Bachmann OO Spring 2022 Announcements inc. OO9

[mdvle]

13 hours ago, Downer said:

it’s been a long time since Bachmann announced any new 00 steam locomotive for its own range. A sign, I think, that the steam and transition eras are rapidly becoming a smaller part of the market. 

 

Alternatively, smart allocation of limited resources by Bachmann.

 

Bachmann, like all manufacturers, will only have so much money for tooling in a year.

 

There are lots of steam locos to choose from but a much smaller number of diesel or electric locos.

 

Their big competitor in Hornby is totally ignoring the diesel locos, leaving the space open for Bachmann to stake claims with actual models that will give them that market for the next 10 years (while fending off the newer manufacturers) while there will still be steam locos to choose from in say 3 years...

 

[Dunsignalling]

8 hours ago, mdvle said:

 

Alternatively, smart allocation of limited resources by Bachmann.

 

Bachmann, like all manufacturers, will only have so much money for tooling in a year.

 

There are lots of steam locos to choose from but a much smaller number of diesel or electric locos.

 

Their big competitor in Hornby is totally ignoring the diesel locos, leaving the space open for Bachmann to stake claims with actual models that will give them that market for the next 10 years (while fending off the newer manufacturers) while there will still be steam locos to choose from in say 3 years...

 

 

Bachmann has been noticeably less steam-orientated than Hornby for several years, and never shared the latter's obsession with big, green, and named in the first place. I think there's been a conscious decision to back-pedal on steam and (that) the retooled V2 marks an end rather than a new beginning. They allowed things like the Lord Nelson, GW Mogul or Manor to go unimproved for so long that others could no longer ignore their indifference and filled the gaps. The V2 would have probably gone the same way had they left it any longer.

 

Bachmann will continue to exploit the non-steam opportunities that Hornby have been letting slip. What goes around comes around? However, having splashed a million quid (allegedly) on the comprehensive new Class 47 development and tooling, I'd think Bachmann will be taking a breather this year from anything major, be it steam, diesel or electric, while that begins to pay for itself.

 

I think that Hornby concentrating largely on steam and Bachmann much less so is a divergence that's probably here to stay. We will see new steam-outline models from Bachmann, but I think they will continue to favour niche and/or smaller prototypes (either independently or for commissioners) rather than going after mainstream stuff that Hornby has been tardy in upgrading.

 

John  

Edited February 3, 2022 by Dunsignalling
(that) added

[RPNaylor0301]

Not a bad crop but nothing for me this time... The release of the deluxe 47s has just reaffirmed my fear that the 69s are going to be £300+ sound fitted when they land (new tooling with? +12 months to go before release, maybe nearer £400 if they do deluxe spec on them). 

 

... That said by then we might have a few more special liveries to go at too! (And maybe the GBRf 47s just to boot the credit card a little harder).

 

The 769s have genuinely got me looking at the possibility of an N gauge tailchaser though. Real soft spot for the 319s from childhood but don't fancy building OHLE. 

[TomScrut]

5 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

However, having splashed a million quid (allegedly) on the comprehensive new Class 47 development and tooling, I'd think Bachmann will be taking a breather this year from anything major, be it steam, diesel or electric, while that begins to pay for itself.

 

It will be interesting to see how many releases of the 47 they do this year. There have been 10 or 12 announced already, I wonder if they will sustain this rate for the next couple of releases or if they are hitting hard for the first couple and then will wind back a bit to let people's wallets catch up!

 

I think a CC model is an inevitability.

[ruggedpeak]

21 hours ago, E100 said:

Thankfully nothing for me in these announcements. My wallet can feel the sigh of relief. Some really great examples of 47's. Very surprised to see the lack of DRS DBSO for the collectors club. I'm sure that will come along with the mk2f's in anglia.

 

May ber because the DRS version will require new tooling of the front end as the lights etc are different and is unique to the DRS versions.

[E100]

19 minutes ago, ruggedpeak said:

May ber because the DRS version will require new tooling of the front end as the lights etc are different and is unique to the DRS versions.

Fair enough. I'd still expect that to come in next couple of months as it will support the mk2fs very well and allow for a very popular train formation seen in different parts of the country with nice motive traction whilst being small enough for most layouts.

[ruggedpeak]

1 minute ago, E100 said:

Fair enough. I'd still expect that to come in next couple of months as it will support the mk2fs very well and allow for a very popular train formation seen in different parts of the country with nice motive traction whilst being small enough for most layouts.

Seems to be a difference between Hornby and Bachmann in that Hornby have been more pro active in bringing out complete sets with locos, coaches and DVT's etc.

[PMP]

9 hours ago, mdvle said:

 

Not saying Accurasacle won't remain cheaper, but comparing an over 2 year old price with current prices is problematic given the way price increases in everything are going for the last 12 months.

Absolutely. I fail to understand why people fail to realise that the batch production system means a relatively small quantity of products has to support larger overheads, compounded currently by shipping issues. 
 

