Ingleford Wharf: 1870s canalside inglenook on the "M&WJR" in 00, and Victoria Quay: a 1900s WIP in 0

[Barclay]

I think that little bit of post and chain fencing looks really good. I wouldn't change the wall myself - the existing one fits into the landscape very nicely.

[MrWolf]

Re the log store, it might not be ideal for it to levitate, but a log store does need a bit of an air gap beneath it otherwise the damp soon gets up into the lower layers of wood and they rot rather than dry out.

[Schooner]

15 hours ago, magmouse said:

...a nice set of red curtains...

 

🤣

 

Bon, merci à tous. After a day or two of Looking On, I think the new wall is out; little log scene is in; railings behind shed and (maybe, final composition depending) at the break in the wharf only. Really useful to have all these extra insights whilst my own coat of Looking On is drying, a dead handy planning tool, so it's all very much appreciated :)

 

In between trying to balance railings and gates (gave up, used Pritstick), I tried out the new rattle can of Indian Red on the Neilson 2 (box) and knocked up a new buffer beam and front footplates:

...although everything else is only loose in the the above.

 

This was a made-to-spec-job (no more expensive than any other rattle can, it turns out, and the gives excellent fines spray), using the same RAL code I'd sent to @Carnforth as a suggestion for Neilson 1 (piano). Even over the bright red primer it's a good couple of shades darker and browner. TBH, I think this will end up being perfect after dry brushing and gentle dusty weathering but is worth bearing in mind for the future. The plan was always to use this shade as a base for 'new' metalwork around the layout, as is not just period correct

(bright but overcast day, about as neutral as possible for colour ref)

 

but which to my eye looks plain better, with a much gentler visual impact. The rattle can is itself too dark, but with a brighter drybush to follow up should be about right I think...?

 

In situ:

 

15 hours ago, magmouse said:

Please don't lose it here!

I'll try not to! However, for expectation management, my impression of this kind of location is very much that whilst they were not crowded they absolutely were cluttered, so things will be creeping in that direction... None of it irreversible, of course :)

 

 

15 hours ago, magmouse said:

my sense of Ingleford is it is fairly rural,

An interesting one, which I'm still working out myself. I think the short answer is that to modern sensibilities, yes; to folks of the setting, no. It would've been a major hub, even with the Lore that by 1875 the M&WJR no longer regards it as a primary facility (transhipment away from Saul Dock being largely unnecessary), so do expect it to look busier as it lurches towards scenic 'completion', whatever that means!

 

PS. CAD/3D printing was a false alarm - it's just not as enjoyable as messing about with bits of wood, card and plastic even if the results are 'better'. Add in the fuss of finding and paying for a design to be printed, the fact that we all spend enough time on computers as it is, and I'd rather be layout designing than part designing, and the lustre rapidly wore off. It's possible, which is good to know, and I don't particularly enjoy it atm, which is also good to know :)

 

Edited June 29, 2023 by Schooner

[Annie]

5 hours ago, Schooner said:

PS. CAD/3D printing was a false alarm - it's just not as enjoyable as messing about with bits of wood, card and plastic even if the results are 'better'. Add in the fuss of finding and paying for a design to be printed, the fact that we all spend enough time on computers as it is, and I'd rather be layout designing than part designing, and the lustre rapidly wore off.

I have to agree.  I'm an old fashioned scratchbuilder and while 3D printing caught my attention for a while there I'd much rather be working with wood and card to make my models.

[JustinDean]

The chain fencing in an L shape around the end of the basin. If you’re really wanting it maybe just have it across the end and not the bit  alongside if that makes sense. That’s removing  part of the basin that can be used  - what would you do that?

 

Jay

Edited June 29, 2023 by JustinDean

[Tortuga]

For what it’s worth:

No to the wall: looks too country manor to my mind

Not sure on the log store: structure looks ideal, but maybe too well stocked? Something about the logs looks ‘off’ to me

Yes to the chain and post fence, but only behind the shed parallel to the ramp and along the end of the basin (as Jay said) - alongside the basin and on the trackside edge of the ramp looks too modern day health and safety.

 

[Schooner]

6 hours ago, JustinDean said:

That’s removing  part of the basin that can be used  - what would you do that?

No idea why, but having railings just in the corners of docks is a bit of a thing. It is a slightly higher risk area*, and actually it doesn't impact utility (you can't get cargo hatches into corners - there's too much ship in the way!), but not sure what the real reason is. For my purposes, as per, it's for a bit of visual guidance and coherence (hopefully!) with a nod to reality, rather than a direct following of a prototype.

