Hornby dublo

[Legend]

The colours to me just smack of Hornby Dublo. Just my view but if you paint them something different , even if more realistic, you are going to lose a part of that Hornby Dublo charm .    I'm the same with Triang and Triang- Hornby stuff . Maroon engine sheds , or later Hornby bright red ones!

[Il Grifone]

The colours to me just smack of Hornby Dublo. Just my view but if you paint them something different , even if more realistic, you are going to lose a part of that Hornby Dublo charm .    I'm the same with Triang and Triang- Hornby stuff . Maroon engine sheds , or later Hornby bright red ones!

 

The maroon was at least an approximation of brick and the roofs and platforms were grey (slate/concete). The bright red ones were somewhat less realistic of course!

 

I preferred the Trix Manyways of concrete design/colour and extremely versatile. They were rather expensive (typically Trix!), but then so were Dublo stations.

[Golden Fleece 30]

The maroon was at least an approximation of brick and the roofs and platforms were grey (slate/concete). The bright red ones were somewhat less realistic of course!

 

I preferred the Trix Manyways of concrete design/colour and extremely versatile. They were rather expensive (typically Trix!), but then so were Dublo stations.

I liked the Trix arched roof canopy which was die-cast and have a few, which may one day end up on my TT layout.  I did not like the tinplate buildings which did just look like a sheet of metal with holes punched in, nothing like a building as such and wooden platforms with a tinplate wall nailed on with panel pins.  There looked to be a bit of a copy between the Dublo wooden stations and the Trix ones in the early days.

 

Garry

[sagaguy]

Trix Manyways stations are cheaper & easier to find than Dublo counterparts but the platform spacings are wrong for HD track.If you have Micheal Fosters history of Hornby dublo,you will find a drawing in there of the dimensions of the city station.I built one from thse in the mid 80s but it got broken in a house move.I suppose i could build another one but i have no room on the layout for it.Here`s a photo of it.

 

 

                              

 

                              

 

                 Ray.

[Wolseley]

The colours to me just smack of Hornby Dublo. Just my view but if you paint them something different , even if more realistic, you are going to lose a part of that Hornby Dublo charm ..............

 

 

Which is the thought I keep having every time I think of what to do with them.  I get the feeling that I'll stick to the original Dublo colours with maybe a few minor changes.  The through station is rather plain when viewed from the back, so I might do something with that, but not so that it looks too fiddly.

[Golden Fleece 30]

Talking of painting I am a little disappointed with Fox Transfers. A few weeks ago I bought some W/B/W for my BR J72 and the corners did not match the straight lines with the white width greater on the straight. I wrote to them 2 weeks ago and still no reply. They are quick at everything else but not helping with issues or problems.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

Some nice Hornby Dublo here, sadly the layout has been scrapped as far as I know.  This is what i call a layout :-)

 

https://www.facebook.com/harrowmrc/

 

Garry

 

ps  Looking at the site there are a few photos showing it broken up but some lovely B/W photos from 1991 and some good colour dublo tankers etc.

Edited October 17, 2018 by Golden Fleece 30

[GoingUnderground]

Some nice Hornby Dublo here, sadly the layout has been scrapped as far as I know.  This is what i call a layout :-)

 

https://www.facebook.com/harrowmrc/

 

Garry

As I understand it, the layout was in the home of a Harrow MRC member, Norman, IIRC, who used to work at Harrow Model Shop. I was in Harrow Model Shop back in the days when it was still in central Harrow, and one of the sales assistants told me that his colleague, Norman, had a layout which occupied much of his house, and ran from room to room through holes in the walls, sorry, I mean tunnels. Norman came over and joined in the conversation and showed me various photos of the layout. Sadly, he died several years ago, and the layout was removed so that the house could be sold. I wouldn't be surprised if it was scrapped as it will have fitted that house exactly, and I doubt that Harrow MRC could have afforded to buy the house, which I believe was somewhere between Hindes Road and Harrow-on-the-Hill Metropolitan Line station.

[Nearholmer]

Brilliant.

 

Unless I'm mistaken, there are 'serving hatch" windows between the rooms in that photo.

 

I'm guessing he was a single chap; I can't imagine any SWMBO permitting that lot!

[GoingUnderground]

Brilliant.

 

Unless I'm mistaken, there are 'serving hatch" windows between the rooms in that photo.

 

I'm guessing he was a single chap; I can't imagine any SWMBO permitting that lot!

