I won't use waterslide transfers because of the visible carrier-film!

[F-UnitMad]

3 hours ago, cctransuk said:

How difficult can it be to apply a coat of Klear

Isn't the difficulty these days getting hold of genuine 'Klear'? I have read lots of stuff on the Interweb about it being re-formulated, re-branded, or suchlike, and it all seems very inconclusive as to what the proper Klear is now, or where to get it.

[cctransuk]

1 hour ago, F-UnitMad said:

Isn't the difficulty these days getting hold of genuine 'Klear'? I have read lots of stuff on the Interweb about it being re-formulated, re-branded, or suchlike, and it all seems very inconclusive as to what the proper Klear is now, or where to get it.

 

I stockpiled Klear when it was indicated that it might be withdrawn, and I have followed subsequent developments as a matter of interest.

 

My understanding is that the current Johnsons product may be cloudy as supplied, under whatever brand name may be current, does perform as per the original product and dries clear.

 

The critical item in the product description seems to be that it is intended for the treatment of thermoplastic floor tiles - which I suspect are rather rare, nowadays.

 

At one time - possibly still current - Humbrol offered a product labelled Klear (Clear?), which was stated here to be the original Johnson Klear formulation.

 

CJI.

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

Of course, one could always use gloss varnish instead of Klear/Clear/Kleer etc just like in the olden days.

The original argument for using an alternative was when spraying larger areas, complete locos, rolling stock etc, and for securing ballast, it worked out cheaper than kosher modellers varnish, but on a transfer sized area I can't really see an issue.

 

Mike.

[cctransuk]

19 minutes ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

Of course, one could always use gloss varnish instead of Klear/Clear/Kleer .....

 

Not on Cambridge Custom Transfers !!

 

As per my instructions, oil-based varnishes will adversely affect them.

 

CJI.

[Enterprisingwestern]

1 hour ago, cctransuk said:

 

Not on Cambridge Custom Transfers !!

 

As per my instructions, oil-based varnishes will adversely affect them.

 

CJI.

 

Obviously with due adherence to manufacturers instructions!

 

Mike.

[Bucoops]

2 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

 

The critical item in the product description seems to be that it is intended for the treatment of thermoplastic floor tiles - which I suspect are rather rare, nowadays.

 

CJI.

 

You'd be surprised - although they are mostly under carpet/laminate now - but we (the asbestos company I work for) oversee their removal several times a week and there's no sign of a slowdown.

[cctransuk]

41 minutes ago, Bucoops said:

 

You'd be surprised - although they are mostly under carpet/laminate now - but we (the asbestos company I work for) oversee their removal several times a week and there's no sign of a slowdown.

 

Not really - our former home, now owned by another member here and part of a large estate, still has thermoplastic tiling on the ground floor.

 

CJI.

[F-UnitMad]

3 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

Not on Cambridge Custom Transfers !!

 

As per my instructions, oil-based varnishes will adversely affect them.

 

CJI.

Yes, I found that out the hard way, years ago.

 

No, I hadn't read the instructions first!! 🙄🙄🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤣🤣

[Type 2]

15 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

I stockpiled Klear when it was indicated that it might be withdrawn, and I have followed subsequent developments as a matter of interest.

 

My understanding is that the current Johnsons product may be cloudy as supplied, under whatever brand name may be current, does perform as per the original product and dries clear.

 

The critical item in the product description seems to be that it is intended for the treatment of thermoplastic floor tiles - which I suspect are rather rare, nowadays.

 

At one time - possibly still current - Humbrol offered a product labelled Klear (Clear?), which was stated here to be the original Johnson Klear formulation.

 

CJI.

This is the latest incarnation I believe (I bought mine a couple of months ago)...

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Pledge-Multi-Surface-Polish-Liquid-Protector/dp/B073VPRMZH?th=1

 

It is cloudy, but dries completely clear and more importantly flat even when brush applied

 

I've been using Klear and its successors for the best part of 30 years, swear by it and haven't had any adverse reactions to any paints nor decals (though I haven't tried yours yet!)