 

Oh, and 'cos I like the reflections :)

 

*Stories abound, most of them hilarious and not all** on the way back on board after a run ashore.

**But also most.

 

6 hours ago, Tortuga said:

For what it’s worth:

Lots, thank you. In principal agreed all round really, just need to decide what to do about it! BTW, what news from Whaley?

 

4mm - Ingleford General updates from this eve:

The final lid popped on the box and (post-photo) given a lick of paint.

 

Terraforming done to take the woodstuffs. A quick note that this is just a little visual reward for an operator who puts in the effort not just to lean around the corner of the old mill to see what happens (what's under the further block? 👀) but to really explore the scene. Not quite a cameo, but a little Easter egg. I think this means it just has to be internally coherent rather than having an explicit place within the wharf context.

 

After 5 attempts over 3 days, finally found a way to get the lean-to off the office/workshop without tearing the building to shreds. Currently trialling it on the other end before working on a new (narrower) roof for it.

 

To put the chain fence in a bit more context:

In context I think the fence will just blend in to soften the edges between scenes. I seem to have misplaced the photo looking further left, showing how the visual link between the shedside and waterside fence sections works, or not...but so far I think I'm into it.

 

Whilst waiting for things to dry I also started stripping the Peckett body for parts.

Useful and therapeutic! Any suggestions on how to get the pipework off intact...?

 

Still all very WIP, all feedback, thoughts and pinions welcome as ever :)

Edited June 30, 2023 by Schooner

[Tortuga]

7 hours ago, Schooner said:

BTW, what news from Whaley?

Not much. I’ve been concentrating my limited modelling time on Alsop, so Whaley is sat waiting on me getting time to deal with the mangled tandem point.

[Schooner]

Some general bits and bobs whilst paint dries, bold subtitles should help guide you to what may (/avoid what may not) be of interest!

 

'50s (mostly) Box Tank references:

 

That little lot should be enough to have a crack at a reasonable arse-end, brakes, backhead controls, pipework etc.

 

Lesson 1: Cassettes

I've just realised that I've meant to jot down a couple of thoughts from the past couple weeks' modelling before I forget it all...and have left it at least 50% too late already! But for now:

• Cassette connection: in general, works a treat. This makes slightly dubious 'small space' schemes like the below, which have potential off-scene routes aplenty

surprisingly easy to set up and use. Many won't have extra space to the sides (if they did, the scene would be larger!), but we all have space at the front from which we operate the layout. This space can be used to represent an off-scene location (or network) in a space-efficient way - eg the running line curving towards the front edge of the layout on the LHS in the above. With one major caveat, I can recommend folding brackets and Intentio cassettes for this purpose. Excuse the grotty pics of a still-WIP setup, but to save a further thousand words:

Caveat: Don't mix track codes. It's not worth it. Just use one for all - if your layout is Code 75 Bullhead, use that in your cassettes. The Intentio products will work fine with it, although might need the outboard 'covering board' leaving off or amending. 

 

The pine block I've used is very much optional, and followers may remember is a newish addition. This is to give a little more space for a more relaxed reverse curve on the enty/exit road on Ingleford, and doesn't impact cassette operation at all - indeed aesthetically it's much neater without.

 

Lesson 2: Epoxy resin water

For dams, don't bother with any purpose-sold polyprop to make up dams for edges*. Just buy a roll of polyester (PET) flash/release tape, ideally wider than the 'water' is deep. Use this to cover the water-side edge of a bit of timber hefty enough for the job of forming a dam and you're good to go. Clamp it well!

 

*Although if you want some just say, I've plenty now going spare 😎

 

This is not only simpler, quicker, and significantly cheaper to achieve a good dam but crucially gives a visibly better (smoother/clearer/higher gloss) finish.

 

When I do it again, the overall process will look something like:

• Make 'underwater' space - dig out the pond or river or whatever
• Sceneic
• Fashion a dam from timber batton/board of suitable size and strength; make sure to try it in situ inc. clamping as it will be for real
• cover in flash tape (ideally one piece, even around corners) where it will be in contact with the resin
• glue to layout fascia with Copydex, clamp tightly and check seal (I used a bit of 50:50 PVA). Do not use hot glue around the dam edge.
• Buy, tint, mix and pour epoxy as per maker's instructions
• When cured, remove clamps and dam. The Copydex is thick and sticky enough to make for a really good seal between dam and fascia, but pulls off easily and cleanly. This cannot be said of hot glue...!
• Enjoy!

