Rails of Sheffield Improved Precedent Class

[Compound2632]

42 minutes ago, AlfaZagato said:

My limited research showed post-1928 for Improved Precedents in black, up to retirement in 1933 for Talavera, one of the last to go.

 

Yes, but my question was, when did Talavera receive the post-1928 livery?

 

Before 1928 it will have been in post-LNWR plain black, not being one of the select four Improved Precedents to receive the red livery. (Some might say, the four that failed to escape the red livery.) 

[Darius43]

On 15/12/2021 at 09:39, Helmdon said:

Thanks, the product description says '21 Pin DCC socket' and the box says 'DCC' 

 

That means it’s DCC ready rather than DCC Fitted so you should be good to go on DC.

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[Jol Wilkinson]

18 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Yes, but my question was, when did Talavera receive the post-1928 livery?

 

Before 1928 it will have been in post-LNWR plain black, not being one of the select four Improved Precedents to receive the red livery. (Some might say, the four that failed to escape the red livery.) 

According to Yeadon's LNWR Locomotives (caption for photo on page 7), Talavera was renumbered 5018 when it received the "final livery" in March 1928. Its small LNWR shed plate number 8 was moved from the rear edge of the cab roof to the smokebox door (Rugby) below the door dart, in 1931/32. The LMS cast number plate was in the usual place above the handle.

 

She was withdrawn/scrapped in December 1932.

[daltonparva]

Just got back from Rails with my LMS black Caledonian 812 and Precedent, the Precedent is a lot shinier black than any other plain black LMS loco I have. In my late 1930's world Talavera was kept on after withdrawal to shove the inspection saloon around for Director's Jollies, so was kept polished. (Rule 1 applies).

Edited December 16, 2021 by daltonparva

[Zunnan]

On 15/12/2021 at 09:39, Helmdon said:

Thanks, the product description says '21 Pin DCC socket' and the box says 'DCC' 

 

I can confirm that out of the box, these are configured for DC with a 21pin blanking plug; just chipped mine.

 

On the subject of coaches, you could always go the Ratio route. Or one step further and hack the Ratio coaches into something other than corridor stock. 

 

I really need to tone down that Crimson on the coaches when I come to transfer and varnish! 'Novelty' is absolutely stunning by the way.

 

 

Its a hard pick between them! Painfully gorgeous models they are. If I was asked to choose prior to opening the boxes I'd have said 'Novelty' would be the looker, but now? Austin Powers style grunts and groans when faced with twins. That black on 'Lucknow' is sublime!

 

Running wise, they're geared a bit on the fast side...but for a Race to the North thoroughbred, do we really want it otherwise? Toned down a bit on DCC for 90mph(ish) flat out just seems a bit killjoy to me!

[Helmdon]

scrolling right back to both the early pages of this thread, and the early pages of the Genesis thread, I can confirm that I am a complete novice stupid enough now I've got a real live Precedent in my hands to at least give a Ratio kit a go. I've got 5 LNWR Genesis on order though because the rendering of the livery is beautiful.

[Methuselah]

They look great - I ordered a couple of Luknow - I will re-name to suit a local shed. They arrived this afternoon and are perfect - no damage. Lovely models. The coaches, however, will require some actual modelling......

[john new]

2 hours ago, Zunnan said:

 

I can confirm that out of the box, these are configured for DC with a 21pin blanking plug; just chipped mine.

 

On the subject of coaches, you could always go the Ratio route. Or one step further and hack the Ratio coaches into something other than corridor stock. 

 

I really need to tone down that Crimson on the coaches when I come to transfer and varnish! 'Novelty' is absolutely stunning by the way.

 

 

Its a hard pick between them! Painfully gorgeous models they are. If I was asked to choose prior to opening the boxes I'd have said 'Novelty' would be the looker, but now? Austin Powers style grunts and groans when faced with twins. That black on 'Lucknow' is sublime!

 

Running wise, they're geared a bit on the fast side...but for a Race to the North thoroughbred, do we really want it otherwise? Toned down a bit on DCC for 90mph(ish) flat out just seems a bit killjoy to me!

I am a novice on many things LNWR as, despite being a part-owner in Orion, that is the only one I know much about plus some basics on the rest. Strangely, unless it is a trick of the camera angles and lighting a couple of things appear; firstly the red livery makes that one look bigger and also the dome on the red one (Novelty) looks slightly off kilter in both photos; slightly clockwise as we look at it head on but doesn't on the black one (Lucknow).

[daltonparva]

Could anyone else who has a Talavera confirm it is shiny black with gold lettering, Rails pictures show a more normal more Matt black with yellow lettering.

[Ian Hargrave]

1 minute ago, daltonparva said:

Could anyone else who has a Talavera confirm it is shiny black with gold lettering, Rails pictures show a more normal more Matt black with yellow lettering.

