Diesels come to Pendon! Form an orderly queue!

[chris p bacon]

I'm looking forward to the wires and catenary.

 

 

 

 

Better than all that copper topped stuff... . .. .. .awaits incoming fire. . . 

[Happy Hippo]

Better than all that copper topped stuff... . .. .. .awaits incoming fire. . . 

I'm pretty sure that copper capped engines were in the minority if you look at the overall GWR fleet.

[Talltim]

I'm looking forward to the wires and catenary.

 

 

 

 

Better than all that copper topped stuff... . .. .. .awaits incoming fire. . .

Short formed IEPs all round!

[Chris M]

This reminds me of the early 1980s when RTR DMUs consisted of Lima Suburban units or the Hornby Calder Valley. A number of exhibition layouts had one of the other as a "token" DMU even if the setting was nowhere near the geographic area where the real units operated. 

A DMU is a DMU - doesn't really matter what class it is, its just a DMU. I can't tell one from another and have no desire to be able to. I  run a token DMU on my layout. Its the wrong class but its just a DMU so it doesn't matter (to me).

['CHARD]

A DMU is a DMU - doesn't really matter what class it is, its just a DMU. I can't tell one from another and have no desire to be able to. I  run a token DMU on my layout. Its the wrong class but its just a DMU so it doesn't matter (to me).

 

Not sure how that's any different from saying any GWR steam locomotive needs to be differentiated from any other (in the context).

 

The whole issue/ raison d'etre about Pendon is (and I stand ready to be corrected) one of the suspension of disbelief; on the basis that the model (the Vale Scene?) is one of the finest, most realistic examples of scale modelling anywhere.  The idea behind the proposed 'what-if' diesel experience seems to be just that, a believable, plausible 'what-if.'

 

So, if the discerning viewer's desired starting point is to experience the Pendon landscape as though it was 1963, then to see SC55006 shuttling along relegated to Parcels car status, tacked onto an AC-cars 4-wheeler, the illusion will be shattered instantly.  It seems to me that the lack of clarity or focus on what's actually proposed runs the risk of satisfying no-one; a cartoon smile superimposed on a Great Master.

 

 

 

Footnote: 'If it were to be done at all, best it were done properly.'

Edited August 17, 2018 by 'CHARD

[Karhedron]

Good grief, many people are acting as if Pendon is somehow being contaminated by the arrival of diseasels!

 

Pendon is a true masterpiece, a work of art. For 99% of the time it is faithful to the original vision of the creators. But allowing some diesels to run as an intriguing "what-if" is both entertaining and harmless. Normal service will be resumed on the 3rd of December and all will be as it always was.

 

Variety is the spice of life and a weekend of diesel working is nor more detrimental to Pendon than a class 50 visiting a preserved railway that closed in the steam era.

[EddieK]

A DMU is a DMU - doesn't really matter what class it is, its just a DMU. I can't tell one from another and have no desire to be able to. I  run a token DMU on my layout. Its the wrong class but its just a DMU so it doesn't matter (to me).

Rule 1   8)

[Metr0Land]

Can someone clarify pls?  Ref the Hymek on coal, and the van train, are these appropriate to the era, or simply another loco pulling Pendon's exiting rakes?

[EddieK]

Good grief, many people are acting as if Pendon is somehow being contaminated by the arrival of diseasels!

 

Pendon is a true masterpiece, a work of art. For 99% of the time it is faithful to the original vision of the creators. But allowing some diesels to run as an intriguing "what-if" is both entertaining and harmless. Normal service will be resumed on the 3rd of December and all will be as it always was.

 

Variety is the spice of life and a weekend of diesel working is nor more detrimental to Pendon than a class 50 visiting a preserved railway that closed in the steam era.

I have no objection to a guest appearance by diesel locos, provided that the modelling standard of the locos and stock is compatible with everything else. From the initial posting, they have taken the trouble to at least get the loco hauled trains appropriate for the line.

[woodenhead]

Roye England will be turning in his grave. By the time of the diesels some of the buildings depicted had gone. The scene he set out was what he had seen..and having been fortunate enough to have a long chat with him a long time ago he wanted people to see the Vale as it was..and what a brilliant job the people involved in Pendon have done about doing just that!