Sounds stressful, but it really isn't and I've no hesitation about planning for resin water features on future layouts :)

 

Lesson 3: 

If you've not already, get a benchhook and/or 2-plane 90 degree jig. Even something like the cheap and cheerful

which I was recently gifted makes for great improvement in convenience if nothing else

 

I thought I was fine with clamps, magnetic and mechanical, engineers blocks etc and I was...but only fine. Things are much much simpler with a decent corner to build things into/against! The bench hook I used was great, but primarily served as a square and mitre cutting guide - the bed was too narrow for many purposes. Now I am, as they say*, away laughing on a fast camel. You inspirational lot are almost certainly ahead of me in this and other things which I've started to codify a little better (ground cover technique, paint schedules, approved approaches to different modelling media etc), so do feel free to critique any of the above and help me improve.

 

Likewise, other Modelling Bench Essential recommendations would be gratefully received :)

 

*Where, mate? Where do they say this?!

 

In other news, there are a couple of small developments to be trialled and I'd like your help to further the M&WJR side of things so expect another chatty post soon, but I'm out of time before this evening's Organised Fun so,

 

Ciao ciao for now!

 

Edited July 1, 2023 by Schooner

[Schooner]

Tiny update on current state of play:

 

To pad things out a little, the best live TV ever recorded

 

Happy Monday!

[JustinDean]

8 minutes ago, Schooner said:

Tiny update on current state of play:

 

To pad things out a little, the best live TV ever recorded

 

Happy Monday!

“Ged up and par-dee!” 
Love this clip of JB

 

Jay

[NHY 581]

8 hours ago, JustinDean said:

“Ged up and par-dee!” 
Love this clip of JB

 

Jay

 

 

Saw James Brown when he provided the support for Red Hot Chili Peppers in Cardiff a few years back. Awesome. Even better as I was working and able to roam around the venue at will. Managed to see most of his set from the pit in front of the stage. 

 

Chilies weren't bad either. 

 

Rob. 

 

[Annie]

11 hours ago, Schooner said:

Tiny update on current state of play:

 

The tools hanging out of the partly opened toolbox is a nice touch.  Considering what you've had to do to make a decent model out of it it's all turned out rather well.

[Schooner]

On 25/07/2023 at 06:35, NHY 581 said:

Saw James Brown when he provided the support for Red Hot Chili Peppers

Oh, stop it! Sounds rubbish...! 

 

JB was the best part 50, and had been gigging hard for 30 years, by the time of that Letterman show and yet is on Full Send mode; no surpise he kept gigging hard for another 20 years after it, right up to the last. Bloody impressive. 

 

On 25/07/2023 at 08:43, Annie said:

The tools hanging out of the partly opened toolbox is a nice touch. 

Ta! Felt it needed to say TOOLBOX very clearly to make any sense...and it helps mask that the fact that the two halves of the lid are from two different scrap etch frets* and aren't too symmetrical! 

 

*Snips snapped, tearing the sister fret. Annoying all round.

 

Since that pic the body has been dismantled, rebuilt and re-painted - the weathered look is a side effect of cleaning up the tiny rivets along the top edge so they wouldn't be swamped. They say third time's the charm, but it's definitely getting worse at each attempt, so will be resisting the urge to fiddle further.

 

Next stage is to make a blank of the motor block so I can pour Liquid Gravity into each end of the bodyshell...

...unless anyone can think of a reason why it's a bad idea? Rough as guts, but should do the job once dry.

 

I also need to replace the AWOL safety valve cover. Any suggestions for suitable starting point, be it household item or a proper cast part, gratefully received.

 

Then it's 'just' brakes and pipes, cab details and a final paint. Then I can get back to what I was meant to be doing...!

 

PS. Counter-intuitively, the most efficient way to fill a space for max weight is to use the larger shot rather than smaller (so as to minimise the number of gaps), correct?

Edited July 27, 2023 by Schooner

[Schooner]

Blank in place...

and loaded with shot (of unknown provenance) to prevent collapse when the ends of the bodyshell were brimmed with shot-full-of-Liquid-Gravity and given a drenching in glue. I'll be leaving it to dry for at least 24hrs...this time...!

 

Vicky Quay bits to follow.

[Schooner]

Victoria Quay

 

An update from Richard

provides both carrot and stick. I'm sure you'll agree it's looking rather fine, much aided by the non-PECO track and the reduced TTs (adapted from the Kitwood Hill kit, which seems to hold something of a monopoly) - the carrot.

 

If you're anything like me, it's about now that you'll be wondering how to turn it into something which does credit to the amount of work that's been put into it already....the stick. There's no intention to turn the layout into a model of anywhere particular, but we've settled on Fremington Quay as our reference so I better find some references!

