70022Tornado Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 having spent some months on my back in hospitalIhad plenty of time fo though, downloading the non scale drawings of both the 6400 and the 5700 and 8750 from http://www.champwilde.f9.co.uk/gwdrawings/index.htmlIthink that it may be possible to creata reasonable replica of the 6400/7400from the hornby8650. obvious mods csb side snd roof remove and tool boxes remove and topfeed and pipes relocate tank vents. paint GWR green and apply new plates,Iappreciate that this eould not psass a rivit counters inspection ! But has anybody tried this or got ant thoughts or advice 7oo22 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 There is a thread elsewhere on RMweb about this. Basically, the problem is that the 6400 is a smaller loco than the 8750 and the 6400 boiler is more or less flush with the tops of the tanks, unlike the 8750. It doesn't help that the Hornby model is stretched to fit the Jinty chassis. It's unfortunate as it's a conversion I've thought about myself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted May 5, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 5, 2011 The 64xx is one of those classes that is missing from the modelling world. There appears to be a couple of models available in O but other than that very little. Given that the Hornby model is stretched the Bachmann model is possibly a better starting point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
industrial Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 This came up on RMweb 3 and the only thing that was any good was the cab. If I find how to get in I will supply a link. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 This came up on RMweb 3 and the only thing that was any good was the cab. If I find how to get in I will supply a link. Pretty sure the cabs are different on the GA's I have although they might look the same.. Need a new chassis too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stuartp Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 This came up on RMweb 3 and the only thing that was any good was the cab. If I find how to get in I will supply a link. It did, it was me that asked. If I recall, the consenus was that the cab was only 1mm out, but the wheel diameter and wheelbase are significantly different, and the cab/boiler/firebox proportions are different. Having said that, Ben Alder Of Kylesku and The Mound has converted one for his Dornoch service by just changing the numberplates and it looks rather good being a stranger in a strange land. But then he has a knack for this sort of thing, making Caley 439s and HR Bens not look like repainted M7s and T9s... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
70022Tornado Posted May 5, 2011 Author Share Posted May 5, 2011 Thanks. the Bachman 57 may be a better starting point, let us see what ebay can provide. BTW was not the DORNOCH paniers 1600 rather than 6400 70022 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Aren't the various Panniers the origin of the saying that all Great Western engines look the same? You've really got to know them to see any differences . . . (Written by a Southern enthusiast!) JE Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
industrial Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Aren't the various Panniers the origin of the saying that all Great Western engines look the same? You've really got to know them to see any differences . . . (Written by a Southern enthusiast!) JE This is to sort the men from the boys, the men know the different but the boys (the people who don't appreciate the best railway :D )don't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Aren't the various Panniers the origin of the saying that all Great Western engines look the same? You've really got to know them to see any differences . . . Not just the panniers, look at the 4-6-0s! Churchward's policy of standardisation was initiated at the start of the 20th century and perpetuated by Collett right up to WW2. As a result most of the GWR locos have a strong family resemblence. I am a GWR fan and it was quite a while before I could reliably ID the locos without looking at nameplates or numbers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted May 5, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 5, 2011 Not just the panniers, look at the 4-6-0s! Churchward's policy of standardisation was initiated at the start of the 20th century and perpetuated by Collett right up to WW2. As a result most of the GWR locos have a strong family resemblence. I am a GWR fan and it was quite a while before I could reliably ID the locos without looking at nameplates or numbers. Used to be dead easy to tell one from another as they came towards you at speed on a line with a slight curve in it - in fact once you got used to them you could even tell one or two of the low numbered 'Star' to 'Castle' rebuilds from an as built 'Castle' when they were still over 100 yards away. But I s'pose it helped if you grew up trainspotting on the Great Western main line a few decades before the acronym merchants turned it into the GWML Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stuartp Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 BTW was not the DORNOCH paniers 1600 rather than 6400 Doh ! Sorry, yes. 1600, 6400, I knew there was a 6 involved. My recollection relates to the 1600s, please ignore it. (They still all look the same to me...