RMweb Gold rodent279 Posted May 19, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 19, 2018 (edited) Wasn't aware of this, but it seems NR is looking at realigning the Dawlish sea wall line out into the sea. https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-news/plans-confirmed-extend-dawlish-line-1583106.amp?__twitter_impression=true Don't think this is covered in another thread-feel free to delete or merge if it is. Edited May 19, 2018 by rodent279 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
locoholic Posted May 19, 2018 Share Posted May 19, 2018 Wasn't aware of this, but it seems NR is looking at realigning the Dawlish sea wall line or into the sea. https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-news/plans-confirmed-extend-dawlish-line-1583106.amp?__twitter_impression=true Don't think this is covered in another thread-feel free to delete or merge if it is. So Brunel made the initial mistake of putting the line along the shore. Network Rail are going one better and moving it out into the sea... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium John M Upton Posted May 19, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 19, 2018 Possibly one of the daftest ideas I have heard for a long time! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
black and decker boy Posted May 19, 2018 Share Posted May 19, 2018 So reading the article it’s not the Dawlish section (which they intend to further strengthen) but the Teignmouth section where the bigger risk is the unstable cliffs behind and above the running lines. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
009 micro modeller Posted May 19, 2018 Share Posted May 19, 2018 Looks from the article as though this is more to prevent problems with falling rocks, but I wonder if it has the potential to make the flooding issues worse... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rivercider Posted May 19, 2018 Share Posted May 19, 2018 So reading the article it’s not the Dawlish section (which they intend to further strengthen) but the Teignmouth section where the bigger risk is the unstable cliffs behind and above the running lines. Me & Mrs Rivercider have walked along the coast path quite a few times, and I have noticed that there have been a number of long standing worksites, due to cliff slippage, in the section nearer to Teignmouth cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianusa Posted May 19, 2018 Share Posted May 19, 2018 This is not the first time this project has been mooted, probably the first time the local MP has heard about it! As another MP puts it, " he'll believe it when he sees it", so what with a dearth of spare cash, he may well be right. Has any geological, meteorological input been considered; one would hope so as this are is wide open to problems as is well known and to move the railway further into the danger zone doesn't make a lot of sense. Just put the whole line in a concrete tunnel and have done with it! Brian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold rodent279 Posted May 19, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted May 19, 2018 This is not the first time this project has been mooted, probably the first time the local MP has heard about it! As another MP puts it, " he'll believe it when he sees it", so what with a dearth of spare cash, he may well be right. Has any geological, meteorological input been considered; one would hope so as this are is wide open to problems as is well known and to move the railway further into the danger zone doesn't make a lot of sense. Just put the whole line in a concrete tunnel and have done with it! Brian. Concrete the whole beach and fill in the bay, I say! That'll give the journos at the Guardian a field day! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted May 19, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 19, 2018 This is not the first time this project has been mooted, probably the first time the local MP has heard about it! As another MP puts it, " he'll believe it when he sees it", so what with a dearth of spare cash, he may well be right. Has any geological, meteorological input been considered; one would hope so as this are is wide open to problems as is well known and to move the railway further into the danger zone doesn't make a lot of sense. Just put the whole line in a concrete tunnel and have done with it! Brian. Agreed, this idea was being floated (sorry) a couple of years ago, at least. The idea of cut and cover (without the need for any cut) may well become necessary relatively soon if sea levels rise at even half the predicted rate. John 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
009 micro modeller Posted May 20, 2018 Share Posted May 20, 2018 This is not the first time this project has been mooted, probably the first time the local MP has heard about it! As another MP puts it, " he'll believe it when he sees it", so what with a dearth of spare cash, he may well be right. Has any geological, meteorological input been considered; one would hope so as this are is wide open to problems as is well known and to move the railway further into the danger zone doesn't make a lot of sense. Just put the whole line in a concrete tunnel and have done with it! Brian. A couple of years ago there was a vague suggestion of rebuilding the Southern Railway route over Dartmoor, but I don't think much came of that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianusa Posted May 20, 2018 Share Posted May 20, 2018 A couple of years ago there was a vague suggestion of rebuilding the Southern Railway route over Dartmoor, but I don't think much came of that. There have been several comments both pro and con about this in previous topics on RM web. Some MPs got hold of it and there it lies! Brian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted May 20, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 20, 2018 There have been several comments both pro and con about this in previous topics on RM web. Some MPs got hold of it and there it lies! Brian. MPs and Lies in the same sentence... sounds about right! Andi 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCB Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Putting the SR line back sounds like the best idea. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Concrete the whole beach and fill in the bay, I say! That'll give the journos at the Guardian a field day! Ssssh. Gees, can't you guys keep a secret! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Out to sea? Perhaps a development of this concept is being studied? Or perhaps not... 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted May 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 21, 2018 If the Exmouth line was upgraded they could build a bridge/causeway from there to Teignmouth and solve a few problems in one stroke! Mike. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickC Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Putting the SR line back sounds like the best idea. Only if you want to add two reversals and increase the journey time to Cornwall by 20 minutes or so! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tomparryharry Posted May 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 21, 2018 Get the speed up, and get a ramp..... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 (edited) There have been several comments both pro and con about this in previous topics on RM web. Some MPs got hold of it and there it lies! Brian. According to SW local TV, teens of millions have been authorised for site investigation work, which is already in hand - there was film of a core drilling team at work. The emphasis was on the unstable cliff section, which apparently already has continuous ground stability monitoring, linked to railway control. Regards, John Isherwood. Edited May 21, 2018 by cctransuk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted May 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 21, 2018 (edited) According to SW local TV, teens of millions have been authorised for site investigation work, which is already in hand - there was film of a core drilling team at work. The emphasis was on the unstable cliff section, which apparently already has continuous ground stability monitoring, linked to railway control. Regards, John Isherwood. The only fully effective solution to the present and future problems affecting the coastal section is to build a big, strong reinforced concrete cover over the whole shooting match. Protection from storm and sea action, protection from rock falls, Job done. It won't look pretty though, so it won't happen until the situation becomes desperate. John Edited May 21, 2018 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted May 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 21, 2018 (edited) Only if you want to add two reversals and increase the journey time to Cornwall by 20 minutes or so! True (at least partly) but fast forward fifty years to sea levels a metre higher and the current railway suffering damage/closure much more frequently. Twenty minutes extra on the train, or replacement coach travel from Tiverton Parkway increasingly becoming the norm. Anyone travelling west of Exeter by train currently can't be in much of a hurry anyway. I live in Honiton and can be in Truro by car as quick as I can get to Plymouth by train using the existing "fast" route. Anybody that needs to get to Cornwall really quickly from further afield flies to Newquay. Reversals aren't really an issue on todays unitised railway, they are accomplished through a crew change with the replacement driver standing in the appropriate place or the driver simply walking to the other end. Either is easily done within the leisurely station stops at Exeter St. David's and Plymouth. OK there'll be a couple of miles going back the way you came but ultimately, the seaward route will become indefensible and there won't be much choice.. John Edited May 21, 2018 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickC Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 (edited) True (at least partly) but fast forward fifty years to sea levels a metre higher and the current railway suffering damage/closure much more frequently. Twenty minutes extra on the train, or replacement coach travel from Tiverton Parkway becoming the norm. Anyone travelling west of Exeter by train currently can't be in much of a hurry anyway. I live in Honiton and can be in Truro by car as quick as I can get to Plymouth by train using the existing "fast" route. John Please supply references to any genuine scientific studies that suggest a sea level rise of a metre in the Dawlish area within the next 50 years! I believe your figure is something suggested that might happen somewhere in the world in the next 500-2000 years if temperatures rise. Edited May 21, 2018 by NickC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted May 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 21, 2018 (edited) Please supply references to any genuine scientific studies that suggest a sea level rise of a metre in the Dawlish area within the next 50 years! I believe your figure is something suggested that might happen in the next 500-2000 years if temperatures rise. It isn't the mean sea level that causes the problems. Even 20cm on that would be enough to put a metre onto storm tides and place the existence of the GW route in jeopardy, with a statistical probability of an event comparable with the one that ripped Dawlish apart occurring every other winter. However the timescale pans out, the eventual choice is likely to be the SR route or no railway west of Exeter. Best to get on with it before any more of it gets built on or it will be rendered useless in the same way as the Teign Valley and the 1936 GWR inland route plan.. John Edited May 21, 2018 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Dawlish suffered a sea wall failure, Teignmouth is expected to suffer from damage from the cliffs. Taking the line out to sea doesn't sound so daft if you think it will solve the two issues that stretch of line faces. Any construction will take account of expected rises in sea level within a reasonable period and be designed to withstand gale force weather impacts on the sea. Probably going to be quicker to deliver an over sea route than an inland route with all the planning permissions, enquiries and Nimbys to contend with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickC Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 The only really sensible alternative to the costal route, if one is required, is to finally build the direct route to Newton Abbott under Haldon hill. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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