Mark 2b, By Accurascale and IRM!

[BR Blue]

The 2z and the 2a had centre doors not present on the 2b or 2c.

Bachmann do the 2z. The 2z is vacuum braked but is essentially the same as the 2a. It has the same body shell.

Edited June 24, 2022 by BR Blue

[reddragon]

1 hour ago, WCML100 said:

 

Quick question (sorry to go slightly off topic)

 

Looking to model 3x MK2's found a charter rake (link below) - Numbered as 5171, 5200 and 9104, all I believe to be MK2z's. Is there anything cosmetic about these that differ from MK2 a's/b's/c's ?  Im trying to put together this rake and I am wondering if the Accurascale TSO's would be suitable for a renumber of the below x2 TSO's. If not are their any other MK2 variants which would be a more suitable candidate ie Bachman's MK2a ? 

 

thanks

 

 

 

 

The 2/2a have similar body shells, those pictured from Bachmann. Standard Mk1 style doors

 

The 2b/c are identical apart from the internal ceiling / fit out on the 2c was made to retrofit aircon. End only swing doors

[Flood]

2 hours ago, WCML100 said:

 

Quick question (sorry to go slightly off topic)

 

Looking to model 3x MK2's found a charter rake (link below) - Numbered as 5171, 5200 and 9104, all I believe to be MK2z's. Is there anything cosmetic about these that differ from MK2 a's/b's/c's ?  Im trying to put together this rake and I am wondering if the Accurascale TSO's would be suitable for a renumber of the below x2 TSO's. If not are their any other MK2 variants which would be a more suitable candidate ie Bachman's MK2a ? 

 

thanks

 

 

 

As already stated by BR Blue and reddragon, Mk2Z stock have centre doors as do Mk2A stock (made by Bachmann).

 

Mk2Z stock have only vacuum brakes (less a few exceptions) so will not have the air brake distributor and cylindrical tank seen on a Mk2A, along with vacuum cylinders instead of the smaller air brake ones.

 

Air brake distributor

 

Air braked above, vacuum braked below

 

In addition the end doors inside the corridor connections were sliding ones similar to Mk1 stock, Mk2A stock had folding doors.

 

Mk2A to the left, Mk2Z to the right.

 

 

For the record, Mk2C stock have different roof vents to Mk2B stock and less of them. All Mk2C stock had only 6 vents on the roof, regardless of the type, although the positions changed slightly between some types.

 

Mk2B stock have scallop style vents, as used on late build Mk1 stock and Mk2Z/Mk2A stock.

 

Early build Mk2C stock used G (or GM) vents which were similar to the cab roof vents on Class 20s, 37s and 40s and they had Mk2B style toilet windows, later built stock used Roevac vents and had toilet windows with no upper vents (as there was originally an air conditioning vent above them).

Edited June 24, 2022 by Flood

[WCML100]

thanks all for the feedback, really really helpful in this minefield that is the variation within the MK2 stock.

 

So I assume (unfortunately I will have to go for the Bachmann one) - question is will the native Bachmann MK2A tooling be correctly modified for the MK2z? I assume time will only tell but in the pics from their site below I can't tell much (especially the door ends can't quite be seen?)

 

https://www.Bachmann.co.uk/product/br-mk2-tso-tourist-second-open-wcrc-maroon/39-354

 

Any guesses?

 

Also were West Coast MK2z 5171, 5200, or 9104 any of the ones that got modified for Scottish routes to work with air brakes? Im assuming any that were modified can be mixed with the a's, b's, c's etc in rakes?

[Flood]

Bachmann's 39-354 is a continuation of 39-350 and 39-351 (blue and grey), 39-352 (NSE) and 39-353 (ScotRail) which are all Mk2Z models so should be correct from the outset. 39-353 should have air brake distributors but no viewable air brake cylinders nor brake linkages because they were disc braked. They've chatted to me about the ScotRail models, the West Coast ones should be correct but I haven't seen one.

Those modified for the Edinburgh - Glasgow push-pull were:

5126, 5130, 5134, 5137, 5142, 5144, 5146, 5147, 5152, 5153, 5160, 5169, 5176, 5182, 5185, 5187, 5189, 5190, 5192, 5195, 5197 and 5202

9387, 9395, 9397, 9400, 9403, 9411 and 9412

13415, 13416, 13423, 13424, 13427 and 13431

so none of those mentioned by yourself.

9104 was originally 9401 before it was converted to a BSOT.

