Heljan Class 14s for Hattons

[clarkea1]

If Ultrascale were to do one (unlikely, but who knows?), you'd be unlikely to see a set before Whitsun/Midsummer, which might be a consideration.

 

I did pose this question to Ultrascale and got a non-committal respose. Last I heard they were going to check some measurements on one of the prototypes at the Nene Valley Railway and see if they had a suitable wheel in the range on which to base a conversion. They also pointed out that they could only do a conversion set if they could get hold of a model to measure up (yet didn't want to borrow mine in case it was damaged).

 

So perhaphs if people would like to see an Ultrascale conversion they need to drop Brian Rodgers an email to see if a few more enquiries helps!

 

Personally, I suspec the Gibson approach would work just as well, although I need to measure up the wheels themselves - you might get away with longer axles on the same wheels in EM (barbaric I know but they look quite fine so it's an option). EDIT - I've just read the previous posts and it appears merely pulling them out to the correct b-b dimension for EM may be an option.

 

Alastair

[craigwelsh]

I did pose this question to Ultrascale and got a non-committal respose. Last I heard they were going to check some measurements on one of the prototypes at the Nene Valley Railway and see if they had a suitable wheel in the range on which to base a conversion. They also pointed out that they could only do a conversion set if they could get hold of a model to measure up (yet didn't want to borrow mine in case it was damaged).

 

So perhaphs if people would like to see an Ultrascale conversion they need to drop Brian Rodgers an email to see if a few more enquiries helps!

 

Alastair

People could reply directly to your message http://www.ultrascale.co.uk/messageboard.php?mid=356&mtit=Heljan+%2F+Hattons+Class+14 , Ultrascale did have a wishlist until recent;y but I cant find it now as it might have closed.

 

I wouldn't expect to see something until Autumn from them though so if you want it quick then Gibsons would be the choice.

[cahoon_danny]

Thanks for drawing that to my attention - mine has one missing, too !!

 

I can't see anything on the parts list that resembles the door catch - I think that I shall admit defeat on that one and bend up a bit of fine wire.

 

It has to be said - the quality control on this one is abysmal !!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

 

 

I emailed Hattons, and i think im going to get the replacement part!

[Grasslands]

It seems my earlier grumble about my 14 wobbling around on the bachrus rollers was unwarranted....the motor promptly blew up last night about 30 minutes into the run in.... so seems like I had a bad one.

 

I will be popping mine in the post tomorrow for its return to Liverpool.

 

How are they at running slow speed? My duff one was quite pathetic at slow speeds

 

Any differences between the 3 different versions and slow motoring (for those with various colours)? Just curious really.

[Guest Max Stafford]

How easy does motor replacement look? I haven't had a chance to inspect the mechanism yet, but I'm getting worried by some of these reports of rough running. I realise return is the main option, but knowing what the maker's motors are generally like at low speed I thimk I'd rather have a Mashima on board. It's a realistic option in this case as I will only ever have this one example.

 

Dave.

[bubbles2]

John Isherwood (cctransuk) has p.m.ed me asking the colour I used to match the buffer beam and as my pms seem not to be working at the moment but also because it may be useful to others here's the answer...

 

 

Mostly RaiMatch wpanel yellow pre64, (no304 I think but this number may be wrong as I've had the jar so long its difficult to read) with a little Humbrol matt white enamel no 34 to lighten it and because there was a slight orange tone missing from the mix, a dab of RailMatch BR maroon no 306 (I think). This was thinned with white spirit and washed over the filled area in two coats to fill any slight in-perfections. Hope this helps, by the way John I must get some of those transfers of yours soon.

 

[Trevor H]

How easy does motor replacement look? I haven't had a chance to inspect the mechanism yet, but I'm getting worried by some of these reports of rough running. I realise return is the main option, but knowing what the maker's motors are generally like at low speed I thimk I'd rather have a Mashima on board. It's a realistic option in this case as I will only ever have this one example.

 

Dave.

 

I think I'll be looking at fitting a Mashimi myself when I EM mine, I havn't had chance to eyeball the actual motor and it's size, but looking at the parts diagram it looks to be a similar design to the Clayton and the Mashimi's I have fitted to them improved the slow running impeccabaly.