[Wheatley]

The advantage with Klear was that it was cheap, it dried almost instantly and it didn't leave brush marks. User experience varied as to whether it yellowed over time or not. 

 

It's other use amongst aero modellers was in dipping scratched or scuffed canopies to restore them to crystal clear, where it really did behave like some sort of miracle elixir. I've never come across a varnish with the same properties. 

 

I didn't stockpile it, I just haven't yet used up the two bottles I bought 25 years ago !  But then I don't habitually spray large models with it. 

[cctransuk]

2 minutes ago, Wheatley said:

The advantage with Klear was that it was cheap, it dried almost instantly and it didn't leave brush marks. User experience varied as to whether it yellowed over time or not. 

 

It's other use amongst aero modellers was in dipping scratched or scuffed canopies to restore them to crystal clear, where it really did behave like some sort of miracle elixir. I've never come across a varnish with the same properties. 

 

I didn't stockpile it, I just haven't yet used up the two bottles I bought 25 years ago !  But then I don't habitually spray large models with it. 

 

Klear has also been suggested as a fixing medium for ballasting - any experience/ comments, anybody?

 

CJI.

[Mr T]

On 22/04/2023 at 11:15, Wheatley said:

It was indeed Modelmaster who reckoned you could peel the carrier film off afterwards. I had a 25% success rate when I tried it so now I don't bother. 

 

What doesn't help is that those of us brought up on Humbrol Authentic Colour were led to believe that all paint should be dead flat matt, and old habits die hard. To my knowledge the only range of military colours which comes in high gloss is Hannants Xtracrylic/Xtranamel, everything else you have to faff about with varnish or Kleer. Railway modellers have it a bit easier with Precision etc. 

 

Incidentally, if decal setting solution doesn't work try making some pin holes in the silvered bits and introducing a bit of liquid polystyrene cement. Obviously try the tamer ones first before you attack it with butanol ...

 

As for Mach 2, ifvit looks anything like an Argosy  I applaud you ! My Dassault Falcon 20 remains unfinished after 20 years, it shouldn't be necessary to correct a plastic kit 8 inches long to get both sides the same length ! 

I know this is off topic, but here is my Argosy, to show no silvering, even with home made decals https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235107127-172nd-raf-armstrong-whitworth-argosy-c1-mach2-kit-finished/

[Darius43]

7 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

Klear has also been suggested as a fixing medium for ballasting - any experience/ comments, anybody?

 

CJI.

Before this thread I’d never heard of Klear being used for ballast fixing.  I suppose it should work as a ballast fixer but, given its rarity (original Klear) and importance as a varnish/decal sealer, why would one use it as such given that diluted pva should be cheaper.   
 

Like pva it would dry hard rather than flexible so wouldn’t provide any sound deadening properties.  Wouldn’t it also leave the ballast shiny and, if you use new Pledge, with the zesty scent of lemon?

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[DavidH]

My experience of the reformulated Klear, applied onto dry ballast, with the subsurface being plywood, was that it flaked off quite quickly. I use watered down Copydex now.

 

So, applying transfers to wet Klear - does this allow for repositioning/fine-tuning, or is it "get it right first time"?

[meil]

Quick Shine from Lakeland: https://www.lakeland.co.uk/20286/quick-shine-floor-finish-800ml?src=gfeed

[Enterprisingwestern]

1 hour ago, meil said:

Quick Shine from Lakeland: https://www.lakeland.co.uk/20286/quick-shine-floor-finish-800ml?src=gfeed

 

Doesn't say it's suitable for rolling stock and ballasting!!!

 

Mike.

[AY Mod]

On 23/04/2023 at 11:38, cctransuk said:

Klear has also been suggested as a fixing medium for ballasting - any experience/ comments, anybody?

 

It can be used for such and I have done so. As with PVA a few drops of detergent help it soak in more and a good soaking is needed (otherwise it will be friable as DavidH advises). It will have a sheen, as does PVA, but that can be addressed with a waft of matt spray varnish. One benefit, thanks to that friability, is that the ballast can be dug out from around the track more easily if necessary than with PVA.

