Peterborough North

[great northern]

The brake third looks fine, but what's happened to the tumblehome on the next two?

'orrible 'ornbys, shown up by a professional job with MJT sides.

[chaz]

'orrible 'ornbys, shown up by a professional job with MJT sides.

 

 

AH - I have seen references to the shortcomings of the Hornby models but had not seen it made so plain as by your photo, which makes them look almost flat sided. It must be a dilemma as to whether to use them at all.

 

Chaz

[great northern]

AH - I have seen references to the shortcomings of the Hornby models but had not seen it made so plain as by your photo, which makes them look almost flat sided. It must be a dilemma as to whether to use them at all.

 

Chaz

At the moment I have no alternative Chaz, though plans are in place to do something about it. Those all door seconds are essential for any Eastern Region model, so I have to put up with them.

[great northern]

A bit more black and white.....

 

and a short parcels train rolls through from Westwood yard.

 

after I posted last night I realised that if I cropped the first of those images a bit more it might look even better.

 

and I think it does. Now I await the arrival of the Master of Little Bytham.

[KNP]

A bit more black and white.....

5 DE.JPG

 

and a short parcels train rolls through from Westwood yard.

6 J3 1.JPG

 

after I posted last night I realised that if I cropped the first of those images a bit more it might look even better.

2 90 2.JPG

 

and I think it does. Now I await the arrival of the Master of Little Bytham.

 

Lovely pictures as usual and I was about to comment about cropping.

Here is the one I was about to send before you did yours which I pulled in even more to concentrate the picture

 

 

Now the train is the star with the background providing a full supporting cast.....

To me, this is the best picture to date.

[Tony Wright]

A bit more black and white.....

5 DE.JPG

 

and a short parcels train rolls through from Westwood yard.

6 J3 1.JPG

 

after I posted last night I realised that if I cropped the first of those images a bit more it might look even better.

2 90 2.JPG

 

and I think it does. Now I await the arrival of the Master of Little Bytham.

Very nice images, Gilbert,

 

Thanks for your hospitality today.

 

The layout's really coming along, and please let me know if the K2 and B17 misbehave again. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[great northern]

That lovely little J3 was the first loco that Tony ever built for me, so it was appropriate that it was sitting in the bay when he arrived this morning. It had run on down past the bridge.

and then propelled its short train into the bay.

I wonder if the fireman ever did move the lamp to the front buffer beam during this manoeuvre. Given the short distance involved, I doubt it. The signalman in Crescent box had a grandstand view of the whole thing anye=way.

[CUTLER2579]

Gilbert,

As I believe PN is based on the summer of 1958, is this modellers licence when to my believe J3 Class  64122  was withdrawn in  April 1953 ?

Just being curious.

Regards,Derek.

[great northern]

Gilbert,

As I believe PN is based on the summer of 1958, is this modellers licence when to my believe J3 Class  64122  was withdrawn in  April 1953 ?

Just being curious.

Regards,Derek.

 You mustn't believe everything you read Derek.   Mistakes were made. 4122 was somewhere out in the wilds of deepest darkest Lincolnshire when the summons to Doncaster came, and the clerk who received it inadvertently binned it. New England being such a big shed, no-one noticed it was still in service, so it kept getting used on light duties for several more years.

 

Actually, I have admitted to this anomaly more than once before, but if you were offered a loco like this by TW,would you turn it down?

[great northern]

Another of the early morning slow trains to Grantham, this time the 6.40 off KX, has now got as far as Peterbrough, and is seen either side of Crescent Bridge.

[manna]

G'day Folks

 

Love the old J3's. built 3, 2 more to go.

 

manna

 

PS, I'm sure your J3 lasted until the end of steam.

[great northern]

Hermit can now enjoy quite a protracted rest.

and that gives an opportunity to focus in on the majority of the passenger accomodation behind the tender, a core of three Gresley TSOs.

[great northern]

Yet another look at Hermit, still waiting at Platform 6.

That lamp has a very slight bend in it, which the camera has as usual exaggerated, a lot.

 

The 8.00am KX- Leeds is next to show up, Minoru leading the way.

[great northern]

 A trip to the far end of Platform 3 gives the opportunity to get two Top Shed single chimney A3s into the same shot.

 

After which we move on in time a bit, as some trains have run without any photos being taken. You haven't missed much though, and the 9.42 Norwich is waiting time at Platform 6, so you get to see another shiny B17.

 

featuring an 'orrible Hornby brake, and unadulterated duck egg blue walls. Another hot and sticky night attempting to get some sleep approaches.

[great northern]

Here is that Hornby all door brake, next to a Kirk all door second.

 

I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that, with all its faults, I'd rather have the Kirk. Any views?

 

Focus then on Tottenham Hotspur, an appropriate B17, given that their players have a lot resting on their shoulders later.

[thegreenhowards]

Here is that Hornby all door brake, next to a Kirk all door second.

2 all doors.JPG

 

I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that, with all its faults, I'd rather have the Kirk. Any views?

 

Focus then on Tottenham Hotspur, an appropriate B17, given that their players have a lot resting on their shoulders later.