 

Also model may have a few inaccuracy's, but hey nothing that can't be improved and will be nice to do some good old modelling on the loco and not just be another RTR out of the box

 

Trevor

[the fuzzler]

Have to say that my green D9500 is a beautiful runner even without being run in. Its silent and will crawl exceptionally slowly, second only to my Hornby 08. I've put the Hornby 8249 chip in (see my DCC thread about the "fun" with that, a really awkward installation in my opinion) and it seems better under DCC than it was with a gaugemaster 12v controller.

 

On the Bachmann rollers there is a very slight wobble, but it doesn't affect the running on my straight test track at all.

 

Talking of wobbles, I've built up a collection of standard steam classes plus the odd one of interest to me for my 2preserved2 layout. Maybe I've been unlucky, but 25% of these have had to be replaced due to wobbly axles. The worst is a Hornby Black 5, bought late last year and only tested today. the middle axle is miles out.

 

Anyone else DCC's one...surely ? Did you have fun ? And how do you put the headcode blinds in ? My headcode glasses are very firmly stuck in, and you can't ping them out from outside the loco thanks to them being a 2x2 digit design with a bit of body in the middle !

[panzerjaeger]

I have two examples, BR green and the NCB version. I have run both in for about an hour in each direction and apart from the NCB version stalling once or twice everything seems OK. By just touching the loco, it goes on its merry way and I suspect the excessive side play in the axles may be the problem.

 

However, this evening, I took both locos to the B(NN)RS club night and ran them both on the club layout Bassetfield. Both locos either stopped or derailed on the same Peco curved point and both juddered a bit over another point. However, when the NCB stopped for no reason, I picked it up and found that the bottom plate beneath the axles had dislodged at one end. One axle and the jackshaft axle were twisted and the pick-ups were bent out of shape.

 

Once home, it was a five minute job to fettle it and the loco is now running fine in both directions. The reaction of the club members to the 'Teddy Bear' was most favourable and they were quite understanding of the need for excessive side play due to the long wheelbase.

 

Although it is a pricey bit of kit for its size, when you compare the prices of the Hornby International locos announced at Nurnberg this week, it seems a positive bargain.

[RedgateModels]

Had a quick look at my pair of NCBs last night, one is perfect, well, nearly. Nothing missing or dislodged, runs beautifully. Cab steps are a tad loose, a pin drop of EMA will sort that. The second one is worse, main issue front buffer beam off, buffers, collars and springs loose in the packaging, one cab step broken off, the other one hardly glued in at all. The little "Celtic Crosses" aslo loose in the packaging. Havn't run this one yet.

 

Should be easy to fix, but I might send it back.

 

EDIT: just been looking at the bad one with a collegue who happens to work on the real ones at the WSR, spotted that the end door top handles are missing! - will check the good one tonight.

Edited February 11, 2010 by RedgateModels

[Trevor H]

A mod I have noticed is the square recess on the long bonnet side door of the model.

 

This seems to vary between the class and I cannot tell weather it is a mod or if others had a cover fitted, but if they did it would of have to of been well fitted, It could also be possible door changes.

 

Locos I have so far noted carrying the recess at some time in their life are D9502/10/14/24/25/26/29/34/35/36/40/43/51

 

Some noted without recess are D9500/09/12/14/24/27/33

 

There seems to be no particular order to this, I first thought it was a mod carried out as all the pics of the class I have found, in industrial use carried the recess. Whereas less seem to have the recess in BR service, although I have a pic of D9533 brand new in Swindon Works with the recess, also D9514 was withdrawn from BR without recess but later did have it.

 

 

[Adam]

A mod I have noticed is the square recess on the long bonnet side door of the model.

 

This seems to vary between the class and I cannot tell weather it is a mod or if others had a cover fitted, but if they did it would of have to of been well fitted, It could also be possible door changes.

 

Locos I have so far noted carrying the recess at some time in their life are D9502/10/14/24/25/26/29/34/35/36/40/43/51

 

Some noted without recess are D9500/09/12/14/24/27/33

 

There seems to be no particular order to this, I first thought it was a mod carried out as all the pics of the class I have found, in industrial use carried the recess. Whereas less seem to have the recess in BR service, although I have a pic of D9533 brand new in Swindon Works with the recess, also D9514 was withdrawn from BR without recess but later did have it.