Standing by for the first unrealistic ‘make them here then’ post…

Edited February 3, 2022 by PMP

[GordonC]

19 minutes ago, PMP said:

Absolutely. I fail to understand why people fail to realise that the batch production system means a relatively small quantity of products has to support larger overheads, compounded currently by shipping issues. 
 

Standing by for the first unrealistic ‘make them here then’ post…

 

Some of those prices really are getting eye-watering and I do wonder if it can be healthy for the hobby, but at least with Bachmann you do know you'll be getting quality models.

 

I suspect that Accurascale can probably offer cheaper prices when they must have a fairly large proportion of direct sales where the normal retailer margin must be contributing to cover development costs and overheads and therefore allowing lower shop prices too. Along those lines, I wonder if Bachmann will look at more direct sales, possibly through the Collectors Club like with the cement wagons.

 

I would also wonder whether Bachmann could do with trying a more 'railroad' level of multiple units where the exterior are fully detailed but simplified interior detailing. For lots of more modern units where the glazing is tinted the interior is hardly visible anyway and in the case of the Class 150 as an example, fitting interior lights just highlights where the motor bogie frame intrudes into the interior and ruins the effect. Could more sales be achieved and more classes offered at a lower spec and lower price than just the all-singing, all-dancing ones we're getting at £450+ for a 4-car unit.

[micklner]

Unecessary pointless Gimmicks trying justifying daft prices. How many people run Trains in the dark??.  £40 for a simple Van, when Oxford are selling their latest for under half that price really ! , sums it up nicely.

Bachmann cant use the excuse of having to use other companies factories, as they own them already, making  them even more profit.

Sadly there will be very few people becoming Railway Modellers in the future , one look at the prices will be enough for them to simply go elsewhere. Quite sad times allround

Edited February 3, 2022 by micklner

[AY Mod]

4 minutes ago, micklner said:

Bachmann cant use the excuse of having to use other companies factories, as they own them already, making  them even more profit.

 

True, they can't use other producers for their own branded products but they have to compete internally for production capacity and labour within an organisation that produces many other lines which aren't model railways and they have to pay the price for production that Kader determine.

 

In terms of spec and price it may not be what you want but the evidence shows that many new products are sold out very soon after they hit the shop shelves. So who's wrong? You may not like it but those are the facts.

[Compound2632]

9 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

In terms of spec and price it may not be what you want but the evidence shows that many new products are sold out very soon after they hit the shop shelves. So who's wrong? You may not like it but those are the facts.

 

Clearly they are producing what the market wants at a price the market will bear. 

[The Stationmaster]

18 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

True, they can't use other producers for their own branded products but they have to compete internally for production capacity and labour within an organisation that produces many other lines which aren't model railways and they have to pay the price for production that Kader determine.

 

In terms of spec and price it may not be what you want but the evidence shows that many new products are sold out very soon after they hit the shop shelves. So who's wrong? You may not like it but those are the facts.

And let us not forget that when Bachmann were selling British out line models at what were in reality remarkably low prices Kader was losing money on manufacturing those models.  Man retailers expressed the view that Bachmann was underpriced and its profitability never made up for the losses that Kader were suffering on making the models so a change was inevitable.  Kader makes a lot more money, and far profits, manufacturing diecast  parts for cars (full size cars, not models) than it does from making model railway items.

 

And as ever as far as proice is convcerned the purchase of any mode railway item is a discretionary purchase which is not mandatory - you don't have to buy railway models.  Very unlike various goods you purchase from supermarkets for everyday life where many prices - I noticed last week - have increased by 10% virtually overnight.

Edited February 3, 2022 by The Stationmaster

[GordonC]

24 minutes ago, micklner said:

Unecessary pointlessGimmicks trying justifying daft prices. How many peopel run Trains in the dark??.  £40 for a simple Van, when Oxford are selling their latest for under half that price, sums it up nicely.

Bachmann cant use the excuse of having to use other companies factories, as they own them already, making  them even more profit.

Sadly there will be very few people becoming Railway Modellers in the future , one look at the prices will be enough for them to simply go elsewhere.

 

Some things are pointless and gimmicks and some aren't, depending on the model and how frequently its used then some higher-spec features will be welcome. For example, I like the Mk2Fs where I'll use them all the time with a variety of locos, but I wouldn't want an all-singing and all-dancing model that I rarely use. For prototypes that have been produced before, the chances are that higher spec features will differentiate a new model from what is already available second-hand so in particular with diesel locos thats where we're seeing continual new features. For prototypes new to tool up, or more niche prototypes, it may be difficult to judge whether the market wants high-spec or lower.

[7013]

I would not pay some of the prices quoted, however, the hobby is not for those on limited budgets these days if they want to buy new stuff. Thankfully there is plenty of 2nd hand stuff around that generally sells at cheaper than the newest and is of good quality, plus a healthy dose of weathering covers a multitude of sins. I remember people bemoaning the fact that locos had gone through the £100 barrier; now we are knocking on the door of £400 for a sound fitted latest incarnation of a 47. Good job I can’t stand the bloody things! 

[Dunsignalling]

17 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

True, they can't use other producers for their own branded products but they have to compete internally for production capacity and labour within an organisation that produces many other lines which aren't model railways and they have to pay the price for production that Kader determine.