 

For general orientation:

It was on this railway https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Devon_Railway#Stations_and_route, subsequently the L&SWR, and was laid out thus https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=18.0&lat=51.07994&lon=-4.12031&layers=168&b=1. From the late 1800s to the mid-1900s it was, by tonnage, the largest port between Bristol and Land's End principally with coal in and clay out. There was also a large abattoir adjacent, and a fair amount of export of the local pottery.

 

Some inspirational pixels of quay and environs

.

Can never have enough gate and fence references! Are they off after elvers do we think?

 

My kind of colour palette! Hints at a backscene option, too.

 

Bridge deck. Possibly fancy dress for one of the cassettes?

 

Much good info, including a potted history 1832-1991, many useful photos and a 1932 timetable, here

https://devonassoc.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/IASDA-Newsletter-3rd-edition_Optimized.pdf

 

Backscene focus 1 - old lime kilns

 

Backscene focus 2 - Toff Hutch

 

Two great photos I've not found elsewhere - shame they are tiny reproductions - here http://www.devon-holiday.com/information/fremington.htm

 

General situation, cranes'n'clay train and strong vibes

It was even more grim in the '70s, especially in the sunshine http://www.cornwallrailwaysociety.org.uk/barnstaple-to-torrington-and-halwill-jct-ecl.html

 

Choo choo!

 

https://www.alamy.com/part-of-a-disused-old-quay-structure-on-a-river-estuary-at-low-tide-image151607923.html

 

https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-severn-sand-dredger-on-the-taw-estuary-at-low-tide-14785643.html

 

The crane is cool, but the track and point lever are more useful!

 

Possible building inspiration from Brunswick Wharf, Bideford

 

 

Sorry for crap format and lack of words. Running on a tighter time and brainpower budget than usual.

 

EDIT: As a perfect demo of which, I missed out the best of the bunch

Poifick :)

 

EDIT 2: Just 'cos schooners, the last of the breed to be launched locally, P.T.Harris of 1912 (well after my proposed period)

Lovely lines, quite archaic, being those of William Ashburner (launched 1876, the largest wooden sailing vessel built in Barrow-in-Furness, and the Ashburner yard's only schooner) though adopting a typically West Country counter stern.

 

The William Ashburner was a good'un, trading widely (regular runs to Uruguay, New York, the Caribbean and the Med) for twenty years - before settling down to coasting, a trade she stayed in until lost on rocks in the Severn in 1950. You can see why the Harris tribe fancied her as an example to copy.

William Ashburner getting a tow out of...somewhere...between the Wars, judging by her little tug, engine exhaust and struck square topsails. Note the cargo derricks and gin blocks rigged on the fore and main masts, a useful modelling reference. Anchor at the water ready to be let go if any of the infernal combustion engines throw a wobbly.

 

Here she is in almost-O, showing some very fine model making

 

Anyway, here's P.T.Harris in frame, at her builder/owner Philip Kelly Harris' yard at Appledore, c.1910

(a useful reference for set-dressing)

 

Whilst the OG chalked up almost 75 in trade, her successor didn't even survive 5

She vanished in a squall of the Welsh coast whilst sailing from Glasgow to St Malo in company with the ketch Bessie Ellen (1904) leaving no trace.

 

Bessie Ellen, another good'un, is currently looking for a new home if anyone reeeaaaally hates their bank account

https://woodenships.co.uk/sailing-yacht/westcountry-trading-ketch-bessie-ellen/

 

EDIT 3:

New gallery found, from which all the below are embedded

Bridge is kinda fun, but we're really interested in the salmon boat (?) with the elver (?) dip net. Compare to the salmon boat below (also at Fremington, 1946)

A slightly higher rez version of this corker:

 

Not the best colour reference, but a great shot for details.

 

Bob Furse, foreman of the crane drivers at Fremington, and some more useful detail

 

One can never have enough fence references, I find. The Ladies of the Fremington Show, c.1900 (if not a little later?)

 

No space for it on the board, but it's such a wonderful pic, also taken around 1900...

...and it's a useful weathering reference for Ingleford!

 

Last of the turn-of-the-century-building-photos, Fishley Pottery at Combrew about a mile South of Fremington

 

Uncaptioned, but almost certainly Garlandstone (image search 'garlandstone braunton' to see what you think). Seen in frame, c.1904

in plank (yup, under that viaduct)

as surveyed and supervised by one Col. H.F. Stephens, and finally launched in 1909, as seen below

as the penultimate wooden sailing coaster to be built within the bounds of the port of Plymouth, at Calstock.

