More model ideas

[wombatofludham]

On 10/02/2023 at 17:12, Accurascale Fran said:

Hi everyone,

 

As you probably have seen we will be announcing our next OO locomotive at Model Rail Scotland, so who knows what it could be (well I do, but you know what I mean!)

 

Could it be steam? Diesel? Electric? Well I will give you all a clue; it's certainly not a gas turbine!

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

 Mmm, the Class 84s were made by North British in Glasgow.  Problem is any model of an 84 you make won't be very realistic as it'll work flawlessly unlike the real things.

Then there's the Class 303 made up the road in Paisley.  

[GordonC]

9 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

 Mmm, the Class 84s were made by North British in Glasgow.  Problem is any model of an 84 you make won't be very realistic as it'll work flawlessly unlike the real things.

Then there's the Class 303 made up the road in Paisley.  

 

If it was 303s my credit card would literally melt!

 

I would think it'd have to be something with a Scottish connection to be announced there. It couldn't be centre headcode 37/0s possibly? The first batch must be with us soon and they're bound to have been tooled up along with the others.

 

Or class 86/87? I think there's be a lot of mileage in models of those, I know Heljan have some on the way but don't think they'd be as definitive as an accurascale one

[E100]

73/9 or GNR H3 (K2) I reckon. The latter will be painful for the wallet!

[Craig85]

My guess is an 8F. Now the Manor is close too arriving. Another steam engine must be due. 

[TomScrut]

56 minutes ago, E100 said:

73/9

 

So with that, I thought that KMS were supposedly continuing their project without Accurascale (and that they were going to make an announcement about it a while ago). I didn't take that to mean that Accurascale were likely to do their own. It is a gap in the market, but I don't think it would be one that somebody would knowingly duplicate the model for?

[nightstar.train]

26 minutes ago, TomScrut said:

 

So with that, I thought that KMS were supposedly continuing their project without Accurascale (and that they were going to make an announcement about it a while ago). I didn't take that to mean that Accurascale were likely to do their own. It is a gap in the market, but I don't think it would be one that somebody would knowingly duplicate the model for?

I was told something similar last year at MRS, but there’s been a deafening silence since then on the 73/9 project. Really want one, but I’m beginning to lose hope. 

[TomScrut]

5 minutes ago, nightstar.train said:

I was told something similar last year at MRS, but there’s been a deafening silence since then on the 73/9 project. Really want one, but I’m beginning to lose hope. 

 

Yeah, thing is I expect only KMS, Accurascale and maybe another manufacturer, know what's going on there. And even then, none of them will know the full story I expect.

[Covkid]

14 hours ago, nightstar.train said:

I was told something similar last year at MRS, but there’s been a deafening silence since then on the 73/9 project. Really want one, but I’m beginning to lose hope. 

 

14 hours ago, TomScrut said:

Yeah, thing is I expect only KMS, Accurascale and maybe another manufacturer, know what's going on there. And even then, none of them will know the full story I expect.

 

It would be very logical for Accurascale to produce the 73/9 - in both CS and NR yellow liveries and details.  It would be great to bolt a Mk5 set to it for a Scottish layout, but equally they could recreate the occasional forays of the 73/9s round the Mersey system with some  er... Mk2s in the middle !!!

 

Talking of which - should Accurascale be planning the former FGW car carrier converts, which have more recently been painted yellow and used as brake force cars in the test trains ?

 

 

Edited February 13, 2023 by Covkid

[frobisher]

47 minutes ago, Covkid said:

It would be very logical for Accurascale to produce the 73/9 - in both CS and NR yellow liveries and details.

 

Er, the two types of 73/9 are quite substantially different (the NR ones are dual engined, the GBRf ones have a single prime mover), the main commonality was that they were converted from Class 73s, so pretty much two sets of body tooling.  Would love to see AS do them of course, and I would see the GBRf/CS ones as a priority but even then you have variations pre/post MK5s entering service (coupling conversion...).

