WCRC - the ongoing battle with ORR.

[john new]

3 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I heard this rumour last week, and it seems its become a reality…

Monday and Tuesday next week, operated by LSL FTW-Mallaig

 

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U07998/2024-04-08/detailed

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U07999/2024-04-08/detailed

 

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U08000/2024-04-08/detailed
 

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U08001/2024-04-08/detailed

 

😀

37667 leading the ecs today…

 

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U07997/2024-04-03/detailed#allox_id=0

I wonder how many Harry Potter fans will show up to see this ?…

 

This is the test those rooting for LSL are waiting for… is a Scotrail 37 and mk3’s a sellable product to Mallaig, as reality is that and a Pacer is all LSL currently has spare… is it a jolly train, test train, railtour, a way of sticking the knife in, who knows… But whatever it is the ORR/NR can tick a box that says someone else can run a compliant heritage train up there, even if later it was seen that no one wanted to ride it. (my Mossel Bay comment re Knysna comes to mind).

 

(url link to Andrewstransport smug mug page).

 

No sign of a southbound working yet.

 

 

 

Whether or not they are Harry Potter fans is, I suspect, secondary to the haulage being steam. If riders, not watchers, then for some the desire is also to ride in stock within which you can hear the locomotive.  This is a heritage ride with HP related bonuses. IF there are more diesel enthusiasts than a declining pool of now probably mostly elderly steam fans it will work as the (probably only a few) who ride the train for the views won't mind either way. The issue regarding the along for the scenery pax is will they pay a premium for better coaches?

 

Edited April 3 by john new
Clarity

[ruggedpeak]

10 minutes ago, 11B said:

 Hi Tony,

 

I fear you may have misinterpreted the point I was trying to make, there should be no exemption or exception to the law that is currently in place. What was simply trying to imply was that a realistic date should have been set many years ago for CDL. Then after that date, if it doesn't have it, if doesn't run in passenger service. What one man calls a "safe work around" for not having CDL may not be seen the same by other!

 

And for clarification - I am neither a supporter or hater of WCR or any other TOC for that matter. I know people that have worked for them, and people that still do. And most importantly to myself, I don't discuss the politics of their work place with them, likewise we don't discuss the politics of mine. Likewise, I am fully aware of the reputation of both WCR and the owner.

 

Kindest regards Ian

Hi Ian

 

Fair point, you did mention the cutoff date and I missed that. I suspect an arbitrary date may have been subject to legal challenge by you know who and an outcry from the "elf and safety gone mad" brigade, but who knows?

 

I do find the use the of the term 'hater' inappropriate with respect to those who object to WCRC's conduct. I have already been falsely accused of hating WCRC on this thread. Objecting to WCRC's behaviour is not hate, it is an informed position by those who put the safety of people first and are prepared to speak out about it.

 

Kind regards

 

Tony

 

 

[ba14eagle]

I for one would be very happy to pay for top & tail tractors and mk3' to Mallaig this Summer.

It would make the long weekend we've got booked and paid for - only an 18 hour round car journey 😲  from Wiltshire! - worthwhile.

[Michael Hodgson]

1 hour ago, phil-b259 said:

 

I was speaking on a general basis not about the West Highland line where Pacers are not permitted anyway.

Wht not?  Do they derail on 1st radius curves?

[black and decker boy]

1 hour ago, adb968008 said:

 

 

two MP HST sets ?

Yes, I believe there will now be 2 Midland Pullman sets with various extra PCs and trailers having been processed through Eastleigh at regular intervals.

 

i think the short lived RCS HST set has now gone blue.

[Gilbert]

2 hours ago, adb968008 said:

 

 

two MP HST sets ?

Probably.....

[11B]

1 hour ago, ruggedpeak said:

 

I do find the use the of the term 'hater' inappropriate with respect to those who object to WCRC's conduct. I have already been falsely accused of hating WCRC on this thread. Objecting to WCRC's behaviour is not hate, it is an informed position by those who put the safety of people first and are prepared to speak out about it.