In trade until c.1960, largely owned from Braunton, sold to a Seppo and found abandoned in 1970, she's been a museum since 1973  and now quietly passes what are, shamefully, likely to be her last days at Morwhellham Quay historic centre on the Tamar, as her owners apparently believe that "It is fitting the Garlandstone ends its life in such surroundings". It shouldn't need pointing out that no vessel on the National Historic Ships Register, one of only three type survivors (Bessie being one and Irene the other) from a fleet of over 1000, has a 'fitting' end of life. Anyway.

 

The Dutch MV Nike arrived at Fremington Quay on 1/10/69 and loaded 550tons of ball clay for Bayonne.

 

One of the brace of Grafton 6 ton cranes in action, unloading  Petersmarland clay (although into what I am not sure).

 

A train of  Petersmarland clay "near Fremington Quay". I have questions. EDIT: It's here before the line was regauged from 3' to stamdard in 1925. 

 

A busy scene at Fremington Quay on the 10/6/67. Top berth MV Northgate discharging house coal, lower berth MV Kolga loads 550tons of clay for La Spezia, Italy.

 

Modeller's-eye view. Britain From Above, the usual gold standard, has only this image of Fremington village.

 

Mostly interesting for showing a sailing vessel (although almost certainly motor-only by this point) alongside the Quay in the mid-50s. Also visible are the two cranes loading the MV.

 

 

 

Okay, done!

Edited July 29, 2023 by Schooner

[BWsTrains]

That is one inspirational post, love it! Begging to be put to good modelling use.

 

We watch with bated breath.

 

Colin

[Pete Haitch]

11 hours ago, Schooner said:

 

The William Ashburner was a good'un, trading widely (regular runs to Uruguay, New York, the Caribbean and the Med) for twenty years - before settling down to coasting, a trade she stayed in until lost on rocks in the Severn in 1950. You can see why the Harris tribe fancied her as an example to copy.

William Ashburner getting a tow out of...somewhere...between the Wars, judging by her little tug, engine exhaust and struck square topsails. Note the cargo derricks and gin blocks rigged on the fore and main masts, a useful modelling reference. Anchor at the water ready to be let go if any of the infernal combustion engines throw a wobbly.

 

 

If the William Ashburner was lost in Severn in 1950, then she would be a candidate for Little Muddle and @KNP 's next build!

[Schooner]

On 27/07/2023 at 23:30, Schooner said:

...it's definitely getting worse at each attempt, so will be resisting the urge to fiddle further.

Oh yeah?!

 

Still...

...that's a win!

 

Note the Liquid Gravity made its way right to the top of the chimney, which is ideal, and the tungsten putty in just about every available orifice. Paint largely stripped for some fairin', fettlin' and general 'kwittery, to be done tomo along with a new lid. Then safety valve cover, then paint.

 

Then cab, pipework &c!

 

PS. Early birds yesterday will find extra Fremingoscity has been added to the previous post, which might be of interest to followers

Edited July 29, 2023 by Schooner

[Schooner]

20 hours ago, BWsTrains said:

We watch with bated breath

Flattered, thank you, but please whatever you do don't anybody hold it!

[Schooner]

Quite enough for one night m'thinks.

 

Concept proved, I'll be making a new, less broken, saftey valve cover. What do we think of the flare?

https://imgur.io/EqM6Jbq?r

 

...which won't embed...link to ref photo.

 

Rear coupling hook will benefit from some quality time alongside a file, but I think the idea works. Ah. I've just realised that I need a fixed hook on the cab end to be able to chain shunt. Lol. A problem for tomorrow.

 

Final audience-participation tune of the night - what do we think about the shade of the Indian Red used previously? 

 

Portraying a 20y/o ex-contractor's loco I'd like to think Tipi received at least a lick of paint on joing the M&WJR...but would she look better in sooty black? 

 

Thanks in advance for your opinions. Very useful and much appreciated ;)

Edited July 30, 2023 by Schooner

[magmouse]

34 minutes ago, Schooner said:

What do we think of the flare?

I like it. It adds, er, flair.

 

34 minutes ago, Schooner said:

what do we think about the shade of the Indian Red used previously?

Keep it - good weathering opportunities, as your earlier version was beginning to demonstrate. Black would make it look like a tar tank wagon.

Nick.

[Schooner]

 

 

[JustinDean]

16 hours ago, Schooner said:

 

 

Thumbs up for both the scene and tune!

 

Jay

[Tortuga]

On 28/07/2023 at 22:37, Schooner said:

 

One of the brace of Grafton 6 ton cranes in action, unloading  Petersmarland clay (although into what I am not sure).

LNER Diagram D195 all-steel high.