 13, 2016 Share Posted December 13, 2016 I shall watch it as one of my neighbours has been involved with it. It's a shame it's the Flying Scotsman rather than say Bradley Manor or the 14xx and Autocoach. But hopefully with a the input from a railway professional and an enthusiast, it should be quite good. So how many people would watch it if it were an engine most people had never heard of? I think the amount of money wasted on the overhaul was a disgrace. But if we wish to attract more people to our hobbies, what better loco to use as bait - partticularly during a holiday period.? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted December 13, 2016 Share Posted December 13, 2016 Probably the same that will watch it anyway. I think everyone is taking people that watch BBC Four to be unaware of railways, they aren't. They repeated Ian Hislop's programme on Dr Beeching the other night. They show The Titfield Thunderbolt on a regular basis. They've had countless programmes on railways. What was the name of the canal boat or the number of the bus? No idea. They were just called All Aboard! The Canal Trip and All Aboard! The Country Bus. So why not All Aboard! The Branch Line Train? Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Colin_McLeod Posted December 14, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 14, 2016 I think the amount of money wasted on the overhaul was a disgrace. Here we go again! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60159 Posted December 14, 2016 Share Posted December 14, 2016 What miseries some people are. Sit back, relax and enjoy the program. If you don't like it, switch it off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
2750Papyrus Posted December 14, 2016 Share Posted December 14, 2016 Here we go again! I used these words only as a form of shorthand to try and avoid revisiting the overhaul topic, the problems of which have been well documented. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted December 14, 2016 Share Posted December 14, 2016 Enough on the perennial arguments please. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Colin_McLeod Posted December 14, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 14, 2016 I used these words only as a form of shorthand to try and avoid revisiting the overhaul topic, the problems of which have been well documented. I agree with Andy York. As for avoiding the topic you are the one who revisited it. I As Basil Fawlty said "don't mention the war" then the same Basil Fawlty nevertheless goes on about it. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yfl6Lu3xQW0 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelson Jackson Posted December 14, 2016 Share Posted December 14, 2016 Thanks for the heads up, I look forward to watching this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted December 17, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2016 I'm not interested in A3's or Flying Scotsman, but clearly many people are. I think this thread is less about the forthcoming TV show than it is about the NRM, their management of the FS restoration and perhaps a touch of resentment towards those people who enjoy seeing steam trains and who have heard of FS but who aren't rail enthusiasts. FS wouldn't be my choice for either this program or for much else but it is pretty clear that as an iconic locomotive that TV producers and the NRM have perfectly sound reasons for milking it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Flying Scotsman: 16 miles in 60 seconds. A sort of London To Brighton in 4 Minutes version for those that don't like "Slow TV", http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/video_and_audio/features/magazine-38392347/38392347 Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Colin_McLeod Posted December 25, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 25, 2016 Now I have seen the programme! Good old BBC. Relaxed version later this week. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chameleon Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 I was under the impression there is commentary from the crew about the loco and the line etc so it should be much more interesting than just a journey along the line. Like the canal boat or bus trip programmes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted December 25, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 25, 2016 The one journey was great, my 2 year old son loved it, watching it repeatedly this morning. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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