 

Baz

Apparently Tony Gee is contemplating a 153 on Leighton Buzzard.

 

I do agree with you that is seems very at odds with the premise of Pendon to introduce diesels albeit in green form but if it is an experiment and not the norm and the models used are of the right quality which i would expect they will be then it's not the end.

 

I am contemplating a weekend down in Oxfordshire to visit Pendon and it is the P4 Bodmin that is making it attractive to visit on that particular weekend.

[Joseph_Pestell]

I have no objection to a guest appearance by diesel locos, provided that the modelling standard of the locos and stock is compatible with everything else. From the initial posting, they have taken the trouble to at least get the loco hauled trains appropriate for the line.

 

Yes, but just about everything else within sight will be inappropriate.

 

That remark about a cartoon smile on an Old Master sums it up very well.

[Joseph_Pestell]

Good grief, many people are acting as if Pendon is somehow being contaminated by the arrival of diseasels!

 

Pendon is a true masterpiece, a work of art. For 99% of the time it is faithful to the original vision of the creators. But allowing some diesels to run as an intriguing "what-if" is both entertaining and harmless. Normal service will be resumed on the 3rd of December and all will be as it always was.

 

Variety is the spice of life and a weekend of diesel working is nor more detrimental to Pendon than a class 50 visiting a preserved railway that closed in the steam era.

 

Contaminated is a bit strong (especially to those of us who live near Salisbury).

 

I think that it would be great to see high-quality diesel (and electric) modelling at Pendon with buildings and scenery to match. Something like Karl Crowther's Hebble Mill which would fit in the space they are devoting to Bodmin. But diesels running against a background of 1930s rustic scenery just does not work.

[Steamport Southport]

Don't worry. Next year good old Doctor Beeching is coming to close it down. 

 

 

 

Jason

[woodenhead]

Don't worry. Next year good old Doctor Beeching is coming to close it down. 

 

 

 

Jason

And we mustn't forget they have already successfully displayed it with HS2 complete through the Vale.

 

Of course it was hard to see for the usual visitor because it is all in tunnel, but those of us in the know knew where to look for the trains passing underneath.

[tomparryharry]

Deleted

Edited August 18, 2018 by tomparryharry

[Captain Kernow]

So overall I tend to see it very much as a sort of 4mm scale diesel gala rather than anything else and not sitting over comfortably in the Pendon mould of either historical accuracy or having any sort of place in the dream Roye worked so hard to turn into a real model

And as such, I doubt that any lasting harm will be done.

 

However, the late 1950s/early 1960s is a very popular period for modellers and it's not hard to see why, with the changeover from steam to diesel traction and major changes in the railways in the offing.

 

Perhaps if this kind of thing was to become a more regular feature at Pendon, someone might consult the likes of Mike/Stationmaster for his in-depth knowledge of traction and train workings, so that the correct type of DMUs and locomotives can be procured. Dirty, run-down ex-GWR steam locos could, then, mix with the diesels.

 

Presumably key non-railway buildings in the Vale scene cannot easily be removed and replaced by modern equivalents (assuming that there was the slightest desire on the part of Pendon to provide such structures), so we would have to accept that they may be a little 'old fashioned' for the more 'modern' era.

 

Signals, however, could be made to be replaced with more modern tubular posts and perhaps even a colour light distant, should that be desired.

[APOLLO]

Did someone mention a 153 ? And another Vale of the White Horse ?

 

 

Prototypical !!

 

Brit15

[Tim V]

1. Roye England was a showman.

2. Whose trainset is it anyway?

 

Don't forget, the trains are only there to impart some movement into the model.

[Nearholmer]

And, it is clearly already raising Pendon's profile, by provoking debate.

 

It would be interesting to understand (a) what their visitor numbers are, (b) whether they are up, down or flat, and © how frequently even 'silent majority fans of the place' visit.

 

I fall into the last bracket, and visit regularly, about once every..... ooh..... decade and a half, despite living only an easy 70 minute drive away. I was there last Sunday, and those very questions were in my head, because I began to wonder whether, in railway-modelling terms, it might have become shrine that few adherents of the religion visit. it might be a victim of its own success, in that, having raised the profile of hi-fi 4mm scale modelling, it is now possible to see quality approaching this on layouts at some exhibitions ........ railway-modelling-wise, leaving aside everything else, it is not as phenomenal as it was.

