Cromford Wharf Shunting layout - structures and scenery

[Alister_G]

Any more progress on the track and scenery?

 

Gordon A

 

Hi Gordon,

 

I'm just awaiting the delivery of some switches and wire, so hope to start wiring up the track this weekend.

 

I haven't had a lot of time this week to do as much as I'd hoped.

 

Al.

[Middlepeak]

The last two look like MR tenders.

Yes they are and they were used in the 1960s after the line was severed at Middleton Incline and water was brought in from Buxton each day. With no inclines to tackle, the centre axle did not need to be removed, although they must have created quite a squeal going round the curve at Gotham!

 

Regards

 

Geraint

 

 

Edited May 5, 2017 by Middlepeak

[Alister_G]

Last night I had a go with my Silhouette cutter to produce some tender side frames reminiscent of the McConnell ones.

 

This is three layers:

 

 

which when laminated together, produce one side frame:

 

 

 

I'll leave this to harden, and then add some springs and axle boxes.

 

Al.

[Alister_G]

On the subject of laminations, this evening I made a start on the wiring, by building the control panel for the turnouts.

 

I decided in the end to go for electrically operated points using a CDU and Seep point motors.

 

The control panel is made from two sheets of 60thou styrene, one white, and the other clear, with a printed paper track diagram sandwiched between them:

 

 

 

 

I will start to wire all this up tomorrow.

 

Thanks for looking,

 

Al.

[Andrew P]

It amazes me Al, how you can SWITCH from one job to another, hahaha.        

 

Nice work and clever idea on the panel mate.

[Alister_G]

Well I seriously underestimated the time it would take me to wire things up.

 

I've put short tails on ten of these:

 

 

and I've continued with the control panel, adding the point indication LEDs and relays:

 

 

and the CDU

 

 

I did a test yesterday with temporary wiring to check the operation of the point position indicators:

 

 

and now I'm starting to add all the permanent wiring. So far, I've managed to do all the common returns:

 

 

I'm suffering from neck and shoulder ache now, so I'm giving up for the evening.

 

It's exactly a month since I started this, and to be honest I thought I would be further along than I am at this point.

 

Thanks for looking,

 

Al.

[Andrew P]

Well I seriously underestimated the time it would take me to wire things up.

 

I've put short tails on ten of these:

 

wiring-cromford004.jpg

 

and I've continued with the control panel, adding the point indication LEDs and relays:

 

wiring-cromford005.jpg

 

and the CDU

 

wiring-cromford006.jpg

 

I did a test yesterday with temporary wiring to check the operation of the point position indicators:

 

wiring-cromford007.jpg

 

and now I'm starting to add all the permanent wiring. So far, I've managed to do all the common returns:

 

wiring-cromford008.jpg

 

I'm suffering from neck and shoulder ache now, so I'm giving up for the evening.

 

It's exactly a month since I started this, and to be honest I thought I would be further along than I am at this point.

 

Thanks for looking,

 

Al.

TBH Al, I would call it good fast and quality progress mate, superb.

[emt_911]

You can't rush quality work Al.

 

Looking good.

[mjcampbell]

I'm pretty much at the same point with my layout that I started about 5-6 weeks ago, and that's much smaller and only has 4 points, so I think you're doing fine!

 

Wiring takes a while, but I quite enjoy it. It's kinda therapeutic, just connecting wires up. 

 

What are the point indicator circuits? It looks like a relay is involved. And are you using passing contact switches? Why 2-pole?

[Alister_G]

Hi Michael,

 

Thanks for the encouragement!

 

I was feeling a bit fed up, but really when I take stock I've got a lot done in the first month, so shouldn't complain.

 

The point indicator modules are just a latching DPDT relay, on a circuit board with screw terminals for convenience. No special circuitry.

 

I'm using centre-off non-latching DPDT toggle switches, one set of poles for the 12V feed to the latching relay, and the other set of poles for the 16V output of the CDU to the point motors.

 

It adds to the complication of the wiring, but it should look good and work well.

 

Cheers,

 

Al.

[Signaller69]

Hi Al,

Your control panel looks a neat piece of workmanship, might pinch the clear plastic covering idea next time I build or upgrade one.

 

You are making much faster progress with your layout than I am with mine so I wouldn't worry too much!

[Alister_G]

A bit more progress on the wiring.

 

All the power feeds are done on the control board, and the first switch, LEDs and module are completely wired up.

 

Here's the first module:

 

 

and the switch and LEDs:

 

 

and the board with power applied:

 

 

So, each switch has two LEDs associated with it. Each of the LEDs are a three-legged dual output device. One lead has a red LED, another lead has a green LED, and the centre lead is the common return. The two LEDs are wired in parallel with the output of the PPI module, but the connections are crossed, so power from one output goes to the red side on one LED and the green side on the other.

 

What you get is this.