[E100]

The 73/9 market is viable from the basis of there being a justification on a very significant number of modern image layouts. The fact they often work in pairs should not be discounted either.

 

Even though KMS have been very quiet on this I wouldn't read that as it being dead but it's maybe not a high priority model for the manufacturing partner, leaving the goal open.

[Wickham Green too]

8 hours ago, frobisher said:

Er, the two types of 73/9 are quite substantially different ...

Er ........ yes .... er .....why the hell did they both get called /9 rather than one being /8, perhaps ??!? ( If this has been explained in the depths of a 'Prototype' thread, I apologise for bringing it up here ! )

[Covkid]

9 hours ago, frobisher said:

 

Er, the two types of 73/9 are quite substantially different (the NR ones are dual engined, the GBRf ones have a single prime mover), the main commonality was that they were converted from Class 73s, so pretty much two sets of body tooling.  Would love to see AS do them of course, and I would see the GBRf/CS ones as a priority but even then you have variations pre/post MK5s entering service (coupling conversion...).

 

Sorry.  I meant 73961-73965 which are actually in GBRf livery aren't they rather than yellow.

I didn't mean those silly dual engined monstrosities

 

 

EDIT

Thinking about it, is there much difference below the solebar between the 73/9s and the yellow pair ?  I imagine that they would require a new bodyshell moulding, but maybe use the same chassis and mechanism

Edited February 13, 2023 by Covkid

[frobisher]

2 hours ago, Covkid said:

Thinking about it, is there much difference below the solebar between the 73/9s and the yellow pair ?  I imagine that they would require a new bodyshell moulding, but maybe use the same chassis and mechanism

 

Not entirely sure - I think very little was reused from the donors so the tanks etc. may be different.  The NR ones I think have their 3rd rail shoes and their DC capability removed, but anything below the solebar is cosmetic on modern models anyway.

 

But they'd be able to share a common drive system and bogie design I'd have thought.

 

 

 

[MJI]

45 minutes ago, frobisher said:

 

Not entirely sure - I think very little was reused from the donors so the tanks etc. may be different.  The NR ones I think have their 3rd rail shoes and their DC capability removed, but anything below the solebar is cosmetic on modern models anyway.

 

But they'd be able to share a common drive system and bogie design I'd have thought.

 

 

 

 

No longer Electro Diesels?

 

Could have 3rd railed the highlands

[Downer]

53 minutes ago, MJI said:

 

No longer Electro Diesels?

 

Could have 3rd railed the highlands

A truly dystopian project.

[newbryford]

1 hour ago, frobisher said:

 

Not entirely sure - I think very little was reused from the donors so the tanks etc. may be different.  The NR ones I think have their 3rd rail shoes and their DC capability removed, 

 

 

 

 

 

73951 and 952 still retain their 3rd rail capability. 2022 flickr pic.

 

 

 

[frobisher]

3 minutes ago, newbryford said:

73951 and 952 still retain their 3rd rail capability. 2022 flickr pic.

 

Ah cool, I do recall someone saying they didn't, glad they were wrong.

[SteamingWales]

1 hour ago, MJI said:

Could have 3rd railed the highlands

 

A bit off topic from the thread, but with the acceleration to Net Zero what is the future in traction terms for the Highland routes and other such as the Settle and Carlisle?

 

Wouldn't OHLE be a no no given the landscapes that they run through, detracting from the asthetic that comes with the Highlands and Yorkshire Dales (I won't moan about that and my opinion though) so would 3rd rail be an option? Sorry I'm not a D&E person so don't know operating requirements

 

I guess the other option for these "long distance" routes is hydrogen but I'm not aware of anything that could potentially fill that gap atm

 

 

[Roy Langridge]

Just now, SteamingWales said:

 

A bit off topic from the thread, but with the acceleration to Net Zero what is the future in traction terms for the Highland routes and other such as the Settle and Carlisle?