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 Not just the panniers, look at the 4-6-0s! Churchward's policy of standardisation was initiated at the start of the 20th century and perpetuated by Collett right up to WW2. As a result most of the GWR locos have a strong family resemblence. I am a GWR fan and it was quite a while before I could reliably ID the locos without looking at nameplates or numbers. When you got ir right the first time, why change? (see below) The main difference between 16xx and 64/74xx panniers is the wheel diameter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paullad1984 Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Dont NUCAST do a kit for a 6400/7400 in OO? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Dont NUCAST do a kit for a 6400/7400 in OO? Yup, one sold on eBay for £27 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NUCAST-WHITE-METAL-KIT-GWR-54XX-64XX-74XX-CLASS-PANNIER-TANK-LOCO-BODY-/350493527441 I wouldn't try looking for a new one though, its over £100 with wheels iirc. Cotswold did the 1600 I believe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted December 7, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 7, 2011 Yup, one sold on eBay for £27 http://www.ebay.co.u...Y-/350493527441 I wouldn't try looking for a new one though, its over £100 with wheels iirc. Cotswold did the 1600 I believe. Cotswold did indeed do the 1600 and it is an excellent set of castings - one is sitting in my 'round tuit' stock. The NuCast 54XX/64XX etc kit is, I presume, the former Westward one and if that is the case it is an atrocious thing - with, originally, whitemetal main frames although I can't imagine it still comes like that. As far as the castings are concerned the quality and 'sharpness' of the Westward kit in its early life just wasn't in the same league as the Cotswold 1600 and in fact the one I bought went straight back after I'd opened the box and had a good look through the castings. Of course it might be completely different now - I certainly hope it is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted December 7, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 7, 2011 Are there any other options for making a 64xx (other than starting from scratch)? Having seen a photo of one with a pair of autocoaches in one of the Cheddar books(all be it on the mainline and probably not heading to Cheddar) I do rather fancy modelling the rake. The lack of a 64xx is the issue... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisf Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Rich, if you start with an 8750 pannier the cab and chimney will come in handy but I rather suspect that the pannier tanks are not the same, says he who has not investigated thoroughly! Wheels are the same diameter, Alan Gibson does frames of 7ft4in+7ft4in and, I think, the rods. In your position I would satisfy myself that I needed one first. Where was the pic taken of the 64 and pair of trailers? I'd guess somewhere like Witham since I do not associate the class with the Bristol area. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 .... the quality and 'sharpness' of the Westward kit in its early life just wasn't in the same league as the Cotswold 1600 and in fact the one I bought went straight back after I'd opened the box and had a good look through the castings. Of course it might be completely different now - I certainly hope it is. It certainly is different: it's no longer in production. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 The other kit to look for is the Stepen Poole. Cast body with milled frames. He even produced his own wheels. The challenge with the 64XX is the wheelbase is set at 7'4"-7'4". The loco was based on the 2021 class, hence the fit of the firebox/tanks as mentioned above. The prototype was rebuilt from no 2080 (and then converted back again when the main class was built) The 57XX class wheelbase is not equal with wheels set 7'3"-8'3" apart. The alternative is to convert a 2021 just as Swindon did.(one on eBay now http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/160696379519?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649 ) Good luck Mike Wiltshire Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisf Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Just had an e-rummage. There were examples of the 54xx at Westbury and Frome in 1947 but no 64xx. 54xx had 5ft2in drivers of course. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isambard Kingdom Brunel Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Interesting thread, I've been wondering how to produce a 74xx for Llanfyllin. Dear Mr Hornby or Mr Bachmann..................... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Just had an e-rummage. There were examples of the 54xx at Westbury and Frome in 1947 but no 64xx. 54xx had 5ft2in drivers of course. Chris Westbury was always a 54XX area. I have recorded 5401/2/3/6/11/12/19/23/24 all worked at somepoint out of Westbury or Frome from 1932 onwards. It was not exclusive as 4803/29,36 were also Westbury allocated during the 1930's. . MW Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium kevinlms Posted December 8, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 8, 2011 Aren't the various Panniers the origin of the saying that all Great Western engines look the same? You've really got to know them to see any differences . . . (Written by a Southern enthusiast!) JE If you look up 6400 for a 'proper railway', the LMS - you'll find that the 6400 was an 0-4-4T, nominally attributed to Stanier,later renumbered 1900-1909. In 1946 a class of 2-6-0s also started with 6400. FWIW aren't all the various Southern 2-6-0s the same. Who can really tell the difference between the N, N1, U, U1? I suppose the K & K1 were a bit easier to spot the difference. Kevin Martin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 ....FWIW aren't all the various Southern 2-6-0s the same. Who can really tell the difference between the N, N1, U, U1? .... Quite a lot of people can. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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