 

If the switch is switched upwards, to set the points normal, then the top LED is green, and the bottom one is red. 

 

 

if the switch is switched downwards, to set the points across the crossover, then the top LED is red, and the bottom one is green.

 

 

The bottom LED of this pair is not positioned very well, and I should really move it to the other side of the switch, on the diagonal, so that it is clear that the crossover is in use. I may do that yet.

 

The other LEDs on the board are better positioned.

 

That's all for now,

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Al.

[bescotbeast]

A bit more progress on the wiring.

 

All the power feeds are done on the control board, and the first switch, LEDs and module are completely wired up.

 

Here's the first module:

 

wiring-cromford009.jpg

 

and the switch and LEDs:

 

wiring-cromford010.jpg

 

and the board with power applied:

 

wiring-cromford011.jpg

 

So, each switch has two LEDs associated with it. Each of the LEDs are a three-legged dual output device. One lead has a red LED, another lead has a green LED, and the centre lead is the common return. The two LEDs are wired in parallel with the output of the PPI module, but the connections are crossed, so power from one output goes to the red side on one LED and the green side on the other.

 

What you get is this.

 

If the switch is switched upwards, to set the points normal, then the top LED is green, and the bottom one is red. 

 

wiring-cromford012.jpg

 

if the switch is switched downwards, to set the points across the crossover, then the top LED is red, and the bottom one is green.

 

wiring-cromford013.jpg

 

The bottom LED of this pair is not positioned very well, and I should really move it to the other side of the switch, on the diagonal, so that it is clear that the crossover is in use. I may do that yet.

 

The other LEDs on the board are better positioned.

 

That's all for now,

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Al.

clever work Al, most of it's over my head but it looks great in action from the pictures.

[Andrew P]

That looks good Al, great looking panel, will you make up similar panels for Bakewell and Grindleford?

[Mrkirtley800]

Looks good Al, although I have no idea what you have actually done. I am afraid bicycle lamp electrics are my limit.

Derek

[Alister_G]

That looks good Al, great looking panel, will you make up similar panels for Bakewell and Grindleford?

 

Hi mate, yes, I probably will, although I might refine the method slightly - I didn't really leave enough room for the LEDs to be fitted, through making the diagram quite cramped. If I do it again, I would make the diagram taller and spread the tracks out a bit.

 

Al.

[Alister_G]

Looks good Al, although I have no idea what you have actually done. I am afraid bicycle lamp electrics are my limit.

Derek

 

Thanks Derek, this is really small bicycle lamps...

 

Al.

[freebs]

Like Derek has said, this has really bamboozled me, but looks pretty impressive

[Stubby47]

Can I ask where you got the relays from and how much they are ?  (I did do a quick trawl of the previous posts but didn't see this info).

Ta

[Alister_G]

Can I ask where you got the relays from and how much they are ?  (I did do a quick trawl of the previous posts but didn't see this info).

Ta

 

Sorry Stu, I didn't actually say.

 

The ones shown are these at a fiver each:

 

https://www.modellingelectronics.co.uk/products/Single-points-position-indicator.php

 

However, they do take up a fair bit of room, and I would probably go for a multi-way one if doing it again.

 

Heathcote do a four-way one, the "Point Indicator Relay" at the bottom of this page:

 

https://www.heathcote-electronics.co.uk/point-indicator.html

 

and Block Signalling do an 8-way here:

 

http://www.blocksignalling.co.uk/index.php/shop/product/view/4/5

 

Hope this is helpful,

 

Al.

Edited May 10, 2017 by acg_mr

[Stubby47]

Al,

 

Very helpful, thanks (now drifting off to think about automating everything on the layout....)

[mjcampbell]

Never come across those indicator circuits before. Neat, but with 4 points on my current layout, I can probably live without on this one!

 

So, the motor is wired from the switch? Do you have to toggle back to the centre off after throwing the point?

[Alister_G]

Never come across those indicator circuits before. Neat, but with 4 points on my current layout, I can probably live without on this one!

 

So, the motor is wired from the switch? Do you have to toggle back to the centre off after throwing the point?

 

Hi Michael, yes, that's right, the live feed from the CDU goes to the central terminal on the switch, and the two coils (normal and reversed) of the point motor come off the outer terminals. The toggle switch is non-latching, so is sprung to return to the centre (off) position when released.

 

Al.

[freebs]

I think I'll just stick to pushing my trains round with my hand and making "choo choo" noises...

[Alister_G]

Al,

 

Very helpful, thanks (now drifting off to think about automating everything on the layout....)

 

Yep

 

That's the problem with looking through websites like for instance the Block Signalling one above.

 

You start off wanting a single servo motor, and then you start reading the product descriptions, and the next thing you know, you're planning a fully automated computer controlled layout with block detection, signalling, station stops, shuttle working and Uncle Tom Cobley, all on a 3 foot shunting plank...

 

Sigh...

 

Al.