[Steamport Southport]

On 22/04/2023 at 18:30, cctransuk said:

 

I stockpiled Klear when it was indicated that it might be withdrawn, and I have followed subsequent developments as a matter of interest.

 

My understanding is that the current Johnsons product may be cloudy as supplied, under whatever brand name may be current, does perform as per the original product and dries clear.

 

The critical item in the product description seems to be that it is intended for the treatment of thermoplastic floor tiles - which I suspect are rather rare, nowadays.

 

At one time - possibly still current - Humbrol offered a product labelled Klear (Clear?), which was stated here to be the original Johnson Klear formulation.

 

CJI.

 

I don't know whether it is exactly the same, I'm far from being a chemist.

 

But the information I read in one of the plastic model kit magazines (probably Airfix Model World) was it was formulated as an alternative when Johnson's changed Klear due to demand from the plastic kit builders.

 

Video here on how to use it.

 

 

I would take some of the comments below the video with a caution as we don't know what paints they used. Like any chemical I would test it before applying to anything that it could potentially damage.

 

It does go slightly white in the jar, but that disappears when shake and/or stirred.

 

I've not had any problems with Humbrol Enamel or Acrylic on mostly plastic kits. I tend to use Halfords spray cans for metal and not had any problems with those either.

 

 

Jason

[t-b-g]

21 hours ago, Mr T said:

I know this is off topic, but here is my Argosy, to show no silvering, even with home made decals https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235107127-172nd-raf-armstrong-whitworth-argosy-c1-mach2-kit-finished/

 

I had a look at your Argosy model. Lovely stuff! I once flew in one back from Bahrain to the UK in 1966, stopping off at Rome for refuelling, with just my family as passengers sitting in a few seats bolted onto the cargo hold and surrounded by various crates and boxes. I was only 6 years old but the memories are still strong all these years later!

[cctransuk]

4 hours ago, DavidH said:

So, applying transfers to wet Klear - does this allow for repositioning/fine-tuning, or is it "get it right first time"?

 

It requires confidence above all - so that you can work quickly.

 

Adhesion is not instantaneous by any means - some manipulation is possible.

 

Practice with some unwanted transfers is strongly recommended.

 

John Isherwood.

[The Fatadder]

15 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

It requires confidence above all - so that you can work quickly.

 

Adhesion is not instantaneous by any means - some manipulation is possible.

 

Practice with some unwanted transfers is strongly recommended.

 

John Isherwood.

I am going to have to give this a try, its got me wondering if this is the solution to one of the more difficult transfer applications adding bodyside logos / numbers to a Class 59/66/67 over the ribs.  

[cctransuk]

4 minutes ago, The Fatadder said:

I am going to have to give this a try, its got me wondering if this is the solution to one of the more difficult transfer applications adding bodyside logos / numbers to a Class 59/66/67 over the ribs.  

 

If you use a brush wetted with Klear to 'tamp' the transfer into the ribs, you should be OK.

 

Just have everything that you need to handso that, when you commence, there are no delays.

 

The transfer can be kept mobile by adding a little more Klear - fortunately, Klear has negligible thickness when dried.

 

That said - I haven't tried it with large transfers; I'd imagine that it may be more difficult to keep larger areas mobile.

 

Good luck,

John Isherwood.

[Type 2]

2 hours ago, The Fatadder said:

I am going to have to give this a try, its got me wondering if this is the solution to one of the more difficult transfer applications adding bodyside logos / numbers to a Class 59/66/67 over the ribs.  

I'd apply 2 or 3 coats of Klear (allowing each to dry thoroughly) and use a good quality decal setter to apply once the decals are in place.  I use this...

 

https://www.mr-hobby.com/en/product2/category_11/215.html

 

Use a film of water under the decal area and push it into place over each rib making sure you get all the water squeezed out (use a cotton bud), if it gets sticky, use more water to lubricate the surface again.

 

One thing you'll need is patience, in abundance, fixing decals over uneven surfaces is not something you can rush!

 

 

 

Edited April 24, 2023 by Type 2