Hornby APT (2020 tooling)

[boxbrownie]

9 hours ago, Dagworth said:

That’s a real shame, would have been so easy to attach it to the motor cradle so that it stayed level with the bogies (non tilting) but in line with the car body. 
 

The original did exactly that, three steps forward, one back? 

[Wolf27]

1 hour ago, boxbrownie said:

The original did exactly that, three steps forward, one back? 

The original Hornby model had the pantograph attached directly to the top of the motor bogie, it also followed the movement of the bogie. The new version follows the same principle where it is attached directly to the bogie. 
 

It could be attached to the motor cradle with some thought. However the movement of the pantograph is relative to the movement of the bogie and will depend on the radius of  the trackworks turnouts and curves.. for those with large radius curves and turnouts it’s not such a problem. 
 

I'm not even sure how noticeable the tilt is on 6ft radius curves yet, as I think it’s designed with 2nd and 3rd radius curves in mind.

[lyneux]

12 minutes ago, Wolf27 said:

I'm not even sure how noticeable the tilt is on 6ft radius curves yet, as I think it’s designed with 2nd and 3rd radius curves in mind.

 

Not very from placing the rake on the fiddle yard curves. Although I am looking forward to seeing it sweep through the reverse curves on Whatley! Errr.... my train set, my rules (or something like that). Obviously not at an exhibition (I hasten to add).

 

Guy

Edited October 29, 2021 by lyneux

[Wolf27]

1 hour ago, lyneux said:

 

Not very from placing the rake on the fiddle yard curves. Although I am looking forward to seeing it sweep through the reverse curves on Whatley! Errr.... my train set, my rules (or something like that). Obviously not at an exhibition (I hasten to add).

 

Guy

In the last hour of a show, anything goes. Except Thomas, never Thomas. 

Edited October 29, 2021 by Wolf27
spelling

[Wolf27]

11 hours ago, 96701 said:

You might need to lose some yellow off the power cars. I took the first one at Farington Curve Junction, the other 2 from Ladywell House in either 1978 or 1979 I can't remember which.

 

 

All sorted now.

 

Untitled by Shane Wilton, on Flickr

 

And just for good measure, because it did happen

 

Untitled by Shane Wilton, on Flickr

Edited October 29, 2021 by Wolf27

[boxbrownie]

1 hour ago, Wolf27 said:

The original Hornby model had the pantograph attached directly to the top of the motor bogie, it also followed the movement of the bogie. The new version follows the same principle where it is attached directly to the bogie. 
 

It could be attached to the motor cradle with some thought. However the movement of the pantograph is relative to the movement of the bogie and will depend on the radius of  the trackworks turnouts and curves.. for those with large radius curves and turnouts it’s not such a problem. 
 

I'm not even sure how noticeable the tilt is on 6ft radius curves yet, as I think it’s designed with 2nd and 3rd radius curves in mind.

Yes my original is the same surprise, surprise.

 

If in the new model it is attached to the motor cradle somehow (I assume you mean the central mounted motor part) then surely the panto would tip as the body tips?

 

If it’s the “turning” of the panto when the bogie turns that is the issue, it’s almost unnoticeable…..seems to be on the old version I have.

Edited October 29, 2021 by boxbrownie

[Wolf27]

9 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

Yes my original is the same surprise, surprise.

 

If in the new model it is attached to the motor cradle somehow (I assume you mean the central mounted motor part) then surely the panto would tip as the body tips?

 

If it’s the “turning” of the panto when the bogie turns that is the issue, it’s almost unnoticeable…..seems to be on the old version I have.

From what I can see the motor cradle in the new version stays parallel to the track, only the body tilts.

[boxbrownie]

5 minutes ago, Wolf27 said:

From what I can see the motor cradle in the new version stays parallel to the track, only the body tilts.

Same as the original then?

 

I suppose a length of plastic card reinforced or even some metal rod/channel might be able to be made up to support the panto over the bogie.

Edited October 29, 2021 by boxbrownie

[Dagworth]

1 minute ago, Wolf27 said:

From what I can see the motor cradle in the new version stays parallel to the track, only the body tilts.

That’s how I did the repower of my original set, the bogies and motor cradle etc. are pretty much a conventional chassis with the pan mounted on that, and the body is free to roll/tilt around the chassis. The only contact from the body to anything else is where it rests on the tilt cams of the bogies. 
 

I will relocate the pan mounts on all my new NMDs in much the same way. 
 

Andi

[Dagworth]

1 minute ago, boxbrownie said:

Same as the original then?

There is no motor cradle in the original, only a pancake power bogie. The pan mounted on top of the bogie rotates as the bogie does. 

 

The motor cradle in Shane’s photos links the two bogie towers, doesn’t tilt but stays in line with the car body which rolls/tilts around it. A pan attached to the cradle would neither rotate with the bogie or tilt with the body, thus behaving exactly as the prototype. 
 

Andi

[WestRail642fan]

2 hours ago, Wolf27 said:

All sorted now.

 

Untitled by Shane Wilton, on Flickr

 

And just for good measure, because it did happen

 

Untitled by Shane Wilton, on Flickr

Are those Prototype HSTs a custom model?