 

Wouldn't the odd GWR diesel railcar be closer to period, less anachronistic in the scenes?

 

Kevin

Edited August 17, 2018 by Nearholmer

[Edwardian]

Frankly, I don't see why Pendon shouldn't apply Rule No.1 for the odd running session, but I think that's what we're looking at; I take the quasi-prototypical justification with a pinch of salt.

 

As is often the case, I think Mike the Stationmaster has the right of it: "I tend to see it very much as a sort of 4mm scale diesel gala rather than anything else and not sitting over comfortably in the Pendon mould of either historical accuracy or having any sort of place in the dream Roye worked so hard to turn into a real model" 

 

With miniature rock stars, all manner of modern RTR locos seen on Madder Valley, and now this "diesel gala", you might be forgiven for wondering if the good folk of Pendon are losing the plot.

 

I'm pretty relaxed about it - arguably some occasional relaxation of Pendon's strict parameters may be no bad thing - and I trust that they still remember why they're there.

 

I won't be going - if I want to see diesels I can do so many, many times over in every magazine and at every show, whereas Grouping era trains with prototypical stock and formations is a much, much rarer sight - but each to his own and I daresay it will be popular.      

[Jammy2305]

A note on possible diesel traction: The WR took its first allocation of an EE Type 3 on 24th April 1963 when D6837 transferred to Landore. This was subsequently followed by numerous other examples and as such most people associate the type's WR allocation with South Wales. However, some were trialled elsewhere on the system, with a few making it across to Swindon (and possibly further). For example, 16th August 1964 saw D6828, D6896 and D6915 at Swindon and there's little to say these didn't make trips into the Vale around that time...

[tomparryharry]

Well, we haven't seen a gas turbine yet, or a Britannia or 9F. If I want to see an impressive load, I'd guess it would be 3x class 37s on the Port Talbot-Llanwern MGR steel jobs.

 

In all honesty, Pendon could justifiably put just about anything on the exhibition: Southern 4-6-0s, Halls, 43's, prairies large & small, and it would look right. Good for them, I'd say.

 

Haven't seen an Aberdare, yet. But I live in hope..... ROD, perhaps?

 

Cheers,

 

Ian.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

I reckon most visitors to Pendon wouldn't differentiate between a Hall and a Hymek, let alone a Castle and a King.

 

Can see no problem at all with having the occasional "modern traction" day, if it's done properly with the same fidelity to diesels as

are currently afforded to steam locos, ie a proper mix of Warships, Thousands, Hymeks etc. (even the Blue Pullan) in their correct liveries

for the chosen period.

 

 

Maybe also an "early BR period" scene with GW steam types, gas turbines and some Standards.

 

 

If it raises the profile of Pendon, gets more people through the doors and connects with a new generation of possible modellers, what's the harm?

 

 

I'm not advocating moving away from the core period; landscape and building wise. But having an occasional different mix of rail traction running

through "The Vale" can't be a bad thing.

[Joseph_Pestell]

1. Roye England was a showman.

2. Whose trainset is it anyway?

 

Don't forget, the trains are only there to impart some movement into the model.

1) Yes, he was. And therefore cared deeply about the quality of that show. I am sure that he would have approved strongly of people who wanted to model blue era diesels on layouts portraying the England of the 1980s. Just as the landscape in the Vale changed greatly in the 30 years from 1930 onwards, it has changed again in the last thirty years. Those mills on Hebble Vale would now all be yuppies' flats or studios for companies designing computer games.

 

2) A moot point. So many people have contributed to Pendon over the years. Someone has taken this decision but I doubt that all, past or present, will approve.

[Craigw]

Have the perpetually outraged run out of things to be outraged about?

 

Seriously, as the blurb states, a series of representational trains. Thats it.

 

Will they be anachronistic in the landscape ? Yes.

 

Will they look good?  Yes.

 

Is is an event designed to bring a bit of variety and something a little different = plus a chance to compare different trains from an era outside the Pendon norm.

 

Pendon will not be harmed in the creation of this event.

 

Maybe the hot weather has been a bit too much for some people in the UK?

 

Regards,

 

Craig W

 

(Australian and Friend of Pendon even though he has never actually been there)