 

You are correct that those modified for the Glasgow - Edinburgh trains could work with any air braked stock. In fact the vast majority of the TSOs and BSOs modified worked with Mk2A stock on the Eastern Region in the 1980s as only five Mk2Z TSOs, and one FK, stayed in Scotland and were painted ScotRail. Two modified BSOs stayed in Scotland but in blue and grey.

 

Sorry to everyone else for straying off topic a bit.

Edited June 24, 2022 by Flood

[WCML100]

2 hours ago, Flood said:

Bachmann's 39-354 is a continuation of 39-350 and 39-351 (blue and grey), 39-352 (NSE) and 39-353 (ScotRail) which are all Mk2Z models so should be correct from the outset. 39-353 should have air brake distributors but no viewable air brake cylinders nor brake linkages because they were disc braked. They've chatted to me about the ScotRail models, the West Coast ones should be correct but I haven't seen one.

Those modified for the Edinburgh - Glasgow push-pull were:

5126, 5130, 5134, 5137, 5142, 5144, 5146, 5147, 5152, 5153, 5160, 5169, 5176, 5182, 5185, 5187, 5189, 5190, 5192, 5195, 5197 and 5202

9387, 9395, 9397, 9400, 9403, 9411 and 9412

13415, 13416, 13423, 13424, 13427 and 13431

so none of those mentioned by yourself.

9104 was originally 9401 before it was converted to a BSOT.

 

You are correct that those modified for the Glasgow - Edinburgh trains could work with any air braked stock. In fact the vast majority of the TSOs and BSOs modified worked with Mk2A stock on the Eastern Region in the 1980s as only five Mk2Z TSOs, and one FK, stayed in Scotland and were painted ScotRail. Two modified BSOs stayed in Scotland but in blue and grey.

 

Sorry to everyone else for straying off topic a bit.

Thanks mate. Your knowledge is insane! 
 

does lead me to wonder how many unconverted Mk2z’s are within the West Coast fleet these days as surely they are limited to only running with others of their type or mixed in within Mk1 sets?

[murphaph]

6 hours ago, Flood said:

For the record, Mk2C stock have different roof vents to Mk2B stock and less of them. All Mk2C stock had only 6 vents on the roof, regardless of the type, although the positions changed slightly between some types.

 

Mk2B stock have scallop style vents, as used on late build Mk1 stock and Mk2Z/Mk2A stock.

 

Early build Mk2C stock used G (or GM) vents which were similar to the cab roof vents on Class 20s, 37s and 40s and they had Mk2B style toilet windows, later built stock used Roevac vents and had toilet windows with no upper vents (as there was originally an air conditioning vent above them).

Excellent post. The mk2c's also had a very obvious large hatch on one end of the roof to allow the planned for AC equipment to be installed, the hatch was the same on the later AC stock.

[adb968008]

ive seen my first mk2b in the flesh in decades today…and guess what its a new very rare Mk2b variant RTO (Restaurant Third Open)..*

 

*imo definitely not first or second looking at the menu

 

Mk2b 5452 ex-TSO

 

seen accompanying mk2a FK 13453 at St Annes on sea, about 1 mile from Blackpool

 

The question isn't how much of a mk2B you can see, but how many mk1 fittings they are now carrying…. I noted 5452 has had some of its windows removed, to become serving hatches, but the windows weren't wasted, they were built into a wooden annex, theres a new centre door hacked into the middle of it, but those doors fitted are mk1’s.. the bogies are mk1 commonwealths, and note the broken springs.

 

Can you not make this variant please 😄

Edited June 25, 2022 by adb968008

[PieGuyRob]

13 hours ago, adb968008 said:

ive seen my first mk2b in the flesh in decades today…and guess what its a new very rare Mk2b variant RTO (Restaurant Third Open)..*

 

*imo definitely not first or second looking at the menu

 

Mk2b 5452 ex-TSO

 

seen accompanying mk2a FK 13453 at St Annes on sea, about 1 mile from Blackpool

 

The question isn't how much of a mk2B you can see, but how many mk1 fittings they are now carrying…. I noted 5452 has had some of its windows removed, to become serving hatches, but the windows weren't wasted, they were built into a wooden annex, theres a new centre door hacked into the middle of it, but those doors fitted are mk1’s.. the bogies are mk1 commonwealths, and note the broken springs.

 

Can you not make this variant please 😄

I live further up the coast from them and I didn't know they were there. They are both in my ICRS numbers book and I need them for sight. Cheers for the info.

[Covkid]

Some excellent info from "Flood".