I believe he was, indeed, single. The "serving hatches" would have been to communicate with colleagues operating other parts of the layout in the adjoining rooms.

 

The Tube map on the wall is unusual in that it shows the Northern line "Northern Heights" extension, which I think dates the map to somewhere between 1938 and 1950.

Edited October 17, 2018 by GoingUnderground

[Golden Fleece 30]

Working my way clearing up ready for my new TT layout to come, hopefully Friday, I came across these ready to put into storage for a rainy day when I am not busy with the TT.  The blue and green boxes are all spare Dublo chassis, there were more I found later. It maybe I start to off load some as I doubt I will ever get around to using many of these as I am thinking of selling a lot of Dublo locos etc off in the not too distant future.

 

What I forgot to photograph was a box full of A4's, a box full of Duchess/city's and a few more R1's.

 

The Royal Scot is a Bristol models kit which is very nice and fitted to an R1 chassis.

 

The B1 is a Replica body again on an R1 chassis with A4 valve gear. 61176 was chosen because I have a photo of me stood alongside the real one in the mid 60's, transfers not varnished over yet.

 

The V2 is Bachmann on the R1 chassis with A4 valve gear, its number is one I photographed near the B1. 

 

The Jubilee is a Jamieson one on a Castle chassis which I did not assemble it was bought like that with the tender. When bought the chassis was not included but the tender was 3-railed ready. All I can take credit for here is putting some valve gear on.

 

A Duchess horsehoe motor in good condition, (rewound? I don't know).

 

There are quite a few more but no time for photos.

 

Garry

Edited October 17, 2018 by Golden Fleece 30

[Golden Fleece 30]

Regarding the Harrow layout above I had not realised it was 3-rail with "brass" pins through the sleepers.  Some of the best views are if you go to the 120 mobile up load photos.  A dream layout it was.

 

Garry

[Il Grifone]

Hi Garry,

 

The horseshoe Duchess does look like it has been rewound - the red wire is a clue. Possibly at Binns Road, as the 500pF mica capacitor looks like the type fitted to later models. The first suppressor capacitors were the waxed paper type (0.01μF IIRC), but I believe the early chassis didn't even have these.

 

I've only got two of three boxes of odd chassis and dead armatures....

 

David

[MikeCW]

Garry, that will be a treasure trove for someone if you decide to sell off the boxes that you've illustrated in Post 361.  Over the years I cannibalised a few Hornby Dublo locomotives for various projects, some of which even came off!  And  I acquired a few non-runners and wrecks.  The left-over parts filled one modest box - nothing like your own "parts department".  About 5 or 6 years ago, in one of those "I've got too much stuff and too many projects and not enough years" moments, like a bloo silly fool I binned the lot and have kicked myself regularly over the last year or so.  I'm now occasionally forking out good money for non-runners and wrecks to provide parts for projects.  Such is life.

 

May I ask a question about the Bristol Models Scot on the R1 chassis in the 5th photo.  The driving wheels line up well with the engine splashers and the whole ensemble "holds together" very well.  Has the R1 wheelbase been stretched between the leading and centre drivers, a modification I believe you've made in the past?  I ask because the wheelbase looks longer than those of the B1 and V2, which are also on the R1 mechanism.

 

Something which appeals to me about the layouts and stock featured on this thread (and the TT Next Big Thing topic which I try to keep an eye on) is that they are interesting.  Many (not all - some of my friends have inspiring layouts) of the current 00 layouts I see illustrated in the mainstream model press or at an occasional local exhibition, are populated with the latest, unmodified, out-of-the-box offerings of the trade from Chinese factories and as a result have a sameness and sterility about them.  They are no doubt better than the Railways of the Month from the 50s and 60s, but somehow lack the character of the retro scenes that you and the "regulars" on these threads have created.

[Golden Fleece 30]

Hi Mike,

 

Like you, years ago I foolishly threw away a lot of "useful" bits and pieces and sold many more off with decent models built and bought (some now classed as rare) at a model railway show once.  I had just started in 0 gauge thinking I would never go back, big mistake that, and sold both 00 and TT off and how I wish I could go back and reverse my thoughts.

 

The R1 wheelbase has been stretched to fir into the Scots body with the front axle hole being moved a couple of mm.  The B1 and V2 have the chassis as standard and in real life the centre wheels were closer to the front set so that makes the R1 the ideal chassis to use.  Somewhere on here there is a photo of the Hornby B17 body on a Castle chassis and a King similarly fitted.  All these are wrapped and boxed away now so difficult to check on.