 

Kind regards

 

Tony

 

 

 

Hi Tony,

 

I can only apologise, on reflection the word "hater" was perhaps not the wisest choice on my part, and it was not aimed at anyone, and I do respect both your views and informed responses. Ultimately, I personally feel that we probably both have a similar wish for a safe and speedy outcome that is acceptable to all parties concerned (rail industry/law makers/passengers and so on), just sometimes what sounds right in my head as I type can be read in a completely different manner thous giving a different spin on what I'm trying to say.

 

Kind regards Ian 

Edited April 3 by 11B

[woodenhead]

1 hour ago, ba14eagle said:

I for one would be very happy to pay for top & tail tractors and mk3' to Mallaig this Summer.

It would make the long weekend we've got booked and paid for - only an 18 hour round car journey 😲  from Wiltshire! - worthwhile.

Top & Tail - it's got a DBSO so it's just the solitary class 37 required - it's as if the Mk3 Push Pulls of 1980 and the post privatisation DRS Mk2 Cumbrian services got melded together with a 37 at the helm.

 

I reckon if the main users of the service are American tourists they will appreciate the ambience of a Mk3 FO over an older Mk1.  The engine at the head might not matter so much to them.

[adb968008]

22 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

Top & Tail - it's got a DBSO so it's just the solitary class 37 required - it's as if the Mk3 Push Pulls of 1980 and the post privatisation DRS Mk2 Cumbrian services got melded together with a 37 at the helm.

 

I reckon if the main users of the service are American tourists they will appreciate the ambience of a Mk3 FO over an older Mk1.  The engine at the head might not matter so much to them.

Only if you take all the windows out…. 

 

its not called land of the free for nothing.

 

Seeing the 37 and the 156 they may be confused between which is older, they might think the 156 is a British budd railcar.

 

it needs a chimney to be obvious,there is space for it on a 37 bonnet !

 

Edited April 3 by adb968008

[phil-b259]

5 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

Wht not?  Do they derail on 1st radius curves?

They suffer from extreme flange wear - if you actually bothered to do research rather than cheap point scoring you would know that British Rail found this out the hard way when the units were first introduced and the subsequent redeployment away from certain places which followed.

Edited April 3 by phil-b259

[woodenhead]

2 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Only if you take all the windows out…. 

 

its not called land of the free for nothing.

 

Seeing the 37 and the 156 they may be confused between which is older, they might think the 156 is a British budd railcar.

 

it needs a chimney to be obvious.

 

The 156 has sliding doors, it would look more like a New York Subway train, they see the door handles on the Mk3 and know that a door means luxurious.

[black and decker boy]

More info on the LSL trains here:

 

https://www.railadvent.co.uk/2024/04/west-highlander-day-trips-to-run-on-scotlands-jacobite-line-next-week.html

 

Tickets will be available as a ‘pay on the day' basis priced at £40 per adult and £20 for those under 16s.

[Northmoor]

Can I suggest that discussion of the suitability of Pacers for railtours on the WHL is a bit far off-topic?

 

There is a whole thread elsewhere devoted to Pacers where if you go back far enough, you will find me accurately predicting that many of those donated to preservation would be unserviceable within about five years.

[adb968008]

14 hours ago, black and decker boy said:

More info on the LSL trains here:

 

https://www.railadvent.co.uk/2024/04/west-highlander-day-trips-to-run-on-scotlands-jacobite-line-next-week.html

 

Tickets will be available as a ‘pay on the day' basis priced at £40 per adult and £20 for those under 16s.

at this short notice I suspect this will be a bit of a stretch to be successful.

if they remained a couple of weeks it may have more chance.

(I do wish LSL would buy a 26 or a 27).

 

 

[black and decker boy]

31 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

at this short notice I suspect this will be a bit of a stretch to be successful.

if they remained a couple of weeks it may have more chance.

(I do wish LSL would buy a 26 or a 27).

 

 

I suspect its crew training runs that opportunistically are being offered to the public but pay-on-day tickets

 

a 37 to Mallaig for £40 will draw out a few tractor bashers but maybe very few normals who happen to be around the station given a scotrail fare is under £20

 

Edited April 4 by black and decker boy

[adb968008]

Interesting comparison to the ORR and WCRC here

 

Heathrow airport is asking regulators for an extension to time limits to roll out new security measures

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-68723697

 

the approach is different though, rather than shutting down Heathrow for non compliance, they intend to use fines…

 

different carrot, different stick.