I would just like to add one little note.  AIUI Mk2 vehicles can only accommodate a single brake system, so are either vac or air.  AIUI this is because they built as monocoque unlike the Mk1, and as such have nowhere to support the extra equipment underneath. Mk1 underframes are able to be dual braked. 

 

 

[adb968008]

20 hours ago, PieGuyRob said:

I live further up the coast from them and I didn't know they were there. They are both in my ICRS numbers book and I need them for sight. Cheers for the info.

The location is here..

it was a bit of a surprise for me too at first. It wasnt immediately apparent they were mk2’s, from a distance, and the wooden annex I originally thought they were LMS, but once you get closer and see the mk2 outline it gives away, but theres a lot of mk1 fittings hacked and welded in to the bodysides (guards doors in the centre) when it was converted to its new role.

 

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Carriage+Cafe/@53.7461396,-3.0329989,17z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x487b412b8566e8b7:0x81fbd1088ec954a6!8m2!3d53.7468691!4d-3.0312062?hl=en-GB

 

They built a station platform for them using original edging stones from somewhere too. 
 

The servings hatches seems a recent thing, looking at older google images, both coaches used to be seating areas.

Edited June 27, 2022 by adb968008

[McC]

20 minutes ago, thetrains said:

Could you tell me the length, buffer end to b end please, have a feeling a feeling I will only get 4 in longest fiddle yard road, can get 5 Bch Mk1's that are close coupled. Cheers.

 

269mm

[Guest]

 

Just a quick question, are very any plans for any Regional Railways-livered a/b/c stock?

 

Also, technically I know this really belongs in the ideas thread but is there any proposal for any air-conditioned variants?

[Accurascale Fran]

13 hours ago, R. Knowles said:

 

Just a quick question, are very any plans for any Regional Railways-livered a/b/c stock?

 

Also, technically I know this really belongs in the ideas thread but is there any proposal for any air-conditioned variants?

 

Sorry @R. Knowles, but we don't comment on plans until we formally announce anything. 

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Accurascale Fran said:

 

Sorry @R. Knowles, but we don't comment on plans until we formally announce anything. 

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

Oh yes of course! Sorry, I  had forgotten about that!

 

No worries, I understand! :) 

[proton]

1966 Mark 2 Pullmans in grey/blue, drool....

 

John

[adb968008]

1 hour ago, proton said:

1966 Mark 2 Pullmans in grey/blue, drool....

 

John

Wrong thread, but yes please, and in IC as pulled by 89001 too please.

[The Black Hat]

Whats the chances of the Vintage Train stock being done by Accurascale?

[Covkid]

On 23/09/2022 at 15:28, The Black Hat said:

Whats the chances of the Vintage Train stock being done by Accurascale?

Not sure Vintage Trains have any Mk2b or Mk2c vehicles, principally because they use vacuum brakes. The current rake TY01 is formed of Mk1s and Mk2zs with a couple of Met Camm Pullmans.

[45125]

On 26/06/2022 at 12:56, Covkid said:

Some excellent info from "Flood".

I would just like to add one little note.  AIUI Mk2 vehicles can only accommodate a single brake system, so are either vac or air.  AIUI this is because they built as monocoque unlike the Mk1, and as such have nowhere to support the extra equipment underneath. Mk1 underframes are able to be dual braked. 

 

 

Not quite true regarding dual braking, after a very long conversation some time with one of BR's eminent brake engineers said it is possible to fit air brakes to a vacuum brake vehicle to make a dual braked vehicle.

 

[Covkid]

11 hours ago, 45125 said:

Not quite true regarding dual braking, after a very long conversation some time with one of BR's eminent brake engineers said it is possible to fit air brakes to a vacuum brake vehicle to make a dual braked vehicle.

 

Thanks very much. That successfully debunks !!!

[ERIC ALLTORQUE]

Runable with a 66 as it happens for real it seems........

 

[TravisM]

Was looking on Flickr for ideas of Network Rail test train stock and found 977969, a BFK which was formerly 14112 and Royal Train household couchette 2906 in former lives.  If Accurascale do another run after this one, please consider it as well as Riveria Trains 17105, again a former Royal Train couchette in Riveria Trains blue and BR blue/grey hint, hint 😉😉😎.

[Hound Dog]

Does anybody know the latest status of the Mk2b coaches ?……. Last update I could find was Q4 22.

[McC]

2 minutes ago, Hound Dog said:

Does anybody know the latest status of the Mk2b coaches ?……. Last update I could find was Q4 22.

No change.