 

I much prefer the individuality of the older layouts and admire the old ones in RM from the 50's and 60's far more than modern ones, I have recently been collecting old issues with TT layouts and one even had a Dublo 3-rail scenic layout.  As you say they all have the sameness about them. 

 

Garry

[MikeCW]

This could be titled "A Tale of Two Cities - Chapter 5".  In previous posts (227,248,255, 279) I reported on a couple of City of London bodies, both in worn to battered condition, and my intention to put them on two chassis - an early Hornby Dublo horseshoe motor "Atholl" and a Wrenn "City".  This is a progress report, in case anyone out there is interested.  Like a Dickens novel. this is a long story  (I'll spare readers that) with some plot twists.

 

My first thought was to create some variety by grafting a "Montrose" smokebox and complete front end onto a "City" body, by cutting both behind the outside steam pipes, sleeving the "City" boiler and attaching the "Montrose" front end to it.  The idea was to get the benefit of the later, more detailed body, but with the variation of the continuous footplate.  A preliminary check with the calipers put paid to that plan.  The "City" boiler is larger, and the whole body wider across the footplate, than a "Duchess", by an amount that ruled out even my bodging. So I was stuck with the "City" with "utility" front end. I started refurbishing it as a red engine (Post 227), in BR red with LMS-style lining. After looking at the photos of others' Dublo Coronations, after a while the red on mine looked too purple, so I sprayed a mist of Humbrol Crimson over the existing finish.  That looked better - at least for the moment.

 

Lining. Now I will probably need to put on a steel helmet and wait for "incoming" after this comment. As a long-standing LMS modeller (though more of an LNW man) I am OK with Midland Crimson Lake but somehow, the BR version always looked unbalanced to my eyes. In LMS days, on 4-4-0 and 4-6-0 engines, with lining and countershaded numbers and company lettering, the livery looked elegant.  But on a Pacific, there was, simply, an awful lot of red!  And when that was combined with the BR Gill Sans cream lettering, and tender totem, it didn't quite work - IMHO. But I gave it a shot, using PC/HMRS Pressfix lining.  It wasn't a success.  The lining was too fine for "Dublo style", and I couldn't get any lining to match the curves on the edges of the "Montrose" tender I was using. (Dublo didn't bother, on either the LMS "Atholls" or BR "Cities".) In short, I made a pig's ear of it, stripped it off, with some of the paint.  After repairs to the paintwork, I had another think. What about the short-lived first version of BR red livery?  Red, but with the standard orange/black/orange lining.  I've not seen that modeled before. Only about a dozen engines carried it, and not all had the utility front end, but it might be worth a try. So back to the bench the next day, an hour or two with Dennis Williams' transfers, with the following result.

 

It's a bit, well, unusual? Because the DW transfers have a lot of orange in proportion to the black, the lining is very bright compared to the prototype version.  The footplate edge lining is of course, hand-painted (Humbrol orange).  The tender lining had to be shortened to fit between the handrails on the "Duchess" tender I'm using.  The first photo cruelly shows the breaks in the lining, about 5-8mm to the right of the rear handrail, not so visible to the naked eye. There is still plenty to do, including cylinder covers, but the biggest question is what engine she is to be?. Of Dennis Williams transfers, I think that only "City of Liverpool" had both the utility front end and this version of the BR red livery, and I understand that sales of these transfers are limited to bona fide restorations. So I may have to choose between the correct livery or the correct front footplate.  If that's the case I'll probably go for the latter.

 

The front footsteps are home-brewed replacements in brass (the originals had been sawed off by a previous owner(why?)), each soldered up with a reinforcing rod at the rear.  The rod is araldited into a hole drilled in the underside of the footplate.

 

In the background the green "City" is the one with the cab roof repair that featured in Post 279.  It is mounted on a Wrenn chassis that I acquired fitted into a "Montrose" body. The chassis had been shortened and slotted at the rear to fit the "Montrose" body, so I had to make a choice between altering the body, or re-making the chassis, if it was to fit back into a "City" body.  I decided that making up a plate in the cab of the locomotive body was the easiest option, as I had done the same with the red engine to fit the old "Atholl" chassis.

 

The plate is made of 1mm brass, with square section brass tube soldered to the edge each side, the whole ensemble carefully filed to a tight fit into the cab, and then araldited in place (I wish mazak could be soldered - I'm a solderer rather than a gluer.) The reinforcing plate under the cab roof, to strengthen the replacement extension (Post 279) can be seen. 