 

Wouldn't OHLE be a no no given the landscapes that they run through, detracting from the asthetic that comes with the Highlands and Yorkshire Dales (I won't moan about that and my opinion though) so would 3rd rail be an option? Sorry I'm not a D&E person so don't know operating requirements

 

I guess the other option for these "long distance" routes is hydrogen but I'm not aware of anything that could potentially fill that gap atm

 

 

 

Given the relatively infrequent service seen on the Highland line, I would suggest there will be a lot of other lines  in front in the electrification queue.

 

Roy

[Wickham Green too]

11 minutes ago, SteamingWales said:

... Wouldn't OHLE be a no no given the landscapes that they run through, detracting from the aesthetic that comes with the Highlands and Yorkshire Dales ...

Didn't stop them stringing up the Lune Gorge ................ and throwing in a dirty great motorway for good measure !

 

Anyway - according to Platform 5, 73.951/2 and 73.961-5 can operate off the juice but for 73.966-71 "third rail electric capability has been retained" ...... presumably everything's there except the pickups !!?!

[Torbay Express]

12 minutes ago, Roy Langridge said:

 

Given the relatively infrequent service seen on the Highland line, I would suggest there will be a lot of other lines  in front in the electrification queue.

 

Roy

Apararantly they are waiting for the Accurascale model with a large enough powerbank, and then scrap the originals. 

 

Seriously, at the end of the day everything has got to be done in a sensible manner, in a way that is sustainable to build, operate and maintain.  It may be the case of leaving them on Diesel for a while and planting a few trees for carbon capture. 

 

Other idea is go full circle and have an atmospheric railway...... 

[nightstar.train]

1 hour ago, SteamingWales said:

 

A bit off topic from the thread, but with the acceleration to Net Zero what is the future in traction terms for the Highland routes and other such as the Settle and Carlisle?

 

Wouldn't OHLE be a no no given the landscapes that they run through, detracting from the asthetic that comes with the Highlands and Yorkshire Dales (I won't moan about that and my opinion though) so would 3rd rail be an option? Sorry I'm not a D&E person so don't know operating requirements

 

I guess the other option for these "long distance" routes is hydrogen but I'm not aware of anything that could potentially fill that gap atm

 

 

The Scottish government has laid out a plan to decarbonise the network. Basically the WHL, Far North, Kyle line, and Stranraer line will not be electrified. They’re too long with too few services to make it economically viable. They’re investigating alternative fuels, which will probably be hydrogen given the route length. Batteries wouldn’t cut it unless there’s some big breakthroughs in battery technology in the next decade. 

[frobisher]

1 hour ago, SteamingWales said:

Wouldn't OHLE be a no no given the landscapes that they run through, detracting from the asthetic that comes with the Highlands and Yorkshire Dales (I won't moan about that and my opinion though) so would 3rd rail be an option? Sorry I'm not a D&E person so don't know operating requirements

 

OHLE would be a lot more likely than 3rd rail (beyond the prohibition on new installation).  3rd rail and snow DO NOT MIX based on the feeble snows that the South generally got (the arcing off of the third rail was "interesting" when frosty and snow even more so), and OHLE is a lot better in that regard.  "Ruining the landscape" clearly didn't apply to the WCML so I'm not sure it would be a factor for the Highland line.  As it stands, there are more than a few powerlines trunked through those areas which are way more obtrusive.

[TomScrut]

16 hours ago, Covkid said:

It would be very logical for Accurascale to produce the 73/9 - in both CS and NR yellow liveries and details.

 

I agree. It's just whether something is happening with KMS's project as to whether it's a massive risk or not. We also don't know why they parted company on this. It could be that the market research suggested it wasn't viable.

[frobisher]

3 minutes ago, TomScrut said:

 

I agree. It's just whether something is happening with KMS's project as to whether it's a massive risk or not. We also don't know why they parted company on this. It could be that the market research suggested it wasn't viable.

 

What it appears to be is that KMS seemed to have decided to go with A N Other manufacturer, but the project appears to have stalled.