[newbryford]

5 hours ago, Wolf27 said:

In the last hour of a show, anything goes. Except Thomas, never Thomas. 

 

Why wait for the last hour?

[boxbrownie]

6 hours ago, Dagworth said:

There is no motor cradle in the original, only a pancake power bogie. The pan mounted on top of the bogie rotates as the bogie does. 

 

The motor cradle in Shane’s photos links the two bogie towers, doesn’t tilt but stays in line with the car body which rolls/tilts around it. A pan attached to the cradle would neither rotate with the bogie or tilt with the body, thus behaving exactly as the prototype. 
 

Andi

Yes I know, effectively the bogie is the motor cradle 

 

And I understood the latter as I commented upon maybe using a strip of plastic and or rod/channel to keep the panto straight and level.

[WestRail642fan]

take this with an entire 7 plank truck full of salt, but according to a comment made by Hornby on facebook, the main train packs are expected to arrive before Christmas



https://www.facebook.com/officialhornby/posts/10158015485775843:0 source of the comment

[E100]

Certainly sounds like the 5 and 7 car packs are on the same boat.

[WestRail642fan]

35 minutes ago, E100 said:

Certainly sounds like the 5 and 7 car packs are on the same boat.

fingers crossed aye?

[Going2theDogs]

Hi All,

Well fingers crossed the APT’s are with us before this Christmas.

In the meantime, I have purchased one of the extension packs (TS - R40011A).

They look great to me.

[Ouroborus]

Food for thought here.  I made an Impulse purchase of the NDM to strip the internals and use inside my.old Hornby model.  But it seems so easy to connect up to the existing model (just a matter of swapping the couplings).  Shame the colour is different.  I think the least painful way will be a respray of the NDM cream into the blue grey that Hornby originally used.  Might not be authentic, but probably the easiest for my skills. 

[Bigeddie]

Anyone Know which colour is closest to the actual APT and, were they all the same anyway?

Edited October 31, 2021 by Bigeddie

[Wolf27]

17 minutes ago, Bigeddie said:

Anyone Know which colour is closest to the actual APT and, were they all the same anyway?

The new one. The original Hornby model was guesswork which was odd as the actual train had been around for a couple of years already.

[WestRail642fan]

i will admit though, the livery on the original model looks just as nice too

[boxbrownie]

12 hours ago, Ouroborus said:

Food for thought here.  I made an Impulse purchase of the NDM to strip the internals and use inside my.old Hornby model.  But it seems so easy to connect up to the existing model (just a matter of swapping the couplings).  Shame the colour is different.  I think the least painful way will be a respray of the NDM cream into the blue grey that Hornby originally used.  Might not be authentic, but probably the easiest for my skills. 

I like that idea, I was wondering about digging out my old version as I changed to the Strathpeffer CD motor conversion which fitted and went well but TBH just doesn’t have the “umph” for the full length train, too much wheel slip when negotiating the corners, your idea would work well by the looks of it and spraying the NDM to match isn’t too much 0f a challenge.

[Ouroborus]

9 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

I like that idea, I was wondering about digging out my old version as I changed to the Strathpeffer CD motor conversion which fitted and went well but TBH just doesn’t have the “umph” for the full length train, too much wheel slip when negotiating the corners, your idea would work well by the looks of it and spraying the NDM to match isn’t too much 0f a challenge.

 

Something very odd with this NDM (in a good way)

 

The couplings unscrew.  Once out, the original NDM coupling will screw in, though it does need a little boring out.  Once out, it connects perfectly to the existing coupling on the original APT carriage.  Same height, the joint equal between the two units.  Coupled fairly close together.   The coupling you take off the new NDM is a simple push fit and clip into the old NDM

 

 

Disclaimer - haven't attempted to sent it around a corner yet.

 

Very unusual to find a mod so easy....

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 31, 2021 by Ouroborus
Typo

[boxbrownie]

14 hours ago, Ouroborus said:

 

Something very odd with this NDM (in a good way)

 

The couplings unscrew.  Once out, the original NDM coupling will screw in, though it does need a little boring out.  Once out, it connects perfectly to the existing coupling on the original APT carriage.  Same height, the joint equal between the two units.  Coupled fairly close together.   The coupling you take off the new NDM is a simple push fit and clip into the old NDM

 

 

Disclaimer - haven't attempted to sent it around a corner yet.

 

Very unusual to find a mod so easy....

 

 

 

 

 

 

OK…this is all your fault…..I decided I wouldn’t touch the new APT as my old one is in perfect condition apart from the traction quality of the power car…..yes I did it, ordered the new power car, now the challenge is to paint match the new to old.

 

Oh well nothing else to do 

[Roy Langridge]

24 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

OK…this is all your fault…..I decided I wouldn’t touch the new APT as my old one is in perfect condition apart from the traction quality of the power car…..yes I did it, ordered the new power car, now the challenge is to paint match the new to old.

 

Oh well nothing else to do 

 

You could always be brave and set yourself an even bigger challenge and paint match old to new 

Roy