The green "City"  in the background is even more of a work-in-progress than its red sibling.  I fitted a Dublo 3-rail pick-up to the Wrenn chassis.  After removing the two-rail pick-up wires, this involved using a length of plastic tube to insulate the 3-rail pick-up fixing bolt where it comes up through the chassis, and an insulating washer under the securing nut. It was pretty straightforward. I turned the motor magnet so that the engine ran in the right direction.  This involved careful work sliding keeper plates on to the magnet so that it was never without pole pieces or keepers throughout the exercise.  The ammeter tells me this has worked satisfactorily .  I fitted "Montrose" bogie and pony trucks which, with the "Montrose" tender, give plenty of electrical continuity from the running rails. There is still a way to go - buffers, blinkers and right front footstep for a start.  And because I used the transfers I had in stock for this model on the red engine, I now have wait for a replacement set.  Most modellers seem to go for the red livery on Coronation Pacifics, particularly "Cities", but I think that the green somehow conveys, in an understated way, the massive proportions and power of these machines. 

 

I'll endeavour to give an update in a week or two.

 

Mike

Edited October 26, 2018 by MikeCW

[sagaguy]

I`ve always used Fox lining sets for my locos,i apply tender lining in four quarters as some times,Fox tender lining is too long & wide.Fox transfers were used on this loco.

 

                      

 

 

                       Ray.

[MikeCW]

I`ve always used Fox lining sets for my locos,i apply tender lining in four quarters as some times,Fox tender lining is too long & wide.Fox transfers were used on this loco.

 

                       City of liverpool.jpg

 

 

                       Ray.

Hello Ray

I've used Fox transfers successfully on some of my "scale" trains, though I prefer Methfix to waterslide as an application method.  It's just what works for me.  When refurbishing or modifying Hornby Dublo items my intention is to finish them in "Dublo style", that is as if they were manufactured in the Binns Road factory.  I guess that over-scale lining is part of that picture.

 

If I were modifying a Dublo locomotive for my finescale layout (probably no need these days with so many other proprietary and kit options around) I'd do what I did with the Ivatt Pacific in a previous post - go the full monty with scale lining, put on with a bow pen in some cases.  Any wobbles can be concealed under a layer of "Camden grime".  When my interest in Hornby Dublo was rekindled year or so ago, due in large part to the posts on these threads, I found I had to adjust my style of modelling.  Though super-fine detail wasn't required, I couldn't cover untidy workmanship with judicious weathering, and that was a bit of a challenge.

 

"City of Liverpool" is a fine-looking model indeed.

 

Cheers

 

Mike  

[sagaguy]

Hi Mike,funny that you should mention the Ivatt locos.One of my projects is to modify a Duchess body to one of these.To that end,i`ve just received a Delta truck & injector castings from Comet Models.Garry suggested a Triang Brittannia bogie which i have so i`ll see which is the best to fit.I have a book of F.J.Roche drawings with one of these locos drawn.A project for the long winter nights.

 

                          Ray.

[Golden Fleece 30]

Lovely finish Mike. As you say, and has been mentioned many times, it is whether you want a Dublo style or finescale style that denotes Fox or Replica transfers.

 

The ones you have used look to be the ones for the plastic tender version, hence the shape being slightly different.

 

It is an unusual colour scheme you have chosen, not for me though, but I can see your thoughts behind it. Certainly Dublo never produced it.

 

Regarding the names it depends on how far you want to stay with Dublo style. As you say, and for obvious reasons, Dennis will only supply Liverpool names for a bona-fide loco. I would recommend that you look at Modelmaster who do the full range in stainless steel all set to fit a Dublo body. They do sets in scale lengths which obviously differed in lengths but the Dublo sized ones are excellent. I used them when some of the replica ones started breaking up, plus on an A4 long ones did not look right going up and down over boiler bands whereas a brass one stayed flat, as it should, over them.

 

Talking of colour, to me a Duchess looks best in BR blue, then BR maroon but without the boiler, cab, tender lining, and lastly BR green. I would have liked the lining that goes around the edge of the cab and tender which was a two colour black then yellow but it would have to have been other makes modified to fit.

 

Keep up the excellent work.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

I`ve always used Fox lining sets for my locos,i apply tender lining in four quarters as some times,Fox tender lining is too long & wide.Fox transfers were used on this loco.

 

City of liverpool.jpg

 

 

Ray.