 

 

 

 

Trevor - it's only a recess inside the cab - outside, it's clearly proud of the front - see the way the shadows fall? Internal cab handrail perhaps which had to be recessed because of the door?

 

Adam

 

Adam

[Pixie]

Mixed news from Gibson on the wheel front. Reply states:

 

The class 14 wheel we produce is on a 1/8" axle. When we get a little time (whatever that is) we'll have a look at doing 2mm version. Not sure what we'll do about the jack shaft, we'll look at doing using out part 5002 but in 2mm.

 

Best Regards

 

Colin

 

Think it's a case of sit tight for now lads!

 

Pix

[Trevor H]

Trevor - it's only a recess inside the cab - outside, it's clearly proud of the front - see the way the shadows fall? Internal cab handrail perhaps which had to be recessed because of the door?

 

Adam

 

Adam

 

Hi Adam,

 

I'm probably been stupid but I'm confused

 

I've also just realised why the recess is there, it's to clear the diagonal on the cab front. The pic of the one without the recess wasn't a good example as the weathering doesnt make it to clear.

 

Trevor.

 

ps. Adam, If your'e talking about the diagonal, I now realise what your saying

[Trevor H]

Mixed news from Gibson on the wheel front. Reply states:

 

The class 14 wheel we produce is on a 1/8" axle. When we get a little time (whatever that is) we'll have a look at doing 2mm version. Not sure what we'll do about the jack shaft, we'll look at doing using out part 5002 but in 2mm.

 

Best Regards

 

Colin

 

Think it's a case of sit tight for now lads!

 

Pix

 

Hi Pix,

 

I'll probably go for just moving the wheels out for the time been and see how it performs, I suppose that is one of the advantages of EM.

 

I really didn't need this distraction at the moment, I should be modelling 2mm but mine is all in bits at the moment, I'll probably fit a Mashimi while it's all apart. Also looking at the possibility of moving the buffer beams back or moving the noses forward slightly.

 

Have you any thoughts on the hornblock and spring detail, certainly enough room for something with a bit more depth.

 

Trevor

[Adam]

Hi Adam,

 

I'm probably been stupid but I'm confused

 

I've also just realised why the recess is there, it's to clear the diagonal on the cab front. The pic of the one without the recess wasn't a good example as the weathering doesnt make it to clear.

 

Trevor.

 

Sorry Trevor - I was looking at the cab front rather than the bonnet panel. Oops.

 

Adam

[Trevor H]

No probs Adam.

 

Whilst I have the loco apart I found the counter gear had the usual sideplay and could rub against the side of the chassis which could cause it to stick. This could only happen in one direction as the endfloat would cause the gear to go push against one side of the chassis, whilst in the opposite direction the gear will naturally go to the otherside.

 

I have fitted a small shim either side and whilst still having a bit of sideplay has rectified the problem. This could well be the reason for locos sticking in one direction, will report if I manage to get it all back together

 

Although the loco may have a few teething problems, I must admit a lot of work has gone into it, just like the real thing I guess

 

Trevor.

 

[Pixie]

I really didn't need this distraction at the moment, I should be modelling 2mm

 

I don't really need the distraction either, I should be dissertationing. Fancy trading some 2mm modelling for writing 60 pages on manufacturing facility design?

 

Have you any thoughts on the hornblock and spring detail, certainly enough room for something with a bit more depth.

 

I'm sure I can some up with something, a trip to Parkend is on the cards to get another batch of prototype snaps, so I'll catch up with D9555 and cover it in photos. I really need to get my model in front of me, although a trip home is on the cards in 10 days time. For me a 4mm 14 is more of a 'money where my mouth is' purchase after campaigning for one for so long but as Parkend has no shrunk to a 2mm project* and Roath being 18 months too late for one I don't really need one. Then again I don't really need a Southern T9 or Porterbrook 57601 and they seemed to have worked their way onto my 'shelf of horn'

 

*Admittedly a currently stalled project as I need to find out what the size and weight restrictions are for taking it on long-haul flights. Bryn's now finished the Herring and the Farish 14 looks close so it should get a bit of renewed attention soon.