 Yes I can but more I think of a silky sheen. Whatever one calls it the overall impression is very effective. Certainly not Matt finish as on the Webb Coal Tank 

[Zunnan]

1 hour ago, john new said:

...and also the dome on the red one (Novelty) looks slightly off kilter in both photos; slightly clockwise as we look at it head on but doesn't on the black one (Lucknow).

 

You're correct there, the dome is on the slide! Hadn't noticed until pointed out, but there is no denying that on closer inspection the bottom of the dome on the right hand side of the boiler isn't seated fully down causing it to lean to the left. Its glued solidly in place so its not really going anywhere. Thankfully its only very slight and not too noticeable when the model is running or viewed normally, but once seen, its difficult to unsee!

[Methuselah]

1 hour ago, john new said:

I am a novice on many things LNWR as, despite being a part-owner in Orion, that is the only one I know much about plus some basics on the rest. Strangely, unless it is a trick of the camera angles and lighting a couple of things appear; firstly the red livery makes that one look bigger and also the dome on the red one (Novelty) looks slightly off kilter in both photos; slightly clockwise as we look at it head on but doesn't on the black one (Lucknow).

I noticed the wonky dome too, but didn't like to mention.....

[No Decorum]

9 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

LMS 1920s?

 

For RTR the most suitable coach models are the Mainline/Bachmann LMS corridor stock.

 

http://www.mainlinerailways.org.uk/Coaches.htm

 

Everything else is either too early or too modern. 

 

 

Jason

I never could pull my eyes way from the round holes in the sides of those coaches. A regrettable blemish on otherwise good models in their time.

[Compound2632]

4 hours ago, No Decorum said:

I never could pull my eyes way from the round holes in the sides of those coaches. A regrettable blemish on otherwise good models in their time.

 

The holes are in the Mainline BR Mk1 carriages. There is such defect in the LMS Period 1 carriages to which Jason referred.

[No Decorum]

4 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

The holes are in the Mainline BR Mk1 carriages. There is such defect in the LMS Period 1 carriages to which Jason referred.

Good point. I just followed the link he provided.

[Legend]

It has to be said Rails of Sheffield are extremely helpful . Just enquired over my Novelty , it’s being despatched . They must be fed up with enquiries from impatient pre orders , yet dealt with in a very courteous and informative way .   You feel they are fellow enthusiasts helping you out as opposed to dealings with Hornby . 

[Ian Hargrave]

1 hour ago, Legend said:

It has to be said Rails of Sheffield are extremely helpful . Just enquired over my Novelty , it’s being despatched . They must be fed up with enquiries from impatient pre orders , yet dealt with in a very courteous and informative way .   You feel they are fellow enthusiasts helping you out as opposed to dealings with Hornby . 

And that’s been my experience in dealing with RoS…..whether by email or phone….exemplary. This has been very much their year ending for Christmas with perfect timing for the delivery and dispatch of their special commissions.

[Dragonfly]

22 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

...one of the select four Improved Precedents to receive the red livery...

 

Out of interest, which were the other three?

 

(googling this on my phone has not yielded results, and by the time I get back to a real computer I will have no doubt forgotten)

[Compound2632]

18 minutes ago, Dragonfly said:

 

Out of interest, which were the other three?

 

(googling this on my phone has not yielded results, and by the time I get back to a real computer I will have no doubt forgotten)

 

Upthread:

 

Edited December 17, 2021 by Compound2632

[Steamport Southport]

I'll try and find them. But ISTR the other three may have had the roundel crest rather than the small LMS.

 

 

EDIT: See below.

 

 

Jason

Edited December 17, 2021 by Steamport Southport

[Compound2632]

2 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

I'll try and find them. But ISTR the other three may have had the roundel crest rather than the small LMS.

 

Ha - it hadn't registered that Novelty's livery was non-standard. Perhaps it was an early repaint?

 

I believe it's the case that some ex-LNWR passenger engines that weren't repainted red did get the roundel, which was supposed to be only for red engines.

[Steamport Southport]

Sorry I've given you false information. These all got the small LMS as livery A4.

 

5012 John Ramsbottom

5036 Novelty

5050 Merrie Carlisle

5069 Penrith Beacon

 

5012 was the only one to get the 1928 LMS on the tender as livery A8.

 

 

A4 Pre 1928 standard 14" figures  LMS letters on cab

A8 Post 1927 standard straw/black insignia   10" numerals (MR style) on cab

 

 

Jason

[Dragonfly]

Awesome. Thanks for the info.

 

As for Novelty, mine arrived safe and sound today. Looks stunning. No sign of the dome being off-centre, so that must have been a trick of the camera angle.

[Jammy2305]

My Lucknow was dispatched yesterday apparently according to the email I've just seen... 

 

Fingers crossed it turns up safely! 

[Battledown]

My Lucknow and as-built Caledonian 812 both arrived the day after receiving respective emails from Rails. Both arrived in one piece having been packed really well and are good runners, so Christmas came early for me. As others say, the service is excellent.