Ray, totally disgusted with Fox that they did not reply to my letter mentioning their lining and curves having different widths. I will use them again if I have to as no alternative but don't like them.

 

The O/B/O seem okay, the MT red and grey sometimes are different but not as bad as the W/B/W ones.

 

Garry

[sagaguy]

Ray, totally disgusted with Fox that they did not reply to my letter mentioning their lining and curves having different widths. I will use them again if I have to as no alternative but don't like them.

 

The O/B/O seem okay, the MT red and grey sometimes are different but not as bad as the W/B/W ones.

 

Garry

Hmm!,I find rhat quite strange,whenever i`ve had a query,they have always replied within hours.

 

                      Ray.

[MikeCW]

Lovely finish Mike. As you say, and has been mentioned many times, it is whether you want a Dublo style or finescale style that denotes Fox or Replica transfers.

 

The ones you have used look to be the ones for the plastic tender version, hence the shape being slightly different.

 

It is an unusual colour scheme you have chosen, not for me though, but I can see your thoughts behind it. Certainly Dublo never produced it.

 

Regarding the names it depends on how far you want to stay with Dublo style. As you say, and for obvious reasons, Dennis will only supply Liverpool names for a bona-fide loco. I would recommend that you look at Modelmaster who do the full range in stainless steel all set to fit a Dublo body. They do sets in scale lengths which obviously differed in lengths but the Dublo sized ones are excellent. I used them when some of the replica ones started breaking up, plus on an A4 long ones did not look right going up and down over boiler bands whereas a brass one stayed flat, as it should, over them.

 

Talking of colour, to me a Duchess looks best in BR blue, then BR maroon but without the boiler, cab, tender lining, and lastly BR green. I would have liked the lining that goes around the edge of the cab and tender which was a two colour black then yellow but it would have to have been other makes modified to fit.

 

Keep up the excellent work.

 

Garry

Hello Garry

On your recommendation I went to the Modelmaster website and ordered a couple of Dublo/Wrenn style nameplates - City of Leeds and City of Bradford. It wasn't intentional but surely there must have been something in my genes which steered me to the two Yorkshire representatives of the class?

 

As you say, whether a paint finish "works" or not depends on the eye of the beholder. And as I said in my post, the effect of the orange/black/orange lining on the red background is "unusual" - for that read "strange". However, in David Jenkinson's "Power of the Duchesses" there is a two page spread of photos of members of the class in different colour schemes, including one of 6247 in this combination.  Because the orange/black/orange lining is much smaller in scale on the real thing, and the black dominates the orange more than on Dennis Williams' transfers, the overall effect is much more restrained and more acceptable. But heck, in the great journey of life, the colour we paint a model train is hardly one of our critical choices - though reading some of the posts on other topics on RMweb, there may be zealots who would disagree!

 

I've never owned a model locomotive of any class in BR blue but will likely give it a go - especially if I pick up another "City". There are a couple of rare colour photos in the Jenkinson book of 6231 and 6241 in this livery which have stirred my interest.  

 

I meant to add in the post about the two Cities that Dennis Williams' transfers went on beautifully, with none of the problems I encountered with the green 2-6-4T.  I must have been holding my mouth in the right position this time round - as well as more carefully measuring out the meths/water brew.

 

Thanks again for the steer to Modelmaster.

 

Mike

[NCB]

My one run behind a Duchess was from Perth southwards; I got off at Birmingham New Street. Summer 1961. Can still remember the sight of that beast standing tall at the platform end at Perth. Maroon (what I call maroon) and in a reasonably clean state. Thought it suited it. It sailed over Beattock and Shap.

[MikeCW]

My one run behind a Duchess was from Perth southwards; I got off at Birmingham New Street. Summer 1961. Can still remember the sight of that beast standing tall at the platform end at Perth. Maroon (what I call maroon) and in a reasonably clean state. Thought it suited it. It sailed over Beattock and Shap.

What a privilege, NCB.  1961 would still have been in the best years of the class.  As the years go by, fewer and fewer people will be around who have had the experience of being hauled by a steam engine on the main line while they were still earning their living on the "front line".  While it's great that so many have been preserved for future generations (and we owe a debt to all the volunteers who made it happen), somehow the highly polished and cossetted preserved engines, even running on the main line rather than shuttling up and down a few miles of preserved track, don't capture for me that tough, working day, look of the real thing earning its living.

 

I don't know where your Duchess was shedded, but I'm told that the Scottish Duchesses were always well kept, even in the mid-60s when steam was increasingly being run down.

 

Mike