 

I've also just realised why the recess is there, it's to clear the diagonal on the cab front. The pic of the one without the recess wasn't a good example as the weathering doesnt make it to clear.

 

I guess it's a simple case that sometimes the recessed door just got replaced with a normal one?

 

Pix

[Trevor H]

I'm sure I can some up with something, a trip to Parkend is on the cards to get another batch of prototype snaps, so I'll catch up with D9555 and cover it in photos.

If you decide to make a day out of it sometime, perhaps we could catch up and have a beer.

 

Bryn's now finished the Herring and the Farish 14 looks close so it should get a bit of renewed attention soon.

 

Pix

Will have to have another chat with Bryn, can certainly never have enough wagons, I think if I had a layout full of wagons and a shunter, I'd still be as happy as a "Pig in S**t"

 

2mm Trev

[Pixie]

If you decide to make a day out of it sometime, perhaps we could catch up and have a beer.

 

You're on! Probably Easter if not the summer now but certainly in the next couple of months.

 

Will have to have another chat with Bryn, can certainly never have enough wagons, I think if I had a layout full of wagons and a shunter, I'd still be as happy as a "Pig in S**t"

 

I know that feeling! Part of me is thinking of putting Stephen Harris on direct debit and just getting him to send me a batch of whatever his latest creation is once a month. There is the other 2mm project we've mused over that would require a lot of wagons...

 

Pix

[cctransuk]

Having had a bit of time this afternoon to tinker with my D9500, I've come to the conclusion that any mechanical deficiencies with this model can be summed up in one word - slop !! (AKA excessive clearances).

 

The amount of sideplay on the wheels has been discussed already, but it doesn't stop there.

 

Don't get me wrong; my model is almost silent and runs very smoothly - except ... it has just the hint of hesitation or surge on each wheel revolution.

 

I'm sure that many of us who built our first steam loco chassis found that it had a bit of a tight spot. So we opened up the coupling rod holes - just a bit too much! The more we sought to remedy the problem with increased clearances, the worse it got.

 

That's the problem with the Heljan D9500, I'm sure.

 

The chassis / axle clearances are so large that you can twist the axle in the horizontal plane quite significantly. The crankpin holes in the coupling rods are *much* larger than the pin itself.

 

Try holding one wheel and then rotating the adjacent wheel - there's no end of backlash!

 

Too much slop is worse than not enough - you can always ease a tight spot but, short of bushing the axles and crankpins, there's nothing to be done with D9500.

 

Fortunately, it's only the merest suggestion of hesitation with my model - it amazes me that it can be so smooth with all that excess clearance.

 

Anyway, I can live with it.

 

Oh - and droopy couplings are going to be a problem with this model, too.

 

The NEM pockets on mine flapped about - the pivot hole is way too large for the screw. I bushed the pivot hole with 2.5 mm. OD brass tube, but I still needed to shim between the underside of the pocket and the chassis baseplate to keep the pocket horizontal.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[Andy Y]

Oh - and droopy couplings are going to be a problem with this model, too.

I've not seen the underneath of one yet but if it's the same as other sloppy Heljan couplings the answer is to slip a shim between the two sticky out prongs and the coupling pocket.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Cheshire001]

Is there an easy way to remove the scale 3 link couplings? They're lovely but fouling the hook and bar couplings.

Had similar problem with Heljan Falcon and ended up slicing/breaking them off with craft knife.

[mikesndbs]

Is there an easy way to remove the scale 3 link couplings? They're lovely but fouling the hook and bar couplings.

Had similar problem with Heljan Falcon and ended up slicing/breaking them off with craft knife.

 

 

Hi

 

I have found that if you just hook them up there is no issue with the coupling?

 

You can see mine working here on tight curves.

 

Yes the couplings are sloppy like all Heljan locos, but a shim will solve this.

I did remove the coupling hook to make the model look better.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

[Trainshed Terry]

Everyone is talking about this loco, but not a lot is being said about the miss moulded exhaust.

 

 

And how to rectify the defect which is a liveable defect. I am sure that there those people with the weathering skills can disguise it.

 

Terry.