 

In terms of spec and price it may not be what you want but the evidence shows that many new products are sold out very soon after they hit the shop shelves. So who's wrong? You may not like it but those are the facts.

Though the $64,000 question is how much of the quick sell-out phenomenon is despite the prices and because of low batch numbers. Probably a combination of the two, I'm guessing.

 

I'm a fairly impartial observer in this; the only new Bachmann products I'm likely to buy this year is a pair of the new Bulleid coaches that I've wanted for a long time. It might be a different story if they were making more green ones but, in my own case, price isn't an issue for now. 

 

Bachmann's particular business arrangements probably don't leave them much choice over pricing, but there are dangers in remaining out of step with the generality of the market for too long and they have much more to worry about than Hornby. Accurascale, Rapido, and KR Models have been/are bringing 4-wheel wagons to the market at prices getting on for 20% lower than the new Vanwide.

 

Bachmann may ultimately find themselves forced into a high-spec, high price, low volume straitjacket that will see them largely exit the mainstream end of the hobby and find their main competitor has become SLW.

 

That's not to say Bachmann couldn't survive, and even thrive under those circumstances but their overall position in the market would be much changed.

 

John

[woodenhead]

So today we saw a 50% leap in the average energy cost, a 100% increase in interest base rates.

 

An 8% inflationary rise from Bachmann looks quite miniscule in comparison.

 

Model trains are not immune from world economic factors, we just need to cut our cloth accordingly.

[andyman7]

14 hours ago, rob D2 said:

If I was KMRC i'm not sure i'd be happy with this release - as you said the 537 old tooling hasn't sold out at £189, the 526 new tooling  and 15% off would be about £26 more .

If you are in the market for a very weathered early 90s duff which would you go for ?

If you're me you'll have both 

 

[scottrains29]

26 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

So today we saw a 50% leap in the average energy cost, a 100% increase in interest base rates.

 

An 8% inflationary rise from Bachmann looks quite miniscule in comparison.

 

Model trains are not immune from world economic factors, we just need to cut our cloth accordingly.

With disposable income now severely squeezed it's now even more important that Bachmann etc can absorb as much of the cost increase as possible. 

 

Luxury goods (model trains etc) will be one of the first things people will cut back on.

 

[woodenhead]

1 minute ago, scottrains29 said:

With disposable income now severely squeezed it's now even more important that Bachmann etc can absorb as much of the cost increase as possible. 

 

Luxury goods (model trains etc) will be one of the first things people will cut back on.

 

I doubt very much they are making excessive profits right now, they are not energy companies you know.

 

A business without a profit is not a business for very long.

[rob D2]

A hobby is only as expensive as you make it.

 

If i couldn't afford more , I'd have one loco and a few wagons . If i want to buy more I need to cut my gas supply from Russia ...

 

No point whining , " adapt and overcome "

[Flittersnoop]

16 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

They're on their way v soon so get the kids on ebay just in case a buyer returns them as faulty and you have to re-advertise. You also get more layout space and modelling time as a bonus. 

Thanks for the warning. Also, I operate a strict No Returns policy on Ebay. Sold As Seen...

[Flittersnoop]

I do wonder, given the advent of the £300 loco, whether we're not approaching the point where it would be economic to manufacture in the UK, with the consequent benefit of being able to be more responsive to customer demand.

 

Not to mention the uncertainty that must now hang over the desirability of being dependent upon trade with a politically problematic country.

[PaulRhB]

3 minutes ago, Flittersnoop said:

I do wonder, given the advent of the £300 loco, whether we're not approaching the point where it would be economic to manufacture in the UK, with the consequent benefit of being able to be more responsive to customer demand.

 

Not to mention the uncertainty that must now hang over the desirability of being dependent upon trade with a politically problematic country.

Problem one with that is the overall owning group hails from the country in question  

Problem two is the knowledge base isn’t as easy to move as just plugging in a machine. The assembly team is highly skilled and setting up a new factory very expensive in premises and equipment before you even start to train a new workforce so the labour costs need to be higher in China before it even starts to make sense long term. 

 

[D860 VICTORIOUS]

18 hours ago, brushman47544 said:

The weathering looks similar to Kernow MRC’s limited edition of 47537 from 2019. That hasn’t sold out yet at £189.95 so I do wonder how quickly 47526 will sell. 

 

I’m pleased to see 47435, as a plain BR blue loco but with ETH, so soon after the first releases, and 47711 in large logo, but another 47712 in Scotrail livery so soon after the Bachmann Rep area limited edition is a surpriseHow many people will realise or care that the livery is as preserved?

 

My first choice for the second batch of 47s was a BR green with full yellow ends, but clearly I’ll have to wait longer for that.

Hi Andrew,some good points there.This is no criticism whatsoever of KMRC,and I think they said the weathering on 47537 was based on research,but despite searching online,seeing the loco on various DVD's and my own pictures,I haven't found any pictures of 47537 in the condition portrayed on the model. 47526 however does look the part.

A gfye 47 will hopefully be among future releases.