3 1630 2.JPG

Gilbert,

 

I’m a little confused by your ‘Hornby’ all door BSK as I don’t remember one of these ever being in their range. They make a BCK of course, but is this some metal sides on a donor coach?

 

With regards to the Hornby vs Kirk debate, I’m in two minds. I accept that the tumblehome is a key feature if these coaches and it’s poor rendition on the Hornby’s is a serious fault. However (almost?) everything else about the Hornby is better than the Kirk’s - underframe detail, flush glazing, door handles, roof detail, bogies (if you can keep the step boards on!), end detail, interior..... For me the real problem is when Hornbys are mixed with other Gresley coaches as this shows up the tumblehome problem and also shows up things like the lack of flush glazing on the Kirk’s. An all Kirk rake or an all Hornby rake (although it’s difficult to form a prototypical rake with their selection of diagrams) both look fine to me.

 

I find Kirk sides on Hornby donors work well if you file down the end to give the correct tumblehome, but of course, etched sides on a kit built coach (or a Hornby donor) give the best of both worlds.

 

Just my views and I know I will stir up some anti Hornby venom!

 

Andy

[micklner]

Kirk's ?? compared to modern etched and r.t.r  coaches they are simply dire , all the above mentioned faults in the previous post, even the Roofs simply don't fit , the mouldings are crude in general and in detail and a product of the 1970's or earlier ?. The only part worth keeping is the basic box, the rest needs replacing with e.g MJT parts.

 

 

Big things are made about the Hornby Tumblehome and the lack off one, the real ones have a 3inch tumblehome that is 1mm in 4mm . You could say the earlier photo above  with the MJT coach leading the Hornby's are that the Tumblehome is actually far too deep ??

[great northern]

Gilbert,

 

I’m a little confused by your ‘Hornby’ all door BSK as I don’t remember one of these ever being in their range. They make a BCK of course, but is this some metal sides on a donor coach?

 

With regards to the Hornby vs Kirk debate, I’m in two minds. I accept that the tumblehome is a key feature if these coaches and it’s poor rendition on the Hornby’s is a serious fault. However (almost?) everything else about the Hornby is better than the Kirk’s - underframe detail, flush glazing, door handles, roof detail, bogies (if you can keep the step boards on!), end detail, interior..... For me the real problem is when Hornbys are mixed with other Gresley coaches as this shows up the tumblehome problem and also shows up things like the lack of flush glazing on the Kirk’s. An all Kirk rake or an all Hornby rake (although it’s difficult to form a prototypical rake with their selection of diagrams) both look fine to me.

 

I find Kirk sides on Hornby donors work well if you file down the end to give the correct tumblehome, but of course, etched sides on a kit built coach (or a Hornby donor) give the best of both worlds.

 

Just my views and I know I will stir up some anti Hornby venom!

 

Andy

I'm a lot confused Andy. Of course Hornby don't do an 'orrible BSK- theirs is an 'orrible BCK. I can't remember how or where I acquired that BSK, but it isn't up to much. It isn't just the lack of tumblehome that so disappoints me about the Hornby coaches, the wrongly positioned waistband just compounds it.  It's a personal thing, but I really do dislike them to the extent that almost anything is preferable.

 

As you say, it is best to keep Hornby and Kirk in separate rakes, and mostly I do. In fact, as the next image shows, nearly all of this formation is KIrk. I hasten to add I have nothing against Hornby, they have done some very good stuff, but the Gresleys were an opportunity wasted which still irks me all these years later.

[great northern]

Kirk's ?? compared to modern etched and r.t.r  coaches they are simply dire , all the above mentioned faults in the previous post, even the Roofs simply don't fit , the mouldings are crude in general and in detail and a product of the 1970's or earlier ?. The only part worth keeping is the basic box, the rest needs replacing with e.g MJT parts.

 

 

Big things are made about the Hornby Tumblehome and the lack off one, the real ones have a 3inch tumblehome that is 1mm in 4mm . You could say the earlier photo above  with the MJT coach leading the Hornby's are that the Tumblehome is actually far too deep ??

Personal preference Mick, but I'd rather it was too deep than for it not to be there at all.

[great northern]

So here is the complete rake of that Norwich train.

I do keep these three Kirks together normally.

 

The West riding is approaching on the Up, and Copley Hill have at last found and mounted the headboard. It's a shame they didn't also replace the 52A shedcode when the loco was transferred to them. I have written to the shedmaster asking for this to be put right.

[great northern]

For some reason I did a slightly different angle on the approaching West Riding, and cropped it even more heavily, basically because I couldn't be bothered to do some difficult shopping.

This one of Tottenham Hotspur swinging under the bridge on its way to Norwich needed a good deal of cropping too.

The sleep deficit from all these hot and uncomfortable nights increases apace.

[great northern]

Do you agree that this curve is far too sharp to allow this kind of head on shot to work?

[Mallard60022]

Do you agree that this curve is far too sharp to allow this kind of head on shot to work?

7 WR 3.JPG

No.

[westerner]

It is that sort of head on, therefore foreshortening shot that often make prototypical photos look as if there are train set curves.

I agree with Phil in answer to your statement NO I do not agree.

[KNP]

Another no.....