[Michael Hodgson]

9 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Interesting comparison to the ORR and WCRC here

 

Heathrow airport is asking regulators for an extension to time limits to roll out new security measures

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-68723697

 

the approach is different though, rather than shutting down Heathrow for non compliance, they intend to use fines…

 

different carrot, different stick.

 

The larger airports have more staff and much stronger financial resources and if they can't plan the installation of a few machines and organise their buildings to accommodate them when all the tin-pot airfields can, I wouldn't rate their chances of organising a p*ss-up in a brewery.

[adb968008]

35 minutes ago, Michael Hodgson said:

 

The larger airports have more staff and much stronger financial resources and if they can't plan the installation of a few machines and organise their buildings to accommodate them when all the tin-pot airfields can, I wouldn't rate their chances of organising a p*ss-up in a brewery.

As someone of experience in handling raised floor loads… putting a heavy weight machine on the ground floor or a tinpot airfield is much more straight forwards than putting it on the 2nd or 3rd floor of a 1970’s concrete building used 24/7… it’s not as straight forwards as wheeling it in, and watching it fall through the floor because the distributed load was used instead of the  point load. I know that puts me back in the minority camp… again… 

Edited April 4 by adb968008

[Darius43]

Quite right.  I have been involved in a lot of work at Heathrow in the past 30 years.  The older terminals T1 and T2 had restrictions on the allowable floor loading which made successive refurbishments “interesting”.

 

This shouldn’t be as much of an issue with the new terminals T5 and T2 although the floor structure capacity will still need to be checked.

Furthermore you can’t just take out 50% of your search lanes in one go or the passengers will be slightly more vexed than Michael above.

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[black and decker boy]

Quote from Heathrow this morning was that they have something like 146 security lanes in total across the airport so that is a lot of machines to exchange, commission etc not withstanding keeping the airport operational and completing any structural works.

 

what tickles me is whilst there is a load of angst in U.K. about the delays, no one seems to have asked if the rest of the world are doing the same.

 

having been in Mallorca recently, there was no sign of any upgrades in progress to their scanners so chances are, you’ll still be limited to 100ml bottles etc when flying home.

 

that’s if you remembered to obtain your ESTA to travel into the EU and consented to having your fingerprints taken at the border, all of which kick in for us foreign types this autumn.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[GMKAT7]

Good morning black and decker boy,

 

Thanks for the information about the new EU travel rules, sounds like another Bu99erit bonus!

 

Mods: Please delete if too political.

 

Cheers, Nigel.

 

[Oldddudders]

11 hours ago, black and decker boy said:

that’s if you remembered to obtain your ESTA to travel into the EU and consented to having your fingerprints taken at the border, all of which kick in for us foreign types this autumn.

Other nations have taken fingerprints for years. My sole adventure to the USA required me to give prints at Orlando in 2007. [For the very clear avoidance of doubt, I was NOT there to see Mickey Effing Mouse!] And I have a Carte de Séjour for France valid 10 years that required me to offer prints.

 

If fingerprints are too demeaning, holidays in the UK can be rather nice! 

[adb968008]

When the fingerprint was introduced by the US, Brasil objected but was ignored.

So they introduced fingerprinting of US passengers in reciprocity, but they used ink.

 

I recall laughing when visiting there with a US colleague as he rubbed his fingers on an ink that wasnt that easy to remove either.

 

Didnt last long but the diplomatic point was obviously made

 

😀

Edited April 5 by adb968008

[Nick C]

13 hours ago, black and decker boy said:

that’s if you remembered to obtain your ESTA to travel into the EU and consented to having your fingerprints taken at the border, all of which kick in for us foreign types this autumn.

Looks like it may have been delayed again:

 

https://travel-europe.europa.eu/etias/faqs-etias_en

 

"It is expected that the European Travel Information and Authorisation System (ETIAS) will be operational from mid-2025."

 

[Siberian Snooper]

I got finger printed on my 1st and 3rd trips and a mug shot on each of my trips to the US. No ink was used in the finger printing, but it does add time getting through immigration.